Moderated Discussion Areas
ContinuousWave: Whaler Performance
|Author||Topic: SOOOOOOO quiet!|
posted 01-16-2002 10:03 AM ET (US)
Oh is that Evinrude 4 stroke quiet! I am thinking of running the pisser into the water because it is too noisy at slow speeds. Will post speeds and RPM's after the weekend. So far I am pumped.
PS those manual jackplates are "manual labor". Took like 45 minutes to jack it 2" due to 3 turns left...3 turns right, measure. Repeat. Looks cool and boat has plenty of holeshot. I think I am in love.
posted 01-16-2002 12:34 PM ET (US)
Nick - Is your jackplate the one piece variety? Mine are simple to lift or lower.
Just loosen two 1/2" nuts on each side, then take a 1 1/8" wrench and turn the big threaded center shaft up or down. Then retighten the 1/2" nuts. Takes about 5 minutes to adjust or change the running height. Always use anti-sieze compound on these threaded shafts, so the stianless and aluminum doesn't bond in salt water.
posted 01-16-2002 12:48 PM ET (US)
"Manual Labor" Six hundred and change you could raise and lower it with a switch.
posted 01-16-2002 01:03 PM ET (US)
I think you're gonna be very happy with that engine that you STOLE, Nick.
Looking forward to a full report.
Red sky at night. . .
posted 01-16-2002 01:57 PM ET (US)
The plate is now a 1 piece(or 3). It was a 2 but I bought the optional 1/2" thick plate that goes across the back, making it solid. It took a while because if you raise 1 side too much it will bind, so it is 3 turns right, 3 turns left and then measure to make sure you are even. I jacked it up 2 inches and will test ride on Friday, saturday, sunday, and Monday if we have off for MLK day.
posted 01-16-2002 03:45 PM ET (US)
Bigshot- Congrats, sounds like a fabulous set up. Keep it under 100. Watch out for the gendarme!!! David
posted 01-16-2002 04:29 PM ET (US)
Let's see some pics. I'm surprised the bracket has two lifting screws. I thought they used a single unit in the center. Nonetheless, you're going to love the change. In this case the YTB is FUN.(personal joke amongst brokers)
posted 01-16-2002 04:35 PM ET (US)
I think he has the older style, two piece brackets, which have a lifting bolt on each side. They are more time consuming to operate and require the alternate side to side work.
posted 01-16-2002 10:57 PM ET (US)
I also have the two piece unit. I have resigned myself to manual labor on occasion, in the name of high performance whaling. I have notified the proper authorities about you Mr. Bigshot. Why should you be happy? Your punishment will be to replace crankshaft seals on 1967 Johnson 20 hp twins all summer.
posted 01-17-2002 12:43 AM ET (US)
Welcome to the 4 stroke club, I can't imagine ever running a 2 stroke again.
You got one of the last Evirude 4 strokes, for 2002 all Evinrudes are Fichts and the 4 strokes and carb 2 strokes will be Johnsons.
posted 01-17-2002 06:39 AM ET (US)
Dick, what's your fuel consumption? On my Montauk/Mercury 50HP four stroke rig I'm getting between 1.3-1.5 GPH at 4000 RPM.
posted 01-17-2002 06:48 AM ET (US)
DGP, what is your speed @4K rpm?
posted 01-17-2002 09:59 AM ET (US)
Clark, at 4000 RPM I'm running 19 MPH.
posted 01-17-2002 10:15 AM ET (US)
damn Dick, I like Johnson's better.....maybe I'll paint it white:) This Jackplate is still made(Vance Industries). They have 2 piece ones at Boaters World too. I am never gonna mess with this thing after I get it set up right. I am running a 14x17" alum prop and am at redline, gonna try my buds 18"ss on his Zuki 60hp. I kept my Yamaha SS 17" prop and if it looks like an 18" is good I will rehub and have it repitched or double cupped to get the inch or so. I like the Yamaha prop because it is semi cleaver(surface piercing) and should be great with a plate. These prop shops are great.
posted 01-17-2002 01:29 PM ET (US)
The only precise test I have run is for top speed. 33 mph running a 13 pitch aluminum prop at 5600 rpm and total weight 1500 to 1600 lbs. I would say at 4000 rpm I am running about 20 mph. Need to run a fuel consumption test this year.
posted 01-18-2002 07:56 AM ET (US)
I know those motors are nice and quiet but I couldn't deal with a top speed of only 33mph. My old 115 OMC will run that fast around 3500rpm.
posted 01-18-2002 09:42 AM ET (US)
Whalerdan, I don't think top speed is what Dick and I considered a high priority when we chose to go with the 50 HP four stroke.
posted 01-18-2002 11:03 AM ET (US)
My 90 cruised at 3700 rpm at 28mph. With my 70 I was doing 24+ but the plate was too low, etc. I will post over this weekend what I find out and with what props.
posted 01-18-2002 01:58 PM ET (US)
If I understand correctly, your priority was performance not at top speed by at cruise speed, right? I'd be interested in what happens when you jack up that 70 a little higher.
posted 01-18-2002 02:52 PM ET (US)
heck with top speed. That's why I have a Baja. I want to be as close to 30 as possible and under 4k rpms. II think i can do 3800 at about 28mph and that will be cool. Will post when GPS'd this weekend.
posted 01-18-2002 03:42 PM ET (US)
A Baha? Is that sort of like a Cigarette?
Reminds me of a story...
My wife is from Oklahoma, and was not very boat savy when we met. On a walk one day we see a rowing shell. "Oh" she says... "look at the sliding seat. Just like my rowing machine". Well duh.
Then we saw a Cigarette style boat. Cruising the ship canal at 7 knots but making a heck of a lot of noise. Surveying it from above (we were on a bridge) she looks at the lack of usablable space (yards of deck and a little cockpit, followed by yards of engine cowling) and asks "What are those boats for".
Screwing, I said. Which is true when you think about it. Wall to wall bed and a wet bar, lots of power and a really pointy bow.
Since then, she calls them Penis Boats.
posted 01-22-2002 11:19 AM ET (US)
Good Name! Maybe I will rename the Baja to the "Beaver Squeezer" or something.
Numbers are in: NON GPS'd (it died). Used a Donzi speedo so it should be acurate, especially when we are talking under 40 here.
5800 with me(200lbs)+ full beer cooler, 27 gals of gas= 41 MPH. 4400=30mph. 3950=26mph and 3400=20mph.
5700 with me and bud(400+ for both), cooler and 24 gallons of gas=39.5mph. 4400=29mph. 3950= 25mph and 3500=20mph.
5600 with me and 2 buds(600+ for us), cooler and 27 gals of gas=38mph. 4400=27.5mph, 3950=23.5mph and 3600=20mph.
I will try and GPS this weekend and compare. Overall I am tickled pink and in the 10 hours I put on this I burned about 12 gallons of gas. Jackplate does wonders with "skinny" water and I get much compliments on the looks and lack of decibels.
posted 01-22-2002 11:25 AM ET (US)
PS: I am running the plate 2 inches from bottom so about 2.5 from bottom of hull. A 14x17 alum prop and no doel fin or other aid. I have bottom paint. The conditions were moderately choppy and some of these speeds were into the wind.
posted 01-22-2002 01:03 PM ET (US)
Whew... I thought I might have offended with my somewhat off topic and off color story. I did intend it as humor. Apologies to any Cigarette style owners.
Anway, great results. Follow up question - your old cruise speed of 28mph @3800 - did you choose that for measured economy or did it just sound right. Realistically I think people may choose the speed where the engine sounds like its not working too hard. What will be your new cruise speed? I see you were looking at 3950 and perhaps 4400. Where do you think the sweet spot is with the new setup?
posted 01-22-2002 01:15 PM ET (US)
Bigshot you're killing me. I've got the same setup as you (sans jackplate) and its sitting under cover, and snow, here on Cape Cod. Maybe I should kick out that renter we have in the little house down by the Hillsborough River around the corner from Ybor City and move down. I lived in Tarpon Springs and New Port Richey for years. It's a nice day here...40 and partly cloudy with the snow melting a little...a few people out shellfishing. P.S. We also rent out a little place on Big Pine Key that I could park my Whaler at out front in the canal. What am I doing??? If this Yankee sensibility (good job) or gross stupidity? You only go around once :)Help!!...Bob M.
posted 01-22-2002 01:59 PM ET (US)
Around 40 mph, that sounds a little better. I could probably live with that. I know top speed isn't you guys objective, I'm just saying I, personally, would go nuts if my top speed was 33MPH.
posted 01-22-2002 02:36 PM ET (US)
Dan: I would too. My yamaha 90 did about 42-43 so 38 I could live with but 40 is fantastic.
Taylor: Before I was doing about 4100+ and 28 with the plate down 2 inches so I thought I was dragging too much, I guess not. I am gonna jack another 3/4 and see what happens. I can NOT blow out the prop at this height so up I go until I do. I like the 3950 range and about 26mph, I was hoping for 28 but who knows, maybe with a SS prop and some tweeking.
Bob: You gotta move. NO job could keep me on the cape for the winter. Summer definately! If I had to listen to "Space Pussy" at the Gov. Bradford in P-Town all winter I would go mad or trans-sexual. Both are not a good option right now:)
Like I noted before I am looking for the fastest cruise with the lowest RPM(How I was taught) and the 90 or 100hp 4's would do that but the 70 came along and with the results....I think I would recommend the 70 to anyone thinking about a 90+hp. Just can't see the $$ for a couple MPH. Plus my gas consumption is so low it is scary. Is this thing running?
posted 01-22-2002 03:22 PM ET (US)
BS.... How is the trim of the boat, static and at plane?
I am thinking about the jackplate... just worried about the trim of my boat. 90hp Evinrude (appox. 300 lbs.) What is the weight of that Evinzuki?
posted 01-22-2002 04:04 PM ET (US)
The boat will get more bowrise than it did with the Yamaha when you trim due to setback. Therefore you do not have to trim it much. I ran it WOT at "straight up and down" trim and when I trimmed more all it did was raise RPM's but no more speed(maybe 1 mph). It never porpoised which was my main concern(no doelfin either). The lack of doelfin might explain my top speed over others who are running them. I always stated they are not necessary on small whalers and now reinstate that statement(whew).
I trim until my steering gets light and my wake flattens out. Used to think the higher the better but no dice. With a mild trim she runs straight with a little bowrise but smoother ride due to setback & weight(340lbs+plate).
posted 01-22-2002 07:13 PM ET (US)
Nick - Are you going to keep the transom jack, or was it a waste of money? 41 mph out of a 70 is pretty good.
How about calling your engine a "RudeSuzi"!
You might want to take a look at a good SS performance prop, like a Stiletto or something. At elevated transom height and 41 mph, an aluminum prop is out of it's league.
posted 01-23-2002 01:26 PM ET (US)
So far I like the Jack. Have no idea if $$ was wasted due to I never ran it sans jackplate. Too late now, it is staying no matter what. Plus it looks cool!
I have a 17" SS Yamaha prop in my garage I am gonna rehub to fit my RudeSuzi. I want to run the alum so I can report the "real" performance advantages of a SS prop over alum.
I got my GPS working again. They have the springs in the bat compartment so I assumed both batts went the same way...DUH!
posted 01-23-2002 08:40 PM ET (US)
bigshot i have susuki 70 4 stroke on my montauk with no jack plate with stainless
prop i weigh about 40 lbs moore then you
i carry 26 gal fuel the most i can get
wot is 36 mph on wass gps trimed out
on flat bay conditions do you think i should
get a jack plate ?
posted 01-24-2002 09:43 AM ET (US)
Hold on until I GPS it, those numbers are with the speedo. I GPS'd it last night and only got 35 and was bummed but my bud said since I reset the GPS it was probably in Knots(makes sense). I will double check later tonight.
posted 01-25-2002 07:14 AM ET (US)
Don't be bummed, if it was set on knots you got 40MPH (add ~15% to knots for mph)!
posted 01-25-2002 08:15 AM ET (US)
Maybe it was kilometers/hr!
posted 01-28-2002 11:39 PM ET (US)
My 2000 Montauk is also pushed by an Evinrude 70 hp four stroke ... great engine. I get 36 mph at 5800 rpm with just me aboard and my Pate 24 gal tank almost full. I've got a DoelFin on the engine, and engine's cavitation plate (or is it ventilation plate?) is about 3/4" above bottom of the boat. And I've got a SS prop. So my findings pretty much match gvisko's.
Bigshot, how did the GPS numbers turn out?
posted 01-29-2002 10:33 AM ET (US)
I am getting about 36 with the alum prop. Gonna try my bud's 18" SS prop this week or so.
posted 01-29-2002 12:07 PM ET (US)
Hoop, what size prop?
posted 01-31-2002 03:22 PM ET (US)
Prop is a SS Viper 17 inch, I think.
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