Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

A conversation among Whalers
Tacky79
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Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Tacky79 » Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:37 am

Our 190 Montauk is away on vacation (inside storage for winter), so we sometimes day dream about the "next boat" this time of year. I have a few questions regarding various Whalers that seem like a good fit for our next boat.

We are a family of five with a dog and new to power boating--two years now. We like to fish, water ski, cruise, swim, and explore. We use the boat half the time in Colorado (biggest lake we visit is 7,000 acres) and half the time in Wisconsin on Lake Michigan.

If the budget allowed and we were to buy a boat today, the 240 Dauntless or 230 Vantage would be on the very short list. I recently saw a nice 2009 220 Outrage for sale, and that got me wondering about the Outrage series. A T-Top is desirable to me.

How is a 220 Outrage for water skiing? I assume our 190 Montauk and 240 Dauntless might be better, but I'm not sure. We aren't great water skiers, but do enjoy it

For lunching, sunbathing, and napping, the 240 Dauntless and even our 190 Montauk seem like they have more room for lounging than the 220 Outrage

I'd like a place to store water skis and other gear - our 190 Montauk doesn't quite have enough storage for us.

The one advantage of the Outrage is its ability to handle bigger Lake Michigan seas than our 190 Montauk, but I'm not sure if we'd give up the livability factors mentioned above.
2017 Boston Whaler Montauk 190 w/ 150 Merc/Fish Pkg/Bowrail delete/aft seating
1979 Boston Whaler Harpoon 5.2 sailboat with sails and a tiller :D

jimh
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby jimh » Sun Jan 06, 2019 12:51 pm

Do you need the new boat to be a trailerable boat? Any restrictions on towing on the highway? If you split use between Colorado and Wisconsin, I assume you must be towing it back and forth. As the boat gets bigger, the towing vehicle has to get bigger, too. It sounds like a 24-foot boat is about the limit.

If you like the 190 MONTAUK, the next two-foot-itis step would be the 210 MONTAUK.

An old favorite of mine--in the category of boats to think about in the winter--was the 22-foot Dauntless. The hull had rather low freeboard, so it was easy to get back aboard from the water if your were swimming or water skiing.

As for a T-Top, I have never had one, but I don't think I am a fan. The first problem with a T-Top: it is always up--even when towing on the highway. That is a lot of wind area and thus wind resistance for towing at 60-MPH. Also, storing indoors with a T-Top is a problem for height clearance. Next, half the shade cast by a T-Top is northern latitudes--like Wisconsin--is not going to land on the boat because the T-Top is so tall and the sun angle is so low. I find the shade under a Flying Top that is just a few inches above my head to be more useful. Maybe on the equator or more southern latitudes the T-Top is more useful--I think you see them down there much more than up north.

We do most of our boating in northern Like Michigan or Lake Huron. Having a weather cloth system with a windshield and side curtains is essential. You generally cannot do that with a T-Top.

In the winter when I boat-dream, I go big: 345 CONQUEST.

Tacky79
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Tacky79 » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:19 am

Re: trailerability, I think we are quickly moving towards having a boat that we leave in Wisconsin and we plan to retire there in the somewhat near future. But yes, trailerability is important for the short term. We can tow 5,000-lbs now, and that 220 Outrage would push that limit--maybe exceed it. We might even ditch the idea of having a boat in Colorado now, or just get a small beater for Colorado.

I'm thinking of skipping the 2-foot-itis in favor of something bigger--IF it fits our budget. That darn budget.

I see what you are saying about the T-top. I'm the fair skinned guy in the family, so I'll just have to chase the shadow and let everyone else worship the sun.

I too, daydream about bigger boats (345 Conquest, 380 Outrage, Nordhavn 55, etc.), but I'm trying to keep some semblance of reality in my life.
2017 Boston Whaler Montauk 190 w/ 150 Merc/Fish Pkg/Bowrail delete/aft seating
1979 Boston Whaler Harpoon 5.2 sailboat with sails and a tiller :D

jimh
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby jimh » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:48 am

Tacky79 wrote:...Nordhavn 55...


Now you're talkin'. I used to have dreams like that, but I am getting more practical in my old-age.

Tacky79
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Tacky79 » Thu Jan 10, 2019 10:53 am

You should save this link, just in case that lottery ticket comes through.
;-)
2017 Boston Whaler Montauk 190 w/ 150 Merc/Fish Pkg/Bowrail delete/aft seating
1979 Boston Whaler Harpoon 5.2 sailboat with sails and a tiller :D

jimh
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby jimh » Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:30 am

Regarding big yachts, there is an axiom about wealth and yachts:

The Yacht should be about ten-percent of your wealth.
The Yacht will cost about ten-percent of its purchase price to maintain each year.

So if you want a $1,00,000 Nordhavn, you should have $10-million available, and expect to spend $100,000 per year keeping it afloat.

For a guy like me, who owns a 29-year-old 22-foot Boston Whaler, that $1,000,000 Nordhavn is going to be a bit of a stretch on the finances.

Tacky79
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Tacky79 » Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:41 am

I just called my bank to see if I had $10MM in my account and they laughed at me and hung up.

I think I'll keep my yacht expenses in the sub-28' Whaler category for now!
2017 Boston Whaler Montauk 190 w/ 150 Merc/Fish Pkg/Bowrail delete/aft seating
1979 Boston Whaler Harpoon 5.2 sailboat with sails and a tiller :D

Ridge Runner
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Ridge Runner » Thu Jan 10, 2019 12:08 pm

With Jerry's Jones net worth of ~$6.2 billion then he under spent by about 60% on his new to him $250 million 358-foot long boat with annual maintenance costs of about $25 million. Maybe he's getting ready for a Great Lakes loop trip in 2022 when the Cowboys play at the Bears, Lions and Packers! I wonder when you get the itch in this class do you jump up by 25 feet?
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2005 170 Montauk, 2010 E-TEC 115 H.O.
2016 210 Montauk, 2017 E-TEC G2 200 H.O.

"Red sky at night, sailor’s delight - Red sky in the morning, sailor’s warning”

Jefecinco
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Jefecinco » Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:50 am

In a cost-is-no-concern scenario I could go for a 50- to 60-foot yacht equipped for operation by an elderly couple, if there is such a thing. I would not care to own a yacht that required any crew.

When it comes to large yachts, chartering would be our solution to longer stays and travels aboard.

My current budget and dreams are focused on a new Boston Whaler 15. The old Sport 13 we have is a nice canal explorer but it is small. The 190 Montauk is getting to be too much at the ramp. In a few months we plan to dry stack the 190 at a local marina. If that works out we will keep the 190 until we decide even that is not convenient.
Butch

Tacky79
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Tacky79 » Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:15 pm

"I would not care to own a yacht that required any crew."


I agree, Butch.

My wife talked about taking a cruise, and I decided that I'm not spending a vacation on a boat unless I'm the captain (or maybe a good friend is the captain).

Our best vacation ever, was bareboat chartering a 45-foot Morgan sailboat for 10 days in the Virgin Islands. It was supposed to be a 36-foot boat, but prior to our arrival, the 36-foot boat had a problem, so they put us on the 45.
2017 Boston Whaler Montauk 190 w/ 150 Merc/Fish Pkg/Bowrail delete/aft seating
1979 Boston Whaler Harpoon 5.2 sailboat with sails and a tiller :D

Jefecinco
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Jefecinco » Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:21 am

Bare boat chartering is an appealing option. A power catamaran would probably be our choice. Easy handling and relatively shallow draft makes for more flexibility in cruising areas although the wider beam may make docking difficult.
Butch

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Dutchman
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Dutchman » Mon Jan 14, 2019 3:06 pm

Tacky79 wrote:
"I would not care to own a yacht that required any crew."


I agree, Butch.

My wife talked about taking a cruise, and I decided that I'm not spending a vacation on a boat unless I'm the captain (or maybe a good friend is the captain).



I too agree with Butch's statement and we did go on a cruise (worse vacation ever we spend lots of $ on) and my Admiral says never again unless we crew the boat (our own or somebody we know)
EJO
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50th edition 2008 Montauk 150, w/60HP Mercury Bigfoot

jimh
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby jimh » Mon Jan 14, 2019 4:23 pm

On the new topic of whether or not to go an a boat cruise when you are not the captain or a good friend is not the captain:

We have been on four cruises and thoroughly enjoyed all of them.

The first cruise was on the SS NORWAY, which was originally built as the Atlantic liner SS FRANCE in the 1960's. It was marvelous to be aboard this historic ship, and, as it turned out, we were on one of its last cruises. A few months after our very nice cruise ended, there was a serious explosion in the engine room, 14 people were killed, and the ship never sailed again under her own propulsion or with paying passengers. She was scrapped out and met an ignominious end to her days of glory as a first-class liner plying the transAtlantic trade and later beginning the entire Caribbean Cruising industry after being converted by Norwegian Cruise Lines.

The second was on the 540-foot fully-rigged square-rig ship S/V ROYAL CLIPPER, which was another fantastic experience, and even included me being able to take the helm on the open deck and steer the ship myself for about 10-minutes, including changing tacks. There were only about 140-passenders. We also got to climb into the rigging and masts via the ratlines, and also climbed out on the 70-foot bow sprit. These are aspects of sailing that I could never duplicate in my own boat, and I have wonderful memories from that cruise. You do not often get to sail aboard the largest fully-rigged square-rig ship ever built, enjoy fabulous accommodations, eat nine-course meals for dinner, and enjoy wonderful ports of call off the usual cruising routes like Ile-Au-Haut.

The third cruise was also on a sailing vessel, the 615-foot MSY WIND SURF, a five-mast stay-sail schooner, which again sailed mostly under wind power, but was Marconi rigged. This was another delightful cruise under sail. There were about 250-passengers

The fourth cruise was on a much smaller boat, an 85-foot yacht, MV ERIC in the Galapagos Islands with 15 other passengers. One cannot enter and cruise in the Galapagos island in a private yacht without a great deal of paperwork, fees, arrangements, and expense. These islands are over 600-miles at sea from the nearest port, so getting to them in my 22-foot Boston Whaler would be quite an accomplishment. The 8-days and 7-nights we spent in the Galapagos Islands were an unforgettable experience and likely not possible to duplicate without being a passenger on a cruise ship, albeit it a small one. Swimming in the open ocean, snorkeling with 10,000 fish in view, crossing the Equator 12 times, and visiting historic islands made for delightful vacation. It fulfilled one of our long held dreams for an experience out of the normal boating.

Now all that said, I would don't think I would enjoy cruising on a modern mega-ship with 4,000 passengers and 2,500 crew, departing from Miami and calling on the usual ports of the Caribbean like the U.S. Virgin Islands, on a floating structure built to be more like a shopping mall and hotel than a ship.

Jefecinco
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Jefecinco » Tue Jan 15, 2019 11:47 am

When I saw your reference to the SS France it brought back memories of my second Atlantic crossing. My Dad and I were on the Isle de France returning from England in early 1952. It was great fun for an 11 year old. Plus we got to witness an at-sea rescue. During a storm we found ourselves idle along side a freighter which was in trouble. The Isle de France's crew shot a line (messenger) to the freighter which allowed a heavy line to be pulled tight between the ships. A sling (bosns chair) was sent over via the line and eventually all the crew were taken off. A few minutes later the freighter sank. I never saw anything of the crew for the few days remaining on the crossing. I guess they may have been quarantined from the paying passengers.

A few months earlier we made the crossing to England on the Queen Mary. That was another great adventure for me.
Butch

hauptjm
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby hauptjm » Tue Jan 15, 2019 12:16 pm

I did my honeymoon on the SS Norway back in the 90's: great ship. Here's an interesting juxtaposition of new and old:

https://i.redd.it/kb2mq41iup511.jpg

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Dutchman
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Dutchman » Wed Jan 16, 2019 10:29 am

Jim's small boat cruises especially the sailing ones are attractive but like I mentioned before my Admiral will not go on a cruise again after the ordeal we had on a 15 night trip to the West Indies. We ran into terrible weather so bad that seasoned (15+ cruises) and newbies left to cruise in the middle to fly home. We had 6 days of terrible stormy weather so bad that the Captain kept adjusting course and apologized daily for the ships motion.
It is quite an experience when you are laying in your bed (positioned Port -SB) on the SB side of the boat 70+ ft above sea level 15+ feet in, in a veranda cabin, and one minute you are looking at your feet and the next moment you are looking at the sea below.

With my dad working for Shell we traveled extensively all over the world when I was young and the easiest travel was by sea with a family. We did 4 CAL and 1 Pacific in the early 1950's and 1960's. After that I did 3 HAL cruises. All crossings were nice old passenger ships such as RMS Queen Elizabeth, SS Rotterdam, SS Nieuw Amsterdam, MV Brittanic and the SS Orsova and a 1/4 of the current cruise ship passenge capacities and divided in 2 or 3 classes. Old school nice traveling, I was lucky.
Even the HAL cruises I took in the 1990's were not with 3,000 other passengers. Smaller ships are the way to go you don't feel like cattle.

Back to dreaming why not have a 200ft plus yacht with a crew and all the toys and pool, where you can just do nothing and get served on your demand and if you want to boat by yourself, you take your 350 Outrage out of the yacht's garage and do what you want. Now that is dreaming.
EJO
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50th edition 2008 Montauk 150, w/60HP Mercury Bigfoot

Guitarfish
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Re: Winter Boat-dreaming About a New Boston Whaler

Postby Guitarfish » Thu Jan 17, 2019 11:26 am

I noticed a Cruise ship television commercial the other day. The ship looked to have 12 stories of stacked compartments and was a mile long, only a 1/4 mile wide. My comment to my wife:

"Why the heck would you want to be stuck in a crowd on that thing?"

I suppose my preference for solitude is obvious. And the news reported recently of yet another cruise cut short due to food poisoning or the like. I'll take the Menemsha on a cruise of the California Delta any day over that.

This is ContinuousWave after all, not CarnivalWave.