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Author Topic:   Repairing major damage on 13' Whalers

R T M posted 12-02-2009 01:05 PM ET (US)
I`ve read alot of threads on CW and the other website about restoring 13 footers that have major saturation problems, chunks of the boat missing, rotted transoms, etc. I ask myself why would someone take on a problem boat like this, when there are many project boats around with dry hulls and just cosmetic problems that can be easily fixed by paint or new gel coat, or even just buffed out, and waxed. Personally I don`t think it's worth it financially or time wise, and if you have to pay someone to do it, you have made a really bad decision. New interiors are easily home built or bought for a few hundred dollars, new rub rails are less than $125, paint or gelcoat $400-$600, some new hardware and steering maybe $300, and your about done.
You can find good dry hulls not counting the trailer for $600-$800, and hulls that need minor cosmetic fixing and buffing out for less than $1500. I think buying a boat that is next to free or free, and trying to resurrect it from the dead, is foolish, and takes major skills to make it look like the damage never happened.
Of course this way of thinking doesn`t apply to larger Whalers, or rare boats in general.
rich/Binkie
Whaler_bob posted 12-02-2009 03:08 PM ET (US)
Sometimes you can get the hull for free....
Back in the mid 70's my dad got our first 13' (1972 Sport Sourpuss) for free after someone ran it into the dock at the Babylon Yacht Club and damaged the bow section. The damage looked worse than it was. My dad worked on it in the garage for several weekends over the winter- when he couldn't go out in the family boat- and it was good to go by spring launch time. We used that boat for 15+ years till the early 90's when I moved out and he sold it to a neighbor. I'd estimate the total materials he used for repair was under $300, and at that time the boat was only maybe 3 years old.... so it was a really great deal for us!
Tohsgib posted 12-03-2009 11:05 AM ET (US)
I agree with Binks but some people who get stuff for free or close to it do not think so. Others may think it is fun like making dowel sticks as a hobby. I personally would start with a good candidate and go from there. The last 17 I had(#22) although resonably dry, would not have been on my list to restore.
contender posted 12-03-2009 03:00 PM ET (US)
I agree with RTM and Tohsgib, why do you want to take on a major project boat that going to cost more problems more cash in the long run. To many hulls out there not to start with one that's in good shape. Maybe if you owned a fiberglass shop and this is something you do all the time and have the space for it could be a different story...
Russ57 posted 12-03-2009 03:04 PM ET (US)
I think some underestimate and get in over their heads. It is hard to turn down a free boat. You figure you will just spend a little time and money now and then as you can afford it. Before long you have so much invested you can't call it quits.
Heck I have one of those that I have God knows how much labor and a couple hundred in it and I don't even know if I can get a title yet. So I'm guilty too.
Tohsgib posted 12-03-2009 03:10 PM ET (US)
Thought about this a bit because I know what to look for when buying a Whaler, others(many) do not. I think a bunch of these "buyers" wind up with the short end of the stick and wind up either having to sell it and take a loss or fix it. Many chose to fix it which could turn out to be the wrong decision. I also think that many people get a satisfied feeling that they kept a classic from the scrap yard. Personally I will leave that up to them. There are many long term consequences that people do not know about with a waterlogged hull. It can delaminate in spots and therefore cause a weakspot that will soon crack when hitting the wrong wake, etc. It also rots out the structural wood and can cause other major problems. If I owned a Whaler and hit something that caused a breach in the hull, sure I would fix it because there was not intrusion per say of water, at least not for long. If The foam in a boat is waterlogged(rare but happens) it is going to have to be removed, not fun on a Whaler. My friend just redid his aluminum boat which has some logs of foam here and there for floatation. They weighed about the same as water and had to be removed and refilled. If per say he only found out or fixed say the port side, it would have terrible handling characteristics once the other side was refoamed and about 100lbs lighter than the other. Lastly I KNOW people worry too much about their hulls being waterlogged. It takes years if not decades for a hull to be waterlogged. A screw hole here or there is NOT going to infiltrate your hull. However a hole from a swimplatform that is not water tight and is subjected to YEARS of underwater life could.
Tohsgib posted 12-03-2009 03:16 PM ET (US)
PS...my first 13(1964) that I got in 1980 or so was a waterlogged hunk of junk. It looked good and was cheap and it only lasted 1.5 seasons before it literally fell apart. There were so many voids in the hull from repairs(not known by us) that when you ran it WOT the water would rush to the starboard bow and the boat would list so much spray would hit you in the face. When we traded it in on a new 13 in 1982(that I still own) the dealer said the hull had to weigh about 700-800lbs when they removed it from the water. He said there had to be about 50 gallons that poured out of the cracks in the bottom in a matter of minutes. Most of this was due to a missing drain tube for god knows how long.
Tom Hemphill posted 12-03-2009 06:24 PM ET (US)

quote:
...fun like making dowel sticks as a hobby.
That's an excellent analogy.
As an aside, it is my understanding that in the old days, when the joinery of timber frame houses was done by hand, the task of making trunnels (tree-nails) for fastening the joints was done during otherwise idle time during the winter. Some Whaler restoration tasks fall into this category.

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Author	Topic: Repairing major damage on 13' Whalers
R T M	posted 12-02-2009 01:05 PM ET (US) I`ve read alot of threads on CW and the other website about restoring 13 footers that have major saturation problems, chunks of the boat missing, rotted transoms, etc. I ask myself why would someone take on a problem boat like this, when there are many project boats around with dry hulls and just cosmetic problems that can be easily fixed by paint or new gel coat, or even just buffed out, and waxed. Personally I don`t think it's worth it financially or time wise, and if you have to pay someone to do it, you have made a really bad decision. New interiors are easily home built or bought for a few hundred dollars, new rub rails are less than $125, paint or gelcoat $400-$600, some new hardware and steering maybe $300, and your about done. You can find good dry hulls not counting the trailer for $600-$800, and hulls that need minor cosmetic fixing and buffing out for less than $1500. I think buying a boat that is next to free or free, and trying to resurrect it from the dead, is foolish, and takes major skills to make it look like the damage never happened. Of course this way of thinking doesn`t apply to larger Whalers, or rare boats in general. rich/Binkie
Whaler_bob	posted 12-02-2009 03:08 PM ET (US) Sometimes you can get the hull for free.... Back in the mid 70's my dad got our first 13' (1972 Sport Sourpuss) for free after someone ran it into the dock at the Babylon Yacht Club and damaged the bow section. The damage looked worse than it was. My dad worked on it in the garage for several weekends over the winter- when he couldn't go out in the family boat- and it was good to go by spring launch time. We used that boat for 15+ years till the early 90's when I moved out and he sold it to a neighbor. I'd estimate the total materials he used for repair was under $300, and at that time the boat was only maybe 3 years old.... so it was a really great deal for us!
Tohsgib	posted 12-03-2009 11:05 AM ET (US) I agree with Binks but some people who get stuff for free or close to it do not think so. Others may think it is fun like making dowel sticks as a hobby. I personally would start with a good candidate and go from there. The last 17 I had(#22) although resonably dry, would not have been on my list to restore.
contender	posted 12-03-2009 03:00 PM ET (US) I agree with RTM and Tohsgib, why do you want to take on a major project boat that going to cost more problems more cash in the long run. To many hulls out there not to start with one that's in good shape. Maybe if you owned a fiberglass shop and this is something you do all the time and have the space for it could be a different story...
Russ57	posted 12-03-2009 03:04 PM ET (US) I think some underestimate and get in over their heads. It is hard to turn down a free boat. You figure you will just spend a little time and money now and then as you can afford it. Before long you have so much invested you can't call it quits. Heck I have one of those that I have God knows how much labor and a couple hundred in it and I don't even know if I can get a title yet. So I'm guilty too.
Tohsgib	posted 12-03-2009 03:10 PM ET (US) Thought about this a bit because I know what to look for when buying a Whaler, others(many) do not. I think a bunch of these "buyers" wind up with the short end of the stick and wind up either having to sell it and take a loss or fix it. Many chose to fix it which could turn out to be the wrong decision. I also think that many people get a satisfied feeling that they kept a classic from the scrap yard. Personally I will leave that up to them. There are many long term consequences that people do not know about with a waterlogged hull. It can delaminate in spots and therefore cause a weakspot that will soon crack when hitting the wrong wake, etc. It also rots out the structural wood and can cause other major problems. If I owned a Whaler and hit something that caused a breach in the hull, sure I would fix it because there was not intrusion per say of water, at least not for long. If The foam in a boat is waterlogged(rare but happens) it is going to have to be removed, not fun on a Whaler. My friend just redid his aluminum boat which has some logs of foam here and there for floatation. They weighed about the same as water and had to be removed and refilled. If per say he only found out or fixed say the port side, it would have terrible handling characteristics once the other side was refoamed and about 100lbs lighter than the other. Lastly I KNOW people worry too much about their hulls being waterlogged. It takes years if not decades for a hull to be waterlogged. A screw hole here or there is NOT going to infiltrate your hull. However a hole from a swimplatform that is not water tight and is subjected to YEARS of underwater life could.
Tohsgib	posted 12-03-2009 03:16 PM ET (US) PS...my first 13(1964) that I got in 1980 or so was a waterlogged hunk of junk. It looked good and was cheap and it only lasted 1.5 seasons before it literally fell apart. There were so many voids in the hull from repairs(not known by us) that when you ran it WOT the water would rush to the starboard bow and the boat would list so much spray would hit you in the face. When we traded it in on a new 13 in 1982(that I still own) the dealer said the hull had to weigh about 700-800lbs when they removed it from the water. He said there had to be about 50 gallons that poured out of the cracks in the bottom in a matter of minutes. Most of this was due to a missing drain tube for god knows how long.
Tom Hemphill	posted 12-03-2009 06:24 PM ET (US) quote: ...fun like making dowel sticks as a hobby. That's an excellent analogy. As an aside, it is my understanding that in the old days, when the joinery of timber frame houses was done by hand, the task of making trunnels (tree-nails) for fastening the joints was done during otherwise idle time during the winter. Some Whaler restoration tasks fall into this category.