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  How many DEFIANCE owners?

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Author Topic:   How many DEFIANCE owners?
Alan Hiccock posted 04-17-2002 10:27 PM ET (US)   Profile for Alan Hiccock   Send Email to Alan Hiccock  
I was just drooling at this boat on the website, also saw a new one in person in Westhampton new for sale.
I've never seen any posts regarding this BW model nor pictures in the gallery.
Hmmmm. Wonder why?
Any Defiance owners out there? Now thats what I call a Whaler! LOL, Alan
mbking1 posted 04-17-2002 11:34 PM ET (US)     Profile for mbking1  Send Email to mbking1     
Alan

Better sit down while checking the cost of them. Hah. Mark

KeysNole posted 04-18-2002 01:24 AM ET (US)     Profile for KeysNole  Send Email to KeysNole     
Although I have never been on a Defiance, there are several of them on the 15th St. canal in Ft. Lauderdale (same area as the Broward Sherriff and their 25-Whalers and 33- Dakotas--I don't think there is a relation to the Defiance though).

The price of a Defiance is actually quite competitive, however Whaler cannot compete with renowned fishing boats such as Blackfin and Luhrs, and therefore the market for the Defiance was never that big.

Bigshot posted 04-18-2002 10:37 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
I've been on one twice. Really nice rig and set up very well. Cabin is a bit small for 34'. I think they are priced reasonably with the diesels, etc., but more than a Luhrs, cheaper than a Cabo, etc.
TightPenny posted 04-18-2002 01:48 PM ET (US)     Profile for TightPenny  Send Email to TightPenny     
Had I only won the big game on Tuesday night, I would have one ordered already.

But alas, I will just have to stay with my Montauk. Not really a bad fall back position.

lhg posted 04-18-2002 03:20 PM ET (US)     Profile for lhg    
I have heard that sales of this boat are frightfully slow. I'm not sure whether it's going to go over at all. Except for the conventional transom, it still looks an awful lot like a Sea Ray to me.
Bugsy Malone posted 04-18-2002 03:37 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bugsy Malone  Send Email to Bugsy Malone     
34 feet of expensive fiberglass with no great redeeming value.

So far in the couple of years in production don't think Whaler has sold more than about 50 or so. Understandable, too, since most of their dealers aren't equipped to market this type of boat.

Should have learned from the unsuccessful 31's of the late 80's early 90's.

Oh well some designer got his jollies putting this thing together. I mean "thing", too. It ain't a true sportfish or a decent cruising boat; not sure where it falls other than unsinkable--chuckle

Alan Hiccock posted 04-18-2002 06:15 PM ET (US)     Profile for Alan Hiccock  Send Email to Alan Hiccock     
Interesting stuff, thanks for the comebacks.
I guess allthough Boston Whaler is one of the great names in boatbuilding they still haven't done all that well in the 35+ sizes. Many folk fork their clams over to Tiara, Bertram, Hatteras, to name a couple.
Hey maybe they'll be discounting them soon!
I bet they're worth it. How many 35's are unsinkable?
thanks, Alan
lhg posted 04-18-2002 06:34 PM ET (US)     Profile for lhg    
With 4000# reserve bouyancy, are we sure it's really unskinkable. I'm not. Not for a boat that size. Just wait til one of these things goes down. That WILL be big news in the boating community. Will the engines stay dry and keep working? Will the boat not get trashed in a partial sinking? 4000# reserve on a boat that size is nothing, loaded up for a major offshore fishing expedition. How much does the fuel and water alone weigh. My 25 Outrage has 9000#, more than twice as much! The Outrage can be left a dock with BOTH sump plugs out, and takes no water to speak of. Try that with a Defiance. For the sake of the Whaler reputation, I sure hope they know what they've been doing with this boat. If I'm going to be on a Whaler that gets into offshore trouble (as I have in an 18 Outrage), I sure don't want to be on this one.
aubv posted 04-18-2002 08:35 PM ET (US)     Profile for aubv  Send Email to aubv     
Anyone know what the structure on the transom is, below the waterline. Whatever it is, it's ugly.


LGH,

Page 41 of the 2002 catalog has typical BW picture of Defiance, filled with water and thirty people on board. Don't see other MFG's doing this.

JFM posted 04-19-2002 08:58 AM ET (US)     Profile for JFM  Send Email to JFM     
Alan,this dealer's Nauset looks a lot like what your looking for, also a good price. Check out the picture: hyperlink
lhg posted 04-19-2002 07:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for lhg    
I saw that picture, and quite frankly, something's funny there. That's a bare hull. No weight of finishing components, no diesel engines, transmissions, full tank of gas, etc. Actually, to me, it shows that a fully outfitted boat COULD sink.

Who knows, time will tell.

aubv posted 04-19-2002 07:37 PM ET (US)     Profile for aubv  Send Email to aubv     
lhg,

Where do you get your glasses, I want a pair!
You can see that there are no engines on the boat in that picture? :-)

Really, I think BW compensates for lack of motor(s) and equipment when testing. I have a recollection of a picture or tape of BW testing hulls that showed they compensate for lack of equipment by adding weights.

Alan Hiccock posted 04-19-2002 08:21 PM ET (US)     Profile for Alan Hiccock  Send Email to Alan Hiccock     
JFM, you're reading my mind as far as stepping up goes.
I love my 15-Sport so much, put 50 hrs. on her already this season & its still April, BUT I couldn't get into the school on mackerel about 7 miles out, I turned around at 4 miles , lost in the haze and swells.
The 17-NAUSET would do it for me, thinking "standard" saw a sweet one yesterday, looks so much different then the Montuak I'd swear it was a different hull.
Still on the fence as far as selling the 15 this year, Alan
PS I couldnt get the picture to come through on the link,
alan
lhg posted 04-19-2002 08:53 PM ET (US)     Profile for lhg    
On any Whaler prior to the Defiance, you could walk up to a Whaler, rigged with engine(s), pull out the drain plug, and watch it float high and dry, with practically no water on the floor at all. My stern heavy, bracketed, twin-200-Merc 25-Outrage takes about 3" of water in the stern sumps with both plugs out!

I think I'll stop at my local Defiance dealer, have him lift the boat out of the water on a hoist, unbolt the garboard drain plugs, drop the boat back in the water, and see the boat get ruined, including the twin diesels. If anybody can find a BW dealer willing to pull the plugs on a brand new Defiance, let me know!

Dick posted 04-19-2002 09:38 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Who cares if it ruins the engines. Not sinking and keeping the passengers safe is the issue.
There is allways insurance to replace the engines. The passengers, NO.
Alan Hiccock posted 04-19-2002 09:43 PM ET (US)     Profile for Alan Hiccock  Send Email to Alan Hiccock     
Bugsy Malone, { or anyone else }
What's the story on the 31' Whalers of the late '80s ? Those too weren't big sellers?
I don't think I ever saw a 31, now I'm curious were they outboard models?
thanks for any input on this, Alan
djahncke posted 04-20-2002 12:27 AM ET (US)     Profile for djahncke  Send Email to djahncke     
lhg

aubv is absolutely correct about adding weights. When I visited the factory in February 2000 I spoke with the man who coordinates those tests. He told me when they went to do this test on the Defiance they removed the engines and other equipment that would be ruined by water and added an equivalent amount of weight with concrete and metal. They pulled the plugs to allow the boat to fill and pumped water into the hull to truly swamp it. The results are the picture you see in the catalog. I am confident that it is just as unsinkable as any other Whaler

Bugsy Malone posted 04-20-2002 03:05 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bugsy Malone  Send Email to Bugsy Malone     
Folks who said Whaler compensated for the weight are 100% correct, for that 34 promo shot.

That said, you ain't going far if the 34 is swamped and generally this would either happen in very very rough conditions or sitting at the dock where one might have sprung a leak through a thru-hull connection. Either way the engines might be trashed.

The 31 was offered as an inboard with diesels or less expensive gas. There was also I believe twin I/O's offered. It was stuffed with so much foam I hear tell that her performance was just so so.

The 27 hull if it springs a leak or the bilge pump goes will also flood the bilge and fish boxes and the aft deck area. Since these are usually outboards, if they will start you can usually get most of the water out.

Alan Hiccock posted 04-20-2002 04:01 PM ET (US)     Profile for Alan Hiccock  Send Email to Alan Hiccock     
Bugsy,
thanks for the comeback, a 31 Whaler sounds pretty cool in my book. I hope one day to have one but my next step is a Montuak, Alan.
jimh posted 04-21-2002 09:52 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
[Made many minor edits to improve readability--jimh.]
jimh posted 04-21-2002 09:56 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
The CETACEA gallery has a photo of a 34-DEFIANCE on http://continuouswave.com/whaler/cetacea/cetaceaPage39.html . See photo 39-7.

This was taken in the Ft. Lauderdale area, so perhaps it is one of the boats to which Keys Nole makes reference.

JFM posted 04-21-2002 11:29 AM ET (US)     Profile for JFM  Send Email to JFM     
Alan, my post was a joke. The dealer has a Nauset listed but has a picture of a sport fisher, maybe a Deiance with a bridge. Regards, Jay
Alan Hiccock posted 04-21-2002 02:30 PM ET (US)     Profile for Alan Hiccock  Send Email to Alan Hiccock     
Jay,
I couldnt get the site in the link to connect fully so I didnt see the boat.

JimH ,
sorry I didnt notice the Defiance in the Cetaca gallery
Alan

Dick posted 04-21-2002 07:58 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
The dealer here in Seattle has sold two 35 Defiances. One went to Alaska as a corporate boat (to lure prospective clients) the other is moored at the marina where I work on Lake Washington, this owner is just like the rest of us Whaler nuts, but he wanted the biggest and newest.
I couldn't begin to describe the custom work he has had done on the boat, mostly SS radar and electronics mounts by Tanner from Bellingham. Beautiful boat.
Hope to get a ride soon.

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