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Author Topic:   need info for new tow vehicle for 18

stefan posted 08-03-2009 12:37 PM ET (US)
Looks like I'm going to have to replace the Titan; I put Abby in her forward facing car seat for 1st time in it, and let's just say it wasn't so comfortable for either of us. She didn't have much leg room, and what she did have was due to my seat pulled up more forward than I'd like.
That's what you get w/ a two door,suucide rear truck...while I don't haul the kids in it that much, I imagine I'll be doing more of it. Truck is paid for, so another car payment bites, but might not be a better time than now.
Tried getting some info w/ seach option regarding ratings and GVWR, but a little confusing.
I'm looking at a SUV, wife would rather have a minivan, but none could tow the 18. Looking at Pilot w/ 3500 max& 5952 GVWR. With 1250 being listed weight of 18 outrage, although many disagree w/ that, not sure if Pilot has enough, especially w/ fact I have single axle trailer. I saw some older posts that older pilots, if towing a boat, needed cooler option, not sure if that's case now. Any thoughts on safety, droping/loading with Pilot w/ these ratings?
Other SUV, I think is in the ball park:pathfinder w/ max of 6000, and GVWR of 6000.
Thanks

Buckda posted 08-03-2009 01:32 PM ET (US)
In my opinion, you want to find a 5,000 lb weight rated vehicle to two the 18' Outrage for long distances. Around town ONLY, then you can get away with 3,500 lbs. When you load the boat with fuel (400 lbs), gear, etc and load the vehicle with clothing, passengers and gear, you quickly max the 3,500 lb rating and/or the CGVWR.
Figure this way - the trailer, if a single axle, is roughly 900 lbs, so you're already at 2,100 lbs. Add 400 lbs of fuel. 400 lbs of motor. You're at 3,000 lbs. Now add gear - ice, anchors, batteries, spare tire on the trailer, etc. You're coming really close to the 3,500 lbs really quickly.
I towed my 18' Outrage for 140,000 miles on a 2002 Ford Explorer V-6 rated for 3,500 lbs and am convinced that the truck would have gone 250,000 miles or much more if I hadn't towed the trailer. As it is, someone got a very trashed drivetrain when they bought the used truck off the lot where I traded it.
Consider keeping the Titan if possible. Otherwise, plan an aggressive fluid change schedule (follow severe duty recommendations) if using a nominal vehicle like the Pilot.
stefan posted 08-03-2009 01:44 PM ET (US)
thanks bukda, here is the fine print from Honda:
[3] Maximum towing capacity for 4WD models is 4,500 lbs. Premium unleaded fuel is recommended when towing above 3,500 lbs. Maximum towing capacity for 2WD models is 3,500 lbs. Towing requires the addition of the Honda accessory towing kit and hitch ball. Trailer harness standard on Touring models. Consult your local Honda dealer for additional towing information.
So, w/ 4WD, about $2k more, get additional 1000lbs, so 4500 works right? but need for premium gas, give me a break....like your idea of keeping the Titan, has 85k, I guess being a little squeezed is worth no payment!
Buckda posted 08-03-2009 01:54 PM ET (US)
In this economy of uncertainty? You betcha!
You may have to let your wife drive the Titan when you need to take Abby - I don't know how my parents worked it out in the early 70's, but they managed with *only* one vehicle - and both worked!
That $500/month car payment can pay for a lot of other things, and the Titan should run to 300,000 miles or better if you change the oil and keep it in good running condition (barring a collision with a deer or other vehicle).
If you can swap out with no payments - i.e. sell yours to a private party and then buy a used Pathfinder (6,000 lb rating) for similar money, then go ahead - but I'd be working hard to eliminate EVERY payment obligation that I have right now - Once you're debt free, you can save for a few months and buy some nice stuff with CASH.
That is fun.
I'm no Dave Ramsey worshiper, but the guy is right on a lot of fronts....
LuckyLady posted 08-03-2009 02:15 PM ET (US)
Been towing my 18 Guardian with a 2002 Jeep Grand Cherokee
Lardeo 4.7L. Has a Class IV Trailer Tow Package with tranmission cooling radiator. 6800 GTW.
Tow with Overdrive off. Also move the shift lever to the next lower position to eliminate excessive transmission shifting. I've never had transmission overheating and it provides better engine braking. On hills turn off AC.
May be over doing it, but she tows really smooth and have had no problems. Bought the Cherokee because of the high towing capacity
LuckyLady posted 08-03-2009 02:22 PM ET (US)
Meant to add to the above:
I use Royal Purple Synthetic oil in front and rear Axles, Transmission, Transfer case and Engine.
HAPPYJIM posted 08-03-2009 02:37 PM ET (US)
I tow mine with a 2003 Ford Expedition. Bigger SUV's are not very popular right now and are going for bargain pricing. I picked up mine for $4100 and it's really clean and an Eddie Bauer edition to boot. It tows the Outrage with zero problems and the back provides plenty of room for all my tackle. It will haul 5 people in comfort and if I use the third seat it boosts people capacity to 8. I get about 13 MPG while towing, not too bad. I found mine on Craig's list. Shop around and find the best deal if you are not pressed for time.
pglein posted 08-03-2009 02:41 PM ET (US)
My 99' Tahoe tows the Outrage quite well, is very reliable (only one small breakdown in 130,000 miles of service), and has lots of room for little ones (though the back seat of mine is occupied only by a Black Lab). It has auto and manual 4wd, heated leather seats, power windows, dual zone A/C, and gets 15mph on the freeway (when not towing). On the used market, I'd be lucky if I could fetch $5,000 for it.
I would prefer the extra torque of a diesel when climbing the steep, high mountin passes we have here in the Pacific Northwest, but below 2,000' it pulls quite nicely.
I really don't think it's necessary to take on a car payment to gain a little extra room for the car seat. You could simply sell your Titan to someone who wants a pickup, and buy an SUV on the used market...and probably pocket the difference in cash.
pglein posted 08-03-2009 02:43 PM ET (US)
That's 15 miles per GALLON, not hour on the freeway! The speed does drop when towing up the mountain, but not THAT much.
Tohsgib posted 08-03-2009 03:06 PM ET (US)
Stefan, I would not sweat it too much. When/if shopping, look for a Jeep Cherokee Diesel. Great MPG and tows a bunch of weight. i think they made them from 06-08.
stefan posted 08-03-2009 03:23 PM ET (US)
looks like your right Nick- see below, man, that's alot of torque!
Fitted with a modern and efficient diesel made by Chrysler's ex (Daimler-Benz), the Grand Cherokee can now shout "I'm green!" as legitimately as anybody. As judged by the EPA's more realistic testing regimes that were instituted for 2008, the diesel-powered Jeep returns mpg estimates of 17 city and 22 highway for our 4x4 model. This theoretically delivers a cruising range of over 450 miles from its 22-gallon tank, a number we confirmed in our week's test of the vehicle.
This mileage beats every other engine offered in the Grand Cherokee line including the 3.7-liter gasoline V-6. While achieving a 30-percent increase in mileage, the diesel also provides more torque (pulling power) than the GC's optional 5.7-liter Hemi.
The specifications on the diesel are this: 215 horsepower at 3800 rpm, 376 lb-ft of torque at a low1600-2800 rpm, and a towing capacity rated at a maximum of 7,400 lbs. What these numbers don't tell you is that while racking up such impressive performance figures, the diesel produces approximately 30-percent fewer C02 emissions than its gasoline-burning counterparts.
number9 posted 08-03-2009 05:10 PM ET (US)
It's hard to beat 7.3L Powerstroke diesel in Ford Excursion if you don't mind a big used vehicle.
Phil T posted 08-03-2009 05:19 PM ET (US)
I would recommend a 2007-2009 Toyota 4Runner. They have a 5k towing rating and are very reliable. There are many coming off leases so the prices are decent. You have your choice, SR 5 or Limited, 2wd or 4wd.
The V6 is fine for your towing plans but the V8 is nice. Only downside to the V8 is it is all-wheel/4wd.
Compare the 4Runner to the Pilot on Edmunds.com or similar site.
striper swiper posted 08-03-2009 05:32 PM ET (US)
I tow my boat with a '02 Yukon , no complaints, it's been good to me.
Just make sure anything you buy has a towing package.
RJG posted 08-03-2009 08:56 PM ET (US)
I have towed my 18 Outrage all over Florida behind a 1999 Chevy Blazer 4X4. It has the tow package and 3.72 rear end. No problem at all. You don't need to spend a lot of money on a vehicle to tow an 18 Outrage.
Jefecinco posted 08-04-2009 08:46 AM ET (US)
When I thought my Titan might be totaled due to over $7K in damage due to a mother squirrel nesting in the engine compartment I carefully shopped around for a replacement. My choice was a Ridgeline. Does everything I need in a tow vehicle, serves well in the pickup role, and is a good people hauler. Rides like a car and works like a truck.
Butch
laylakewhaler posted 08-05-2009 11:49 AM ET (US)
Stefan,
I am the proud owner of an '07 Jeep Grand Cherokee diesel 4x4. I am getting 23+ mpg hwy. Don't know what hwy towing might be, probably 18-19 mpg. It's a great tow vehicle! My only complaint is rear seat room and cargo capacity.

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Author	Topic: need info for new tow vehicle for 18
stefan	posted 08-03-2009 12:37 PM ET (US) Looks like I'm going to have to replace the Titan; I put Abby in her forward facing car seat for 1st time in it, and let's just say it wasn't so comfortable for either of us. She didn't have much leg room, and what she did have was due to my seat pulled up more forward than I'd like. That's what you get w/ a two door,suucide rear truck...while I don't haul the kids in it that much, I imagine I'll be doing more of it. Truck is paid for, so another car payment bites, but might not be a better time than now. Tried getting some info w/ seach option regarding ratings and GVWR, but a little confusing. I'm looking at a SUV, wife would rather have a minivan, but none could tow the 18. Looking at Pilot w/ 3500 max& 5952 GVWR. With 1250 being listed weight of 18 outrage, although many disagree w/ that, not sure if Pilot has enough, especially w/ fact I have single axle trailer. I saw some older posts that older pilots, if towing a boat, needed cooler option, not sure if that's case now. Any thoughts on safety, droping/loading with Pilot w/ these ratings? Other SUV, I think is in the ball park:pathfinder w/ max of 6000, and GVWR of 6000. Thanks
Buckda	posted 08-03-2009 01:32 PM ET (US) In my opinion, you want to find a 5,000 lb weight rated vehicle to two the 18' Outrage for long distances. Around town ONLY, then you can get away with 3,500 lbs. When you load the boat with fuel (400 lbs), gear, etc and load the vehicle with clothing, passengers and gear, you quickly max the 3,500 lb rating and/or the CGVWR. Figure this way - the trailer, if a single axle, is roughly 900 lbs, so you're already at 2,100 lbs. Add 400 lbs of fuel. 400 lbs of motor. You're at 3,000 lbs. Now add gear - ice, anchors, batteries, spare tire on the trailer, etc. You're coming really close to the 3,500 lbs really quickly. I towed my 18' Outrage for 140,000 miles on a 2002 Ford Explorer V-6 rated for 3,500 lbs and am convinced that the truck would have gone 250,000 miles or much more if I hadn't towed the trailer. As it is, someone got a very trashed drivetrain when they bought the used truck off the lot where I traded it. Consider keeping the Titan if possible. Otherwise, plan an aggressive fluid change schedule (follow severe duty recommendations) if using a nominal vehicle like the Pilot.
stefan	posted 08-03-2009 01:44 PM ET (US) thanks bukda, here is the fine print from Honda: [3] Maximum towing capacity for 4WD models is 4,500 lbs. Premium unleaded fuel is recommended when towing above 3,500 lbs. Maximum towing capacity for 2WD models is 3,500 lbs. Towing requires the addition of the Honda accessory towing kit and hitch ball. Trailer harness standard on Touring models. Consult your local Honda dealer for additional towing information. So, w/ 4WD, about $2k more, get additional 1000lbs, so 4500 works right? but need for premium gas, give me a break....like your idea of keeping the Titan, has 85k, I guess being a little squeezed is worth no payment!
Buckda	posted 08-03-2009 01:54 PM ET (US) In this economy of uncertainty? You betcha! You may have to let your wife drive the Titan when you need to take Abby - I don't know how my parents worked it out in the early 70's, but they managed with only one vehicle - and both worked! That $500/month car payment can pay for a lot of other things, and the Titan should run to 300,000 miles or better if you change the oil and keep it in good running condition (barring a collision with a deer or other vehicle). If you can swap out with no payments - i.e. sell yours to a private party and then buy a used Pathfinder (6,000 lb rating) for similar money, then go ahead - but I'd be working hard to eliminate EVERY payment obligation that I have right now - Once you're debt free, you can save for a few months and buy some nice stuff with CASH. That is fun. I'm no Dave Ramsey worshiper, but the guy is right on a lot of fronts....
LuckyLady	posted 08-03-2009 02:15 PM ET (US) Been towing my 18 Guardian with a 2002 Jeep Grand Cherokee Lardeo 4.7L. Has a Class IV Trailer Tow Package with tranmission cooling radiator. 6800 GTW. Tow with Overdrive off. Also move the shift lever to the next lower position to eliminate excessive transmission shifting. I've never had transmission overheating and it provides better engine braking. On hills turn off AC. May be over doing it, but she tows really smooth and have had no problems. Bought the Cherokee because of the high towing capacity
LuckyLady	posted 08-03-2009 02:22 PM ET (US) Meant to add to the above: I use Royal Purple Synthetic oil in front and rear Axles, Transmission, Transfer case and Engine.
HAPPYJIM	posted 08-03-2009 02:37 PM ET (US) I tow mine with a 2003 Ford Expedition. Bigger SUV's are not very popular right now and are going for bargain pricing. I picked up mine for $4100 and it's really clean and an Eddie Bauer edition to boot. It tows the Outrage with zero problems and the back provides plenty of room for all my tackle. It will haul 5 people in comfort and if I use the third seat it boosts people capacity to 8. I get about 13 MPG while towing, not too bad. I found mine on Craig's list. Shop around and find the best deal if you are not pressed for time.
pglein	posted 08-03-2009 02:41 PM ET (US) My 99' Tahoe tows the Outrage quite well, is very reliable (only one small breakdown in 130,000 miles of service), and has lots of room for little ones (though the back seat of mine is occupied only by a Black Lab). It has auto and manual 4wd, heated leather seats, power windows, dual zone A/C, and gets 15mph on the freeway (when not towing). On the used market, I'd be lucky if I could fetch $5,000 for it. I would prefer the extra torque of a diesel when climbing the steep, high mountin passes we have here in the Pacific Northwest, but below 2,000' it pulls quite nicely. I really don't think it's necessary to take on a car payment to gain a little extra room for the car seat. You could simply sell your Titan to someone who wants a pickup, and buy an SUV on the used market...and probably pocket the difference in cash.
pglein	posted 08-03-2009 02:43 PM ET (US) That's 15 miles per GALLON, not hour on the freeway! The speed does drop when towing up the mountain, but not THAT much.
Tohsgib	posted 08-03-2009 03:06 PM ET (US) Stefan, I would not sweat it too much. When/if shopping, look for a Jeep Cherokee Diesel. Great MPG and tows a bunch of weight. i think they made them from 06-08.
stefan	posted 08-03-2009 03:23 PM ET (US) looks like your right Nick- see below, man, that's alot of torque! Fitted with a modern and efficient diesel made by Chrysler's ex (Daimler-Benz), the Grand Cherokee can now shout "I'm green!" as legitimately as anybody. As judged by the EPA's more realistic testing regimes that were instituted for 2008, the diesel-powered Jeep returns mpg estimates of 17 city and 22 highway for our 4x4 model. This theoretically delivers a cruising range of over 450 miles from its 22-gallon tank, a number we confirmed in our week's test of the vehicle. This mileage beats every other engine offered in the Grand Cherokee line including the 3.7-liter gasoline V-6. While achieving a 30-percent increase in mileage, the diesel also provides more torque (pulling power) than the GC's optional 5.7-liter Hemi. The specifications on the diesel are this: 215 horsepower at 3800 rpm, 376 lb-ft of torque at a low1600-2800 rpm, and a towing capacity rated at a maximum of 7,400 lbs. What these numbers don't tell you is that while racking up such impressive performance figures, the diesel produces approximately 30-percent fewer C02 emissions than its gasoline-burning counterparts.
number9	posted 08-03-2009 05:10 PM ET (US) It's hard to beat 7.3L Powerstroke diesel in Ford Excursion if you don't mind a big used vehicle.
Phil T	posted 08-03-2009 05:19 PM ET (US) I would recommend a 2007-2009 Toyota 4Runner. They have a 5k towing rating and are very reliable. There are many coming off leases so the prices are decent. You have your choice, SR 5 or Limited, 2wd or 4wd. The V6 is fine for your towing plans but the V8 is nice. Only downside to the V8 is it is all-wheel/4wd. Compare the 4Runner to the Pilot on Edmunds.com or similar site.
striper swiper	posted 08-03-2009 05:32 PM ET (US) I tow my boat with a '02 Yukon , no complaints, it's been good to me. Just make sure anything you buy has a towing package.
RJG	posted 08-03-2009 08:56 PM ET (US) I have towed my 18 Outrage all over Florida behind a 1999 Chevy Blazer 4X4. It has the tow package and 3.72 rear end. No problem at all. You don't need to spend a lot of money on a vehicle to tow an 18 Outrage.
Jefecinco	posted 08-04-2009 08:46 AM ET (US) When I thought my Titan might be totaled due to over $7K in damage due to a mother squirrel nesting in the engine compartment I carefully shopped around for a replacement. My choice was a Ridgeline. Does everything I need in a tow vehicle, serves well in the pickup role, and is a good people hauler. Rides like a car and works like a truck. Butch
laylakewhaler	posted 08-05-2009 11:49 AM ET (US) Stefan, I am the proud owner of an '07 Jeep Grand Cherokee diesel 4x4. I am getting 23+ mpg hwy. Don't know what hwy towing might be, probably 18-19 mpg. It's a great tow vehicle! My only complaint is rear seat room and cargo capacity.