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Author Topic:   Cetol Marine Light - How many Coats?

John from Madison CT posted 03-25-2004 04:07 PM ET (US)
Well, I took ALL the darn wood off my 22' Outrage. That includes the entire super console and all the wood at the stern due to a Whaler Drive.
It was meticulously sanded to bare wood, then I put 3 coats of Cetol Marine Light. It says 3 coats is what you need, but annual maintenance thereafter.
Does anyone know if additional coats will benefit me in any way? Has anyone used the Cetol Clear as a topcoat?
I'll link some pics real soon to show you how it came out.
John
Barry posted 03-25-2004 09:13 PM ET (US)
Three coats should be fine and should last a long time. I tried the Clear but didn't like it. Too shiny for me. I prefer the matt finish.
I'd love to see the pictures. I'm curious to see how the Light looks.
John from Madison CT posted 03-25-2004 09:28 PM ET (US)
Here ya go boys:
http://ctfisherman.com/data/55Cetol6.jpg
http://ctfisherman.com/data/55Cetol1.jpg
http://ctfisherman.com/data/55Cetol5.jpg
John from Madison CT posted 03-25-2004 09:30 PM ET (US)
And one more:
http://ctfisherman.com/data/55Cetol4.jpg
jimh posted 03-26-2004 07:57 AM ET (US)
When you collect in one place all the wooden components from a classic Boston Whaler boat like John's OUTRAGE 22, suddenly you realize just how much wood trim and decoration there really is. No wonder they don't make the newer boats with these wonderful teak and mahogany trim pieces and components. It would add many thousands of dollars to the price!
The wood looks great, and when back on the boat will look even better as an accent to the gel coat hues and other components of your fine classic.
Over the LINE posted 03-26-2004 08:25 AM ET (US)
I did the one piece of wood, on my slip kept sailboat, that does not have a cover with Cetol Light about two years ago. I followed the directions and it has held up wonderfully. Down south we don't pull boats for the winter, so it has more than 700 days in the sun.
Sure would be easier if I could take all the wood off my sailboat and varnish in the garage.
AC posted 03-26-2004 10:54 AM ET (US)
8 coats of varnish, John. A short while ago Tom Clark recommended a book on wood finishing, aka brightwork, by Rebecca Wittman. I was in the midst for a search of such a book, and then found Wittman's book for sale by Hamilton Marine. I am only 3 chapters into it, but will quote Wittman on the very topic you inquire about: "As an exterior finish, varnish can look beautiful after three coats but requires substantial buildup - no fewer than eight coats from bare wood - in order to function properly as a protector. This foundation must be refreshed periodically to maintain its integrity as well as its beauty." Was your wood bare?
John from Madison CT posted 03-26-2004 12:58 PM ET (US)
AC: My wood was bare, but is Cetol like varnish? I thought it was fundamentally different stuff.
John
adaco posted 03-26-2004 04:49 PM ET (US)
John from Madison CT-
Barry is correct about the number of coats for Cetol. An excellent site I discovered for Cetol-related questions is <www.yachtpaint.com>. Just select Cetol products from the product list, then follow the links for applying any of the Cetol products to any condition of wood. Hope that helps.
adaco
Drisney posted 03-26-2004 05:05 PM ET (US)
John, I just finished stripping and redoing all the brightwork on my V-22 Revenge. It really is a lot of wood. I put four to five coats on everything and plan to add a coat each year with some sanding. For the subsequent coats I will carefully paint in place not remove them. Dave
Fitz posted 03-26-2004 09:28 PM ET (US)
John:
I don't think you'll get any benefit by applying more than three coats. I removed and refinished my boat's teak last winter using Cetol light, matte finish, three coats. It looked as great at the end of the season as at the beginning:
http://www.eurnet.com/wellcraft/restored/index.htm
It would undoubtedly look better on a Whaler, but teak is teak.
AC posted 03-26-2004 11:37 PM ET (US)
Sikkens Cetol is like varnish, but, yes, different. Cetol is a synthetic, whereas varnish is a complex finish that consists of oil, solvents and thinners, resins, dryers and additives. I have no experience with synthetics, so I certainly won't advise against the manufacturer's recommendation. I didn't catch the difference when I first posted.
Fitz, one season of exposure doesn't prove that more coats are of no benefit, at least not with varnish. PowerBoat Reports performed a test of 20 varnishes, and exposed them to the elements for different time frames, and also used a varied number of coats. The results proved that more coats result in longer protection. Perhaps you are correct with Sikkens Cetol.
montauk madness posted 02-16-2006 01:31 AM ET (US)
Are more people leaning towards using Cetol Light vs. the standard color Cetol? I'm about to do my 89 Outrage 20 and don't want it to end up too dark or orange. I want it to be as close to the original color as possible.
My boat is in the water all summer in the Pacific Northwest
Thanks for your help,
-Jeff
dhorton posted 02-16-2006 10:39 AM ET (US)
John. I put 7 coats on my boat before I got the depth of shine that I was looking for. Sanding between each coat was the most important.
BBS posted 02-16-2006 01:21 PM ET (US)
I followed the manufacturers advice and used 3 coats, sanding between each (you can see it in my profile). After a year of use it has held up OK, except where the caulk is between the boards on my gunnals. It has begun to peel/allow water in at this point. Everytime I look at this I wonder if another coat or two would have prevented it. I plan on putting another 2 coats on this year.
Florida15 posted 02-16-2006 03:04 PM ET (US)
So, which is better , Cetol or varnish ?
I still don't understand the difference. Does Cetol look like varnish and apply like varnish ?
Does it give the same finish as varnish ?
BBS posted 02-16-2006 03:39 PM ET (US)
Works like varnish, cleans up like varnish, a little more "orange" than varnish, but a very nice finish. I didn't want the real gloss shine so I buffed mine out with #000 steel wool.

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Author	Topic: Cetol Marine Light - How many Coats?
John from Madison CT	posted 03-25-2004 04:07 PM ET (US) Well, I took ALL the darn wood off my 22' Outrage. That includes the entire super console and all the wood at the stern due to a Whaler Drive. It was meticulously sanded to bare wood, then I put 3 coats of Cetol Marine Light. It says 3 coats is what you need, but annual maintenance thereafter. Does anyone know if additional coats will benefit me in any way? Has anyone used the Cetol Clear as a topcoat? I'll link some pics real soon to show you how it came out. John
Barry	posted 03-25-2004 09:13 PM ET (US) Three coats should be fine and should last a long time. I tried the Clear but didn't like it. Too shiny for me. I prefer the matt finish. I'd love to see the pictures. I'm curious to see how the Light looks.
John from Madison CT	posted 03-25-2004 09:28 PM ET (US) Here ya go boys: http://ctfisherman.com/data/55Cetol6.jpg http://ctfisherman.com/data/55Cetol1.jpg http://ctfisherman.com/data/55Cetol5.jpg
John from Madison CT	posted 03-25-2004 09:30 PM ET (US) And one more: http://ctfisherman.com/data/55Cetol4.jpg
jimh	posted 03-26-2004 07:57 AM ET (US) When you collect in one place all the wooden components from a classic Boston Whaler boat like John's OUTRAGE 22, suddenly you realize just how much wood trim and decoration there really is. No wonder they don't make the newer boats with these wonderful teak and mahogany trim pieces and components. It would add many thousands of dollars to the price! The wood looks great, and when back on the boat will look even better as an accent to the gel coat hues and other components of your fine classic.
Over the LINE	posted 03-26-2004 08:25 AM ET (US) I did the one piece of wood, on my slip kept sailboat, that does not have a cover with Cetol Light about two years ago. I followed the directions and it has held up wonderfully. Down south we don't pull boats for the winter, so it has more than 700 days in the sun. Sure would be easier if I could take all the wood off my sailboat and varnish in the garage.
AC	posted 03-26-2004 10:54 AM ET (US) 8 coats of varnish, John. A short while ago Tom Clark recommended a book on wood finishing, aka brightwork, by Rebecca Wittman. I was in the midst for a search of such a book, and then found Wittman's book for sale by Hamilton Marine. I am only 3 chapters into it, but will quote Wittman on the very topic you inquire about: "As an exterior finish, varnish can look beautiful after three coats but requires substantial buildup - no fewer than eight coats from bare wood - in order to function properly as a protector. This foundation must be refreshed periodically to maintain its integrity as well as its beauty." Was your wood bare?
John from Madison CT	posted 03-26-2004 12:58 PM ET (US) AC: My wood was bare, but is Cetol like varnish? I thought it was fundamentally different stuff. John
adaco	posted 03-26-2004 04:49 PM ET (US) John from Madison CT- Barry is correct about the number of coats for Cetol. An excellent site I discovered for Cetol-related questions is <www.yachtpaint.com>. Just select Cetol products from the product list, then follow the links for applying any of the Cetol products to any condition of wood. Hope that helps. adaco
Drisney	posted 03-26-2004 05:05 PM ET (US) John, I just finished stripping and redoing all the brightwork on my V-22 Revenge. It really is a lot of wood. I put four to five coats on everything and plan to add a coat each year with some sanding. For the subsequent coats I will carefully paint in place not remove them. Dave
Fitz	posted 03-26-2004 09:28 PM ET (US) John: I don't think you'll get any benefit by applying more than three coats. I removed and refinished my boat's teak last winter using Cetol light, matte finish, three coats. It looked as great at the end of the season as at the beginning: http://www.eurnet.com/wellcraft/restored/index.htm It would undoubtedly look better on a Whaler, but teak is teak.
AC	posted 03-26-2004 11:37 PM ET (US) Sikkens Cetol is like varnish, but, yes, different. Cetol is a synthetic, whereas varnish is a complex finish that consists of oil, solvents and thinners, resins, dryers and additives. I have no experience with synthetics, so I certainly won't advise against the manufacturer's recommendation. I didn't catch the difference when I first posted. Fitz, one season of exposure doesn't prove that more coats are of no benefit, at least not with varnish. PowerBoat Reports performed a test of 20 varnishes, and exposed them to the elements for different time frames, and also used a varied number of coats. The results proved that more coats result in longer protection. Perhaps you are correct with Sikkens Cetol.
montauk madness	posted 02-16-2006 01:31 AM ET (US) Are more people leaning towards using Cetol Light vs. the standard color Cetol? I'm about to do my 89 Outrage 20 and don't want it to end up too dark or orange. I want it to be as close to the original color as possible. My boat is in the water all summer in the Pacific Northwest Thanks for your help, -Jeff
dhorton	posted 02-16-2006 10:39 AM ET (US) John. I put 7 coats on my boat before I got the depth of shine that I was looking for. Sanding between each coat was the most important.
BBS	posted 02-16-2006 01:21 PM ET (US) I followed the manufacturers advice and used 3 coats, sanding between each (you can see it in my profile). After a year of use it has held up OK, except where the caulk is between the boards on my gunnals. It has begun to peel/allow water in at this point. Everytime I look at this I wonder if another coat or two would have prevented it. I plan on putting another 2 coats on this year.
Florida15	posted 02-16-2006 03:04 PM ET (US) So, which is better , Cetol or varnish ? I still don't understand the difference. Does Cetol look like varnish and apply like varnish ? Does it give the same finish as varnish ?
BBS	posted 02-16-2006 03:39 PM ET (US) Works like varnish, cleans up like varnish, a little more "orange" than varnish, but a very nice finish. I didn't want the real gloss shine so I buffed mine out with #000 steel wool.