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Author Topic:   frozen steering

grizzly posted 05-05-2003 09:55 PM ET (US)
The teleflex cable steering on my '92 13 GLS has "frozen" after a few months without use. As far as I can tell, the end of the cable where it feeds into the hollow tube in the bracket on the engine (a 40 HP Merc 4 cylinder) has seized in place.
Any suggestions on fixes? Much obliged for any tips.
Drisney posted 05-05-2003 11:19 PM ET (US)
Griz,
When I used to have this problem on my 17; I would disconnect the arm to the engine(1 bolt) then use the arm to turn (twist) the steering cable. Twist only enough to break it free. Now, as long as you have it disconnected, do yourself a favor and buy ($20) a nut for the end with a zirc in it. Run your steering cable out as far as it will go(with the nut off) lube the cable very well with marine grease and crank it back in. install the zirk nut and lube it. If you do this (1 hour work tops) you will never have frozen steering again just lube the zirk periodically..... Dave
adaps4 posted 05-06-2003 12:29 AM ET (US)
Late night for me-
Just got back from a Dixie Chicks concert- another topic altogether.
I am just about finished doing a complete refurb of my 13'. The steering had seized just like yours. At first, I wrapped a towel around the rod and used vice grips to pull on it. This didn't do too much. Next, I tapped the other end with a hammer until it was alomost in the tube. I then took a long bolt and held it to the end and tapped it through. This took time and patience- I didn't want to damage anything. To prevent this from happening again, I first took a wire brush to the inside. I got plenty of rust out of there. I gently pushed the steering rod through slowly back and forth until it went through. I then pulled it out and cleaned the rod several times until clean. A few squirts of marine grease came next, and then I put the end nut on. You can get these nuts from any marine store. I got mine from Bob's Marine in Ruskin FL. Just make sure it is the right one for your engine, and you will be fine. You only have to grease the nut every once in a while, and it will prevent this from happening. Also, remember that it only requires one pump of grease. I don't know why, but the guys at Bob's were adament about this fact- something to do with completely wrecking the steering system with too much grease. Good luck getting it out.
Clark Roberts posted 05-06-2003 05:30 AM ET (US)
I have had my share of frozen-up steering and attribute most of it to the heavy grease most often used (like wheel bearing grease). The stuff just turns to glue and then hardens up for some reason! My solution (used for years) is to lightly coat rod and inside of tilt tube with white lithium grease (just a very thin film) and assemble. Then periodically oil with very light oil like 3-in-1 or Marvel Mystery oil (nothing heavier than 90 weight gear oil). This has worked for me as far as lubrication goes. If engine has non-stainless tilt tube then annual removal of rod and cleaning of tilt tube will help prevent rust from seizing the thing permanently... Happy Whalin'... Clark... Spruce Creek Navy
Tom2697 posted 05-06-2003 11:03 AM ET (US)
Grizzly,
Do not twist the cable to free it!!! These cables are usually spiral wrapped. Twisting in the wrong direction will break your cable in no time. If you can determine the direction of the wrap (ie - you can see the wire strands), you can twist gently but the chances of breaking the cable are still high. Gently tapping with a hammer is a better method.
As for how to lube it, if you can fully remove the cable from the sheath, do this. I agree that lithium grease will work best but as long as you maintain the cable, almost any lube should do. As for the grease nut, I learned why only 1 pump is needed, you will destroy the nut on the 2nd pump, or you will destroy the sheath.
Popeye posted 05-06-2003 06:40 PM ET (US)

When you have it apart,if the inside of the tube is really badly rusted, get after it with a brake honing stone and a drill motor. Run it back and forth with a little brake fluid and it will clean up like new.
Good Luck
Mark
grizzly posted 05-06-2003 08:37 PM ET (US)
Thanks for the tips. I had another go at it and here is an update.
I can easily pull the cable out of the starboard side of the tilt tube, up to the point where only a bit of cable is left inside the tube. I can't pull it any further (all the way out) because something is holding the end of it inside the tilt tube.
When I do this, the other end of the cable that sticks out an inch or two from the port side of the tilt tube (to which is attached the steering arm - although I have the arm disconnected) stays in exactly the same place. Obviously the connection between the steering cable and the end piece has broken somewhere inside the tilt tube.
When I try to pull or hammer on the end of the cable that sticks out of the port side of the tilt tube, it does not go in or out, but seems locked in place.
I think my only remedy is to remove the whole tilt tube (which I realize means removing the engine from the boat) and replace the tilt tube and the teleflex cable with new parts. This is going to cost me some $ in parts.
Any more thoughts?
Cheers.
adaps4 posted 05-07-2003 02:17 PM ET (US)
I think that the cable is supposed to work the way you described. Starboard side of engine -cable should extend in and out of the main rod. There is a solid piece that fits the length of the rod. When you hit the end, it stops. The actual rod inside the engine tube should not be moving at all.
This was the exact scenarion I had. Keep after it. Do NOT take the engine apart for this. I would try everything before I would do that. Get some PB Blaster, coat the hell out of it, coat it again, and then bang on the end with a hammer. Be careful, but not too careful. Mine was hell to get out, and I really had to lay into it a couple times to get it to move an inch- like 10 hits per inch to give an idea. Then when you run out of space, get something long that you can use to bang it through the rest of the way.
This was no short project, it took about 20-30 min to get the rod out. Then you gotta get all the corrosion out. The good news is- now, I can turn the wheel with one finger it is so smooth. Give it time- have fun, and keep us posted.
grizzly posted 05-07-2003 09:12 PM ET (US)
Thanks adaps4.
The reason I think the cable is broken is that before (when it worked) the cable ran in and out of both the port and starboard sides of the tilt tube together, which is pretty obvious because the cable is a continuous piece.
Now, there seems to be a disconnect somewhere inside the tube, because I can pull the cable out the starboard side but the port side end remains stationary (locked in place). Unfortunately, I can't pull the cable all the way out the starboard side to see what is broken because something is preventing it from coming all the way out.
BTW - what is PT Blaster?
DillonBW posted 05-07-2003 10:13 PM ET (US)
After you have freed up your steering, put in grease nipple nuts, cleaned with wire brushes etc, etc. Go buy an inner tube for a little bicyle wheel, cut it to the length of the extended (exposed) end of the steering shaft, slide it over this with a hose clamp at each end. This will stop you from touching the greasy shaft and keep (or slow up)saltwater fron creeping in around it. Did mine years ago, never had a problem since. When the rubber perishes, still got a length or two in the boat shed for replacment.
adaps4 posted 05-08-2003 05:34 PM ET (US)
PB Blaster is WD-40x 10 sort of. You just spray it on and let it sit- it will loosen anything. Car part stores carry it. So, it sounds like the thick rod broke in half?? Could that be? I can't see how that would happen. There is a solid smaller diameter post that goes through the whole rod- could this be what you are seeing? If you have a digital camera, pictures would help. Hope you get it fixed.
whalersman posted 05-08-2003 07:09 PM ET (US)
The larger rod that goes in and out and the Port side is threaded onto a smaller rod inside the larger rod itself...
It sounds like something is broken already so I would suggest trying to unscrew the large end from the inner rod. Try and turn the large end (Port side) Counter Clockwise with Vise Grips, Pipe Wrench, etc... Once you get it turning and loose, it should unscrew itself from the inner rod and then you should be able to get both ends out...
The new Teleflex cable comes with a new Large end so I wouldn't worry about the old one.
Good Luck and let us know
grizzly posted 05-08-2003 08:13 PM ET (US)
Thanks all for the great advice. It is good to be in the company of such knowledgable whaler fans.
When I get some time (this weekend I hope) I will pursue these leads and post my findings!
lhg posted 05-08-2003 08:48 PM ET (US)
Sounds like a new cable is needed. I agree with the SS Steersman grease fitting port side tilt tube nut. When using one of these, be sure to remove the Mercury O-ring inside the tilt tube, since the o-ring in the Steersman nut replaces it. This way grease can be inserted behind the O-ring and your problems will be over. Inject the grease with the ram fully extended or while it's being drawn in. Also, with this nut, new O-rings can be installed in minutes, without removing the cable, as the Mercury o-ring requires (and never gets done). This nut also replaces the Mercury tilt tube nut.
adaps4 posted 05-09-2003 10:16 AM ET (US)
Wow Grizzly-
I think that is the first time I have been lumped into the knowledgeable group. I must be doing something right. Thanks.

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Author	Topic: frozen steering
grizzly	posted 05-05-2003 09:55 PM ET (US) The teleflex cable steering on my '92 13 GLS has "frozen" after a few months without use. As far as I can tell, the end of the cable where it feeds into the hollow tube in the bracket on the engine (a 40 HP Merc 4 cylinder) has seized in place. Any suggestions on fixes? Much obliged for any tips.
Drisney	posted 05-05-2003 11:19 PM ET (US) Griz, When I used to have this problem on my 17; I would disconnect the arm to the engine(1 bolt) then use the arm to turn (twist) the steering cable. Twist only enough to break it free. Now, as long as you have it disconnected, do yourself a favor and buy ($20) a nut for the end with a zirc in it. Run your steering cable out as far as it will go(with the nut off) lube the cable very well with marine grease and crank it back in. install the zirk nut and lube it. If you do this (1 hour work tops) you will never have frozen steering again just lube the zirk periodically..... Dave
adaps4	posted 05-06-2003 12:29 AM ET (US) Late night for me- Just got back from a Dixie Chicks concert- another topic altogether. I am just about finished doing a complete refurb of my 13'. The steering had seized just like yours. At first, I wrapped a towel around the rod and used vice grips to pull on it. This didn't do too much. Next, I tapped the other end with a hammer until it was alomost in the tube. I then took a long bolt and held it to the end and tapped it through. This took time and patience- I didn't want to damage anything. To prevent this from happening again, I first took a wire brush to the inside. I got plenty of rust out of there. I gently pushed the steering rod through slowly back and forth until it went through. I then pulled it out and cleaned the rod several times until clean. A few squirts of marine grease came next, and then I put the end nut on. You can get these nuts from any marine store. I got mine from Bob's Marine in Ruskin FL. Just make sure it is the right one for your engine, and you will be fine. You only have to grease the nut every once in a while, and it will prevent this from happening. Also, remember that it only requires one pump of grease. I don't know why, but the guys at Bob's were adament about this fact- something to do with completely wrecking the steering system with too much grease. Good luck getting it out.
Clark Roberts	posted 05-06-2003 05:30 AM ET (US) I have had my share of frozen-up steering and attribute most of it to the heavy grease most often used (like wheel bearing grease). The stuff just turns to glue and then hardens up for some reason! My solution (used for years) is to lightly coat rod and inside of tilt tube with white lithium grease (just a very thin film) and assemble. Then periodically oil with very light oil like 3-in-1 or Marvel Mystery oil (nothing heavier than 90 weight gear oil). This has worked for me as far as lubrication goes. If engine has non-stainless tilt tube then annual removal of rod and cleaning of tilt tube will help prevent rust from seizing the thing permanently... Happy Whalin'... Clark... Spruce Creek Navy
Tom2697	posted 05-06-2003 11:03 AM ET (US) Grizzly, Do not twist the cable to free it!!! These cables are usually spiral wrapped. Twisting in the wrong direction will break your cable in no time. If you can determine the direction of the wrap (ie - you can see the wire strands), you can twist gently but the chances of breaking the cable are still high. Gently tapping with a hammer is a better method. As for how to lube it, if you can fully remove the cable from the sheath, do this. I agree that lithium grease will work best but as long as you maintain the cable, almost any lube should do. As for the grease nut, I learned why only 1 pump is needed, you will destroy the nut on the 2nd pump, or you will destroy the sheath.
Popeye	posted 05-06-2003 06:40 PM ET (US) When you have it apart,if the inside of the tube is really badly rusted, get after it with a brake honing stone and a drill motor. Run it back and forth with a little brake fluid and it will clean up like new. Good Luck Mark
grizzly	posted 05-06-2003 08:37 PM ET (US) Thanks for the tips. I had another go at it and here is an update. I can easily pull the cable out of the starboard side of the tilt tube, up to the point where only a bit of cable is left inside the tube. I can't pull it any further (all the way out) because something is holding the end of it inside the tilt tube. When I do this, the other end of the cable that sticks out an inch or two from the port side of the tilt tube (to which is attached the steering arm - although I have the arm disconnected) stays in exactly the same place. Obviously the connection between the steering cable and the end piece has broken somewhere inside the tilt tube. When I try to pull or hammer on the end of the cable that sticks out of the port side of the tilt tube, it does not go in or out, but seems locked in place. I think my only remedy is to remove the whole tilt tube (which I realize means removing the engine from the boat) and replace the tilt tube and the teleflex cable with new parts. This is going to cost me some $ in parts. Any more thoughts? Cheers.
adaps4	posted 05-07-2003 02:17 PM ET (US) I think that the cable is supposed to work the way you described. Starboard side of engine -cable should extend in and out of the main rod. There is a solid piece that fits the length of the rod. When you hit the end, it stops. The actual rod inside the engine tube should not be moving at all. This was the exact scenarion I had. Keep after it. Do NOT take the engine apart for this. I would try everything before I would do that. Get some PB Blaster, coat the hell out of it, coat it again, and then bang on the end with a hammer. Be careful, but not too careful. Mine was hell to get out, and I really had to lay into it a couple times to get it to move an inch- like 10 hits per inch to give an idea. Then when you run out of space, get something long that you can use to bang it through the rest of the way. This was no short project, it took about 20-30 min to get the rod out. Then you gotta get all the corrosion out. The good news is- now, I can turn the wheel with one finger it is so smooth. Give it time- have fun, and keep us posted.
grizzly	posted 05-07-2003 09:12 PM ET (US) Thanks adaps4. The reason I think the cable is broken is that before (when it worked) the cable ran in and out of both the port and starboard sides of the tilt tube together, which is pretty obvious because the cable is a continuous piece. Now, there seems to be a disconnect somewhere inside the tube, because I can pull the cable out the starboard side but the port side end remains stationary (locked in place). Unfortunately, I can't pull the cable all the way out the starboard side to see what is broken because something is preventing it from coming all the way out. BTW - what is PT Blaster?
DillonBW	posted 05-07-2003 10:13 PM ET (US) After you have freed up your steering, put in grease nipple nuts, cleaned with wire brushes etc, etc. Go buy an inner tube for a little bicyle wheel, cut it to the length of the extended (exposed) end of the steering shaft, slide it over this with a hose clamp at each end. This will stop you from touching the greasy shaft and keep (or slow up)saltwater fron creeping in around it. Did mine years ago, never had a problem since. When the rubber perishes, still got a length or two in the boat shed for replacment.
adaps4	posted 05-08-2003 05:34 PM ET (US) PB Blaster is WD-40x 10 sort of. You just spray it on and let it sit- it will loosen anything. Car part stores carry it. So, it sounds like the thick rod broke in half?? Could that be? I can't see how that would happen. There is a solid smaller diameter post that goes through the whole rod- could this be what you are seeing? If you have a digital camera, pictures would help. Hope you get it fixed.
whalersman	posted 05-08-2003 07:09 PM ET (US) The larger rod that goes in and out and the Port side is threaded onto a smaller rod inside the larger rod itself... It sounds like something is broken already so I would suggest trying to unscrew the large end from the inner rod. Try and turn the large end (Port side) Counter Clockwise with Vise Grips, Pipe Wrench, etc... Once you get it turning and loose, it should unscrew itself from the inner rod and then you should be able to get both ends out... The new Teleflex cable comes with a new Large end so I wouldn't worry about the old one. Good Luck and let us know
grizzly	posted 05-08-2003 08:13 PM ET (US) Thanks all for the great advice. It is good to be in the company of such knowledgable whaler fans. When I get some time (this weekend I hope) I will pursue these leads and post my findings!
lhg	posted 05-08-2003 08:48 PM ET (US) Sounds like a new cable is needed. I agree with the SS Steersman grease fitting port side tilt tube nut. When using one of these, be sure to remove the Mercury O-ring inside the tilt tube, since the o-ring in the Steersman nut replaces it. This way grease can be inserted behind the O-ring and your problems will be over. Inject the grease with the ram fully extended or while it's being drawn in. Also, with this nut, new O-rings can be installed in minutes, without removing the cable, as the Mercury o-ring requires (and never gets done). This nut also replaces the Mercury tilt tube nut.
adaps4	posted 05-09-2003 10:16 AM ET (US) Wow Grizzly- I think that is the first time I have been lumped into the knowledgeable group. I must be doing something right. Thanks.