170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

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jaymoussy
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170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby jaymoussy » Fri Oct 30, 2015 9:24 am

It looks like I may put my Montauk 170 on a mooring during the warm months next year, at the nearby marina, in sheltered Cape Cod inner bay waters.

I am not familiar with the actual tieing of a boat to a mooring, and the specifics on the Montauk. I read that the bow eye is hard to reach and I have seen different styles of pendants online--kind of confusing. What do I need to know?

Should I keep in the plug and leave the sump pump on AUTO?

Or, keep out the plug and allow a small amount [of water to collect] at the stern and not worry about freak rainstorm?

I will be nearby, and can do a check on the boat, as needed.

I found long thread on the subject of plugs in old forum.

jimh
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby jimh » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:06 am

If I were leaving my Boston Whaler boat on a permanent mooring, I'd want to have two pendants from the mooring ball to the boat. One pendant would be set shorter so it would take up the strain initially, and a second pendant set slightly longer to take up the strain in case the first pennant failed.

Reaching over the bow to make a line fast to the bow eye on the stem is generally too difficult to accomplish, even on a small boat like a 17-footer, and with the nature of the bow on the 170 MONTAUK I'd think it would be very hard to reach the bow eye from the boat. To use the bow eye as a mooring point, I would attach a short pendant to the bow eye, rigged with an eye splice and thimble at the free end. This pendant is made long enough to bring the free end up and over the bow, so you can tie or fasten the mooring pennant to the bow eye pennant.

Exactly how to attach the short pendant to the bow eye remains to be solved. I suppose you also have an eye splice and thimble at the bow-eye end of the short pendant and use a shackle to connect it to the bow eye.

jimh
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby jimh » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:20 am

Regarding the cockpit sump drain to the sea: if the trim on the boat at rest is such that the water coming in via the sump drain is always contained in the sump, I'd leave the sump drain open to the sea when on the mooring. The sump pump would then be set to OFF.

Hoosier
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby Hoosier » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:23 am

You may be able to leave the drain plug out. On my 1986 Montauk I could do that and got almost no water above the sump. I'd just go try it and see how much comes in and go from there. If it's too much to make leaving the plug out an option, look at a solar charger for your battery so the bilge pump can't kill the battery.
1978 Outrage V20 with 2004 Suzuki DF-115. 1992 23 Walkaround with two 2010 Yamaha F-150s.

JRP
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby JRP » Fri Oct 30, 2015 12:30 pm

The conventional wisdom usually advises two mooring pendants. And in fact, many marinas and harbormasters still cling to this requirement.

However, after decades of mooring boats of various sizes, I recommend against this approach. Dual pendants have the tendency to tangle, wrap, and wear at each other. Often the purpose for which the are intended -- redundancy -- is defeated by the wear and tear that they inflict on each other. Particulalry in a big blow with wave action, they have a tendency to saw each other in half.

In my opinion a better approach is a single over-sized mooring pennant, professionally spliced, fitted with correctly-sized schackles and chaffing gear, and connected to properly spec-ed and sized ground tackle. My experience is that a single over-sized pendant will outlast dual pendants by a factor of 3-4 before needing replacement, and I would have far more confidence in an over-sized single pendant suriving a big blow than dual pendants.

The single-pendant approach is being adopted in many locations. The most recent marina where we moored our 14,000 lbs displacement boat prohibited dual pendants.

flymo
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby flymo » Fri Oct 30, 2015 12:41 pm

Having tried the two pendants thing, I advise against that - it's a complete nightmare. As wind and tide swing the boat around, the pendants sink and wrap themselves around the mooring chain and the whole thing becomes a tangled mess. Been there, done that, and you don't want to.

If you are in a sheltered area, keep it simple. The mooring pendant will have an eye splice on the boat end - just slip it over a bow cleat, and cleat another piece of line over the top of it so it won't slip off. You'll see formulas about what size pendant to use for what size boat; forget about them, just use the heaviest pendant available that will still fit on your cleat. That will likely be something much heavier than the formula.

If the mooring location is more open to wind and waves, the boat will ride more quietly if you attach the pendant to the tow eye - connecting low down, near the waterline, makes a surprising amount of difference in how bouncy things get. If you go that route, have a custom pendant made with a swivel on the mooring ball end and a thimble on the boat end. Use a shackle to connect a large stainless clip to the thimble, and then clip on to the bow eye. Use another shackle to the pendant's thimble to connect a safety line to a bow cleat, in case the clip comes off (although it shouldn't, with the swivel in place). A bonus with this method is that you can use a very short pendant, which may help in a crowded mooring area.

Yes, you can't reach down from the deck very easily to release the clip from the bow eye, but it's very easy to reach from the dinghy in which you rowed to the mooring. You just need to remember to do so, or it gets embarassing or wet or both...ask me how I know.

Flymo
Last edited by flymo on Fri Oct 30, 2015 3:44 pm, edited 3 times in total.

tomcharron
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby tomcharron » Fri Oct 30, 2015 1:26 pm

Fairly simple: use two pendants the same length.

I do this all the time when pulling my dingy on the open pacific ocean. If one fails the other is there to ensure holding.

macfam
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby macfam » Fri Oct 30, 2015 10:55 pm

I've had two moorings on Cape Cod for over 20 years. There has been at least one Whaler attached to these, at one time or other.
Do this right, and NEVER worry.

Let's assume you have a worthy, inspected mooring with adequate chain, swivels, and shackles. I highly recommend a Taylor Sur-mor mooring ball with a PVC pipe through the middle. That PVC tube allows the chain end to be on the top of the ball, out of the water. This is where your pendant gets attached, remaining dry throughout the season. This prevents the hardware from being submerged and being fouled with marine growth.

Now the pendant: The very best is a CYCLONE MOORING PENDANT, made from Endura 12TM, a 100% Dyneema® SK75 fiber rope characterized by extremely high tensile strength and ultra low elongation. And is developed and used by Nantucket Moorings in conjunction MIT and New England Ropes. The rope is coated with a proprietary tinted vinyl-based formula to enhance durability, improve fiber-to-fiber abrasion, protect from UV, and provide a system for color coding. And it FLOATS! This Dyneema is stonger that steel cable of the same diameter, and ALWAYS remains soft to the hand.

R & W Rope in New Bedford is unbelievable! Describe your situation, take a few pics, and call KEVIN, at R & W ropes, and they will custom fabricate and splice the New England Rope product. They will furnish a spliced eye to attach to you front cleat. Easy.

One more thing: When off the mooring, it is convenient to have a "Pick-up buoy" attached to your line. Simply approach the mooring, reach for the raised rod, pick it up and your pendant is attached--nice! If you plan on doing this multi-year, purchase your pick-up buoy from Inland Marine <http://www.mushroommooring.com> They manufacture a buoy antenna that won't splinter and KILL your hands. They also have the Taylor Sur-Mor Ball too--and cheapest!

I have a Dyneema split bridle using 1/2-inch line with admirable chafe guard holding a 9000-lbs Albin 28. This past week, 45 knot winds, and no problem!

The plug should remain in if your bilge pump operates, and you've got a good battery. You CAN leave the plug out, and the boat will drain without the bilge pump. However, this is only recommended for SHORT periods of time. The reason: marine growth doesn't take long to get established in your sump, and who needs that?

In any event, if your battery or bilge pump quits, then rain will accumulate, blah, blah, blah.
Hey, it's a Whaler--she ain't gonna sink!
Good luck!

Ridge Runner
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby Ridge Runner » Wed Nov 11, 2015 6:18 pm

I keep my 170 in the water tied up to my dock in Florida. I made the decision to pull the drain plug after too many huge rain storms killed my two large batteries. My 170 does not have any water that comes up over the sump with the plug out; my engine is an E-tec 115HO; the sump is small. I just prepped and painted the inside of the sump with white 1161 Pettit Vivid Hard SR Ablative Anti-fouling Bottom Paint. No more worries.
Member since 2005
2005 170 Montauk, 2010 E-TEC 115 H.O.
2016 210 Montauk, 2017 E-TEC G2 200 H.O.

"Red sky at night, sailor’s delight - Red sky in the morning, sailor’s warning”

jimh
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby jimh » Wed Nov 11, 2015 7:54 pm

Painting the sump with anti-fouling paint--great idea!

Hoosier
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby Hoosier » Thu Nov 12, 2015 9:11 pm

Don't forget the drain tube.
1978 Outrage V20 with 2004 Suzuki DF-115. 1992 23 Walkaround with two 2010 Yamaha F-150s.

Jefecinco
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby Jefecinco » Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:15 am

As copper is the primary anti-fouling ingredient in anti-fouling paint the old brass tubes MAY not need any anti-fouling paint. Another consideration is that commonly used ablative anti-fouling paint may not play well over metal. If the drain tube needs an anti-fouling coating a specialized paint may be indicated.
Butch

endus
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby endus » Mon Nov 16, 2015 3:04 pm

I would definitely not leave the drain plug out. Even if you are comfortable with where the boat sits in the water, you're going to get marine growth in the sump where it will cause problems and be impossible to clean out. I think the suggestion of a solar charger and leaving the pump on is excellent. That's what I would do if my boat were on a mooring.

Ridge Runner
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby Ridge Runner » Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:38 pm

I will stand on my previous statement - I have always been much more comfortable leaving the plug out. I have been doing this for over 35 years with many, many Boston Whaler boats. From experience a lot more can go wrong with leaving the pug in than leaving it outL batteries can die, float switches malfunction, strainer baskets get clogged, pumps die. Most folks with a small whaler will only have one battery. If that battery dies you are stuck, and, most likely, a fully discharged battery will need to be replaced.

From my 170 Montauk's owner's manual: "The deck drain provides self-bailing capabilities while the boat is static in the water and no passengers on board. This feature prevents the accumulation of water in the cockpit. The drain must be in place when underway."

For me this just works as a very simple solution.
Member since 2005
2005 170 Montauk, 2010 E-TEC 115 H.O.
2016 210 Montauk, 2017 E-TEC G2 200 H.O.

"Red sky at night, sailor’s delight - Red sky in the morning, sailor’s warning”

MariettaMark
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby MariettaMark » Thu Mar 24, 2016 3:33 pm

Ridge Runner wrote:I have always been much more comfortable leaving the plug out...


That post is relevant to my situation. I have an 1985 Montauk 17, and I want to leave it tied to my marina dock for the summer. I just bought a sump pump (but have not yet installed it) to handle rainwater; I assumed you had to leave the drain plugs in while the boat was in the water. If I understand this answer correctly, you can remove the lower drain plug and the boat will self bail and not sink. I know Whalers are not supposed to sink but I wasn't sure with a 100-HP engine on the back.

This is my first power boat. My previous boat was a sailboat and I have the houseboat that the Whaler is the tender for.

jimh
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby jimh » Thu Mar 24, 2016 4:30 pm

For advice on the drain plugs of a different boat, not the 170 MONTAUK which is the topic of this thread, read the owner's manual for the different boat. If the different boat is a classic MONTAUK 17, an on-line version of the owner's manual for that boat has been available since c.2005. See

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/manual9-17/

For specific advice about the drain plugs on the 9-foot through 17-foot hulls, see the special section of the owner's manual on that topic:

http://continuouswave.com/whaler/refere ... drainTubes

To determine how high any water in the cockpit will rise in your boat when left at the dock, remove the cockpit sump drain plug, step off the boat, and watch what happens. Seawater will enter the cockpit sump and fill it. If the boat has a particularly heavy condition, water may rise above the cockpit sump and flood parts of the cockpit. Once the water level stabilizes, this will be the level that will remain in the boat. If rain falls, the water will not rise any higher.

MariettaMark
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Re: 170 MONTAUK: First Time on a Mooring; Drain Plug

Postby MariettaMark » Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:28 pm

Thank you, I do have the classic Montauk 17.