13-footer and 15-footer: Shape of Liner Mold Where Console Mounts

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Author Topic:   13-footer and 15-footer: Shape of Liner Mold Where Console Mounts

Binkster posted 01-14-2011 09:29 AM ET (US)
In different years [the shape of the cockpit deck of the 13-foot Boston Whaler boat changed] in the area where the console was mounted. What years did the changes take place? Pictures would help. Did the 15-footer always have a flat floor?
Tohsgib posted 01-14-2011 11:32 AM ET (US)
15's were all the same. 13's changed in 1978. The newer floors had the newer square anchor cover and the corner boarding traingle thingies on the bow with non-skid.
1981 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1981-13Whaler/019.jpg
Tohsgib posted 01-14-2011 11:39 AM ET (US)
Oops:
1981 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1981-13Whaler/024-1.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1981-13Whaler/027.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1981-13Whaler/025.jpg
1976 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1976-13whaler/Mar17_20. jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1976-13whaler/May05_17. jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1976-13whaler/May05_18. jpg
Binkster posted 01-17-2011 11:52 AM ET (US)
Thanks for the info, Nick. Thinking about building a plug and mold and then some glass copies of my mahogany console. It would need to fit into all thirteen and fifteen footers as a center or side console. It would have a mahogany windscreen and dash, and some mahogany trim. It would have to be narrower of course, and it could be adjustable height wise, as it would be made in two pieces. Haven`t seen a glass console yet that looks like it belongs in those Whalers. Would like to have a measurement of the width of the trough in the floor in your 13 footer.

http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c191/floridaboy2053/ Whaler%20with%20Mercury/console.jpg
http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c191/floridaboy2053/ Whaler%20with%20Mercury/consolerearview.jpg
<"((>{
blacksmithdog posted 01-17-2011 12:38 PM ET (US)
Tohsgib:
In the second picture in your second post, it shows hinges on the bow locker. Were these standard? Mine doesn't have them. If they are standard, where are they available?
Thanks
Tohsgib posted 01-18-2011 01:25 PM ET (US)
Not standard on 13's but were on 15'+. They are Perko and available anywhere.
blacksmithdog posted 01-19-2011 07:32 AM ET (US)
After seeing your picture, I went and looked at mine, and there was no evidence of any filled screw holes.
Two other questions:
Do you consider the addition of the hinges an improvement?
The hinges I've seen that were used on Whalers seemed to have a short leg and a long leg. Does the short leg go on the hull, and the long leg on the cover?
adlert posted 01-19-2011 08:16 AM ET (US)
Tohsgib,
Do you have any preference between the deck and bow shapes, transom differences aside? If so, why?
jimh posted 01-19-2011 08:33 AM ET (US)
The REFERENCE article on the 13-footer mentions 1977 as the year of the change in the liner mold. See
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/13/
Tohsgib posted 01-19-2011 12:04 PM ET (US)
It was late 77 they changed I believe for the 78 model year. I have never seen a 77 with the newer interior.
Blacksmithdog: They never used hinges on classic 13's just the stupid bungee which takes up half the room of barely anything to begin with. Yes the hinges are wonderfull or I would not have installed them. Makes sure you put some weather striping inside the lip to keep the hatch from slamming on the gel. The hinges I used are equal length with 2 long sides. If you bought the others I would use the smaller on the wood.
Adlert: Yes I find the newer floor MUCH better over the older style. The old style for one ALWAYS has durt or something in that center valley that drives me nuts. The bow is very slippery if waxed, the non-skid(ears) on the newer models makes it much nicer and safer to use. The front hatch is also more usefull and better looking in my opinion. Lastly the floor seems much stronger and there is no flex what so ever. The even newer style (1985+?) has a different transom that makes installing modern engines just a tad easier and looks better as well. It is more square than rounded. I think the newer style(77+) have some bottom changes as well.
Personally I would love a late 71-72 smirked blue hull or a 1977+ newer design. I had a 64 and a 76 and I prefer the newer style interiors but I love that blue gel.
Tohsgib posted 01-19-2011 12:10 PM ET (US)
PS...Jim you need to edit your page. My brochure for 1978 shows it with the old style interior and so does your page(2nd pic). I believe late 78 they changed the liner.
jimh posted 01-19-2011 12:16 PM ET (US)
There is always some confusion between a particular event such as a model change occurring in a particular years and the notion that the model change was coincident with a change in the model year of the boat. It is just easier to say a change occurred around a particular epoch, which, in this case, is around 1977.
adlert posted 01-19-2011 02:15 PM ET (US)
Thanks for the info Nick. Good information to have as I look for 13's.
Tom W Clark posted 01-19-2011 02:59 PM ET (US)
The first change of the interior mold for the Desert Tan 13 footer was in 1978 not 1977.
Tom W Clark posted 01-19-2011 03:05 PM ET (US)
No, that's not right. Curiosity got the better of me. The wood locating diagram for this hull:
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/13/graphics/13Wood.gif
...clearly shows the triangular step pads and new bow locker beginning with 1977 models, which actually suggests the hull change occured in August of 1976.
Tom W Clark posted 01-19-2011 03:07 PM ET (US)
The note says (in reference to the triangular step pads and bow locker):

quote:
Only in 1977 and later boats with the flat floor.
Peter posted 01-19-2011 08:03 PM ET (US)
A friend had a 1977 Sport and it did not have the "flat floor" interior. Based on that I interpret the note as meaning that a 13 foot hull made in 1977 could have either the non-flat or flat floor.
Tohsgib posted 01-20-2011 10:53 AM ET (US)
Tom read my small post above...the 78 brochure shows the old style liner so it can't be 1977 model year.
Tom W Clark posted 01-20-2011 10:59 AM ET (US)
Nick -- Read my post above. The factory wood locating diagram indicates otherwise.
Photos in a brochure do not trump factory information. We all know the photographs they used in their catalogs were not necessarily current, sometimes being as many as 8 years old.
Russ 13 posted 01-20-2011 06:23 PM ET (US)
I have used the small [and] medium consoles from Carolina Skiff. When epoxy-painted to match the color Desert Tan, they have worked well in form [and] function on both the 13-foot [and] 15-foot. Made of fiberglass [and] light weight, they are a BIG improvement in comfort and allow higher seating to match.I can E-mail a photo, if interrested, as I don't have a way to add one to this post.
Waterwonderland posted 01-23-2011 02:17 PM ET (US)
Here are two photos from Russ of those consoles:
http://s1229.photobucket.com/albums/ee471/Ericbmac/Console/?action=view& current=444.jpg
Russ 13 posted 01-23-2011 08:33 PM ET (US)
Thank you for the photo publishing!
To "borrow" a line from an old Steve Martin movie....
I'm published.....I'm SOMEBODY now!!
Binkster posted 01-30-2011 09:10 AM ET (US)
Can anyone give me the measurement for the width of the flat portion of the floor where a console would sit on the post `78 13 footer. While many have used generic consoles on their 13 and fifteen footers, they seem to look like add-ons. Most including the above one looks like a speaker lectern. I would like to build some consoles in glass with mahogany trim that looks like it was designed by Whaler. this project at the moment is in the (thinking about it stage) Have some boat projects to finish first.
Russ 13 posted 01-31-2011 03:11 AM ET (US)
A Speaker Lecturn, now that's old school.
Preaching to the choir, I have always thought of the boat as heavenly.
If you do design & fabricate a more appealing model, I would be interrested.
The smirk 13' does not have the large amount of wood under the floor that the 15' does, so the console would need a large deck mounting area, or attachment lip.
Binkster posted 01-31-2011 11:42 AM ET (US)
Russ, you don`t need wood to attach the console to the deck floor. Do a search here and you will find threads covering the method and procedure. Its true that the narrowness of the beam of the 13 and 15 footer poses a problem in the design of consoles. The minimum space needed to get by the side of one to go forward or aft, never has been established, I guess its just a personal thing. Anyone have any ideas?
Tohsgib posted 01-31-2011 01:02 PM ET (US)
The wood I believe is just on the sides or maybe even just the starbord side. I know with the 15' console I had to use epoxy to hold the screws in for the wood piece that the console screws to because there was no wood in the center of the hull.
Russ 13 posted 02-01-2011 10:36 AM ET (US)
Yes, I agree you can use epoxy to add adhesion to the console mount.
There is a small strip of wood in the floor of a smirk 13'.
Where the original side console attached to the deck.
I found allot of wood under the deck of my 1989 15'.
Under every screw that holds the console & seat.
And the wood diagram, listed the same.
Maybe the model year had something to do with that.
I have seen a flat's boat style console used as a side console in a 15', it was not so lecturn style, in shape.
Tohsgib posted 02-01-2011 02:28 PM ET (US)
The 15 and 13 share only 1 thing in common...twarts. The wood would/could be totally differnt between the 2 just like comparing it to a Montauk.
blacksmithdog posted 02-02-2011 10:40 AM ET (US)
Tohsgib:
One last question about the hinges on the bow locker. The wood of the bow locker is rather thin, probably 1/2" or so. Did you through bolt through the locker cover?
thanks
Tohsgib posted 02-02-2011 10:46 AM ET (US)
Bow locker is more like 3/4 and no I did not thru-bolt, just screws. There is no stress on the screws, just holding a hinge to it. In the future I can always flip the cover if I need to.
blacksmithdog posted 02-03-2011 07:35 AM ET (US)
Tohsgib:
Mine's 1/2" mahogany plywood.
Tohsgib posted 02-03-2011 11:44 AM ET (US)
Just measured and mine is 3/4 and is pretty much flush with the deck.
Tom W Clark posted 02-03-2011 11:50 AM ET (US)
I have never seen a bow locker cover on a small classic Whaler that was not 3/4" thick. Indeed, the hull is molded to accept a 3/4" thickenss.
If a 1/2" thick bow locker cover is present, it is not an original Whaler part.
blacksmithdog posted 02-04-2011 12:46 PM ET (US)
I bought this boat this fall from a small boat dealer in north central North Carolina. He'd bought it from an organization that takes boats as charitable contributions and then sells them. What he bought was the boat and trailer and nothing else. He put new wood in the boat, and a motor on the back that he'd taken in trade. He got the wood from Specialty Marine I assume, because he said it came from California. The bow lockers for the 13's and 15's from both Specialty Marine and Nautical Lumber are plywood, as you can see in this picture:
http://www.nauticallumber.com/virtuemart?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=76&category_id=9
Tom W Clark posted 02-04-2011 12:50 PM ET (US)
Yes, that is correct.
Tohsgib posted 02-04-2011 02:08 PM ET (US)
Nope...my bow locker is from Nautical and it is solid, not ply like OEM. My oem is in my garage and is 3/4 as well.

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Author	Topic: 13-footer and 15-footer: Shape of Liner Mold Where Console Mounts
Binkster	posted 01-14-2011 09:29 AM ET (US) In different years [the shape of the cockpit deck of the 13-foot Boston Whaler boat changed] in the area where the console was mounted. What years did the changes take place? Pictures would help. Did the 15-footer always have a flat floor?
Tohsgib	posted 01-14-2011 11:32 AM ET (US) 15's were all the same. 13's changed in 1978. The newer floors had the newer square anchor cover and the corner boarding traingle thingies on the bow with non-skid. 1981 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1981-13Whaler/019.jpg
Tohsgib	posted 01-14-2011 11:39 AM ET (US) Oops: 1981 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1981-13Whaler/024-1.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1981-13Whaler/027.jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1981-13Whaler/025.jpg 1976 http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1976-13whaler/Mar17_20. jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1976-13whaler/May05_17. jpg http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v225/BiggieFL/1976-13whaler/May05_18. jpg
Binkster	posted 01-17-2011 11:52 AM ET (US) Thanks for the info, Nick. Thinking about building a plug and mold and then some glass copies of my mahogany console. It would need to fit into all thirteen and fifteen footers as a center or side console. It would have a mahogany windscreen and dash, and some mahogany trim. It would have to be narrower of course, and it could be adjustable height wise, as it would be made in two pieces. Haven`t seen a glass console yet that looks like it belongs in those Whalers. Would like to have a measurement of the width of the trough in the floor in your 13 footer. http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c191/floridaboy2053/ Whaler%20with%20Mercury/console.jpg http://i27.photobucket.com/albums/c191/floridaboy2053/ Whaler%20with%20Mercury/consolerearview.jpg <"((>{
blacksmithdog	posted 01-17-2011 12:38 PM ET (US) Tohsgib: In the second picture in your second post, it shows hinges on the bow locker. Were these standard? Mine doesn't have them. If they are standard, where are they available? Thanks
Tohsgib	posted 01-18-2011 01:25 PM ET (US) Not standard on 13's but were on 15'+. They are Perko and available anywhere.
blacksmithdog	posted 01-19-2011 07:32 AM ET (US) After seeing your picture, I went and looked at mine, and there was no evidence of any filled screw holes. Two other questions: Do you consider the addition of the hinges an improvement? The hinges I've seen that were used on Whalers seemed to have a short leg and a long leg. Does the short leg go on the hull, and the long leg on the cover?
adlert	posted 01-19-2011 08:16 AM ET (US) Tohsgib, Do you have any preference between the deck and bow shapes, transom differences aside? If so, why?
jimh	posted 01-19-2011 08:33 AM ET (US) The REFERENCE article on the 13-footer mentions 1977 as the year of the change in the liner mold. See http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/13/
Tohsgib	posted 01-19-2011 12:04 PM ET (US) It was late 77 they changed I believe for the 78 model year. I have never seen a 77 with the newer interior. Blacksmithdog: They never used hinges on classic 13's just the stupid bungee which takes up half the room of barely anything to begin with. Yes the hinges are wonderfull or I would not have installed them. Makes sure you put some weather striping inside the lip to keep the hatch from slamming on the gel. The hinges I used are equal length with 2 long sides. If you bought the others I would use the smaller on the wood. Adlert: Yes I find the newer floor MUCH better over the older style. The old style for one ALWAYS has durt or something in that center valley that drives me nuts. The bow is very slippery if waxed, the non-skid(ears) on the newer models makes it much nicer and safer to use. The front hatch is also more usefull and better looking in my opinion. Lastly the floor seems much stronger and there is no flex what so ever. The even newer style (1985+?) has a different transom that makes installing modern engines just a tad easier and looks better as well. It is more square than rounded. I think the newer style(77+) have some bottom changes as well. Personally I would love a late 71-72 smirked blue hull or a 1977+ newer design. I had a 64 and a 76 and I prefer the newer style interiors but I love that blue gel.
Tohsgib	posted 01-19-2011 12:10 PM ET (US) PS...Jim you need to edit your page. My brochure for 1978 shows it with the old style interior and so does your page(2nd pic). I believe late 78 they changed the liner.
jimh	posted 01-19-2011 12:16 PM ET (US) There is always some confusion between a particular event such as a model change occurring in a particular years and the notion that the model change was coincident with a change in the model year of the boat. It is just easier to say a change occurred around a particular epoch, which, in this case, is around 1977.
adlert	posted 01-19-2011 02:15 PM ET (US) Thanks for the info Nick. Good information to have as I look for 13's.
Tom W Clark	posted 01-19-2011 02:59 PM ET (US) The first change of the interior mold for the Desert Tan 13 footer was in 1978 not 1977.
Tom W Clark	posted 01-19-2011 03:05 PM ET (US) No, that's not right. Curiosity got the better of me. The wood locating diagram for this hull: http://continuouswave.com/whaler/reference/13/graphics/13Wood.gif ...clearly shows the triangular step pads and new bow locker beginning with 1977 models, which actually suggests the hull change occured in August of 1976.
Tom W Clark	posted 01-19-2011 03:07 PM ET (US) The note says (in reference to the triangular step pads and bow locker): quote: Only in 1977 and later boats with the flat floor.
Peter	posted 01-19-2011 08:03 PM ET (US) A friend had a 1977 Sport and it did not have the "flat floor" interior. Based on that I interpret the note as meaning that a 13 foot hull made in 1977 could have either the non-flat or flat floor.
Tohsgib	posted 01-20-2011 10:53 AM ET (US) Tom read my small post above...the 78 brochure shows the old style liner so it can't be 1977 model year.
Tom W Clark	posted 01-20-2011 10:59 AM ET (US) Nick -- Read my post above. The factory wood locating diagram indicates otherwise. Photos in a brochure do not trump factory information. We all know the photographs they used in their catalogs were not necessarily current, sometimes being as many as 8 years old.
Russ 13	posted 01-20-2011 06:23 PM ET (US) I have used the small [and] medium consoles from Carolina Skiff. When epoxy-painted to match the color Desert Tan, they have worked well in form [and] function on both the 13-foot [and] 15-foot. Made of fiberglass [and] light weight, they are a BIG improvement in comfort and allow higher seating to match.I can E-mail a photo, if interrested, as I don't have a way to add one to this post.
Waterwonderland	posted 01-23-2011 02:17 PM ET (US) Here are two photos from Russ of those consoles: http://s1229.photobucket.com/albums/ee471/Ericbmac/Console/?action=view& current=444.jpg
Russ 13	posted 01-23-2011 08:33 PM ET (US) Thank you for the photo publishing! To "borrow" a line from an old Steve Martin movie.... I'm published.....I'm SOMEBODY now!!
Binkster	posted 01-30-2011 09:10 AM ET (US) Can anyone give me the measurement for the width of the flat portion of the floor where a console would sit on the post `78 13 footer. While many have used generic consoles on their 13 and fifteen footers, they seem to look like add-ons. Most including the above one looks like a speaker lectern. I would like to build some consoles in glass with mahogany trim that looks like it was designed by Whaler. this project at the moment is in the (thinking about it stage) Have some boat projects to finish first.
Russ 13	posted 01-31-2011 03:11 AM ET (US) A Speaker Lecturn, now that's old school. Preaching to the choir, I have always thought of the boat as heavenly. If you do design & fabricate a more appealing model, I would be interrested. The smirk 13' does not have the large amount of wood under the floor that the 15' does, so the console would need a large deck mounting area, or attachment lip.
Binkster	posted 01-31-2011 11:42 AM ET (US) Russ, you don`t need wood to attach the console to the deck floor. Do a search here and you will find threads covering the method and procedure. Its true that the narrowness of the beam of the 13 and 15 footer poses a problem in the design of consoles. The minimum space needed to get by the side of one to go forward or aft, never has been established, I guess its just a personal thing. Anyone have any ideas?
Tohsgib	posted 01-31-2011 01:02 PM ET (US) The wood I believe is just on the sides or maybe even just the starbord side. I know with the 15' console I had to use epoxy to hold the screws in for the wood piece that the console screws to because there was no wood in the center of the hull.
Russ 13	posted 02-01-2011 10:36 AM ET (US) Yes, I agree you can use epoxy to add adhesion to the console mount. There is a small strip of wood in the floor of a smirk 13'. Where the original side console attached to the deck. I found allot of wood under the deck of my 1989 15'. Under every screw that holds the console & seat. And the wood diagram, listed the same. Maybe the model year had something to do with that. I have seen a flat's boat style console used as a side console in a 15', it was not so lecturn style, in shape.
Tohsgib	posted 02-01-2011 02:28 PM ET (US) The 15 and 13 share only 1 thing in common...twarts. The wood would/could be totally differnt between the 2 just like comparing it to a Montauk.
blacksmithdog	posted 02-02-2011 10:40 AM ET (US) Tohsgib: One last question about the hinges on the bow locker. The wood of the bow locker is rather thin, probably 1/2" or so. Did you through bolt through the locker cover? thanks
Tohsgib	posted 02-02-2011 10:46 AM ET (US) Bow locker is more like 3/4 and no I did not thru-bolt, just screws. There is no stress on the screws, just holding a hinge to it. In the future I can always flip the cover if I need to.
blacksmithdog	posted 02-03-2011 07:35 AM ET (US) Tohsgib: Mine's 1/2" mahogany plywood.
Tohsgib	posted 02-03-2011 11:44 AM ET (US) Just measured and mine is 3/4 and is pretty much flush with the deck.
Tom W Clark	posted 02-03-2011 11:50 AM ET (US) I have never seen a bow locker cover on a small classic Whaler that was not 3/4" thick. Indeed, the hull is molded to accept a 3/4" thickenss. If a 1/2" thick bow locker cover is present, it is not an original Whaler part.
blacksmithdog	posted 02-04-2011 12:46 PM ET (US) I bought this boat this fall from a small boat dealer in north central North Carolina. He'd bought it from an organization that takes boats as charitable contributions and then sells them. What he bought was the boat and trailer and nothing else. He put new wood in the boat, and a motor on the back that he'd taken in trade. He got the wood from Specialty Marine I assume, because he said it came from California. The bow lockers for the 13's and 15's from both Specialty Marine and Nautical Lumber are plywood, as you can see in this picture: http://www.nauticallumber.com/virtuemart?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage.tpl&product_id=76&category_id=9
Tom W Clark	posted 02-04-2011 12:50 PM ET (US) Yes, that is correct.
Tohsgib	posted 02-04-2011 02:08 PM ET (US) Nope...my bow locker is from Nautical and it is solid, not ply like OEM. My oem is in my garage and is 3/4 as well.