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  Brakes for 170 Montauk trailer?

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Author Topic:   Brakes for 170 Montauk trailer?
tabasco posted 02-21-2002 04:53 PM ET (US)   Profile for tabasco   Send Email to tabasco  
Would like input on ordering trailer with or without the brake option since the new montauk comes with a trailer package. Boat and 4 stroke will be close to 2000 lbs. I would imagine they are surge brakes. Comes with a fresh water flush kit.

Any feedback would be appreciated
Thanks

Bigshot posted 02-21-2002 04:59 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
I would not get them on mine if I was buying but I also do not tow over mountains or hills. Towing that is like towing a montauk classic(i guess now) with 2 big boys(450lbs) in the back seat.
triblet posted 02-21-2002 05:25 PM ET (US)     Profile for triblet  Send Email to triblet     
You might also want to check on legalities.
Caifornia requires brakes on trailers over
3000 pounds gross weight (boat, motor, gas,
battery, anchor, trailer) manfactured since
I think 1966. I don't think the new Montauk
is going to hit 3000 pounds gross weight, but
some states may have a lower limit.

BTW, in California, it's 1500 pounds for
house trailers and camp trailers.

Chuck

russellbailey posted 02-21-2002 05:27 PM ET (US)     Profile for russellbailey  Send Email to russellbailey     
Though I imagine I'm in the minority, I would lean towards getting them if you trailer a lot, not for mountains or hills but for safety in an emergency maneuver.

I drive a 1/2 ton Chevy extended cab (5000 lbs) and pull a Striper 15 (~1500 lbs). Once a car pulled out close in front of me and I slammed the (ABS) brakes on - you could really feel the boat pushing the back end around. It stopped fine, but I've got a comparitively large, long wheelbase vehicle and small boat.

In normal driving and in mountains I don't see why any car that would pull a Montauk-sized boat would need the brakes - engine braking plus wind drag and normal brakes should be fine. But for full braking power accident avoidance, I suspect a lot of peoples rigs would be much safer with trailer brakes.

Bigshot posted 02-21-2002 05:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
That rule probably exists due to that movie with Lucy and Desi Arnez where they take the trailer up the coast or whatever....funny. Remember even an alum trailer will weigh 500+
Bob K posted 02-21-2002 06:32 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bob K  Send Email to Bob K     
Hey Tobasco,
I'm certainly no pro in the boat towing department but in the RV department (not much different) there are some reasonable and sensible rules. Each tow vehicle should be rated by the manufacturer for the Combined Gross Vehicle Weight Rating, CGVWR. That is a fancy term which basically says that when you load your vehicle with people and stuff, including gasoline, and you load your trailer and boat with ice, rods and stuff, the comibed weight of everything should not exceed the CGVWR. Otherwise, the brakes on the tow vehicle may not stop your combined loads. If you are close to the CGVRW, based on your expected weights, don't take a chance. The extra cost is nothing compared to a disaster. Also, the brake flushing attachment is a must if you are in salt water. Sorry to sound dismal, only realistic.
Tom W Clark posted 02-21-2002 08:21 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
tabasco,

Your gross trailer weight will be over 2000 lbs, but not much, maybe 2500 lbs. wet and with gear.

Skip the brakes unless you're towing with some dinky little thing. Brakes are a good thing when you need them, but they are expensive and a real hassle (in the long run). What's your tow vehicle going to be?

lhg posted 02-21-2002 08:27 PM ET (US)     Profile for lhg    
Towing this new Montauk will be about the same as a single engine 18 Outrage, even though it's about 150 lbs heavier, since engine weight will be a little less, and less fuel capacity.

Most do not use brakes for an 18. Be sure you have a 3500# class II hitch. Trailer should be rated for 2800# capacity.

jimh posted 02-21-2002 08:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
[Changed topic; was "Whaler offering surge brakes in new montauk trailer package."]

The choice of brakes or no-brakes on the trailer is primarily a question (on a legal basis) of total towed weight and the laws of your state. It does bring up an interesting legal issue, since the dealer is delivering a package.

I suspect that if boat dealers were prosecuted for delivering boat and trailer combinations that did not have brakes when required by local laws, there would not be a dealer left in business.

Check your state law and use that as a guide.

tabasco posted 02-21-2002 09:16 PM ET (US)     Profile for tabasco  Send Email to tabasco     
Tom W Clark-

To answer the question on my tow vehicle........it's an S Class Mercedes with a 300HP motor. Had trouble getting a trailer hitch for it as mercedes only makes a hitch for the ML SUV's. Since it is my only car, I am having a custom hitch made up by a local welder who specializes in trailer hitches. The wiring will probably be done by UHaul unless any one can recommend a wiring kit I can buy. Worried about computer damage but Big Shot suggested that I can buy something at radio shack that will relieve this problem.
Thanks for all your input on the brakes

Tom W Clark posted 02-21-2002 09:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
tabasco,

Oh. You do not need brakes with that pull. The law is another matter, but one that's easy enough to figure out.

Even if there's a law on the books for your state I'd suspect the chances of encountering a law enforcement officer with the knowledge of it as well as the ability to discern the fact that your trailer has a gross weight of over 2000 lbs is very, very slim.

But let's back up and do the math: new Monatuk (1440 lbs), Merc 90 hp 4S (386 lbs), group 24 battery (40 lbs), 13.2 gallons of fuel and two plastic tanks (90 lbs), accessories and personal gear for the weekend (200 lbs), galvanized EZ Loader trailer (700 lbs). Total: 2856 lbs. Still less than 3000 lbs.

tabasco posted 02-21-2002 10:40 PM ET (US)     Profile for tabasco  Send Email to tabasco     
Thanks........ completely forgot about the weight of the trailer. That makes a difference bringing it close to the 3000
mark. I also plan on installing a Pate fuel tank which hold 27 gallons
Tom W Clark posted 02-22-2002 11:41 AM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
In the state of New York, under Title III, Article 9, Section 375:

"Every trailer and semi-trailer weighing more than one thousand pounds unladen and every trailer and semi-trailer manufactured or assembled on or after January first, nineteen hundred seventy-one having a registered maximum gross weight, an actual gross weight or gross weight consisting of the unladen weight and maximum carrying capacity recommended by the manufacturer in excess of three thousand pounds also shall be equipped with adequate brakes in good working order if operated or drawn on the public highways of this state.

tabasco posted 02-22-2002 01:16 PM ET (US)     Profile for tabasco  Send Email to tabasco     
Thanks Tom -
My car is registered at my house in Vermont so I will probably register the boat & trailer in the state of Vermont. Does the same weight restriction apply in Vermont for trailers?
Tom W Clark posted 02-22-2002 01:40 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
Vermont Statute, Title 23, Chaper 13, Subchapter 14, 1307:

(e) Trailers, semi-trailers, trailer coaches or pole trailers of a gross weight not exceeding 3,000 pounds need not have brakes provided the total weight on, and including, the wheels of the trailer, semi-trailer or pole trailer shall not exceed 40 percent of the gross weight of the towing vehicle when connected to the trailer, semi-trailer or pole trailer.

(f) Every trailer, semi-trailer or trailer coach of a gross weight of more than 3,000 pounds but less than 6,000 pounds when operated upon a highway shall be equipped with brakes on the wheels of at least one axle, adequate to control the movement of and to stop and to hold the vehicle and so designed as to be applied by the driver of the towing motor vehicle from its cab. The brakes shall be so designed and connected that in case of an accidental break-away of the towed vehicle, the brake thereon shall be automatically applied, and remain applied for not less than 15 minutes.

triblet posted 02-22-2002 02:32 PM ET (US)     Profile for triblet  Send Email to triblet     
That 40% rule could be a problem. Your typical
SUV weighs 3000-4000 pounds. 40$ of 4000 is
1600. It's going to weigh more than 1600 pounds.

Chuck

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