Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Repair or modification of Boston Whaler boats, their engines, trailers, and gear
InVision
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Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby InVision » Mon Oct 16, 2017 8:48 am

Based on a few outings in our newly acquired use 190 Nantucket with Mercury 150-HP OptiMax, I think trim tabs might be very helpful.

[Wants to see] photos of trim tabs installed on a 190 Nantucket or 190 Outrage.

I have read the article by Jim on Seymour's install of electric trim tabs. Not sure I like that tabs bridging the strake. In the past I have better luck when the tab is between the strakes.

Thank you--M
Last edited by InVision on Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:33 am, edited 3 times in total.
Proud owner of 2004 Boston Whaler 190 Nantucket ! ;)

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jimh
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby jimh » Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:26 am

InVision wrote:I have read the article...on...trim tabs.


I think you mean to refer to this article

Trim Tab Installation
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/trimTabs.html

InVision wrote:...Not sure I like that tabs bridging the chime (sic).


I think you are referring to the trim tab being installed so it is across a hull bottom running strake. The chine of a hull is much too far outboard for a trim tab to mount in a way that would extend past the chine. The word "chine" is not mentioned in the article. The article describes the installation of trim tabs relative to the position of hull strakes. The term "strake" is mentioned eight times in the article, and illustrations show how some trim tabs are installed so that they are in-line with hull bottom strakes.

InVision
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby InVision » Mon Oct 16, 2017 9:44 am

I did and I fixed it thanks Jim !!

M
Proud owner of 2004 Boston Whaler 190 Nantucket ! ;)

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vze2gbs4
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby vze2gbs4 » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:49 am

Your only options for 190 is Lenco electric tabs . If I remember correctly its 9 x 9 .Port side seat is removable so traditional installation on port side going through the hull with cables wont work because there is no space under the seat like the starboard side has .What whaler did is run port side tab cable on the transom (like a transducer )and bring it to the motor well and than connect it to main motor harness where all other cables are so this way it will get to starboard side ,connect with starboard side cable so you can run them together through a designated tubing to get to the console and eventually to the helm .If you google pic of 190 with tabs on the trailer you will understand what has to be done .

Divin'Ivan
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby Divin'Ivan » Mon Oct 16, 2017 12:29 pm

I installed my Lenco Trim Tabs a few months ago and I'm very glad I finally did. I went with the 12x9 instead of the 9x9.

Image

Notice I did not have to go over the transom on my port side, I simply went in a bit closer to the motor. As you can see, my dive ladder is on my port side, vs on the starboard for your model.
Image

Image
Current boat - 2018 270 Dauntless, Twin Mercury 225 Verado
Previous boat - 2013 190 Outrage, Mercury 150 EFI - SOLD

InVision
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby InVision » Mon Oct 16, 2017 3:07 pm

I like that installation. Being toward the outside it seems you have better adjustments. If only it was not drilling holes which I hate. May consider having it done at the service shop. Can anyone talk to how much effort is involved in a DIY?

M
Proud owner of 2004 Boston Whaler 190 Nantucket ! ;)

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Jefecinco
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby Jefecinco » Mon Oct 16, 2017 7:31 pm

Bennett also sells electrically operated trim tabs for use when space is limited below deck. They have an excellent customer support reputation.
Butch

vze2gbs4
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby vze2gbs4 » Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:07 pm

Invision--if you decide to [install trim tabs] be very careful to choose the right model. I went through this.

To save you a headache: ONLY one [two?] model[s] will fit the very-trim-tab-unfriendly transom of the 190 NANTUCKET because of the very limited space due caused by the swim platform; and the angle of the actuator (when the tab is flush with the hull bottom when fully retracted).

[The two model of the trim tab recommended are the] LENCO Edge-mount or Bennet Edge-mount Bolt electric tabs; the actuator is a standard 101 series.

Boston Whaler installs 9x9 tabs; I choose 9x12--just like Ivan did.

If you decide to use 9X9 tabs, the actuator is custom order--super shor--made only for Boston Whaler. A custom order translate to big bucks. I think this option was over $1,000; cost was the reason I choose longer ones.

Installation is very straight-forward, but [be certain] to measure everything three times before you drill holes. Do a mock up run to make sure [the tabs will] retract and deploy fully from a desired spot . Several locations may be need [to be tested] to find the right spot and angle.

Make sure you seal all the [fastener] holes and every single [fastener] individually--some even so-called pros will skip this step; guess how I know.

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby jimh » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:06 pm

VZE--I found your advice a bit confusing. You said only one model will fit, but then you mention two different manufacturers.

Which manufacturer did you use? LENCO or BENNETT?

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby jimh » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:21 pm

'VISION--what aspect of the boat's performance after a few outings led you to conclude that the hull needed trim tabs?

Do you think the hull needs trim tabs to get on plane better?

Do you think the hull needs trim tabs to even out the lateral trim?

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby jimh » Tue Oct 17, 2017 9:33 pm

'IVAN--thanks for the nice photos and advice from your installation. I noted the extreme outboard mounting location. The farther out from the keel the tabs are located, the better their effect on changing lateral trim. However, I wonder if having the tabs more inboard would make them more effective with the fore-and-aft trim.

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby vze2gbs4 » Tue Oct 17, 2017 11:38 pm

I used Lenco 9 X 12 ( careful here because there are 12 X 9 as well-you cant use these ) edge mount tabs kit with Led indicator switch with auto retract feature. Bennet Electric tabs must be recent product developed to compete with Lenco. Back in a day when I was installing them no such a thing. I am not all that crazy about Lenco because I had 2 failure of that 101 actuator on my other boats but it was the only option for this hull.Never had a failure of hydraulic Bennet tabs on my bigger boats.I think problem with actuator develops if the boat is water slipped and sea life attacks actuator ram causing failure . Since your boat has a lift you may see long life from your tabs.

InVision
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby InVision » Wed Oct 18, 2017 4:51 am

jimh wrote:'VISION--what aspect of the boat's performance after a few outings led you to conclude that the hull needed trim tabs?

Do you think the hull needs trim tabs to get on plane better?

Do you think the hull needs trim tabs to even out the lateral trim?


Jim - Mostly operation in shallow waters which we have a bunch of here in the Destin area. Boat wants to ride higher in the bow and come off plane faster than we like. Our top end was really good, 45-MPH SOG at 5500 RPM with the OptiMax 150-HP with two people, light gear and full gas tank. Not too much trouble all from side to side, but we only had my wife and I on the leaning post.

We do have a Doel-Fin that the original owner installed which may helps some. Obviously big debate about Doel-Fin. I personally would not have installed one because I hate drilling hole :-).


M
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chicagodiver
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby chicagodiver » Wed May 09, 2018 11:00 am

I read all these posts, and ordered the wrong [trim tab size].

I have 190 Nantucket, recently bought, that runs great. I ordered 9x12 Lenco as suggested on this forum. A Lenco 9x12 is actually 9 long and 12 wide.

What people need to order is 12x9. I read the description while ordering but it did not specify it, and thought, people on the forums are always right and just bought it. Before installing i didn’t measure it either—dumb on my part.

I didn’t want a swim platform so in my case 9x12 worked.

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby Divin'Ivan » Wed May 09, 2018 6:11 pm

chicagodiver wrote:I read all these posts, and ordered the wrong [trim tab size].

I have 190 Nantucket, recently bought, that runs great. I ordered 9x12 Lenco as suggested on this forum. A Lenco 9x12 is actually 9 long and 12 wide.

What people need to order is 12x9. I read the description while ordering but it did not specify it, and thought, people on the forums are always right and just bought it. Before installing i didn’t measure it either—dumb on my part.

I didn’t want a swim platform so in my case 9x12 worked.


If you read my post you will see that I wrote 12x9. I really like the way the longer tabs perform, I almost went with a 12x12 but I was concerned that the edge of the starboard tab would be too close to the water speed sensor. I'm curious as to why you don't want a swim platform, how do you get back on board after a dive?
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Divin'Ivan
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby Divin'Ivan » Wed May 09, 2018 6:18 pm

jimh wrote:'IVAN--thanks for the nice photos and advice from your installation. I noted the extreme outboard mounting location. The farther out from the keel the tabs are located, the better their effect on changing lateral trim. However, I wonder if having the tabs more inboard would make them more effective with the fore-and-aft trim.


Thanks Jim, the fore-and-aft trim works quite well, I'm definitely able to trim the bow down into the waves on a choppy day and the ride improvement is noticeable. What is really nice is the lateral adjustments, they are very responsive. Another benefit to having them wide is that they are well out of the way of the trailer bunks, so I really don't need to worry about retracting them when I load the boat on the trailer. Overall I think the size of tab and placement was ideal for my needs.
Current boat - 2018 270 Dauntless, Twin Mercury 225 Verado
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby jimh » Thu May 10, 2018 4:35 pm

My very strong preference is to collect GOOD information, and at this point, I find the information content of this thread is very confused. I will review the contents and try to organize the information, which is mostly about the length and width dimensions of the a trim tab. Here is what I find.

Very early in the thread a dimension is mentioned:

vze2gbs4 wrote:If I remember correctly [the size of the OEM trim tab used by Boston Whaler is] 9 x 9.


Immediately following, the next post says:

Divin'Ivan wrote:I installed my Lenco Trim Tabs ...I went with the 12 x 9 instead of the 9 x 9.


At this point, there are two sizes mentioned for TRIM TABS for a 190 NANTUCKET:
OEM = 9 x 9
DIVIN'IVAN = 12 x 9

Now the confusion starts. In reply to the above we get this:

vze2gbs4 wrote:...I [chose] 9x12--just like Ivan did.


This is MISLEADING, because DIVIN'IVAN clearly said he used 12 x 9, not the other size that VZE' mentions.

Later, VZE' returns and further stirs up the mud:

vze2gbs4 wrote:I used Lenco 9 x 12...careful here because there are 12 x 9 as well-you can't use these...


This is more confusing because we already have a report from DIVIN'IVAN that he used 12 x 9 and we must conclude they work.

Next, a new reader of the thread shows up and he says:

chicagodiver wrote:I read all these posts, and ordered the wrong [trim tab size]...I ordered 9 x 12 Lenco as suggested on this forum.


Whoa, the thread did not suggest using only 9 x 12--the thread suggested using three sizes. So this is misleading. There are three sizes suggested. A conflict for sure, and CHICAGO' chose one of the three sizes mentioned.

CHICAGO' then says:

chicagodiver wrote:...people need to order...12 x 9....[but because his boat] didn’t [have] a swim platform..[the] 9 x 12 worked.


I don't have a 190 NANTUCKET, and I don't want to install trim tabs, but at this point I am a bit confused. We have conflicting recommendations. What really works? The choices seems to be:

--9 x 9 size, the OEM size used by Boston Whaler

--9 x 12 size, as installed successfully by VZE' and later by CHICAGO'

--12 x 9, as installed by DIVIN'IVAN

InVision
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby InVision » Thu May 10, 2018 5:10 pm

IMHO - Moral of the Thread is "Trim Tabs Help". I miss them, my last boat had them.

M
Proud owner of 2004 Boston Whaler 190 Nantucket ! ;)

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chicagodiver
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby chicagodiver » Tue May 22, 2018 12:05 am

Jimh, you are dead right in your review. My apology for saying the forum suggested the size i ordered. I should have said, it was confusing. What stood out the most was by a poster saying i ordered 9x12 and dont get 12x9. That's a mistake.

A narrower 12-long x 9-wide is best option. With 12 x 9 you can cut a notch on the swim platform and it will go over the ram.
A 9 x 9 sounds like its OEM size but it Is costly.

The reason I removed the swim platform is I am building a dive ladder than can be mounted on either the Port or Starboard side.

I dive as a living, mainly fixing harbors, cleaning boat bottoms, changing props--that sort of work. A swim platform ladder isn't easy to use with dive fins. Also, I use my Boston Whaler boat for water safety, and I don't want anyone using a ladder so close to propellers.

So all in all, moral of the story is any size trim tabs will fit, but 9 x 9 and 12 x 9 will fit with least amount of modification to your boat.

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby Dutchman » Wed May 23, 2018 11:40 am

In most--if not all--industries dimensions are normally WxLxH. If we would all adhere to that a 12 x 9 is 12-inch wide and 9-inch deep and a 9 x 12 is 9-inch wide by 12-inch long.

That is "deep" as looking at the transom the tab sticks out towards you creating depth from that point of view and width is self explanatory.

An 1-foot tab width or 1-foot length is pretty big for a 19-foot, hence Boston Whaler's OEM is 9 x 9.
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InVision
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby InVision » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:38 am

Having some trouble finding OEM trim tabs #1782251. Probably will have to order Lenco 9" x 9". Lenco has two types: standard or performance. Performance trim tabs have rounded sides. I believe that the OEM trim tab did not [have rounded sides]. I read rounded-side trim tabs are better [than non-performance trim tabs without rounded sides].

I plan to use a Lenco Switch model 15171-001. Any thoughts?

Thank You--M

Standard_Performance_Trim_Tab_Kit_35a5617eaf91d23d156b6e29f69e4fd4.jpg
Performance Trim Tab
Standard_Performance_Trim_Tab_Kit_35a5617eaf91d23d156b6e29f69e4fd4.jpg (14.27 KiB) Viewed 13972 times


Standard_Mount_Trim_Tab_Kit_079263a15af0f03414c592f415c9fce2.jpg
Standard Mount Trim Tab
Standard_Mount_Trim_Tab_Kit_079263a15af0f03414c592f415c9fce2.jpg (13.38 KiB) Viewed 13972 times


led_Integrated_switch_dual_bf4696e1cf4d575f8f94d7f845b82db8.jpg
Trim Tab Control Switch
led_Integrated_switch_dual_bf4696e1cf4d575f8f94d7f845b82db8.jpg (11.81 KiB) Viewed 13972 times
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby jimh » Mon Jun 11, 2018 9:54 am

Dutchman wrote:In most--if not all--industries dimensions are normally WxLxH. If we would all adhere to that a 12 x 9 is 12-inch wide and 9-inch deep and a 9 x 12 is 9-inch wide by 12-inch long.

That is "deep" as looking at the transom the tab sticks out towards you creating depth from that point of view and width is self explanatory.

A 1-foot tab width or 1-foot length is pretty big for a 19-foot, hence Boston Whaler's OEM is 9 x 9.


To assume that there is some standard method in which dimensions of length, height, and width must be or always will be presented by every manufacturer is a poor way to discover the actual size. Most manufacturers list dimensions in a tabular presentation or use explicit notation. I would never make a purchase decision based on DUTCH's theorem that all manufacturers give dimensions in a particular order.

As for "deep" being a dimension, I am confused by DUTCH's use. I would infer that "deep" as a dimension in at trim tab would refer to the thickness of the metal. Also, DUTCH uses "deep" to describe one set of dimensions, then uses "long" to describe the next set of dimensions; so much for there there being a standard of usage.

Length generally refers to the longest dimension. Width refers to the smaller dimension in the same plane as weight. Height refers to the dimension orthogonal to the length-width plane.

I don't see any possible way to know if a trim tab described (variously) as 9 x 12 will have a width at the attachment to the transom of 9-inches or 12-inches. I refer to the dimension of the trim tab at the point of attachment to the transom as the width because in perspective to the boat itself, that direction is the width or beam of the boat. To discover what size the trim tab will be, I would consult the manufacturer's literature.

For example, refer to the image below:
tab1.jpg
View of trim tabs on boat at night
tab1.jpg (12.9 KiB) Viewed 13960 times


From this image you can deduce that the trim tab is longer than it is wide. This tab is described (above in the article where it was posted) as being
12 x 9.
Based on the image, the tab is 9-inches wide and 12-inches long.

Two other participants (VZE' and CHICAGO')'mention they installed trim tabs that were
9 x 12
But we have no images that show those tabs. On that basis, I cannot tell the length and width dimensions of those tabs. I don't know if the were 9-inches long or 12-inches long. Can we please get clarification? Thanks.

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby Dutchman » Tue Jun 12, 2018 11:42 am

jimh wrote:
Length generally refers to the longest dimension. Width refers to the smaller dimension in the same plane as weight. Height refers to the dimension orthogonal to the length-width plane.

To discover what size the trim tab will be, I would consult the manufacturer's literature.

Two other participants (VZE' and CHICAGO')'mention they installed trim tabs that were
9 x 12
But we have no images that show those tabs. On that basis, I cannot tell the length and width dimensions of those tabs. I don't know if the were 9-inches long or 12-inches long. Can we please get clarification? Thanks.


Sorry Jim but you answered your own question with the assumption that the longest dimension is the length. No matter how we look at it, it is not a true 3-dimensional item (although it is) and therefore height/depth/thickness are irrelevant.

Bottom line of this whole conversations we can all agree on is [unclear--please simply state in your own words what you think is the element of this conversation that everyone can or should or must agree on--jimh]
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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby jimh » Tue Jun 12, 2018 12:20 pm

Dutchman wrote:Sorry Jim but you answered your own question with the assumption that the longest dimension is the length


DUTCH--we are not discussing whether the term "length" refers to a particular element of the trim tab. We are discussing your proposal that when dimensions for trim tabs are presented in the form of A x B that the dimensions "A" is always the "width".

If you would now like to change the discussion to discuss what the term "length" means in regard its use in your proposed standard that dimensions in the form of A x B are always to be read as "Width" x "Length" or as you also proposed as Width" x "Depth", we can have that discussion, too.

To begin that discussion, I will repeat my earlier comments so readers can be clear about what I said compared to what you propose to say I said:

jimh wrote:Length generally refers to the longest dimension. Width refers to the smaller dimension in the same plane as weight. Height refers to the dimension orthogonal to the length-width plane.


In support of this proposition that "length" generally refers to the longest dimension, I will cite a few examples:

--a boat is said to be 20-feet in length. This is generally understood to be the boat's dimension from bow to stern.

--a garden hose is said to be 25-feet in length. This is generally understood to be the dimenison of the hose from one end to the other;

--bridge is said to be 5-miles in length. This is generally understood to be the dimensions of the highway in the direction of travel.

I will also quote from a few references:

From https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/length:
Definition of length
    1 a : the longer or longest dimension of an object


From http://www.dictionary.com/browse/length?s=t

length
    the longest extent of anything as measured from end to end:
    the length of a river.
    the measure of the greatest dimension of a plane or solid figure.


I hope this makes clear the manner in which I used the word "length" when I was commenting on your proposal there exists some sort of universal understanding or practice or recommendation that when a trim tab is described in a form of A x B that number in position "A" must be the width.

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby jimh » Tue Jun 12, 2018 12:29 pm

DUTCH--I also want to make clear that I do not believe in or adhere to your concept as you stated earlier:

Dutchman wrote:In most--if not all--industries dimensions are normally WxLxH.


If there were to be some common practice in use, I would think it would Length x Width x Height.

Can you give a few examples of use of your proposed standard of
Dutchman wrote:...WxLxH.
as used in boats?

I do not recall ever seeing Boston Whaler, for example, describe a boat that was 18-feet long and having a 6-foot beam as being "6 x 18".

I do acknowledge that in the lumber industry, if you buy a sheet of plywood that is "4 x 8" it will have dimension of 4-feet by 8-feet, but deciding which one is the length and which is the width is a bit arbitrary, as lumber is an unfinished item and that sheet of plywood could be turned into something else, where length and width might make more sense, say a table. Now if you go shopping for an 8-foot table, I would expect you would be talking about the longest dimension of that table.

But, the real point of my interrupting the discussion is just to ask participants to provide EXPLICIT dimensions, so we can try to under stand if a tab installed by one guy who says he got "9x12" tabs is really different from a tab another guy installed that he says is "12x9." I am still waiting for that clarification.

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby Masbama » Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:21 pm

Read this whole thread. Still a bit confused. What is the general consensus for the best size of Lenco trim tans for a 190 Nantucket?

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby InVision » Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:40 pm

OEM size is 9" x 9"

9"x12" has more adjustment. I speak from experience, IMHO I would go with the larger tabs. I now have a 205 Pioneer Sportfish. Yje OEM tabs were 9" x 9" and I installed 9" x 12". I can tell the difference.

M
Proud owner of 2004 Boston Whaler 190 Nantucket ! ;)

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby Masbama » Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:34 am

InVision wrote:OEM size is 9" x 9"

9"x12" has more adjustment. I speak from experience, IMHO I would go with the larger tabs. I now have a 205 Pioneer Sportfish. Yje OEM tabs were 9" x 9" and I installed 9" x 12". I can tell the difference.

M

Thank you sir. Do you miss your Nantucket?

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Re: Trim Tabs for 190 Nantucket-Outrage

Postby InVision » Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:39 am

In some respects I do miss the classic. I am enjoying my ride and features of the new Pioneer Sportfish 202.

M

IMG_3379.jpeg
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IMG_3472.jpeg
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