Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

A conversation among Whalers
DrDon
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Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby DrDon » Thu Jan 17, 2019 8:21 pm

I am considering re-powering my 1996 24 Outrage. I thought some current real-world [prices] help those looking to re-power.

I received a quoted price from a local Suzuki dealer: out-the-door price was $19,095 for a 30-inch-shaft 300-HP engine, including installation, controls, gauges, and stainless steel propeller.

I also received another quoted price: $32,785 for a [similar package with a] Yamaha digital engine

The price difference was a shock. I'll follow up at a later date.

Jefecinco
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki

Postby Jefecinco » Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:36 am

You've just highlighted the reason Suzuki is taking the commercial outboard engine re-power market from Yamaha, at least in our area of the Gulf Coast. The difference in price structure is almost shocking.
Butch

jimh
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki

Postby jimh » Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:15 am

The Yamaha modern engines seem to be mostly sold on the transoms of new boats, and Yamaha has many boat builders with strong loyalty to their brand. In contrast, Suzuki does not have a large market on new-boat transoms, so Suzuki is likely very interested in selling into the re-power market.

Generally boat builders get much better prices on outboard engines when they make commitments to a single supplier. The cost to a high-volume boat builder for a Yamaha engine to be put on their new boat's transom is likely to be much less than the single-quantity retail price a dealer can offer to a re-power customer.

Also, if "digital" mean that the Yamaha engine cited above in the comparison with the Suzuki engine has some sort of electrically operated shift and throttle controls, that feature alone can add several thousand dollars to the price of an engine. A comparison won't be fair unless both engines have the same features for remote controls.

Historically the Suzuki engines have always tended to be sold on the basis of a lower price than competitors. I recall when Suzuki first began to compete in the outboard engine market in North America. Some other brand-super-fans were highly critical of Suzuki for competing in the marketplace on the basis of cost, and they decried this practice as "buying market share," as if competing on the basis of cost was something illegal or at the least un-American.

Suzuki has been quite innovative in their outboard engine marketing. Suzuki was the first outboard manufacturer to abandon two-stroke-power-cycle engines and move to an all-four-stroke-power-cycle engine line. They also introduced fuel-injection to outboard engines. And, most notably, Suzuki completely upset the outboard manufacturing industry by offering very long factory warranty coverage. I believe they offered a five-year or six-year warranty on their four-stroke-power-cycle engines at a time when most other outboard engine manufacturers were offering a one-year or two-year warranty.

frontier
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby frontier » Fri Jan 18, 2019 12:41 pm

Something fishy here. Outboard prices shown look like new old stock discounted Suzuki prices and full blown retail Yamaha prices (better known as a "no-bid").

hauptjm
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby hauptjm » Fri Jan 18, 2019 2:32 pm

Very Fishy!

I just priced a Yamaha 300 XCA for $23,000.00 - all in. Full retail is in the $27,000-28,000 range.

DrDon
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby DrDon » Fri Jan 18, 2019 10:23 pm

The first Suzuki quote [mentioned in the initial post to be $19,095] was for a 2018 DF 300 25” shaft with [electric remote control], with a color display, a stainless steel propeller, and installation. Also I was offered $5,000 trade in for my pair of Yamaha engines. Later I told the dealer I needed a 30-inch shaft; that would be an extra $345.

A second Suzuki dealer quoted $18,500 for 25-inch-shaft but they do not take a trade-in.

The Yamaha engine comes in the [electric remote control] version for a 30-inch-shaft model. The price on the written quote was $27,050, which included a $1,629 discount off the retail price of $28,679, and this price also included $4,106 trade-in credit for my old engines.

The [second] Suzuki price did not include any trade-in credit.

The Yamaha quote was from a high-volume re-power dealer.

I am still amazed at the price difference.

jimh
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby jimh » Sat Jan 19, 2019 9:00 am

If a valid price comparison is to be made, the goods and services have to match.

DrDon wrote:The first Suzuki quote [mentioned in the initial post to be $19,095] was for a 2018 DF 300 25” shaft with [electric remote control], with a color display, a stainless steel propeller, and installation. Also I was offered $5,000 trade in for my pair of Yamaha engines. Later I told the dealer I needed a 30-inch shaft; that would be an extra $345.


The $19,095 quoted price would then be $19,440 if adjusted for the 30-inch-shaft model cost of $345. Or did your price of $19,095 already have the extra $345 for the longer shaft?

And was this quote including the $5,000 credit for trading in the old engines? Or not including that credit?

DrDon wrote:A second Suzuki dealer quoted $18,500 for 25-inch-shaft but they do not take a trade-in.


The $18,500 quoted price would then be $18,845 if adjusted for the 30-inch-shaft model cost of $345.

DrDon wrote:The Yamaha engine comes in the [electric remote control] version for a 30-inch-shaft model. The price on the written quote was $27,050, which included a $1,629 discount off the retail price of $28,679, and this price also included $4,106 trade-in credit for my old engines.


If you take out the trade-in credit the cost then becomes $27,050 + $4,106 = $31,156. That is different from the $32,785 price mentioned in the initial article.

It seems hard to understand how a dealer who is said to be a high-volume dealer selling many engines for re-powering boats can sell the 300-HP Yamaha at $31,156, and another dealer is said to be selling them at around $23,000. There is an $8,000 difference in prices. If that difference is only due to the higher-cost dealer including a propeller, remote controls, one gauge, and installation, those are an expensive propeller, controls, gauges, and labor.

DrDon
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby DrDon » Sat Jan 19, 2019 6:55 pm

Sorry if the second post was not clear quotes were given differently.

Both are installed and include rigging and props

Suzuki - $19,095. No trade in that price but offered $5000 for the used pair

Yamah - $32,785 minus $4106 trade for $28,679 for total of $28,679 then a discount was applied bring the final to $$27,050

I am not sold on one brand over the other, and sounds like another Yamaha quote would be in order. I have always heard good reports whenever I talk to Suzuki owners.

That is still a huge difference in price.

jimh
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby jimh » Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:12 pm

If I understand your last comments, all goods and service are equivalent in the quoted price. The prices with trade-in then become:

SUZUKI: NET PRICE = $14,095.

YAMAHA: NET PRICE = $27,050

You would be paying almost double for the Yamaha engine. I can't imaging there would be such a huge variation in the price.

DrDon
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby DrDon » Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:56 pm

That is correct. Hard to believe the difference. Suzuki has promotion now that includes a six year warranty

frontier
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby frontier » Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:57 pm

Longtime combination Suzuki and Yamaha outboard dealer website pricing (installation not included) :
Suzuki DF300 - 30" shaft = $ 21,055.
Yamaha F300 - 30" shaft = $ 23,000.
I've known and trusted this dealership for years for fair pricing and great service.

Both Yamaha and Suzuki have included 6 year warranty promotions going on now.

I'd go with the Yamaha because of better quality, reputation and resale.

Seahorse
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby Seahorse » Mon Jan 21, 2019 8:13 am

DrDon wrote: Suzuki has promotion now that includes a six year warranty


Be aware that it is not a warranty for 6 years. Suzuki only warrants the motor for the first 3 years and the remaining 3 years of coverage are administered by a service contract company, not Suzuki.

The administrator is CornerStone United, Inc., 1020 Main Ave. NW, Hickory, North Carolina 28601, 1-877-473-7669

dtmackey
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Re: Cost Comparison Yamaha and Suzuki Re-power

Postby dtmackey » Tue Jan 22, 2019 11:02 pm

Yamaha is considered the gold standard of outboards by many, but I don't subscribe to that since Yamaha has launched numerous engines over the problems with plaguing problems which should be unheard of considering their reputation. They do seem to command a price premium when new, but problem engines have taken a resale hit on the used market. For the record I am also a Yamaha outboard owner and have 3 Yamaha outboards (15, 25 & 70, all 2 strokes).

When referring to Yami problem models:
- HPDI 250 and 300 - powerhead failures, I'm hearing they also do not support many replacement parts for these motors now
- 4 stroke 200-250 with exhaust corrosion problems, Yamaha did not support owners, yet redesigned the metal castings from a different alloy to minimize the concern
- Yamaha V8 that needs the flywheel replaced after 100 hours of operation at cruise speed (RPM dependent).
- Yamaha 90 and 115 oil makers that had ring seating problems

Suzuki is very aggressive on re-power pricing and has an impressive product offering. The local dealer here sells Zukes like crazy and I have yet to hear of problems from people I know that are running them.

I'd go with the motor that you can get the best price and with local dealer support.

D-