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Author Topic:   Capsized 17 Montauk
Drisney posted 11-13-2001 07:46 PM ET (US)   Profile for Drisney   Send Email to Drisney  
Well known west coast fisher Abe Cuang (sp?) was fishing with three aboard outside the Golden Gate and capsized his 17 Whaler. Appearently engine failure contributed as well as a large individual 300# moving to the rail in tall wind waves coming offshore.
Thought you might be interested,
Dave
andygere posted 11-13-2001 09:25 PM ET (US)     Profile for andygere  Send Email to andygere     
Was it this weekend? From about noon on Saturday it was "Victory at Sea" conditions down here in Santa Cruz. A 19 foot boat lost power and was on the beach here on Sunday.
FISHNFF posted 11-14-2001 03:10 AM ET (US)     Profile for FISHNFF  Send Email to FISHNFF     
Abe has an older hull 17 with a tan/white interior and wooden console and a 70 Evinrude 4 stroke. Heard his bow chock was ripped out while Coast Guard was trying to tow it in.
Drisney posted 11-14-2001 06:07 PM ET (US)     Profile for Drisney  Send Email to Drisney     
Yes Andy it was this past weekend. My buddy who was out the Gate said the conditions were awful...and I know him to fish bad conditions happily.
Dave
Hoop posted 11-15-2001 04:37 PM ET (US)     Profile for Hoop  Send Email to Hoop     
Abe Cuanang gave a verbal report on the San Francisco Sunday morning KNBR 680 radio fishing show, hosted by Brian Hoffman (6 am to 7 am).

Abe reported that all aboard had life jackets on, which was very important. They were slow trolling with stern to the sea. They were taking waves with bilge pump running. They took a couple of waves which swamped the stern of the boat, including the batteries, apparently losing the engine.

As reported above, a large individual in the stern moved to the rail and the boat went over. Abe reported that he told all aboard to clear the boat so they didn't get bashed in the head during the roll over. All got back to the boat, and all but the heaviest were able to get back on top of the inverted hull. A party boat was close by, but the high-sided hull meant that they were unable to render immediate assistance. A Coast Guard cutter was apparently offshore and did come inshore to assist. The large individual was not doing well, was exhausted, and the Coast Guard put a diver in the water and pulled the individual out by helicopter. Others went aboard the Coast Guard boat, as I recall.

The Whaler was righted and towed back. (I don't recall hearing him mention the bow chock damage.) The air-lifted individual was doing fine later on that day. Abe repeated his point of saying how important it was that all had life jackets on.

Host Brian Hoffman has a special interest, as he owns an Outrage 18.
Hoop

lhg posted 11-15-2001 05:00 PM ET (US)     Profile for lhg    
There is only one place to properly hook a tow line to a Whaler (and most other boats) - the bow eye. The problem is, this is often hard to reach from inside the boat. Usually, a person in the towing boat has to do the hook up. The cleats and bow chocks WILL pull out.

I had a very similar situation happen to me while trolling 3 miles offshore in my 18 Outrage, but with 5 people aboard. Whalers, when fully submerged, can get a little "tippy" even though they're still floating. It is essential that passengers not panic, maintain balance, and even help balancing the boat, until the hull can drain. In my case, with official BW battery boxes, which even though were under water, the second engine started. These boxes are designed to create an air pocket so the battery does not get submerged immediately. In that situation, the 18 Outrage literally saved our lives, being able to plane off the boat, and drain the water in less than 5 minutes. I was happy to have a pair of 115's on the back. We were out there all alone, with nobody in sight.

JoeH posted 11-15-2001 10:36 PM ET (US)     Profile for JoeH  Send Email to JoeH     
I have a 92 19 Outrage and it too has factory battery boxes. However, my lids both have two holes in each, about 1/2" dia in opposite corners. Wouldn't that allow any air pocket to be "burped" out should conditions become that critical? I'm a new owner, just trying to learn all I can so thanks for any help
Tom W Clark posted 11-15-2001 10:47 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
JoeH, I think you are correct. I recall the Whaler battery box I had had two holes in opposing corners of the lid the had little "grills" on them. The holes are, I presume, for venting fumes.

All the battery boxes sold now have this vent hole(s) but they did not used to. When I buy a battery box now (the three that I've bought in the last two years were black) I put a piece of electrical tape over the holes on the inside to seal them for the air pocket effect.

I reality, if your boat is swamped and the battery box is underwater, it's going to take quite a while for it to fill with water. You should have enough time to get the motor going and get underway, sloshing the water over the transom.

TampaTom posted 11-15-2001 11:45 PM ET (US)     Profile for TampaTom  Send Email to TampaTom     
The problem with sealing your battery in the box is that it gives off hydrogen and oxegen gas. If it builds up in the box and there is a spark... not good. That's why when jumping a battery you connect to + and then connect to ground away from the battery.

One of these days, I'll move my batteries under the console... after I get my fuel tank from under there.

TampaTom posted 11-15-2001 11:56 PM ET (US)     Profile for TampaTom  Send Email to TampaTom     
In regard to capsizing 17's when flooded, this is not uncommon (especially with a large load on board). The boat is filled with positive floatation, what would you expect. It a good thing to keep in mind (tell the fat guy to sit down in the middle of the boat.)
JoeH posted 11-16-2001 12:48 AM ET (US)     Profile for JoeH  Send Email to JoeH     
Thanks for the input, gentlemen. Keep an eye out for more stupid questions as I enjoy the the learning curve of my new toy.
Drisney posted 11-19-2001 12:29 AM ET (US)     Profile for Drisney  Send Email to Drisney     
Fat Guy in the middle??!!! I tip the scales at 280.....hmmmm maybe that is why I am buying a bigger Whaler.......
Dave
vdbgroup posted 11-19-2001 01:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for vdbgroup  Send Email to vdbgroup     
OUTRAGE 18 with Twin 115's????? Please explain.
Blackeagle posted 11-19-2001 01:50 PM ET (US)     Profile for Blackeagle  Send Email to Blackeagle     
>OUTRAGE 18 with Twin 115's????? Please explain.

See the Rendezvous article on this site. Click here: http://continuouswave.com/whaler/rendezvous/dayTwo.html#outrage-18

Blackeagle posted 11-19-2001 01:55 PM ET (US)     Profile for Blackeagle  Send Email to Blackeagle     
Hmm. That did not quite work the way I though it would. Just click on the link and scroll down toward the bottom where it says "The 18-Foot Outrage."
newboater posted 11-19-2001 07:00 PM ET (US)     Profile for newboater  Send Email to newboater     
On the topic of safety and submerging batteries, absorbed gas mat (AGM) and gel batteries are sealed and will operate indefinitely underwater. (They can be installed on their sides too.)

Gel batteries require different charging voltages than a flooded battery, which keeps them from being used in outboard applications.

The AGMs can use the standard charging voltages of an outboard, don't produce corrosive or explosive fumes, and don't self discharge. It seems they would be perfect for a Whaler, except they are a little more expensive. Ok, maybe they are twice the price of the Wal-Mart special, but it seems to me they are worth it.

I got a little one for my 13 this weekend.

Dave S.
San Diego

triblet posted 11-19-2001 07:46 PM ET (US)     Profile for triblet  Send Email to triblet     
AGMs are more like 4x the Walmart specials.
In the West Marine catalog, #24 AGM is $170.
#24 gels are $160. #24 flooded (normal type)
batteries are $45-$88.

Chuck

stagalv posted 11-19-2001 10:47 PM ET (US)     Profile for stagalv  Send Email to stagalv     
I have two Optima AGM's mounted under the console of my Montauk and I love them for a few reasons:
*No water levels to keep checking
*Lighter wieght than wet batts
*No fumes to accumulate
*Tough - they can take a pounding in the small Whalers.

I have two different batts. One AGM is made for starting/cranking and the other is a dual purpose type of AGM.

Rex

ron mezzetta posted 11-19-2001 11:09 PM ET (US)     Profile for ron mezzetta  Send Email to ron mezzetta     
I was out the golden the day the 17 ft whaler flipped in 18 ft. outrage the wind was from the north east 25-30 knots plus although I never felt threatened, I did get quite wet. I carry a large shoot on bow, in the event of an engine failure, My boat has 115 hp 4 stroke Yahama, with Lenco trim tabs and I've been as far 50 mi. out. The trim tabs do wonders for this vessel.
ron mezzetta posted 11-19-2001 11:09 PM ET (US)     Profile for ron mezzetta  Send Email to ron mezzetta     
I was out the golden the day the 17 ft whaler flipped in 18 ft. outrage the wind was from the north east 25-30 knots plus although I never felt threatened, I did get quite wet. I carry a large shoot on bow, in the event of an engine failure, My boat has 115 hp 4 stroke Yahama, with Lenco trim tabs and I've been as far 50 mi. out. The trim tabs do wonders for this vessel.

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