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Author Topic:   Raising Montauk 17 seat

ChrisCT posted 11-29-2002 09:33 AM ET (US)
Hello - Raising my pilots seat 2 inches to accomodate to 13 gallon tanks rather than the standard 6.5's. Had a cabinet maker build me two 2 inch platforms for the seat bases. I think he used ash saying it would be good in water. My question is - has anyone done this and besides getting 2 inch longer identical stainless steel screws what should I do to secure it? Should I go an extra 1/4 inch because of the height? Should I fill in the old screw holes with something to give the new screws more bite?
Lastly should I stain the wood to give it a teak look first?
Barry posted 11-29-2002 11:45 AM ET (US)
A quick search using the site search engine, http://continuouswave.com/htdig/ , found many topics for raising the RPS including:
http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000720.html
http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/002652.html
http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/001993.html
http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/000484.html
ChrisCT posted 11-30-2002 11:59 AM ET (US)
Thx Barry - some good ideas in there.
Montauk72 posted 12-03-2002 06:44 PM ET (US)
Interesting. Mines a 72 and has a rebuilt seat. Mine has a 28 gal Tempo can under my seat.
ratherwhalering posted 12-04-2002 01:33 PM ET (US)
Why not raise the seat at cushion level instead of at the base?
JBCornwell posted 12-04-2002 02:23 PM ET (US)
I like Ratherwhalering's idea.
Not only would it allow that TALL cap* to fit, but it facilitates hinging the seat so that the tank can be filled without moving it.
*Instead of raising my seat, I put a short cap on the Tempo 1428. It now fits under the seat. I have pics.
Red sky at night. . .
JB
ChrisCT posted 12-04-2002 02:26 PM ET (US)
wow - might make it more stable that way - but not sure of how the bulky wood would look at the middle of the seat there. Would also have to shave the wood down to match the contours of that area. Thx for idea, will run it by guy who made wood blocks for me.
ChrisCT posted 12-04-2002 02:29 PM ET (US)
FYI - Have the short caps I picked up at Walmart from their garden center but still about an inch and a half short on clearance w/ the 2 13's under the seat.
daverdla posted 12-04-2002 02:36 PM ET (US)
ChrisCT,
I hinged my seat so I could access the fuel filler. If the tanks fit under the seat but hamper fueling, consider hinging the seat. If hinging the seat won't work for you, I think ratherwhalering's idea is the way to go. You will need to notch the wood blocks for the stainless rails that run under the cushion.
Ash is used on old cars. I redid the frame of my Morgan in ash. It's also used for baseball bats. The reason ash is chosen for these uses is its ability to absorb impacts without cracking. It is not unfortunately water resistant. None of the wood on my Morgan was physically damaged, just rotten from moisture.
Dave
Barry posted 12-04-2002 02:36 PM ET (US)
A block under each corner of the cushion might work. I like that idea "rather than" messing around with the attachment of the RPS to the deck.
oysterman posted 12-04-2002 04:34 PM ET (US)
Get the lower profile fuel cap- less work!
T Party posted 12-10-2002 05:24 PM ET (US)
My RPS is raised both places: at the floor under the feet I have some mahogany spacers(or whatever you'd like to call them) and then again under the seat cushion I have additional spacers - again mahogany. I have long legs and a 28 gallon Tempo tank, and this improvement (along with the risers under the console and the mahogany/teak box atop the console) make my Montauk much more comfortable for me and allow the gas tank to fit under the seat with the "tall" cap.
I've only said I'd take pictures of htese features and send them in about 100 times so far, but I never get around to tidying up the boat enough to take pictures of her. Soon...
lhg posted 12-10-2002 07:37 PM ET (US)
When I raised my RPS, I considered putting the "risers" under the seat. But then I had to deal with the curved notches for the SS seat back bars. So I stayed with the idea of floor blocks. I built my blocks to be installed in two layers. This allows the bottom layer to be installed with shorter screws directly into the existing holes. Then the top layer of blocking is installed, using different screw locations, but still under the seat base so they don't show in the end result. Then the seat base is installed into the new wood block tops. This is a stronger and more stable installation than attempting to locate SS screws longer than 3" (hard to find) and going all the way through to the old boat floor holes. Same method works for raising the console also.
Although the extra space is nice under the raised seat, the REAL reason to do it is increased seating height and comfort. It makes a huge difference. I always though the Whaler RPS was designed for midgets. It's WAY too low for proper seated operation safety and visibility forward. Low seating has been a problem in almost all classic Whalers, especially the 13-17 Sports. Try increasing the height anywhere from 2" to 6", gauranteed you will love it.
I am surprised a woodshop would recommend ash for marine use. Mahagony and teak are the universally accepted woods to use here. I would stain those blocks teak or mahogany color, and then varnish 10 coats before installing. That will give them a chance to survive.
ChrisCT posted 12-16-2002 08:11 AM ET (US)
Rethought out and now using 4 blocks w/ one corner curverd for at the seat height for the 2 inch increased height. Got 3 1/2 inch stainless steel screws that match the originals and had the wood shop use teak. Thx for the replies!
Now I just have to figure out what I should put in the floor holes before securing the seat back to the deck for increased 'bite'.
John O posted 12-16-2002 10:25 AM ET (US)
I used marine tex in the holes after I replace the screws because previous owner used low grade SS. I let the Marine tex set for about a week and then redrilled holes. I used 3m 4200 in the holes, on the bottom of the 2x4 Mahgogany risers and around the lower edges of the risers where they meet the deck. My only concern is that the stain on the Mahagany my break down the 4200. It has been 7 months so far. Boat is out for the season.
I weigh 240lbs and the seat has not budged.

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Author	Topic: Raising Montauk 17 seat
ChrisCT	posted 11-29-2002 09:33 AM ET (US) Hello - Raising my pilots seat 2 inches to accomodate to 13 gallon tanks rather than the standard 6.5's. Had a cabinet maker build me two 2 inch platforms for the seat bases. I think he used ash saying it would be good in water. My question is - has anyone done this and besides getting 2 inch longer identical stainless steel screws what should I do to secure it? Should I go an extra 1/4 inch because of the height? Should I fill in the old screw holes with something to give the new screws more bite? Lastly should I stain the wood to give it a teak look first?
Barry	posted 11-29-2002 11:45 AM ET (US) A quick search using the site search engine, http://continuouswave.com/htdig/ , found many topics for raising the RPS including: http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000720.html http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/002652.html http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/001993.html http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum3/HTML/000484.html
ChrisCT	posted 11-30-2002 11:59 AM ET (US) Thx Barry - some good ideas in there.
Montauk72	posted 12-03-2002 06:44 PM ET (US) Interesting. Mines a 72 and has a rebuilt seat. Mine has a 28 gal Tempo can under my seat.
ratherwhalering	posted 12-04-2002 01:33 PM ET (US) Why not raise the seat at cushion level instead of at the base?
JBCornwell	posted 12-04-2002 02:23 PM ET (US) I like Ratherwhalering's idea. Not only would it allow that TALL cap* to fit, but it facilitates hinging the seat so that the tank can be filled without moving it. *Instead of raising my seat, I put a short cap on the Tempo 1428. It now fits under the seat. I have pics. Red sky at night. . . JB
ChrisCT	posted 12-04-2002 02:26 PM ET (US) wow - might make it more stable that way - but not sure of how the bulky wood would look at the middle of the seat there. Would also have to shave the wood down to match the contours of that area. Thx for idea, will run it by guy who made wood blocks for me.
ChrisCT	posted 12-04-2002 02:29 PM ET (US) FYI - Have the short caps I picked up at Walmart from their garden center but still about an inch and a half short on clearance w/ the 2 13's under the seat.
daverdla	posted 12-04-2002 02:36 PM ET (US) ChrisCT, I hinged my seat so I could access the fuel filler. If the tanks fit under the seat but hamper fueling, consider hinging the seat. If hinging the seat won't work for you, I think ratherwhalering's idea is the way to go. You will need to notch the wood blocks for the stainless rails that run under the cushion. Ash is used on old cars. I redid the frame of my Morgan in ash. It's also used for baseball bats. The reason ash is chosen for these uses is its ability to absorb impacts without cracking. It is not unfortunately water resistant. None of the wood on my Morgan was physically damaged, just rotten from moisture. Dave
Barry	posted 12-04-2002 02:36 PM ET (US) A block under each corner of the cushion might work. I like that idea "rather than" messing around with the attachment of the RPS to the deck.
oysterman	posted 12-04-2002 04:34 PM ET (US) Get the lower profile fuel cap- less work!
T Party	posted 12-10-2002 05:24 PM ET (US) My RPS is raised both places: at the floor under the feet I have some mahogany spacers(or whatever you'd like to call them) and then again under the seat cushion I have additional spacers - again mahogany. I have long legs and a 28 gallon Tempo tank, and this improvement (along with the risers under the console and the mahogany/teak box atop the console) make my Montauk much more comfortable for me and allow the gas tank to fit under the seat with the "tall" cap. I've only said I'd take pictures of htese features and send them in about 100 times so far, but I never get around to tidying up the boat enough to take pictures of her. Soon...
lhg	posted 12-10-2002 07:37 PM ET (US) When I raised my RPS, I considered putting the "risers" under the seat. But then I had to deal with the curved notches for the SS seat back bars. So I stayed with the idea of floor blocks. I built my blocks to be installed in two layers. This allows the bottom layer to be installed with shorter screws directly into the existing holes. Then the top layer of blocking is installed, using different screw locations, but still under the seat base so they don't show in the end result. Then the seat base is installed into the new wood block tops. This is a stronger and more stable installation than attempting to locate SS screws longer than 3" (hard to find) and going all the way through to the old boat floor holes. Same method works for raising the console also. Although the extra space is nice under the raised seat, the REAL reason to do it is increased seating height and comfort. It makes a huge difference. I always though the Whaler RPS was designed for midgets. It's WAY too low for proper seated operation safety and visibility forward. Low seating has been a problem in almost all classic Whalers, especially the 13-17 Sports. Try increasing the height anywhere from 2" to 6", gauranteed you will love it. I am surprised a woodshop would recommend ash for marine use. Mahagony and teak are the universally accepted woods to use here. I would stain those blocks teak or mahogany color, and then varnish 10 coats before installing. That will give them a chance to survive.
ChrisCT	posted 12-16-2002 08:11 AM ET (US) Rethought out and now using 4 blocks w/ one corner curverd for at the seat height for the 2 inch increased height. Got 3 1/2 inch stainless steel screws that match the originals and had the wood shop use teak. Thx for the replies! Now I just have to figure out what I should put in the floor holes before securing the seat back to the deck for increased 'bite'.
John O	posted 12-16-2002 10:25 AM ET (US) I used marine tex in the holes after I replace the screws because previous owner used low grade SS. I let the Marine tex set for about a week and then redrilled holes. I used 3m 4200 in the holes, on the bottom of the 2x4 Mahgogany risers and around the lower edges of the risers where they meet the deck. My only concern is that the stain on the Mahagany my break down the 4200. It has been 7 months so far. Boat is out for the season. I weigh 240lbs and the seat has not budged.