Making my first boat a classic whaler

A conversation among Whalers
inlandlaker
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Making my first boat a classic whaler

Postby inlandlaker » Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:33 pm

Greetings. I am in the market for my first boat. Having spent a lot of time on Cape Cod in the harbors, I have always admired the form and function of a Boston Whaler.

I found a 1969 hull that is being billed as a MINOT that has just gone though a full restoration including shoring up a section of the floor, custom paint and epoxy bottom with three coats of bottom paint. Original wood seat [original seat was not wood—jimh] and side mount fiberglass console have been replaced, and the boat has been re-powered with an Evinrude E-TEC 90 with less than 10 hours.

What might I look for that would indicate a quality restoration?

Would around $10,000 a fair price for this boat?

Some photographs of the refurbishing process are available at
https://imgur.com/a/stt43sk

MINOT_.jpg
Fig. 1. A refurbished 1969 Boston Whaler 16-footer.
MINOT_.jpg (54.59 KiB) Viewed 3074 times

https://imgur.com/a/QgTFzaz

Thanks for replies.

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Phil T
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Re: Making my first boat a classic whaler

Postby Phil T » Thu Apr 02, 2020 9:54 pm

What makes it a "Minot" is the interior console, seating arrangements. If it is not all original, then it is considered/called a 16' Custom.

Sorry to say but painting the hull topsides and replacing parts of the interior is not a restoration, more a renovation. This detracts from its value.

Copy the photo and add it to your cloud account/add a link or email to me (click on my name to get my email) and I will add to the thread.
1992 Outrage 17
2019 E-TEC 90
2018 LoadRite 18280096VT
Member since 2003

NLA01
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Re: Making my first boat a classic whaler

Postby NLA01 » Fri Apr 03, 2020 12:21 am

If you want classic restored Boston Whaler boat, you should pass on this boat.

If you want a original 16 hull which has been painted, refit with a non-original console, a non-original seat, and don't care that nothing is original, then this boat will be okay for you.

The $10,000 asking price is really for the value of the Evinrude E-TEC engine, not the boat.

If you are really looking for a classic Whaler you will be disappointed getting a boat like this boat. The seat is a nice swing back, but not Whaler OEM.

The console is a cheap old design that is ugly on its best day. Since the the boat is not going to have original parts, why not put in a modern nice console?

Then there are the missing side rails and bow rails, no windshield, no grab rail on the console.

The fuel tank is under-sized.

There is no bow locker hatch.

There is no access to the inside of the console. You would need to cut holes and add plastic hatches.

[These flaws subtract] if you want a classic Whaler look.

This boat looks like [the seller is] after a cheap quick flip on the sale.

Archie

jimh
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Re: Making my first boat a classic whaler

Postby jimh » Fri Apr 03, 2020 6:30 am

The refurbished 16-foot 1969 Boston Whaler hull (seen above in Figure 1) is no longer a MINOT model. It is now a custom refurbished 16-foot Boston Whaler boat.

Regarding a MINOT, that model was a lower-cost variant of a KATAMA. The MINOT did not have a windshield, nor railings at the helm console, nor a wooden seat. It had a molded console and a large flat molded seat behind the console with no upholstery.

The hull of the boat under discussion looked to be in rather rough condition in the photographs of the repairs. As Phil mentions, when all original gel coat finish is gone and replaced with paint, there is a loss in value. Also, exactly how long the painted finish will remain durable and bright is unknown. There is a lot of rough underlying surface below that paint top coat.

The integrity of the hull and the workmanship of the repairs cannot be judged from a few photographs. An in-person and close, careful visual inspection is necessary, along with some tapping of the hull to assess it for any voids or soft spots. See the FAQ question:

Q3: Is There Water in a Hull?
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/FAQ/#Q3

FAQ wrote:The best method for locating de-lamination is to use the factory's own technique: tapping with a small plastic head hammer. The report of a hammer tap will be much different over areas that have de-bonded than on sound areas.


By performing extensive repair and refurbishment to the boat, there is no doubt the seller has hoped to increase the boat's value and selling price. This is not a commission of a sin. The seller has every right to expect to gain value from the work he did.

That the seller bought the boat with the intention of making repairs and selling the boat, is not unusual, suspicious, or contemptible. Many artisans perform this sort of work with the expectation of earning money from their labors. I can't condemn the seller because he refurbished this boat and wants to sell it. That may be how he earns his living.

The E-TEC 90 is a very good engine for that hull. I don't know the exact retail price of a new E-TEC 90 with rigging, propeller, and gauges. It might be close to $10,000 for just the engine and accessories. The steering is probably new, too. That adds value. The high value in the engine actually means the asking price of "about $10,000" accounts for not a great deal of value in the boat itself. You can look at the proposition as follows: would I buy a almost new E-TEC 90-HP engine for $8,000, including all the rigging and accessories, and installation onto a boat, and then also buy this refurbished 51-year-old Boston Whaler boat for $2,000? Viewing the deal in that perspective may give you a better feeling for the relative value of the asking price for the boat and engine as a single entity.

A few deviations from the classic look: the yellow hull color is unusual, but in today's boating, not abnormal. The side rails are missing. The non-OEM molded console is not particularly awful. Its construction and rigging is impossible to judge from one photograph.

One anomaly: how do you add fuel to the tank under the seat? The filler cap seems hidden. The tank volume looks quite sufficient to me for the E-TEC. A 16-foot open skiff is not expected to carry enough fuel for trips of hundreds of miles.

Is there a trailer?

If your goal is to have a restored classic 16-footer, you would need a white hull, a blue deck, and a lot more varnished mahogany components. The E-TEC 90 would be fine on any classic. There actually are thousands and thousands of older 16/17-foot Boston Whaler boats still in use. They are by no means rare.

biggiefl
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Re: Making my first boat a classic whaler

Postby biggiefl » Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:38 am

Trailer and what year e-tec?

$10k again is fair if engine is practically new. Many things to consider but looks like a square deal if you do not care about originality.
On my 24th Whaler. Currently in the stable: 86 18' Outrage, 81 13' Sport(original owner), 87 11' Sport, 69 Squall(for sale cheap).

inlandlaker
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Re: Making my first boat a classic whaler

Postby inlandlaker » Fri Apr 03, 2020 10:52 am

Thank you all so much for your thoughtful responses.I am learning much here. To know that the model was so dependent on the above deck configuration and not so much the hull itself is interesting.

It is clear to me that the majority of the value of this boat is in the engine. I figured if the value of the hull was essentially a wash I could compromise on the lack of original parts and appearance. I am not so much concerned with having a year and model accurate restoration as I am with having a hull with the characteristics of the whaler.

The boat does come with the side and bow rails as well as the bimini top, and it is on a trailer. The E-TEC was new in 2019.

This forum has been immensely helpful, thank you all again.

biggiefl
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Re: Making my first boat a classic whaler

Postby biggiefl » Fri Apr 03, 2020 11:55 am

There are differences in the hull shape between a classic 16 and a classic 17. The 17 will ride smoother and drier. The 16 is lighter and will probably run in shallower water as the hull is flatter. Again $10,000 is solid, $9,000 is better for all you are getting.
On my 24th Whaler. Currently in the stable: 86 18' Outrage, 81 13' Sport(original owner), 87 11' Sport, 69 Squall(for sale cheap).

jimh
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Re: Making my first boat a classic whaler

Postby jimh » Fri Apr 03, 2020 1:32 pm

The addition of a trailer, railings, and a Bimini top enhances the value in the boat.

Many older Boston Whaler boats have been modified from original condition. The concern with any modification is two part:

--how well the modification was accomplished, the workmanship, the finish, and so on, and

--how well the modification was designed, how it appears, its aesthetic appeal.

You mention you admire the "form and function" of a Boston Whaler boat. I do, too. Home-made modifications do not intrinsically improve the form or the function. If OEM parts are abandoned, their replacements need to be intelligently designed and very well made. One guy's idea of an improvement to a Boston Whaler may not be universally met with similar enthusiasm. The people who designed Boston Whaler boats were some rather crafty fellows, and outdoing their designs will be difficult.

Generally the MOST admired classic-era Boston Whaler boats are the ones that are all-original or very close to all-original, have a lot of teak and mahogany wood in perfect condition, even in some cases now varnished to a high gloss (which was never done by Boston Whaler) and perhaps even more wood trim than original; boats with original gel coat finish and thus original colors with a polished and waxed finish, having no bottom paint, with no history of significant repairs made, and if repairs were made, the work is excellent and the repair imperceptible. Canvas made by Wm. J. Mills & Co. is the favorite, with Pacific Blue being a very traditional color. Powering with an engine of appropriate size, and by that I mean the actual size of the engine, not its power; some early four-stroke-power-cycle engines are huge for their horsepower, with a cowling size on a 90-HP that would fit a 200-HP engine. (The E-TEC 90 is beautifully sized for a classic 16-footer).

To learn more about the change in the hull design that occurred c.1976 you should read this article I wrote in the REFERENCE section over 20-years ago:

The 16/17 Hull
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/16-17/

NOTE: the website resources are much larger than just the articles seen in the current listing of forum topics. I encourage you to begin at the top-page of the WHALER section and explore. Begin at

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/index.html