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Author Topic:   13'3" planing problem
tobycarlson posted 06-28-2001 10:08 AM ET (US)   Profile for tobycarlson   Send Email to tobycarlson  
I have an old (late '60's) 13'3" Whaler with a 1971 Johnson 50 HP motor. The motor seems too heavy for the boat (it sits low in the back), and when running the boat at full throttle the hull seems to "dive" and get very unstable and, I think, dangerously squirrelly. Nothing I can do with the manual trim settings seems to work to make it go more smoothly at full throttle.

Any thoughts from anyone? I'm thinking I could block the throttle to allow only 2/3 throttle, since the boat is primarily for my kids' use. I'm also going to install a bow rail and a ignition cut-off lanyard. More than that I cannot do, I'm thinking.

Thanks to everyone, and have a wet weekend!

Toby

Bigshot posted 06-28-2001 10:30 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Bad news Toby!
Bigshot posted 06-28-2001 10:30 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Bad news Toby!
Bigshot posted 06-28-2001 10:30 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Bad news Toby!
Bigshot posted 06-28-2001 10:30 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Bad news Toby!
Bigshot posted 06-28-2001 10:30 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Bad news Toby!
Bigshot posted 06-28-2001 10:32 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Bad news Toby! You have water in the hull. That 50 is no heavier than todays 35's. If it starts edging or bow diving at high speeds it is the shifting of water in the hull. Had it happen and can feel the feeling. If you weigh that boat, you will see it is heavy.
Bigshot posted 06-28-2001 10:33 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Was not rubbing it in Toby, something happened. Sorry!
tobycarlson posted 06-28-2001 10:43 AM ET (US)     Profile for tobycarlson  Send Email to tobycarlson     
Seems odd that one could get water in a Whaler hull...

Anything to be done about it?

Toby

triblet posted 06-28-2001 11:24 AM ET (US)     Profile for triblet  Send Email to triblet     
There has been much discussion about how to
get water out in the past. In this case, if
the water is "loose" enough in the hull to
shift, you should be able to just drain at
least some of it. I'd put it on the trailer,
crank the bow way up, and drill a small hole near
the base of the transom and see if it drips.
Plug the hole with a screw sealed with 101
after it gets done dripping. That would be
a bandaid prior to sucking more water out.

But isn't a 50 a LOT of power on a 13?

Chuck

Chris J posted 06-28-2001 11:35 AM ET (US)     Profile for Chris J  Send Email to Chris J     
The 13 footer was rated at 40 HP max (or at least that's the spec that came with my late 60's model). I just have a 25 HP and it is adequate power unless you want to pull a skier.

As baet up as my 13 footer is, I'd expect it to have a waterlogged hull but it doesn't behave anything like that. Maybe moving some weight forward would help.

When fully on plane with one passenger the 13 footer does seem a bit flighty to me too, but I think that's just because there is so little wetted area. It is almost suspended by the propeller. I've never had it porpose on me.

Bigshot posted 06-28-2001 01:34 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
I had a 64 back in the 80's that had some repair work. It had a 25 on it and drove nice. The plug sleeve in the bulkhead was gone and the hull filled with water. It was so bad that at high speeds the nose would squat to one side or the other and almost drag the boat like it does when riding a wave down in a following sea. Pulled the boat and drilled a hole and I bet it dripped for over a couple weeks. The foam was still saturated and wood was rotting. We traded it in on a new one and wow what a difference. When I went to pick up my wrap around railing, the mechanic said it was the heaviest 13 he had ever seen and said it had approx. 300lbs+ of water in it. They sold it to a crabber or something for barely anything.
tobycarlson posted 06-28-2001 02:26 PM ET (US)     Profile for tobycarlson  Send Email to tobycarlson     
I hate to be tedious about this, but what I'm hearing (reading) is that the foam in the hull gets waterlogged due to some compromise of the hull skin (not unlikely that the hull would be compromised on this boat, it's pretty beat up), the boat then is over-weight and tends to nose in at speed. But can the water shift that quickly? Or is it the foam in the bow that's waterlogged, and it's only noticeable when the boat is planing?

I guess the ultimate question is whether this is a situation that is serious enough that I should consider getting rid of the boat (I only paid $1000 about a year ago), or is it something I can deal with by drilling a few holes and draining a little water? I was planning to do a lot of hull work this fall, and I was about to send my money in to CMI for a new bow rail, but if I'm fighting a losing battle I'm not going to invest a lot of time and energy into this boat.

And what argument would be best to use on my wife to convince her that I need a Montauk?

JimU posted 06-28-2001 03:14 PM ET (US)     Profile for JimU  Send Email to JimU     
Chase down some previous threads on this forum on water in hull. I have removed much water by pulling a vacuum on the hull. You can also remove water by cutting some one inch holes in the skin and letting it air dry. I have used the latter technique (recommended by Chuck Bennett as BW) as well. Here is how to do it. Put a one inch hole saw on electric drill. Drill/cut one inch holes about every 12-18 inches in a rectangular pattern in the floor. Cut just through the skin, not down into the foam. Use a shop vac to pull as much water as you can from each hole. Then flip the boat over over after removing the motor and other parts. (I removed everything down to the bare hull as this was a restoration project--my third BW Restoration.)Elevate the boat upside down on some concrete blocks-one block high-and cover it with a plastic sheet. Let it sit for a month. The plastic sheet will create an oven effect and dry the foam. Once done patch the holes with West system epoxy and paint with Awl Grip or Interlux paint. Good Luck, JIM
TightPenny posted 06-28-2001 05:38 PM ET (US)     Profile for TightPenny  Send Email to TightPenny     
Almost breaking my buddy's coxcyx on a togboat wake in the Arthur Kill in my Sport 15 was the final straw that helped convince my Wife that the 2000 Montauk belonged in the yard.

Pleading, begging and constantly moaning and groaning about the need for a new boat helps also. Being self employed and having a good enough year in 1999 to pony up the cash for the new Montauk hull (used the old engine for the first year) was the final convincing factor.

tobycarlson posted 06-28-2001 09:48 PM ET (US)     Profile for tobycarlson  Send Email to tobycarlson     
Hmm. Maintenance of coccyxal integrity. I hadn't thought of that.
L A posted 07-06-2001 10:13 AM ET (US)     Profile for L A  Send Email to L A     
I have some of the same handling problems on my 62 13 with 40 Mariner. Wide open with passengers on the rear seat the hull will lift pretty good. The biggest problem with speed has always been getting the hull out of the water. If I shift a little weight forward the sponsons dig in and really slows the boat down. I jacked the front of the trailer up last night and drilled a couple of small holes near stern in the bottom but got no water leakage, and the hull seems consistent when you tap on it. Onde thing that may be a culprit is a hook in the bottom of the hull from a roller that was too high, the last roller on the trailer. Any suggestions? LA
Bigshot posted 07-06-2001 10:42 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
No leakage but was the foam dry? Check it again to see if it is weeping.
L A posted 07-06-2001 10:50 AM ET (US)     Profile for L A  Send Email to L A     
Foam seemed to be dry, will check tonight to see if any weeping, the very end of hull at transom(last couple of inches) has different sound, very hard, not a hollow sound, is this normal or is there wood there?
Samars posted 07-06-2001 11:49 AM ET (US)     Profile for Samars  Send Email to Samars     

Toby...now you have me worried about my 67 13 footer....has not been in the water in 3-5 years...(My father-in-law had it until recently). I have done major refinishing and will be doing engine work to the original Evinrude (30) soon...hope it hasn't been in vain...will let you know with in the next few weeks or so...the outcome once I get her wet.
Bigshot posted 07-07-2001 09:12 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
make sure all the drain plug sleevess are good and any small holes are filled. LA-that is wood.
tobycarlson posted 07-09-2001 09:16 PM ET (US)     Profile for tobycarlson  Send Email to tobycarlson     
Sorry to have been so long getting back to this thread, but I've been on the water for the last week. I did the "weep test" without any weeping, then cranked the trim on the motor all the way up to compensate for the angle of the transom. The motor cavitated pretty badly at first, but when the boat got up on plane it really took off. I think the trim setting was my problem, although I wish the prop wouldn't cavitate quite so much...

Now the engine is running badly, no power, no throttle response -- I'm thinking fouled plugs. It feels like bad gas in a car.

But what a great week bobbing around in the wet! It's all part of the joy of boat ownership.

whaleryo posted 07-10-2001 03:31 PM ET (US)     Profile for whaleryo  Send Email to whaleryo     
Have you tried adding Doel-fins? I added them to my 15' Sport with 70hp Yamaha and the difference was staggering. The boat planes faster and handles better all for about $30.00.
tobycarlson posted 07-10-2001 09:17 PM ET (US)     Profile for tobycarlson  Send Email to tobycarlson     
I've already located them in BoatUS, and will get a set. Thanks for the tip; I'll let you know how they work!

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