1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Repair or modification of Boston Whaler boats, their engines, trailers, and gear
Newportme
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1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby Newportme » Wed Jul 05, 2017 8:53 am

I have an electrical problem with my 1989 Evinrude 225 outboard engine. The other day while warming up the engine quit unexpectedly. There is no spark on any cylinder, I have verified that the key switch and the safety lanyard switch are not the problem by following the test procedures in my manual.

The manual goes on to say that resistance readings can be taken on the charge coils and the trigger coils. I cannot locate the connectors for these coils. Please point out to me where these are so that I can do further testing. I'm guessing that they are either under the flywheel, or under the CDI. In either case I may just take it in to be repaired

Thanks
Bruce

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Phil T
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225

Postby Phil T » Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:25 am

Bruce--if you get into a jam, let me know. I know a guy.

Next time I am up it would be great to touch base.

Phil
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1992 Outrage 17, 1992 Evinrude 115

Seahorse
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225

Postby Seahorse » Thu Jul 06, 2017 8:52 am

Connections are under the CDI pack. Exercise care when testing the timer base, it is easily damaged electronically if you do something wrong.

Newportme
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225

Postby Newportme » Thu Jul 06, 2017 12:07 pm

Thanks Guys I will proceed with caution.

Newportme
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225

Postby Newportme » Thu Aug 31, 2017 11:04 am

I have since removed the Flywheel, and there is a broken magnet. Apparently the fragments of the magnet contacted the stator damaging it, they also appear to have gotten into the timer base assembly and caused physical damage there as well.

There is a small ring of metal with three narrow slots in it. Is this a part of the flywheel?

Or, part of the timer base?

The ring of metal is approximately 3-inch diameter about 7/8-inch tall; the three slots are maybe 1/32-inch wide, and the slots appear to be 120-degree spacing.

Thanks
Bruce

ALAN G
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225

Postby ALAN G » Thu Aug 31, 2017 6:41 pm

I don't know what the part is you are asking about.

OMC sells epoxy for gluing the magnets of the V6 engines. It is P/N 431929.

If you need a magnet and epoxy, it is P/N 584304.

There are a lot of search results if you Google OMC V6 magnets. Loose magnets apparently are not an uncommon failure after years of exposure to vibration, heat, and corrosive marine salt atmosphere. Perhaps a mechanic who has repaired many of these flywheels will weigh in on this forum.

Unfortunately, replacing the magnet is the easy part--the collateral damage to stator and timer base is more expensive.

It also appears that there are a number of flywheels for sale on Ebay.

Whether it is better to repair your flywheel or procure another one is an interesting dilemma, given that a "new" (used) flywheel could fail similarly. Whatever you do, check to see the other magnets are undamaged and adhered well.
Al

jimh
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby jimh » Fri Sep 01, 2017 4:44 am

As I recall from my 1990 Evinrude 225-HP engine, there are three coils involved in the component that is generally referred to as "the stator," that is, the non-rotating coil under the flywheel that is generating electrical energy. The three coils are:

--the main alternator charging circuit stator coil or coils, usually multiple poles, to generate electrical power to create 12-Volt DC current for running the engine and charging the battery;

--the timer base coil to generate the timing signal to trigger the spark ignition circuit to produce spark, and

--a third coil--whose OMC literature name I don't recall but could be "charge coil"--that creates the electrical current that is used in the primary winding of the spark coils, where it will be stepped up by the transformer winding of the spark coils into the very high voltage that causes an arc across the spark plug electrode gap.

As I recall, these various coils have leads emerging from the stator assembly, and they connect to various electrical modules in the engine. The main alternator coil goes to the rectifier-regulator; the timer base and other coils go to the Power Pack module.

If you have the service manual for the engine, these coils are shown in the fold-out pictorial diagram at the back that shows the main electrical wiring of the engine. Unfortunately the drawing has no nomenclature or identification of the wiring it shows, and you have to deduce or intuit what each conductor does. I have heavily annotated the drawing in my manual using advice from my expert mechanic.

Newportme
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby Newportme » Fri Sep 01, 2017 8:49 am

Thanks for the responses.

Jim I have the service manual. I should have added that the damage I noted is physical. I did perform resistance testing on the stator and one of the coils was well out of specification, like double or more the resistance it should have been, the manual has plus or minus 10 ohm and the resistance was over by like 500. the physical damage to the timer base is such that even if it tested ok I would likely replace anyway. That is how I plan to repair this.

Bruce

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dg22
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby dg22 » Fri Sep 01, 2017 10:48 am

Evinrude has excellent on-line diagrams of parts and pricing at shop2.evinrude.com for all models. Best of luck with your repair. I had to replace the stator assembly and Power Pack on my 1973 Evinrude 50-HP about six years ago.

jimh
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby jimh » Sun Sep 03, 2017 1:07 pm

Newportme wrote:...I did perform resistance testing on the stator and one of the coils was well out of specification, like double or more the resistance it should have been, the manual has plus or minus 10 ohm and the resistance was over by like 500..


Bruce--a coil whose DC resistance was supposed to be 10-Ohm and that measured 500-Ohm has probably suffered a fatal defect. Your plan to replace the assembly is a good one.

DG22--as for the durability and service life of the electrical components associated with the spark ignition circuit, I can offer my experience with a 1992 Evinrude 225 engine. First, I am fairly certain my engine is very similar to the one under discussion, a 1989 Evinrude 225, and that they have very similar spark ignition systems. My experience was as follows:

--I bought the engine in 2004, and it was thus 12-years-old

--the engine seemed to run well, but over time I began to notice it had acquired a problem--loss of engine speed of several hundred RPM at higher engine speeds that would come and go, but usually the onset was after the engine temperature had risen to operating temperatures in the 120-degree to 180-degree range;

--I attempted to diagnose the cause of this intermittent engine speed loss; since the onset or disappearance of the problem was always very sudden, the cause was believed to be electrical, as opposed to engine speed loss from fuel shortage, which would be more gradual;

--with some testing using an in-line spark tester, I was able to identify that there was an occasional loss of spark in one particular cylinder;

--with the affected cylinder identified, I then began at the spark plug, worked back toward the Power Pack, and began replacing components associated with that cylinder. Thus I tried a new spark plugs, I swapped in a different spark plug lead, and I tried a new spark coil. None of these produced a cure;

--the last step, and the most expensive and thus held out until the end of exploring other options, was to replace the Power Pack; this cured the problem.

Also during the first year or two of ownership, I discovered that the rectifier-regulator was not regulating or rectifying very well, and I replaced that component.

After ironing out those wrinkles, the engine ran flawlessly for years, and never again gave me the slightest trouble. I sold it five years later in 2009 when it was then 17-years-old, and, as far as I know, the electricals are still working perfectly for the new owner. The engine today would be 25-years-old. They can still run quite well.

ALAN G
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby ALAN G » Sun Sep 03, 2017 3:17 pm

For graphic description of these flywheel magnets, I have attached a pic from my nephew's Evinrude 225 (not sure what year it is, but around 1990). It appears one magnet came loose and jammed in between the stator or stationary engine block, then took out the rest like dominoes.
Al

flywheel5.jpg
flywheel5.jpg (185.62 KiB) Viewed 4707 times

Newportme
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby Newportme » Tue Sep 05, 2017 6:40 am

Alan--thanks for the picture. My failure was not that dramatic, but I was able to see the metal ring I was asking about. It is affixed to the underside of the flywheel. I believe that a small portion of the broken magnet that I referenced was caught between the rotating parts and the stationary parts causing the damage my motor suffered. Hopefully the parts come in this week.

Bruce

Newportme
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby Newportme » Wed Sep 20, 2017 8:29 am

Update on this ongoing saga. With the help of a mechanc I have replaced:

--the flywheel (used replacement)

--timer base (new part)

--stator (new part)

--power pack (new part), and

--rectifier (a known good used part).

Still no spark.

The ignition key switch and safety lanyard switch check out good. Does anyone have a recommendation on where to look next? I am nearing my breaking point.

Bruce

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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby jimh » Thu Sep 21, 2017 3:20 pm

One circuit element in the spark ignition circuit that can shut off all spark is the circuit related to the safety lanyard. This circuit carries a fairly high voltage, perhaps 300-Volts AC. A voltage of 300-Volts AC could have developed a short to ground somewhere due to breakdown of wire insulation or connector insulation. I recommend investigating the circuit further, looking for a possible short to ground at some point.

The circuit is carried on conductors with black and yellow insulation. It originates at the Power Pack, at two points. The SHIFT INTERRUPT switch is connected to one branch. Both branches connect through steering diodes to a single black-yellow conductor which is then carried through the multi-pole Amphenol rubber connector, to the wiring harness, to the helm controls, to the safety lanyard switch. Make certain there is no breakdown of the insulation in the circuit. Note that measuring with a DVM for resistance will only apply a small DC voltage to the circuit; there may be some point in the circuit that only breaks down under the much higher 300-VAC that is applied with the engine running.

Newportme
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Re: 1989 Evinrude 225 No Spark

Postby Newportme » Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:44 am

Thanks Jim

I will check this area thoroughly.

Bruce