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Author Topic:   Montauk bow locker repair
ratherwhalering posted 09-03-2002 01:18 PM ET (US)   Profile for ratherwhalering   Send Email to ratherwhalering  
I hit a ferry wave this weekend, and managed to pop open the bow locker despite the velcro latch. Of course, a coiled, spare dock line popped 1/2 way out on one side, and when the hatch slammed shut, it ripped the wood screws out of the hatch. Luckily, the screws came out clean, and did not split the wood. Rather than re-threading, I am considering replacing the wood screw system with machine screws, secured with countersunk washers/nylon nuts on the underside. Anyone done this? I can't think of any drawbacks, other than the possibility of ripping the hull screws out next time it happens. Any experience in this department is appreciated! --Rob--
Tom W Clark posted 09-03-2002 01:38 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
Rob,

The only problem I can think of is that you will need to countersink the nuts deep enough that they are flush on the underside and this will not leave much "meat" for the fastener to grab.

If it were me I would just glue in teak plugs and reset the screws. Remember, you need to use plugs NOT dowels or toothpicks if you want it to be a strong as it was originally.

Another alternative would be to use stainless steel T-nuts in conjunction with machine screws. This would allow a flush fit on the underside and take full advantage of the thickness of the cover as well as spread out the load over a greater area than just a washer.

I have never understood why Whaler did not provide a positive hold down for those lids. The first time you go over a wave the thing is slapping up and down. Velcro will not cut as you have discovered.

The best hold down I have found is this hold down clamp made by Perko http://perko.com/cgi-bin/perko.pl?dis+1108-hold_down_clamps_info I installed this part on both of my Montauks. The hook goes on the edge of the locker cover and the rest screws on to the face of the bulkhead where there is wood backing for a pedestal seat mount.

Bigshot posted 09-03-2002 02:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Those are great clamps until you stub a toe on it, etc. I think Whaler did not use them for that reason. I have yet to find something perfect that is unobtrusive.
ratherwhalering posted 09-03-2002 02:16 PM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
Tom:
I like the idea of using the T nuts with machine screws! I'm sold. As I remember, the t-nut has a flat top, with teeth on the underside to prevent slipping. I believe the front two holes will need these, but I just checked, and the aft holes clear the fiberglass lip, so I can use the nut idea on at least those two holes. I'm going to have to get creative with the bow locker latch though...I have the pedestal seat mount in place (makes for a great bait/picknic table too), so the latch you sugguested won't work for me. Great solution, though.
Salmon Tub posted 09-03-2002 02:17 PM ET (US)     Profile for Salmon Tub  Send Email to Salmon Tub     
Rob, if my mental TV is working properly, I picture that the hinges lay on the top of both the hatch and the hull. They are secured into both with self taping wood screws. The screws that popped out are on the hatch side of the hinge rather than the hull side. If this is correct, give the guys at Outboard shop a call and see if they have 4 sets of the newer fasteners. They are two piece, and screw into each other. They also have a flush fit that will not require counter-sinking any bolt heads.
Chap posted 09-03-2002 02:31 PM ET (US)     Profile for Chap  Send Email to Chap     
Hello,
Maybe you could retro fit a rubber ball and socket like on Tobasco's anchor locker. If you can find them. There probably isn't a "glassed in" nice mounting location but maybe a screw through the side of the socket would be enough, into the wood for your picnic table mount. but from the inside.

continuouswave.com/whaler/cetacea/cetaceaPage58.html

You might also try the newer strong "mushroom" or "t" type Velcro.

Or something like the brass friction cabinet keepers used on the console doors. The "squeezers" can be cranked down pretty tight.

Thanks
Chap

ratherwhalering posted 09-03-2002 03:47 PM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
Salmon tub: Yep, you are correct. The hinges are on the outside of the hatch, and mounted to the hull. I am going to try two things this afternoon. One is to abandon the self taping wood screw system on the hatch (leaving the wood screws in the hull), and use machine screws through the wood, then backing the machine screws with tee nuts, so the locker will still lay flat. I just purchased the tee nuts at Wests (it is dangerous having that place 3 minutes from the office!) They screw into eacho ther with both ends being flush(ish). Second, I'm going to try using an interior mounted, spring loaded cabinet lock. I should be able to stick my finger through the lifting hole and trigger the clip from the inside. If it looks like it will work, I'll try mounting it. I'll combine this with Chap's sugguestion of the newer velcro, and see where it gets me. Thanks folks, and I'll let you know if the interior latch idea works. I've used these on plenty of sailboats without a problem. --Rob--
Tom W Clark posted 09-03-2002 04:42 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
Rob,

Your right, if you have the pedestal mount the hold down will not work, at least not on center. The elbow latch idea sounds like a good solution if you can reach it with your finger. Let us know how it works out.

Nick,

The Perko 1108 won't stub your tows. It mounts on the vertical face and does not protrude up at all nor is it anywhere near floor level. I described its installation backwards. The hook goes on the bulkhead, the rest of the hold down on the hatch's edge. Additionally, this piece of hardware is nicely smoothed and rounded, though at $40 is kinda' spendy. There are cheaper knock-offs of this part but I never found anything else that worked half as well.

Salmon Tub posted 09-03-2002 11:05 PM ET (US)     Profile for Salmon Tub  Send Email to Salmon Tub     
I feel a bit stupid, I did not read the responses to your question until after I posted and realized that the T-nuts that Tom mentions is what I was talking about.
ratherwhalering posted 09-09-2002 11:44 AM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
Just an update... The tee nuts worked great. I drilled out the old, stripped holes in the hatch and used a 1.25" #10 bevel head machine screw backed with a #10 tee nut ($1.99 each!). The hatch closes just fine. The elbow latch will never work, however. The lifting hole goes through the thick wood brace on the underside of the hatch. It is also too far forward to reach such a latch. Oh well, back to the drawing board.

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