160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Repair or modification of Boston Whaler boats, their engines, trailers, and gear
MillieTheBoat
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Joined: Thu May 26, 2016 8:16 pm
Location: Dana Point, CA

160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Postby MillieTheBoat » Fri Jul 05, 2019 11:55 pm

Bob (and others)--I have installed a hydraulic steering kit [possibly a BAYSTAR kit that is being discussed in this thread--jimh].

1a.jpg
Fig. 1. Completed installation.
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I experienced a problem when I tried to insert the [support] rod into the port side [of the engine tilt tube]. After some twisting and shoving, the [support] rod went in[to the engine tilt tube] but became stuck.

I could not push [the support rod] forward or backward. I could rotate the rod without any problem.

There is a nut [perhaps referring to the nut that retains the TILT TUBE on the engine mounting casting]. I tried [to move the nut by rotating it] both clockwise and counterclockwise.

The rod is stuck, but I was able to screw the support arm to the shaft.

Please look Fig. 2. below.

Q: is the outside groove normal?

Thanks.



2a.jpg
Fig. 2. Position of machined groove in port support bracket rod now stuck in position.
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jimh
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Re: 160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Postby jimh » Sat Jul 06, 2019 9:38 am

The part on the engine though which a rod will be inserted as part of the installation is referred to as the TILT TUBE.

Referring to the Telex BayStar installation instructions, from

http://www.seastarsolutions.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/964610C.pdf

Refer to page 13, CYLINDER INSTALLATION.

BayStar calls the two rods with right-angle bends that are to be inserted into the engine tilt tube "SUPPORT RODS".

Refer to Step 1:

Step 1: Using a good quality marine grease...lubricate the tilt tube and the support rods [callout 5 in the drawing titled FIG. 9,10,11, and 12]...


MILLIE--did you perform the necessary lubrication prior to inserting the two SUPPORT RODS into the TILT TUBE?

MillieTheBoat
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Joined: Thu May 26, 2016 8:16 pm
Location: Dana Point, CA

Re: 160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Postby MillieTheBoat » Sat Jul 06, 2019 10:31 am

Hi Jim--Thank you for clarifying post and for the link.

I read that manual page by page before the work. Prior to inserting the support rods, I cleaned the [tilt] tube with WD-40, then put some Quicksilver marine grease 2-4-C in both ends of the tilt tube. Then greased the support rods with the same marine grease.

The initial insertion of the support rod on the port side was stuck. My initial thought was maybe [the tilt tube] needed more cleaning. I put a flathead screwdriver and scraped out a few gunks. After that, I was able to insert [the support tube] and rotate it--and it stuck. I don't want to bang it out. I am afraid I might damage the tilt tube.

Maybe others experienced similar difficulty?

Thank

jimh
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Re: 160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Postby jimh » Sat Jul 06, 2019 10:56 am

The inside surfaces of an outboard engine tilt tube are somewhat notorious as places that will have rust and corrosion, and possibly there could be loose debris or old hardened grease entrapped in the tube.

I don't have any experience with the installation you are performing.

My speculation: I'd try to tap out the stuck port-side support rod. First use some some penetrating oil and let it soak for a day. Then perhaps warm the tube using a heat gun, in the hope that there might be some expansion. Then try to extract the stuck support rod.

If successful at extracting the port support rod, then try to further clean the inside surfaces of the tilt tube using, perhaps, some sort taper or conical wire brush as might be used to clean a gun barrel.

It seems very odd to me that the stuck support rod is able to freely rotate around in the tilt tube, yet it cannot move at all in an in-out direction. I cannot image how it could become stuck in that manner.

Also, I am confused how the two support rods, each with a right-angle bend, are to be connected together in the TILT TUBE. I would assume one rod must have a threaded end and the other a machined threaded boss into which the first rod threads into, with the coupling occurring inside the tilt tube. The BAYSTAR instructions are somewhat vague about this point.

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GoldenDaze
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Re: 160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Postby GoldenDaze » Sat Jul 06, 2019 3:10 pm

Millie, my support bracket installation looks exactly like yours. It's been a few years now and I don't recall how easily the brackets went into the tilt tube, but I think it should be able to rotate. However, when I tilt my motor the whole tilt tube assembly turns in the mounting bracket so it doesn't look particularly important for the bracket to rotate in the tilt tube.

-Bob
2003 160 Dauntless Golden Daze

MillieTheBoat
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Re: 160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Postby MillieTheBoat » Sat Jul 06, 2019 7:17 pm

It bothered me that I could not get the support rod out [from its stuck position in the tilt tube] while I was able to rotate it freely.

I remembered I looked through the [tilt] tube and cleaned out [the tilt tube] before I inserted the [support] rod [into the tilt tube].

I used a hammer and tried to tap out [the support rod from the tilt tube] but [it did not come out]. I tried with all my strength for 10 minutes [to pull out the support rod from the tilt tube] and gave up. I thought [the support rod] had some kind of one way lock mechanism--but that would be a flaw design if people need to replace the [support] rod in the future.

I put a metal rod I had on hand through the other side [of the tilt tube]. I tapped [the metal rod] a few times and [the support rod] came out [of the other end of the tilt tube].

Upon inspection, I saw an O-ring at the entrance of the [tilt] tube (not on the starboard side) [thus probably on the port side]. When I inserted the [support] rod [into the tilt tube on the port end], I had to push [the support rod] a bit hard, and [the support rod] stuck at the first groove on the rod. But, after I tapped [the support rod] a bit more, [the support rod] went through [the opening of the tilt tube past the first groove on the support rod].

I then used the metal rod to tap out [the support tube from the tilt tube] again, on the other side. After the second [insertion and removal], now I can freely insert and pull out the [support] rod [from the tilt tube].

SUPPORT RODS MOVE

After I installed the hydraulic steering, when [the steering wheel is] turned left and right, the support rods move in and out of the [tilt] tube about 1/4-inch.

I am not sure if [the movement of the support rods in an out of the tilt tube as the steering is operated] is by design--but everything seems solid.

This installation was my first time doing this procedure. The installation is really fun but it took two days.

Thank you everyone for your help.

Here are some pictures [that have no captions or explanation of what is being shown--jimh]

[Changed topic to begin discussing other future projects. Please start a new thread to discuss future projects on your boat.--jimh]
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Sifd324
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Re: 160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Postby Sifd324 » Fri Aug 23, 2019 6:00 pm

I am repowering my 2006 130 Sport from Merc 40 4s to Yamaha 40 4s. I used the kit with the HC4645 cylinder and it went on without any mods when I put it on the Merc. I planned to reuse the Baystar on the Yamaha. After trying to swap it and failing I found out that I had to install a different top plate to change it to the HC4648 configuration and purchase the spacer kit.

The only spacer you have to use is the thick aluminum one with a washer to lower the assembly down to relieve the interference with the controls. I also had to move the steel ring on the control arm in one notch. This is because on the smaller Yamahas the tilt tube is shorter. This makes the first set of notches visible after installation.

I had the same problems with the control arms described above. If the cylinder is not parallel with the tilt tube the control arms are hard to remove from the shaft. I learned this trying to just swap the steering. Make sure you have the right top plate or cylinder and use the spacers as instructed.

rtk
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Re: 160 DAUNTLESS: Problems Installng BAYSTAR Steering

Postby rtk » Sat Aug 24, 2019 8:32 am

A tube brush attached to a power drill cleans the tilt tube out very nicely. Just a little bit of dried up grease or a spot of corrosion in the tilt tube can cause significant binding.

https://www.grainger.com/category/clean ... ters=attrs

Rich