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Author Topic:   Buzzer warning 1986 Evinrude 175hp VRO

Raaaaay posted 03-11-2009 12:50 PM ET (US)
I took out my new to me 1973 Outrage last weekend. It is powered with a 1986 Evinrude 175hp VRO. Last week I had the motor serviced to include a new water pump impeller, full tune-up, new thermostats, gear oil, compression check with 95-105 lbs, and a check-up that indicated that the motor was running good.
I took the boat out on Saturday and the motor started and idled great, went through the 5mph no wake zone fine. Upon giving it gas to get up on a plane, a "constant" warning buzzer sounded. The buzzer stopped when I slowed back to an idle. I went through this several times, and then powered it more up to about 40mph, and the buzzer sounded and then the engine cut out(I am not sure if it cut out 100% or just dropped the rpm's back as I pulled the throttle back all the way and turned off the motor). The motor restarted and again idled fine up to about 7mph.
I am running off of a 6 gallon Tempo deck tank as I dont trust the in-hull tank yet. The 6 gallon deck tank is connected by a 3/8 inch line, although now I realize that it should be connected by a 1/2 inch line.
ALSO....I may have inadvertently NOT opened the vent on top of the tank...I am not sure of this.
SO....did I experience a buzzer due to a fuel delivery problem due to my not venting the tank properly, or running a 3/8 inch line instead of a 1/2 inch line?????
I was going to take the boat back to the dealer, but before I do, I will go back out on the water with it this next weekend to see if my stupidity was the cause of the problems...but I would appreciate imput from the forum also...THANKS
Tohsgib posted 03-11-2009 01:12 PM ET (US)
These engines have a fuel restriction buzzer which is also a solid alarm like overheat. A 6 gal tank with a small line could very well be the culprit when you increase the throttle. Could also be a clog in the water passages somewhere. Do you have or have access to a heat gun so you can read the temps of your cyls when running(point and shoot type)? For the overheat alarm to go off it has to get over 190 degrees I believe which is hot enough that you won't be able to touch it. At the normal 140-150 range you can touch it for a second or so before you pull away. Also on mine it would go into S.L.O.W mode if overheated and would run so rough you swear it is trying to rip itself off the transom. This would not go away unless you turned off the key to reset. If your alarm resets itself quickly and no steam is coming out of the pee-hole, I think it is fuel or a bad VRO sensor(if still connected).
Raaaaay posted 03-11-2009 01:32 PM ET (US)
The dealer checked the engine temp with a point and shoot heat gun when he serviced the motor last week and he told me the temp was fine.
There was no steam coming out of the pee hole, and the dealer indicated that the water passages were fine when it was serviced last week.
One strange thing was when the motor was serviced last week was that there were no thermostats in the motor, why a prior owner had removed these...I have no idea.
I am very curious if my problem was the vent cap "maybe" being closed, or a 3/8 inch gas line.
Tohsgib posted 03-11-2009 01:43 PM ET (US)
If it is not the fuel then remove the thermos and try it again. Many older engines get a little scale in them and the little restriction the thermos make can make it overheat. Others just remove them and are too lazy to buy new ones or their "buddy" says you don't need them. I have owned a couple older engines that would run hot with the thermos in. I would cut the thermo part out and just leave the small brass ring which restricts it enough to keep engine warm but not enough to overheat...might be your answer.
Raaaaay posted 03-11-2009 02:05 PM ET (US)
I will know pretty quickly this weekend if it is a fuel problem.
If not a fuel problem, I think I will follow your suggestion and have the dealer remove the thermostats and give it another try. As I recall, the dealer did indicate that a "part" of the thermostat was there, before they put the new thermostats in. Oh well...maybe $50 was spent on parts that wernt needed.
Pierce posted 03-12-2009 11:04 AM ET (US)
I believe a constant buzz alarm is an over heat issue. An intermitant buzz is a lack of oil.
Tohsgib posted 03-12-2009 11:15 AM ET (US)
No intermittent is low oil. Constant I know is overheat and fuel restriction and I am almost positive that it means NO oil as well. Only reason I know it is fuel restriction is my fuel line was hard wired in, no easy way to disconnect. I used to put a pair of vise grips(with tape) on the line to crimp it when I winterized it...man was that buzzer annoying for the minute and 15 seconds or so it took to run dry.
Sal DiMercurio posted 03-13-2009 09:02 AM ET (US)
I don't know of any 1986 engine that requirers a 1/2" fuel line, as 3/8 is standard on any engine below 250 hp.
You will never see steam come out of the pee hole on an OMC engane, because the water coming out of the pee hole is water that is coming straight from the water pump, "BEFORE" it goes through the engine, thus it will be the temp of the water in the river or lake or coming out of the hose at your house.
It sounds like you have a fuel restriction, possibly a faulty primer bulb, or kink in your fuel line, or a semi clogged fuel filter [ aka water seperator ].
You may also have a dirty tank & the crap inside clogs the pick-up tube, thus alarm time.
That fuel line should be hard connected to the engine, not the snap type.
I would just change the complete fuel line w/bulb before anything, & go from there.
Make sure the arrow on the bulb points towards the engine, an faces upward, as there is a check valve in it & if it's [ arrow ] points down, it could close that valve, restricting the fuel flow...[ not common, but it happens ].
Sal
Tom W Clark posted 03-13-2009 09:43 AM ET (US)
A constant buzzer is either an indication of overheating OR a fuel flow restriction.
Running off a portable tank with the vent closed would surely cause a fuel flow restriction.
Sal is correct, 3/8" diameter fuel hose is all you need. Open the tank's vent an try it again.
Tohsgib posted 03-13-2009 10:28 AM ET (US)
Sal I have seen steam on MANY OMC engines from the P-hole.
Sal DiMercurio posted 03-13-2009 04:56 PM ET (US)
Nick, the water coming out of the p hole on an omc engine shouldn't even be warm.
If the pee hole hose is properly plumbed, the water coming out is supposed to be pre engine.
Unless someone plumbed it wrong, & put the tell tail hose post engine, after it goes through the engine.
I believe the Merc tell tail, is after the water went through the engine, but OMC is pre engine..
Sal
Raaaaay posted 03-14-2009 07:43 PM ET (US)
Thanks for all the advice and ideas. As I said, I am currently running off of a 6 gallon portable tank that is connected via a NEW 3/8" line. The motor side of the gas line is hard plumbed, and the tank side of the gas line has a standard fitting. The bulb is new.
Tommorow I will be back out in the bay and test it again and make sure the vent on the tank is open..hopefully it is a simple cure.
Like I said earlier, the motor was just serviced, so hopefully the buzzer was a result of "user" error....my own stupidity.
I will post the results tommorow.
Raaaaay posted 03-15-2009 11:06 PM ET (US)
The problem was fuel starvation. I went out on the bay today and used the 6 gallon portable tank alone with the 3/8" line, but this time I made sure the cap was vented properly. The BUZZER sounded again, I slowed down the buzzer stopped. I turned over the controls to my son and went back to the tank/hose and as he acelerated the bulb collapased. Then...the buzzer sounded again.
I reattached the in-hull tank with the old line and the motor ran great with no buzzer or problems.
I figure that the fitting on the portable tank is not large enough to allow an adequate amount of fuel through for a 175hp motor.
so...all is well now...I just need to put on a new fuel water seperator filter and make sure that my existing fuel tank is safe to use. I plan to replace the tank soon, but that may not come till next fall.
Thanks to all who gave their ideas on my delima.
jimh posted 03-16-2009 11:38 PM ET (US)
On the larger OMC motors there is a vacuum-operated switch that is Tee-ed into the fuel supply line. If the suction on the fuel supply line becomes excessive, an indicator of a fuel supply restriction, the vacuum in the line exceeds the switch threshold. That is, the switch electrical contact closes. When the switch is closed the alarm sounder is operated. If the suction maintains high vacuum, the alarm will maintain a constant sounding.
One of the problems in running a large and fuel-hungry motor like a classic two-cycle V6 from a portable tank is the risk of fuel restriction at high throttle settings. The sophisticated alarm system of the OMC motor just saved you from a possible major problem. Lack of fuel in the engine can lead to a lean fuel mixture in the combustion chamber. Lean mixtures lead to high temperatures. High temperatures can lead to failures of the piston. That is an expensive repair.
These older OMC motors are quite nicely designed and have the best alarm system of any motors of their era. They are also the only ones that actually sense oil flow in the oil system, and they will sound an alarm if the oil flow rate is not sufficient for the engine speed. That is another plus for these OMC motors.

Raaaaay posted 03-17-2009 10:11 AM ET (US)
Is it possible to run a larger motor off of a portable tank, or even a less portable tank such as a 12 or 18 gallon deck tank[?]
I would think that there is a brass fitting available for a larger deck tank that would allow for the delivery of a larger fuel supply than the restricted brass fitting on my small 6 gallon tank.
jimh posted 03-18-2009 07:57 AM ET (US)
The fuel line to a V6 motor should be 3/8-inch-ID and have correspondingly sized fittings. The fuel pick-up tube in some 6-gallon tanks may be the limiting factor. I suspect that an OEM Evinrude 6-gallon tank might have the proper size of fittings and pick-up tube to permit its use with a V6 engine, but that is just speculation. Check the details of your tank and consult with a dealer.
Tohsgib posted 03-18-2009 10:43 AM ET (US)
Could also be you have a crap Tempo or ?? fuel bulb. Use OEM, does not matter what OEM, just pick one.
Raaaaay posted 03-18-2009 11:32 AM ET (US)
The Tempo tank I was using is the tank for my 40HP Mercury, and thus had a tank-end fitting appropriate for this motor. Like I said...it seemed to be very restrictive.
Obeviously a 175hp motor uses fuel at such a rate that I would empty a 6 gallon tank very quickly. I plan on eventually replacing my inhull tank, but for now, I will just pick up a larger deck tank with an appropriate tank fitting that will allow suffecient fuel flow for the 175hp motor.
Sal DiMercurio posted 03-20-2009 08:16 PM ET (US)
Raaaay, I really doubt that 6 gallon tank [ 5/16" fuel line ] can't supply enough fuel for that engine, because the only time it "MIGHT" be questionable, is at WOT, wide open throttle.
At WOT that engine will pull 17 gallons an hour, & a 5/16' line, will empty a can of 17 gallons that is flowing, in less than an hour.
Unless you run that engine at WOT all the time, I don't think it's the fuel line.
Even though a V-6 engine calls for a 3/8" fuel line, it would only need it, if you ran that engine at WOT for longer than 5 minutes, because at 1/2 - 3/4 throttle that engine is only pulling approx 7 - 10 gallons of fuel an hour, & a 5/16 line would surely provide that.
Sal
Raaaaay posted 03-22-2009 05:28 PM ET (US)
Sal....i feel the problem wasnt the hose itself..but the brass tank fitting. It seems like the brass orafice (Mercury-I think for my 40hp motor) is very small and not designed for the 175hp motor. And, the hose and bulb were brand new and still somewhere there was a restriction that caused the bulb to collapse
Anyways...the motor ran fine on the in-hull tank with the original fuel line...problem solved. Now I just need to ensure that the fuel in the original tank isnt contaminated.

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Author	Topic: Buzzer warning 1986 Evinrude 175hp VRO
Raaaaay	posted 03-11-2009 12:50 PM ET (US) I took out my new to me 1973 Outrage last weekend. It is powered with a 1986 Evinrude 175hp VRO. Last week I had the motor serviced to include a new water pump impeller, full tune-up, new thermostats, gear oil, compression check with 95-105 lbs, and a check-up that indicated that the motor was running good. I took the boat out on Saturday and the motor started and idled great, went through the 5mph no wake zone fine. Upon giving it gas to get up on a plane, a "constant" warning buzzer sounded. The buzzer stopped when I slowed back to an idle. I went through this several times, and then powered it more up to about 40mph, and the buzzer sounded and then the engine cut out(I am not sure if it cut out 100% or just dropped the rpm's back as I pulled the throttle back all the way and turned off the motor). The motor restarted and again idled fine up to about 7mph. I am running off of a 6 gallon Tempo deck tank as I dont trust the in-hull tank yet. The 6 gallon deck tank is connected by a 3/8 inch line, although now I realize that it should be connected by a 1/2 inch line. ALSO....I may have inadvertently NOT opened the vent on top of the tank...I am not sure of this. SO....did I experience a buzzer due to a fuel delivery problem due to my not venting the tank properly, or running a 3/8 inch line instead of a 1/2 inch line????? I was going to take the boat back to the dealer, but before I do, I will go back out on the water with it this next weekend to see if my stupidity was the cause of the problems...but I would appreciate imput from the forum also...THANKS
Tohsgib	posted 03-11-2009 01:12 PM ET (US) These engines have a fuel restriction buzzer which is also a solid alarm like overheat. A 6 gal tank with a small line could very well be the culprit when you increase the throttle. Could also be a clog in the water passages somewhere. Do you have or have access to a heat gun so you can read the temps of your cyls when running(point and shoot type)? For the overheat alarm to go off it has to get over 190 degrees I believe which is hot enough that you won't be able to touch it. At the normal 140-150 range you can touch it for a second or so before you pull away. Also on mine it would go into S.L.O.W mode if overheated and would run so rough you swear it is trying to rip itself off the transom. This would not go away unless you turned off the key to reset. If your alarm resets itself quickly and no steam is coming out of the pee-hole, I think it is fuel or a bad VRO sensor(if still connected).
Raaaaay	posted 03-11-2009 01:32 PM ET (US) The dealer checked the engine temp with a point and shoot heat gun when he serviced the motor last week and he told me the temp was fine. There was no steam coming out of the pee hole, and the dealer indicated that the water passages were fine when it was serviced last week. One strange thing was when the motor was serviced last week was that there were no thermostats in the motor, why a prior owner had removed these...I have no idea. I am very curious if my problem was the vent cap "maybe" being closed, or a 3/8 inch gas line.
Tohsgib	posted 03-11-2009 01:43 PM ET (US) If it is not the fuel then remove the thermos and try it again. Many older engines get a little scale in them and the little restriction the thermos make can make it overheat. Others just remove them and are too lazy to buy new ones or their "buddy" says you don't need them. I have owned a couple older engines that would run hot with the thermos in. I would cut the thermo part out and just leave the small brass ring which restricts it enough to keep engine warm but not enough to overheat...might be your answer.
Raaaaay	posted 03-11-2009 02:05 PM ET (US) I will know pretty quickly this weekend if it is a fuel problem. If not a fuel problem, I think I will follow your suggestion and have the dealer remove the thermostats and give it another try. As I recall, the dealer did indicate that a "part" of the thermostat was there, before they put the new thermostats in. Oh well...maybe $50 was spent on parts that wernt needed.
Pierce	posted 03-12-2009 11:04 AM ET (US) I believe a constant buzz alarm is an over heat issue. An intermitant buzz is a lack of oil.
Tohsgib	posted 03-12-2009 11:15 AM ET (US) No intermittent is low oil. Constant I know is overheat and fuel restriction and I am almost positive that it means NO oil as well. Only reason I know it is fuel restriction is my fuel line was hard wired in, no easy way to disconnect. I used to put a pair of vise grips(with tape) on the line to crimp it when I winterized it...man was that buzzer annoying for the minute and 15 seconds or so it took to run dry.
Sal DiMercurio	posted 03-13-2009 09:02 AM ET (US) I don't know of any 1986 engine that requirers a 1/2" fuel line, as 3/8 is standard on any engine below 250 hp. You will never see steam come out of the pee hole on an OMC engane, because the water coming out of the pee hole is water that is coming straight from the water pump, "BEFORE" it goes through the engine, thus it will be the temp of the water in the river or lake or coming out of the hose at your house. It sounds like you have a fuel restriction, possibly a faulty primer bulb, or kink in your fuel line, or a semi clogged fuel filter [ aka water seperator ]. You may also have a dirty tank & the crap inside clogs the pick-up tube, thus alarm time. That fuel line should be hard connected to the engine, not the snap type. I would just change the complete fuel line w/bulb before anything, & go from there. Make sure the arrow on the bulb points towards the engine, an faces upward, as there is a check valve in it & if it's [ arrow ] points down, it could close that valve, restricting the fuel flow...[ not common, but it happens ]. Sal
Tom W Clark	posted 03-13-2009 09:43 AM ET (US) A constant buzzer is either an indication of overheating OR a fuel flow restriction. Running off a portable tank with the vent closed would surely cause a fuel flow restriction. Sal is correct, 3/8" diameter fuel hose is all you need. Open the tank's vent an try it again.
Tohsgib	posted 03-13-2009 10:28 AM ET (US) Sal I have seen steam on MANY OMC engines from the P-hole.
Sal DiMercurio	posted 03-13-2009 04:56 PM ET (US) Nick, the water coming out of the p hole on an omc engine shouldn't even be warm. If the pee hole hose is properly plumbed, the water coming out is supposed to be pre engine. Unless someone plumbed it wrong, & put the tell tail hose post engine, after it goes through the engine. I believe the Merc tell tail, is after the water went through the engine, but OMC is pre engine.. Sal
Raaaaay	posted 03-14-2009 07:43 PM ET (US) Thanks for all the advice and ideas. As I said, I am currently running off of a 6 gallon portable tank that is connected via a NEW 3/8" line. The motor side of the gas line is hard plumbed, and the tank side of the gas line has a standard fitting. The bulb is new. Tommorow I will be back out in the bay and test it again and make sure the vent on the tank is open..hopefully it is a simple cure. Like I said earlier, the motor was just serviced, so hopefully the buzzer was a result of "user" error....my own stupidity. I will post the results tommorow.
Raaaaay	posted 03-15-2009 11:06 PM ET (US) The problem was fuel starvation. I went out on the bay today and used the 6 gallon portable tank alone with the 3/8" line, but this time I made sure the cap was vented properly. The BUZZER sounded again, I slowed down the buzzer stopped. I turned over the controls to my son and went back to the tank/hose and as he acelerated the bulb collapased. Then...the buzzer sounded again. I reattached the in-hull tank with the old line and the motor ran great with no buzzer or problems. I figure that the fitting on the portable tank is not large enough to allow an adequate amount of fuel through for a 175hp motor. so...all is well now...I just need to put on a new fuel water seperator filter and make sure that my existing fuel tank is safe to use. I plan to replace the tank soon, but that may not come till next fall. Thanks to all who gave their ideas on my delima.
jimh	posted 03-16-2009 11:38 PM ET (US) On the larger OMC motors there is a vacuum-operated switch that is Tee-ed into the fuel supply line. If the suction on the fuel supply line becomes excessive, an indicator of a fuel supply restriction, the vacuum in the line exceeds the switch threshold. That is, the switch electrical contact closes. When the switch is closed the alarm sounder is operated. If the suction maintains high vacuum, the alarm will maintain a constant sounding. One of the problems in running a large and fuel-hungry motor like a classic two-cycle V6 from a portable tank is the risk of fuel restriction at high throttle settings. The sophisticated alarm system of the OMC motor just saved you from a possible major problem. Lack of fuel in the engine can lead to a lean fuel mixture in the combustion chamber. Lean mixtures lead to high temperatures. High temperatures can lead to failures of the piston. That is an expensive repair. These older OMC motors are quite nicely designed and have the best alarm system of any motors of their era. They are also the only ones that actually sense oil flow in the oil system, and they will sound an alarm if the oil flow rate is not sufficient for the engine speed. That is another plus for these OMC motors.
Raaaaay	posted 03-17-2009 10:11 AM ET (US) Is it possible to run a larger motor off of a portable tank, or even a less portable tank such as a 12 or 18 gallon deck tank[?] I would think that there is a brass fitting available for a larger deck tank that would allow for the delivery of a larger fuel supply than the restricted brass fitting on my small 6 gallon tank.
jimh	posted 03-18-2009 07:57 AM ET (US) The fuel line to a V6 motor should be 3/8-inch-ID and have correspondingly sized fittings. The fuel pick-up tube in some 6-gallon tanks may be the limiting factor. I suspect that an OEM Evinrude 6-gallon tank might have the proper size of fittings and pick-up tube to permit its use with a V6 engine, but that is just speculation. Check the details of your tank and consult with a dealer.
Tohsgib	posted 03-18-2009 10:43 AM ET (US) Could also be you have a crap Tempo or ?? fuel bulb. Use OEM, does not matter what OEM, just pick one.
Raaaaay	posted 03-18-2009 11:32 AM ET (US) The Tempo tank I was using is the tank for my 40HP Mercury, and thus had a tank-end fitting appropriate for this motor. Like I said...it seemed to be very restrictive. Obeviously a 175hp motor uses fuel at such a rate that I would empty a 6 gallon tank very quickly. I plan on eventually replacing my inhull tank, but for now, I will just pick up a larger deck tank with an appropriate tank fitting that will allow suffecient fuel flow for the 175hp motor.
Sal DiMercurio	posted 03-20-2009 08:16 PM ET (US) Raaaay, I really doubt that 6 gallon tank [ 5/16" fuel line ] can't supply enough fuel for that engine, because the only time it "MIGHT" be questionable, is at WOT, wide open throttle. At WOT that engine will pull 17 gallons an hour, & a 5/16' line, will empty a can of 17 gallons that is flowing, in less than an hour. Unless you run that engine at WOT all the time, I don't think it's the fuel line. Even though a V-6 engine calls for a 3/8" fuel line, it would only need it, if you ran that engine at WOT for longer than 5 minutes, because at 1/2 - 3/4 throttle that engine is only pulling approx 7 - 10 gallons of fuel an hour, & a 5/16 line would surely provide that. Sal
Raaaaay	posted 03-22-2009 05:28 PM ET (US) Sal....i feel the problem wasnt the hose itself..but the brass tank fitting. It seems like the brass orafice (Mercury-I think for my 40hp motor) is very small and not designed for the 175hp motor. And, the hose and bulb were brand new and still somewhere there was a restriction that caused the bulb to collapse Anyways...the motor ran fine on the in-hull tank with the original fuel line...problem solved. Now I just need to ensure that the fuel in the original tank isnt contaminated.