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Author Topic:   Kicker Installation on 17' Montauk
Ferdinando posted 02-17-2004 09:56 AM ET (US)   Profile for Ferdinando   Send Email to Ferdinando  
I am about to install a 6 hp 4-Stroke on my Montauk, do I need to remove part of the rubrail at the rear to install the motor?

Should I bolt the engine to the transom or do I just use the engine clamps?

Any other suggestions are welcome.

Thks,

Fred

Dick posted 02-17-2004 10:05 AM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Fred

On my Montauk I used a Panther fixed bracket and a homemade set back. This allowed me to mount on the stbd side without cutting the rub rail and interfering with the stern light.

I will e mail you a picture.

Dick

Dick posted 02-17-2004 11:46 AM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Fred

My e mails to you are not going through.

There is a picture of my kicker installation at:
www.homepage.mac.com/whaler1/PhotoAlbum4.html

Dick

Ferdinando posted 02-17-2004 01:00 PM ET (US)     Profile for Ferdinando  Send Email to Ferdinando     
Dick:

Your set-up is awesome, I'd like to copy it if I may. Can you fill me in on the details and what parts I would need.

It looks much better then being hooked up to the transom itself. Your Whaler looks pretty new, mine is a 98.

Thks for the info.

Fred

Dick posted 02-17-2004 03:55 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Fred

Glad you like the set up and you are more than welcome to use the idea.

I started with a Panther #405 Static Motor Mount Plate.
www.panthermarineproducts.com/images/pan_products/55-0405L.jpg I glued up 2 pieces of 1" mahogany with a 1 3/4" oak center for the spacer several coats of poly later it was ready for installation.

I did the entire job by myself but it would have been much easier with a little help when it came to the lifting and positioning.
Total set back with my spacer was 3 3/4" and to clear the rub rail I had to cut off the thumb screws to drop the motor on. I would add at least an inch to the set back if I were to do it again.

The assembly is through bolted to the transom with 4 bolts and the holes bedded with Boat life Life Calk.

If you need any more info let me know.

Dick

steelhead5 posted 02-17-2004 05:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for steelhead5  Send Email to steelhead5     
Whaler recommends that you mount (clamp) directly to your starboard transom. I have a honda 8hp 20 inch shaft mounted directly to my transome, and it works perfectly. Why wreck your transom with bolts?
Dick posted 02-17-2004 06:16 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
steelhead5

Why wreck your transom by cutting the rub rail and screwing the clamps into the gel coat?

The mounting system I devised not only looks good but is far more secure than the clamp on method.

Dick

whalersman posted 02-17-2004 06:45 PM ET (US)     Profile for whalersman  Send Email to whalersman     
steelhead5,

What year Montauk do you own? I am guessing the older Classic that did not have the Rub Rail wraping around the transom like the newer Classics..

Dick's boat was the newer version and so it would seem right to do what he has done to preserve the Rub Rail.. A fine job too Dick..

On my older 1978 Classic, I mounted directly to the transom as I did not have the wrap around Rub Rail... I also Clamped and BOLTED my 8 hp kicker... I new it would never go anyplace with the bolts installed... Clamps can come loose and over the rear she goes unless you have a safety chain...

Joe Kriz

Dick posted 02-17-2004 07:06 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
whalersman

Thanks.
I did not consider the fact that stealhead5 may have one of the earlier Montauks. I do agree with you, through bolting on the older hull is still a good idea in case the clamps slip.

Dick

Ferdinando posted 02-17-2004 08:14 PM ET (US)     Profile for Ferdinando  Send Email to Ferdinando     
Dick:

I'm a little confused with the gluing part, could you send me a picture of a close-up of the bracket and how it's connected, bracket, wood, transom. Appreciate all the help.

Thks again,

Fred

Ferdinando posted 02-17-2004 08:20 PM ET (US)     Profile for Ferdinando  Send Email to Ferdinando     
Dick:

I forgot to ask, what does the motor mount plate run for $$$

Thks,

Fred

Dick posted 02-17-2004 09:46 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Fred

I surfaced planed the three pieces of wood and glued them together. I next clamped them to the lower portion of the Panther bracket, the part that would go against the transom, and marked the outline. Next I cut the wood to shape on the bandsaw and finish sanded it prior to the poly finish.

The Panther bracket was around $150.00.

I just e-mailed you a close up picture of the bracket. Hope this one goes through as none of the others have.

Dick

Dick posted 02-17-2004 09:50 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Fred

The last e-mail has been kicked back as un deliverable, as all others have. We seem to have an e-mail problem.

Dick

Ferdinando posted 02-18-2004 08:28 AM ET (US)     Profile for Ferdinando  Send Email to Ferdinando     
Dick:

Thks for all your help, my E-Mail address is fvoltaggio@hotmail.com or FredEastern@aol.com one of these has to work.

Thks again for all your help.

Fred

P.S. Due to the fact that your kicker is on the bracket and not directly on the transom is their any flexing of the motor itself on the bracket?

Dick posted 02-18-2004 11:48 AM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Fred

Bolted to transom as I did the bracket is an extension of the transom and no flex is possible.

I will try your aol address and see if it works.

Dick

Tom W Clark posted 02-18-2004 12:08 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
Dick,

hotmail has a notoriously low file size limit. Unless an attached photo is quite small and the recipient has cleared out their space, any attachment will bounce back as undeliverable. I NEVER bother sending attachments to hotmail accounts for this reason.

steelhead5 posted 02-18-2004 02:30 PM ET (US)     Profile for steelhead5  Send Email to steelhead5     
btw I do have an 81 montauk. You can bolt, or just chain it up to your rear lifting eye (if you have one). I just cant get myself to cut into my boat anywhere. As for the ultimate test, I pulled a boner one day and took off with the honda down. IT started to pull off, but the chain saved it. Also, I put a nice sheet rubber gasket material on the motor side of the transom, so that it can get nice and snug.
MantyMonty posted 02-19-2004 10:11 AM ET (US)     Profile for MantyMonty  Send Email to MantyMonty     
I would like to know if anyone has mounted a kicker four stroke on a 2004 Montauk. Also if you did, where did you put it and how is it mounted. I am going to purchase a 6 or 8 hp. in the near future for this purpose if it can be mounted on the 04. Thanks for your help.
Dick posted 02-19-2004 12:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Looking at the 2004 brochure I can see that it has the same CP rubrail that my 1999 had. If you hang a kicker directly to the transom the rubrail will have to be cut. The alternative would be to use a mount such as mine or one of the heavy duty Garelick brackets.
Dick
bobeson posted 02-20-2004 07:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for bobeson  Send Email to bobeson     

I bought a 6hp Mercury four-stroke and had it mounted
on my 2003 Montauk 170 by the dealer I bought it from.
I told them I wanted something very sturdy and still
removable, and I was willing to pay for custom work
for a suitable bracket.

What I got was complete garbage. They took an aluminum
Garelick moveable bracket and mounted it on two
sections of aluminum square tubing that acted as
stand-offs from the transom. The whole assembly was
bolted in four places through the starboard transom.

The vibration of the motor through this rickety bracket
was terrible. The bracket is not suitable for trailering,
and not suitable for motoring with the kicker lifted.
In fact the bracket was just not suitable in general.

I suspect the vibration would still be bad but more
tolerable with a fixed bracket.

Fortunately, the kicker was stolen off my boat three
weeks after I bought it, after using it only twice.
This means I can redesign the whole thing from scratch
to be something much better. I certainly won't be
using the POS Garelick bracket. I probably won't get
another 6HP Mercury four-stroke either, but I'm not
sure what motor will be more suitable that is legal
in California.

I spent some time evaluating possible fixed bracket
designs while I still had the motor on my boat, and the
clearance required for tilting means either a huge
setback or a lifting mechanism of some sort, in
order to clear the rub rail. Perhaps other outboard
will have better mechanical suitability for tilting
on a fixed bracket. I don't intend to get another
kicker motor until this mounting issue is solved.

I'd love to hear from anybody else who has had more luck
in mounting a kicker on their 170.

Dick posted 02-20-2004 08:52 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
bobeson

Don't blame Garelick, your dealer installed a product that was not correct for the application.

Garelick makes many motor brackets from light to heavy duty and they are all good but not all are good for every application.

www.garelick.com check out the 71090/91 series. The are h___ for stout. Depending on your browser you will get pictures and specs or just specs. They may be available at Cabela's, I didn't check.

The slide on/off bracket mounts are for light duty applications. Through bolt the bracket to the transom and through bolt the motor to the bracket.

Dick

Ferdinando posted 02-25-2004 12:39 PM ET (US)     Profile for Ferdinando  Send Email to Ferdinando     
Tom:

I finally purchased my kicker today I went new, Johnson 6HP and belive it or not I called the dealer just to ask if he had any of these motors left he said yes and then quoted me for $1,566 dollars. Last week he quoted me $1,750 dollars and would not budge from that price, you figure it out. I bought the engine on my credit card and will pick up this Sat.

Heres my final question regarding mounting. I like Dick's system but I don't want to spring for the extra 150 bucks for the mount. The rear side of my Whaler (Montauk 98) slants downwards. Do I mount the engine on this slant or do I try to keep it straight as my main engine? Do I use starboard, etc. And what can I do to minimize vibration.

Thks again for your help and to Dick for his assistance also.

Fred

Tom W Clark posted 02-25-2004 12:47 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
Fred,

You can mount the kicker with the slope of the transom top or you can raise the outboard clamp a bit so the kicker sits plumb and parallel to the main motor. The latter will look nicer and is what most people would do (and I have done).

I would strongly recommend you use the auxiliary bolt holes and let the motor clamps dig into the fiberglass for a good grip. This is what Whaler has always recommended doing. I would not use a rubber pad.

Dick posted 02-25-2004 07:56 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
Fred

I think that you will find it necessary to cut the rubrail befor the motor will fit for a direct clamp on installation.
No matter which way you go I would through bolt the motor bracket to the transom. This will not only eliminate any vibration problems but will also stop the motor from falling off if the clamps loosen.
After mounting you can adjust the motors vertical orientation with the pin holes on the bracket.

Dick

Ferdinando posted 02-26-2004 05:05 PM ET (US)     Profile for Ferdinando  Send Email to Ferdinando     
Tom & Dick:

Thks for the info, I will start this project up this Sun morning with an extra pair of hands to help out. Will let you know how everything turns out and yes I plan to thru bolt the engine to the transom.

Thks again,

Fred

waterguy posted 02-26-2004 05:38 PM ET (US)     Profile for waterguy  Send Email to waterguy     
Dick,
Maybe I'm just catching up to you, but I like the way you strap your tank in. I use a strap over the top of the tank and I have to kneel down to get under the seat to loosen or tighten the strap. Does your strap simply go around the seat legs or is it attatched to the legs somewhere?

Water

Dick posted 02-26-2004 08:31 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
waterguy

The strap system is made up of two Kevloc tie downs. It just goes around the RPS legs and is not attached anywhere.

ferdinando

Good luck on the install.

Dick

waterguy posted 02-27-2004 01:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for waterguy  Send Email to waterguy     
Thanks Dick.
Has anyone tried something more permanant like a bar going across the legs? Pictues anyone?
Ferdinando posted 02-29-2004 08:51 PM ET (US)     Profile for Ferdinando  Send Email to Ferdinando     
Guys:

The operation was a success, I mounted my kicker in about 3 hrs with help from a friend. I was able to re-install my rubrail around the engine and in between the mounting bracket so it looks like a custom installation. I did notice some vibration at engine start up but it calmed down as soon as it warmed up.

I through bolted the engine to the transom as Tom/Dick suggested and I did give it that tilt so the engine looks
straight. All in all everything went well and I am very satisfied how everything looks.

Tom, I do have one more question, I can purchase an optional 6 amp generator for my engine, my question is could this be used to charge a dead battery??????

Thks again to all for your help it made this project much more enjoyable and simple.

Fred

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