2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

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Ledgewalk
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2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Ledgewalk » Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:53 pm

I may buy a 2019 150 MONTAUK with the optional fishing package, bow cushion, console and seat covers, Bimini top, and Garmin MDF. The engine has 40-hours of use, and the boat has bottom paint. The prior owner bought in May [[2019] and traded-up quickly. The dealer I'm working with doesn't want to budge too much off the list price of $25,000.

Q1: as this is my first boat, should I expect any negotiating over price?

Q2: should I see this as a great deal and (assuming [the boat] checks out when I see it) [buy at the asking price]?

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Phil T
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Phil T » Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:03 pm

My first boat was used.

I just went and built a new 2019 model with the options you listed and the MSRP is $28,000, so the selling dealer is WAY too high.
https://www.bostonwhaler.com/build-your-whaler/?model=150-montauk

I would not spend $25,000 when there are many relatively-new 150 Montauk boat's on the market that reflect the depreciation hit your candidate does not take into account.

See this candidate - https://www.boattrader.com/listing/2013-boston-whaler-150-montauk-103700170/?refSource=standard%20listing&refSource=standard%20listing&refSource=standard%20listing&refSource=standard%20listing
Could negotiate down to $17,000.
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jimh
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby jimh » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:44 am

The dealer probably gave the original buyer a generous trade-in allowance because the fellow was buying a more expensive boat. The dealer would now like to make another profit with this used 2019 150 MONTAUK by selling it for more than the trade-in allowance he gave. This may account for his high asking price.

A new boat is much like a new car. Once purchased as new and then used for any amount of service, the first year of ownership will have the most depreciation.

Demand for boats is usually seasonal, and particularly in northern areas.

Boston Whaler boats last a long time. There are 30-year-old Boston Whaler boats that look like new and perform like new. Don't be shy about buying one with more age and hours.

biggiefl
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby biggiefl » Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:32 am

A $3,000 reduction from the current MSRP of $28,000 [as mentioned above by Phil] is definitely not enough discount for a one-year-old boat; the 2020 models are out.

To pay $25,000 for a used 15-foot boat is outrageous as well.

I would be looking at used boats. Most buyers will find a 15-foot boat is too small in a relatively short period of time. You might want to test drive one before you buy to see how it will fit your needs.
On my 24th Whaler. Currently in the stable: 86 18' Outrage, 81 13' Sport(original owner), 87 11' Sport, 69 Squall(for sale cheap).

Jadoca
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Jadoca » Wed Oct 30, 2019 2:22 pm

Factory Incentives should be out soon if they are not already on the 2020 and leftover 2019 model years.

jimh
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby jimh » Wed Oct 30, 2019 2:57 pm

Re owner life span of a 15-foot Boston Whaler: as NICK mentions, if you buy a 15-foot Boston Whaler as your first boat, and you discover you enjoy boating with an outboard boat and a trailerable boat, you will be likely to move to a bigger boat in a short time. Apparently the first buyer of the 150 MONTAUK took only a few months to figure out he wanted a bigger boat.

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Phil T
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Phil T » Wed Oct 30, 2019 5:19 pm

Boston Whaler does not discount the MSRP of the standard boat configuration.

Incentives tend to be on accessories and/or dealer option/services and not reduction on the MSRP.

Boston Whaler does not build inventory. When you visit the dealer, your purchase is a factory order with a lead time of several months. In rare instances a dealer will order a hull on spec. With the elimination of floor financing, this is risky.

Occasionally a dealer will sell a showroom model after several years with a small discount.
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Jadoca
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Jadoca » Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:19 pm

Phil T wrote:Boston Whaler does not discount the MSRP of the standard boat configuration.

Incentives tend to be on accessories and/or dealer option/services and not reduction on the MSRP.

Boston Whaler does not build inventory. When you visit the dealer, your purchase is a factory order with a lead time of several months. In rare instances a dealer will order a hull on spec. With the elimination of floor financing, this is risky.

Occasionally a dealer will sell a showroom model after several years with a small discount.


Disagree. I have received both factory and dealer incentives on new in stock and ordered boats from Whaler.
Usually late in current calendar year or early in the next.

jimh
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby jimh » Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:52 pm

There might be incentives from “the factory” but they are probably for the dealer and aren’t published or given to the retail buyer. If there are Boston Whaler discounts on the price of the base boat, just give a hyperlink to them when they are made public or to some past incentives if their public announcement is still online.

Jefecinco
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Jefecinco » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:13 am

My experience with buying new Boston Whalers from dealers is that so called mega-dealers are the least willing to deal when selling boats. I've only bought two new boats. and in both cases I used small dealers and bought from on-hand stock. In both cases I was able to negotiate significant discounts.

I believe various factors affect a dealers willingness to negotiate. The current state of the economy and ability of the dealer to sell boats is a factor. If a dealer is unable to sell boats at MSRP he will reduce price until the boats sell or he runs out of operating capitol and goes out of business. Time-of-year can affect price for the same reason. If sales are slow or nonexistent, then prices need to be adjusted.

The largest discount I was able to get was in a very down economy for a left over year model boat from a dealer several hundred miles far from our home. The other discounted boat was from my local dealer in January.

My present local dealer is a mega-dealer and will not discuss a discount of any kind these days. Locally the boating season is year round and boats are selling well. That's not good news for buyers of new Boston Whaler boats here.
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby biggiefl » Thu Oct 31, 2019 10:49 am

Maybe things have changed but I would not pay MSRP for anything, especially a boat. The old rule of thumb is thirds. If a boat's MSRP is $90k it was usually $30k it cost the manufacturer to make the boat. $60k is what the dealer paid from the manufacturer and in the next $30k is the profit they will make. I have lost a lot of faith since they were bought by Brunswick and mostly sold through Marine Max stealerships. I have found that winter boat shows are your best places to shop. You can still negotiate on "boat show specials". Lastly....you make your best deal when you are not looking to buy.

One should always have an open mind as well. If Whaler is not willing to negotiate and the Scout dealer is, weigh your options. Just because it has a Mercedes emblem does not mean a BMW, Jag, or Lexus is subpar.
On my 24th Whaler. Currently in the stable: 86 18' Outrage, 81 13' Sport(original owner), 87 11' Sport, 69 Squall(for sale cheap).

Jadoca
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Jadoca » Thu Oct 31, 2019 5:06 pm

Incentives should be on Whaler site [January 1].

Ledgewalk
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Ledgewalk » Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:18 pm

Appreciate all the feedback. It's given me a lot to think about. Thanks again.

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FirstWhaler
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby FirstWhaler » Fri Nov 01, 2019 9:04 am

Last year I bought my first boat, a DAUNTLESS 16. I had a lot of fun in-shore, but I wish I had bought a 18- or 20-foot boat.

F82MG
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby F82MG » Fri Nov 01, 2019 6:18 pm

My first boat was a 150 Montauk. I bought it used for [$14,500] and sold it two years later for essentially the same price. The boat was fun and served its purpose very well. I would recommend buying it used as you will probably upsize soon.

Jefecinco
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Jefecinco » Sat Nov 02, 2019 11:02 am

FirstWhaler - When I sold my first Boston Whaler, a 1999 Dauntless 16, after owning it for 10 years I essentially received what I had paid for it when it was new. I was out the cost of the self-installed electronics and the four blade stainless steel propeller I had added to the boat but felt that was a very low cost for all the pleasure the boat had provided over the 10 years of ownership. I was also out the difference in the 1999 cost versus the 2009 cost but really felt that the total outlay was well worth the pleasure the Dauntless provided.

Since your Dauntless was a used boat you should be able to sell it for about what you have spent and buy an 18 to 20 foot boat, even another Dauntless if you like the basic layout.
Butch

Tacky79
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby Tacky79 » Mon Nov 04, 2019 11:18 am

I think you need to walk the fine line between negotiating a good price and not alienating your local dealer. Whatever way you negotiate, just make it so that you don't offend the dealer for life, as you may need his help at some point for warranty.

Along those lines, you could say "That's the boat for me, and I'm ready to buy, but I'm at a much lower price than you are asking. Would you take $dd,ddd for it?" If he says no, you can just tell him you'll have to think about it.

I don't think it makes sense to squabble over $1000 or $1500 on a purchase like this, if that's the boat for you. I don't like to over pay for anything, but losing the perfect boat for you isn't worth a few bucks, either.
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jimh
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby jimh » Mon Nov 04, 2019 12:26 pm

Regarding the ability to buy, own, and use a Boston Whaler boat and then sell the boat for very close to the initial purchase price: this effect is not due to some complete resistance of the Boston Whaler boat to depreciate with time, but rather due to the continually rising cost of new Boston Whaler boats of similar size. A reasonable example can be taken from the very popular 170 MONTAUK.

At introduction in 2002, the MSRP base price for a 170 MONTAUK was $17,655. Using the WHALER.COM website and the build-your-own feature, the base price for a 2020 170 MONTAUK is $35,198. Thus in 18-years the base boat MSRP has increased by $17,543, a 99.4-percent increase. This suggests that the price of Boston Whaler boats is rising at about 5.5-percent per year.

Or, we could estimate the value of $17,655 in 2002 in terms of 2020-dollars. One website offers that function:

https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

Using an input of $17,655 in 2002 and asking for a calculated value in 2020 returns $25,198, or 42.7-percent inflation over 18-years.

Clearly the cost of a 170 MONTAUK has been rising faster than the value of the dollars that will buy one.

The cost of a similar new replacement boat often will drag upward the price of used boats of the same design. This might allow someone to own, for example, a 170 MONTAUK for 18 years and be able to sell it used at nearly its original cost--now only about 50-percent of the cost of a new boat.

Another factor in the good resale value of a Boston Whaler boat comes from the general durability of the Boston Whaler boat, its rugged construction, and its tendency to not employ fads in its design. Boats are not subject to the same wear and tear as a car, particularly fiberglass boats used seasonally in freshwater.

In the case of buying a used boat, the expectation of retained value is probably even better. A used boat has already experienced loss of value due depreciation and also increase in value due to new-boat price inflation. So its price is likely to remain fairly constant over a short period of time, say two or three years. However, prices of used boats vary widely. The notion that a used boat can be bought, owned for a few years, and sold at the same price depends on buying the boat at a very good price to begin with.

cebulap
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby cebulap » Mon Nov 04, 2019 2:38 pm

30% rule of thumb on new boats dose not really apply to small whalers, Boston Whaler dose not give the dealers much room to move on the smaller boats, there is more room as the boats get larger. Go to SeeDealerCost.com, I have used this as a good start of how much room there is on new boats and has worked pretty close. The thing that is not accounted for is volume discounts that the dealers may get.

I ran the numbers on that sight and MSRP on that boat new in 2019 was $28,630 dealer cost $25,766, not counting electronics or bottom paint.

cebulap
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby cebulap » Mon Nov 04, 2019 2:42 pm

Also comparing the cost of a 2002 to a 2020 is not completely linear. With the improvement of the model change in 2018 would increase the cost alone outside of inflation.

jimh
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Re: 2019 150 MONTAUK Purchase: Price Negotiation

Postby jimh » Mon Nov 04, 2019 7:00 pm

Warren Buffet once remarked: the value of a good product is how easily its price can be raised. In my opinion that is a very acute and cogent analysis. And by that analysis, the 170 MONTAUK has been a good product, as can be seen how much its prices has been raised.

In my view, there is some potential for being misled by my 2002 170 MONTAUK price example. When the 170 was introduced, it was replacing the most popular model that Boston Whaler had ever made, the classic MONTAUK 17. The MSRP of the classic MONTAUK 17 in 2002 was about $24,000. When the 170 MONTAUK was announced at $17,655, it was substantially less expensive than the prior model, and the very attractive price might have been calculated to insure that there was very enthusiastic adoption of the new model. If the new model 170 MONTAUK had been introduced at a price that was $5,000 MORE than the existing model, I don't think it would have sold as well as it did.