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hardensheetmetal posted 12-28-2000 11:40 PM ET (US)   Profile for hardensheetmetal   Send Email to hardensheetmetal  
Well now you all have gone and done it. I found this site about two weeks ago and have become addicted. So much so that I've moved into full on search mode for another 13 Sport in the NY, NJ, and CT area. Ive just missed two real cheap, but Ive found a few in the mid $2000 to $3500 range. I have owned two of these boats before but I do have a couple of questions that I am sure you guys can answer. First, I have owned a 67 13 sport with a 35 Evinrude and a 84 with a 40 Evinrude, I am now looking at an 80 with a 80 25 Johnson. The boat is in real nice shape, but I need to know, how disappointed am I going to be in the performance?(I don't really use the boat for sking).If I do buy it and decide on changing out the motor, I'm looking at a minimum of $3500.00 to repower, so I'd have about $6000 into the boat, less whatever I could sell the 25 for. At that point, I feel like mabey I should just be looking for a more expensive package to begin with. I guess what it comes down to is will this boat do 30 with the 1980 25?I've read back through all the threads and found a lot of related material on this, please let me know what you think.

Thanks - Dan

goldstem posted 12-29-2000 09:27 AM ET (US)     Profile for goldstem  Send Email to goldstem     
If you're not skiing, the 25 should be fine.
top end will be slightly less than the 35-40s, (unless you hop-up the 25!). everything else should be just dandy.
Easy E posted 12-29-2000 11:27 AM ET (US)     Profile for Easy E    
The 25 on the 13 wouldn't push you very fast unless you have stainless steel prop,power tilt & trim,hydro fins,etc.Even that would only get you to about 30mph.With out that stuff your probably lookin at 25-26mph and thats if the 20+ year old engine can still get max profomance.
If the boat is in truly good condition then you should buy it.After you buy it clean the engine up give it a good check up and if every is ok with the engine sell it for about $800-$1000.A 40hp engine shouldnt cost you $3500 unless you are lookin at yamahas.I can get a Johnson 40hp here for about $3200. Buy the time your done it should be about $2500-boat,$3200-engine,subtract $1000 for old engine = $4700.Now you will have a brand new engine on a good boat as to $4700 for a used engine.-Easy E
bigz posted 12-29-2000 12:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for bigz    
Yes it will push it out to around 30 mph, without doing much to it -- in reality the load carried will be a major factor coupled of course with the condition of the '80 Johnson 25 --- and of course the water conditions --- so buy it and try it for my two cents -- Z
Dick posted 12-29-2000 05:15 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Among my performance test sheets I found one done by Whaler on 10/6/93
13 GLS Hull #2E9264
40hp Johnson
11 3/4X17 prop
370# load
max speed 32.8 mph @5400 rpm
0 to 30 mph 8.6 seconds
seconds to plane 4.23
Hope this helps
Dick
bigz posted 12-29-2000 05:34 PM ET (US)     Profile for bigz    
All kinds of BW specs Dick, I have one from their'79 catalog which gives a 13 Sport with 35-40hp top end at 34 and with a 20hp a 24 mph and bing bang 29 with a 25hp, yeah like the way I calculate ----- chuckle --- :) Tom
Easy E posted 12-29-2000 05:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for Easy E    
Dick-
I dount think your proformance sheet is very accurate.A 13' whaler should at less go 38mph with 40hp Johnson behind it.I have had other 13' whalers with 40hp keep right up with me and even pass me going at 38-40mph. Thats my 2 cents-Easy E
Dick posted 12-29-2000 06:05 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
The performance sheets I have came directly from Boston Whaler and are the tests that they have run. This doesn't mean that you or I coldn't do better. I received these sheets from Whaler when I was a dealer so I know they are authentic.. Maybe they were afraid to trim it out.
Dick
Easy E posted 12-29-2000 06:33 PM ET (US)     Profile for Easy E    
Oh i see.
Peter posted 12-29-2000 08:41 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
Hardens...

I think your hp requirements will depend in large part on how many people and how much gear you plan to take with you on average and your need for speed requirements? Personally, I would do a minimum of 35hp on the 13'. 20+ years ago I had a 74 with a '77 35hp Evinrude. It was a great combination. Have you checked www.bargainnews.com. I see 13s listed from time to time. I doubt you'll get more than about $400 to 500 for the used '80 25.

hardensheetmetal posted 12-29-2000 10:41 PM ET (US)     Profile for hardensheetmetal  Send Email to hardensheetmetal     
Thank you everyone for your input, keep it coming...

Peter - I checked The Bargain News yesterday and found a 1968 for $2000, the guy claims the hull is in decent shape, but painted outer hull, just from the conversation I kind of doubt it was done too well. The boat has a 1968 40HP Evinrude, which I gather from the discussion is shot, I'm supposed to go look on Monday, if he can get tomarrows snow off it, well see. As far as repowering I'm sort of leaning toward a Merc. One reason being the lack of a Yamaha dealer near me (My 22 Revenge has a 225 Yam that I would like to have serviced and I dont really want to trailer it anywhere far.) So possible a mercury 30 (2 stroke).

bigz posted 12-30-2000 06:33 AM ET (US)     Profile for bigz    
Dick things haven't changed much I have the dealer '98 spec sheet --- they used 2 people and 405lbs for weight, same prop and a Johnson 40 HP TLE WOT&RPM= 32.9 mph@5300rpms.

Which is pretty much what the '78 catalog sheet said with a 40hp ---here it would top out at 34 mph -- no big deal ---

Now I know of 13's which can make these figures look like your standing still (Clark Roberts little speed demons)however these are fine tuned and quite a bit of testing and rigging work is done ---

Hardensheet --- a '78 20hp as I said would do 24 mph so I would anticipate a stock '80 25hp would hit in the high 20mph range with little modification.

Not sure where Clark has been hiding lately but maybe he could shed a little more light on the subject since he has played around doing some serious performance work on 13's for many years ---

Tom

Dick posted 12-30-2000 11:16 AM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Tom
It has been years since I ran a 13. It had a 35 Evinrude on it but no speedo. As I remember it went as fast as I would want to go in a boat that size.
Dick
Peter posted 12-30-2000 11:38 AM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
Hardens...

Unless you're purchasing as a collector or restorer, I would go for the '80 or newer which has the 20 inch transom. I think the 20 inch transom is a benefit. The '68 will have a 15 inch notched transom. I think a 30 hp 2-stroke Merc is probably equal in output to my '77 35 Evinrude since it wasn't prop rated hp at that time. Because you're so low to the water in the 13, the 13 felt pretty fast with the 35, as I recall. A Merc 30 should be pretty good all around.

hardensheetmetal posted 12-30-2000 07:32 PM ET (US)     Profile for hardensheetmetal  Send Email to hardensheetmetal     
As I had stated earlier, I had owned a 67 and an 82 13, I had swapped the 35 to the 1982 boat and then purchased a new 40. As I remember, there was a considerable difference between the two. Therefore, I can imagine there would be a considerable difference between a 25 and a 35. I am cautious because I won't be able to test the boat out due to the time of year. I am leaning somewhat toward the 67 boat that would need a new motor. I haven't been able to research motors to much at this time, but I am interested in finding out who still makes a short shaft motor, any ideas would be appreciated, Thanks - DAN
bigz posted 12-31-2000 06:41 AM ET (US)     Profile for bigz    
Harden ---

Tohatsu makes a 15" shaft in their 40hp with a number of configurations including power tilt and trim http://www.tohatsu.com/outboards/index.html

Nissan has basicly the same motor (Tohatsu makes the Nissan branded OB's) and here is a site which has excellent prices on them ---
http://mobiletel2.mobiletel.com/~helen/directnissan.html

Mercury also makes a 40hp in a 15" shaft 2 cylinder and in a 30hp!

OMC in both lines offer a 40hp.

You have plenty to choose from except Yamaha 40 only is offered in a 20" shaft -- good luck Tom

AZdave posted 01-02-2001 12:36 AM ET (US)     Profile for AZdave  Send Email to AZdave     
I just installed a new 30hp Yamaha three cylinder on a 1968 13ft hull. It seems to have about the same performance as the vintage 40hp Evinrude which it replaced. With four people and gear on board (about 800 lbs I think) the boat will do 25mph, according to the GPS. I'm not sure that this is the perfect trim setting, and the bottom of the hull is good, but not pristine. This boat clearly goes a lot faster with minimal weight behind the wheel. You might think about the newer hull with the higher transom as this would make it a lot easier to find a newer outboard on the used market. You might also look up Hastings Marine in Ontario, Canada. They ship by air freight. There was no import tariff on outboards at this time last year. I thought their prices were quite reasonable.
hardensheetmetal posted 01-02-2001 10:27 AM ET (US)     Profile for hardensheetmetal  Send Email to hardensheetmetal     
Thanks Dave -
You are right, I have been able to find quite a few late model used 25 and 30 HP Mercurys and Johnsons for sale and they are all long shaft. Not that I am considering it, but what would happen if someone put a long shaft on an older model with a cut transome? Again, I'm not considering this, just curious.
Peter posted 01-02-2001 10:45 AM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
You would experience significant gear case drag. You might not even be able to get up on a plane.

FYI, some older long shaft outboards in this power range were made by extending the short shaft with a 5 inch extension kit. If you find an older outboard made like this, it can be shortened.

HIGHLANDER posted 01-02-2001 02:30 PM ET (US)     Profile for HIGHLANDER  Send Email to HIGHLANDER     
DAN, I HAVE A 1967 13 POWERED WITH A 1980 50 HP 4 CYL MERC. THE MOTOR IS OLD AND UNRELIABLE SO ITS TIME TO REPOWER.DUE TO $$$$ MY 2 CHOICES FOR MOTORS ARE 25 HP MERC NO ALTERNATOR AND 25 HP YAM 4 STROKE WITH ALTERNATOR. PRICES ARE 1900.00 AND 2400.00. I HOPE FOR SPEED OF APPROX 30 MPH.WITH A LIGHT LOAD. MY 50 MERC WAS OLD AND TIRED AND IT ONLY WENT ABOUT 30 MPH DOWNHILL! MOST PEOPLE WILL NOT BE SATISFIED WITH THE PERF. RELIABITYWITH THESE 20 YEAR OLD SALT WATER MOTORS. GOOD LUCK .
hardensheetmetal posted 01-07-2001 12:54 AM ET (US)     Profile for hardensheetmetal  Send Email to hardensheetmetal     
I was finally able to go on a full day of 13 sport searching today, like a kid in a candy store. This really is the best part of boat buying. I sort of set a limit of $4000.00 for any 13" Whaler I was going to buy. The following is a list of what I found, I realize this is a personal decision, but I would love to hear what some of you have to say:

1. 1967 13 Sport, 1967 40 Evin.(not running), outer hull hand painted(rough), cleats broken out from stern bulkhead, bad wood, good trailer, full of snow and leaves, owner shoveled out with metal spade shovel(me cringing at every scrape) asking $2000.00(looking for offers)
2. 1981 13 Sport, 1998 30 Merc, Ex-Tender w/strongback mounts), ugly red boot stripe, real good wood, no trailer,asking $4900.00(dealer)
3.1998 13 Sport Aniversary, 1998 25 Merc, Traler, Mint, Asking $9500(dealer)
4.1972 13 Sport, 1978 40 Merc(rebuilt), some substantial scratches in gel coat, real good non-skid(very few screw holes or worn flat spots), good trailer, side rails,typical stess cracks, factory lights w/chock(wiring outside of original white rub rail), salvageable wood, pilot tube steering, trust worthy private owner.Asking $3,800(looking for offers)
5.1972 13 Sport, 1990 25, All wood and steering out of boat, used as standard(tiller), typical stress cracks, bad new rub rail, asking $3,800(looking for offers) less)
6.1980 13 Sport, 1980 25 Johnson, side rails, clean, good gel coat, bottom paint, good trailer, bimini, asking $2,800.00 (farthest from my house)

Sorry this is so long, give me some opinions
Boat shopping on a winter day rules, I got a real sense that most of these people wanted these boats out of their yards and would deal.

Thanks-Dan

whalernut posted 01-07-2001 01:21 AM ET (US)     Profile for whalernut  Send Email to whalernut     
Except for boat number 6, they all seem way too high of price. I sold my 71` `13 Sport with trailer and 76` 35h.p. Evinrude in average condition for $1500. You can get really good deals in N.E. Ohio and N.W. PA. All freshwater boats. I just paid $4750 for a 73` `16 Currituck with 75` 85h.p. Johnson boat and trailer in above average condition, and engine in average condition, all freshwater. I bought it in Mich.I would be patient and get a great deal on a clean boat! Regards-Jack Graner.
hardensheetmetal posted 01-07-2001 01:44 AM ET (US)     Profile for hardensheetmetal  Send Email to hardensheetmetal     
I have seen a couple advertised for about $1500 - $2000 but they were pretty well shot, they were all repairable, but would take a lot of work. This doesn't mean I am against doing the work, but I don't wan't to start out with a really rough boat, and a motor that would be better used as an anchor. This is the equation that keeps going through my head:

Decent 60'/70's boat&trailer - $1300.00
New motor - $2700.00
Total - $4000.00

...then add gel coat patch kits, new rub rail,labor of love...
or
Used 80's boat, 98 30 Merc - $4000.00
New trailer - $300.00
Total - $4300.00

Peter posted 01-07-2001 12:15 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
Hardens...

6 has my vote. If hull is good, I suspect the 25 is shot. 10 years ago, I sold my '74 Sport with well used '77 35 and shorelander trailer for $2500. Checking Boattraderonline.com seems to show that the value of the classic 13 has increased significantly. I would keep looking. Your selection will get better as more come on the market as we get closer to the boating season. They surface from time to time on the bargain news site.

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