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Author Topic:   1991 19 Outrage - chicago area
Chesapeake posted 07-06-2009 01:52 PM ET (US)   Profile for Chesapeake   Send Email to Chesapeake  
2 foot-itis has struck again. Seems I do this every 3 years.

Am considering selling my 1991 19 Outrage and buying a larger vessel. She is cosmetically in really nice shape (I searched forever before finding this boat). This was the last year of the classic Doherty hull before it went to the molded interior.

- 1991 Johnson 150 with 90 compression on all cylinders (had checked last week), runs strong but paint a little faded.
- Heavy duty galvanized bunk trailer. Recently rewired
- 1 year old Mills mooring cover (Jockey red)
- New Mills console cover (Jockey red - not yet installed)
- Brand new, but 1991 original BW Outrage leaning post recently installed
- All new seat back & cooler cushions, including banana cushions for bow (not yet installed)
- Was originally bottom painted, but had it removed and refinished.
- Twin-Cities just went through it pretty much top to bottom to ensure gas lines, deck caulk, etc where all in shape.

What is a reasonable price for this hull? While this fact does not matter - she was purchased for $16K and put about $5K into her. She is located in the Chicago area.

Would really appreciate your thoughts so I can figure out how to go.

themclos posted 07-06-2009 05:20 PM ET (US)     Profile for themclos  Send Email to themclos     
In this market, based upon my observations, $7,500 to $10,000, depending upon condition.

Best of luck if you should decide to move up. It is a good time to be buying, but, conversely, not as good a time to be selling.


L H G posted 07-06-2009 05:48 PM ET (US)     Profile for L H G    
At that price, this boat would sell in an hour. Way too low. I have seen the boat an it's a beauty.
Dan posted 07-06-2009 09:24 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dan  Send Email to Dan     
Kind of hard to guess value without photos. Mills mooring cover is valuable -- you might do better to sell it separately. Same think for banana cushions -- I'm not crazy about these because you have to put in all the snap pieces in your hull. Do you have the taller console that some 1991's came with? My guess is 11-12K -- hard to say. Twin Cities had a very very nice 1991 with 150 Yam, Yam kicker, red Mills sun top, and a newish twin axle trailer -- took them a while to sell and they got about 14K I think. The Johnson VRO motor might not be that popular, and replacing the VRO pump with an ethynol resistant one is almost $500 installed. It probably is worth keeping this hull, unless you're moving to a 22 and really need the extra room. Good luck. Again, just guessing on value without photos or knowing the geographical value -- some parts of the country command higher prices.
bryan mack posted 07-07-2009 12:54 PM ET (US)     Profile for bryan mack  Send Email to bryan mack     
Hey themclos said, "At that price, the boat would sell in an hour" Well, I have a 19' with a 130 HONDA 4-stroke, with low hours on it that I've put up for sale. I'm selling for $11,900 (FIRM). The motor starts first time, every time. Boat is in good to fair condition...spent most of its years in Freshwater, and on trailer in non-salt environment.
My # is 301 865-0662 [maryland]
Tohsgib posted 07-07-2009 01:38 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tohsgib  Send Email to Tohsgib     
i kinda agree without knowing EXACT condition that $9-12k would be the estimate. Motor is pretty much worthless so is the hull really worth $7-10k...I think so.
george nagy posted 07-07-2009 05:58 PM ET (US)     Profile for george nagy  Send Email to george nagy     
WHY is the motor worthless? It is of little value if seperated but if it is clean and in good working order than I would think it is worth something. Allthough it is not a mercury that is. Just as a point of reference a few years back I had an old 1987 150 evinrude good compression but in very rough cosmetic shape and used in saltwater for ALL of it's life that was NOT in good running order either due to an electrical issue probably residing in the flywheel and I sold it for $350.00. Without PROP!
L H G posted 07-07-2009 06:48 PM ET (US)     Profile for L H G    
I can sell my 1988 Mercury 150 on Scream and Fly for $2600-$2800 anytime I want to give it up. Good mint condition 150's, particularly 20" models, are in demand by the guys on that website.

This engine on Bob's boat has got to be worth that much, maybe more. Aren't OMC's worth more than hot little Mercs?

george nagy posted 07-07-2009 08:32 PM ET (US)     Profile for george nagy  Send Email to george nagy     
Hey larry is that 1991 johnson one of those merc copies with a 60d block?
Whaler19 posted 07-07-2009 11:49 PM ET (US)     Profile for Whaler19  Send Email to Whaler19     
I just relisted my 1985 25 Outrage Cuddy (chicago area) with a 1996 225 Evinrude and new trailer after my first 7 day e-bay auction topped out at $5,600.!!!

It's really hard to say how the market is unless you actively have a BW for sale. I've heard repo boats aren't getting any offers. It's tough out there.

Tohsgib posted 07-08-2009 10:57 AM ET (US)     Profile for Tohsgib  Send Email to Tohsgib     
George $350 is pretty much worthless which is what I said. I did not say worthless or completely worthless. If you read my post again it says $9-12k or hull alone is worth $7-10k. Therfore I said the engine is worth $2k which it might be if clean. I had my 1991 175hp Johnson in very good shapoe for sale with controls etc in 2006 for $1800 and NEVER got a call on it.
george nagy posted 07-08-2009 12:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for george nagy  Send Email to george nagy     
TOSHIB, Okay I'm looking at your post above and it does say "worthless" unless my eyes are on th fritz. My point is if the motor is all original and fresh water use only than the motor should attribute much more to the overall package than "worthless". If you were to remove the engine and sell the boat only you would NOT get as much for the boat as you would as if it were a package. One reason is after spending thousands of dollars it would be nice to go for a boat ride and the motor would be very important to do this. I think we are or at least are heading back to the days were a total package in overall good condition will fetch a higher price than one where the motor will definately need replacing. I think people in general will recognize that the boat and motoretc.. in great shape will be worth more thus leaving the engine NOT being worthless. Gone are the days were a "hull only" purchase will get nearly the same price as a "package deal" if in comparable condition.
themclos posted 07-08-2009 03:20 PM ET (US)     Profile for themclos  Send Email to themclos     
I agree with Whaler19. The only way to determine the market is to set a price, list the boat and field offers. I would place an ad on this site as well as on Craigslist.

I accept Larry's assessment of the boat's condition. If he thinks it is a beauty, that is good enough for me. I would agree with Tohsgib and Dan, $10k - $12K may be more realistic.

From my observations, buyers are not willing to pay a premium today for 18 year old hulls and motors. Obviously, there are always exceptions for rare models in bristol condition. This boat is a fairly common model in very good condition.

There are some very nice boats languishing on the market today, that likely would have sold in a short time in past years.

The number of people looking to buy boats has declined, as has the amount they are willing to pay. I think this is affecting larger boats (25ft +) and may explain why Whaler19 has not been able to sell his boat yet. People are looking at the ongoing cost of ownership for all boats, but especially the larger ones.

If you do not get your price, you still have a great boat to use. There are worse problems to have.

Again, best of luck to you, whatever you decide to do.


Tohsgib posted 07-08-2009 03:25 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tohsgib  Send Email to Tohsgib     
Again it is like the housing market. Sure you won't get what you could have 3 years ago but that house that you want to trade up to is cut down just as much so it kinda washes. In the housing market though you save much more due to lower taxes and insurance than waiting for prices to rise again.
Chesapeake posted 07-09-2009 01:03 PM ET (US)     Profile for Chesapeake  Send Email to Chesapeake     
Dan's comment from Twin Cities may best reflect the Midwest market. While I have no factual data, I would tend to agree that supply and demand is the rule of the day and that less people are buying. I thought 14-15 might be where this came out. In this market, that might be the top end -- particularly knowing that Twin Cities will sit on a boat before they sell it below the owner's desired price.

Not sure what we will do. My guess is that someone will "need" to have this boat, as they have with my previous three whalers and then it will sell at a price with which I am comfortable. There is no rush to sell tomorrow and this rig is in really fine shape, so maybe I am a 19 Outrage owner for an indefinite period of time. As Themclos said, there are a lot worse problems to have.

FYI - As I spoke with two dealers over the past six months about potentially repowering, they both were offering trade-in value between 1300 and 1800. I thought that was pretty decent.

Chesapeake posted 07-09-2009 02:18 PM ET (US)     Profile for Chesapeake  Send Email to Chesapeake     
What is amazing to me is the holding value of Montauk's... despite this economy we've discussed above. Ever since I sold my '97 (a day I have lived to regret), I have kept my eyes open for a 2002 Classic Montauk. I finally found a bristol 2002 Montauk several weeks ago at a dealership in Conn. It sold before I pulled the trigger and it sold at $15K. That price for a late model "classic" whaler hasn't seemed to budge for 4 or 5 years, even though the boats get older with each passing year. Perhaps part of that is that I understand CPD will no longer make a classic Montauk / Alert... only the newer mold so I am told.

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