What motor? It's not a black and white decision is it?

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Author Topic:   What motor? It's not a black and white decision is it?

whalerron posted 01-28-2002 08:00 PM ET (US)
I have been unpleasantly surprised with the fact that I need to replace my 1975 70hp Johnson. I am thinking about replacing it with a 90. I have always owned Johnsons and they have always performed flawlessly. I would not hesitate to buy a new Johnson 90 if it wasn't for the whole Bombardier fiasco. As I understand it, they are just starting up their production line and I would be a guinea pig if I bought one of their motors now. What are your thoughts on this? My decision is to go with either the Johnson 90 or a Mercury 90.
Any thoughts are appreciated. Thanks.
- Ron
Dick E posted 01-28-2002 09:38 PM ET (US)
I have a 1998 90 Hp Merc on my Montauk
I have not had one problem with it. I use my boat every month of the year.
I use Merc brand oil, decarbonize it yearly.
And perform regular maintenance.
If you are going to chose between a white Johnson or a black Merc it really is a black and white decision.
Oh That's Phantom Black
SuburbanBoy posted 01-28-2002 09:39 PM ET (US)
If it is any consolation, at Bombardier/Johnson every part had to re-apply for it's job. Which is ment to imply that BBD reviewed the designs and suppliers, and requalified every part and assembly. Without prices and models it is tough to advise. Consider the cheapest, and skip the hi-tech options.
sub
Flipper posted 01-28-2002 09:50 PM ET (US)
I haven't owned a better engine than the 90 Merc I have right now.It's a strong engine, with some bite out of the hole and great top end. The lighter weight of the 3cyl. Merc, compared to the 4cyl. Evinrude Ficht, was why I initially went from Evinrude 'back' to Merc (we were a Merc family). I'm glad I switched when I did; I did not forsee the impending OMC meltdown at the time!
That said, a friend of mine put a 90 Evinrude Ficht on his Montauk and it ran great for the small amount of time it had on the water last summer- his uncle knocked the lower unit off on a shoal, in front of their island, before it was even broken in!- This engine was purchased to pull the wakeboarders in the family; a job it will do well some day because of it's great torque.
For my application and with the luck I've had thus far, I still prefer my Merc. Why don't you check out some Yammys & Hondas too?
whalerron posted 01-28-2002 11:29 PM ET (US)
Flipper: I have read that the Yammies although rated as 90s don't run like 90s and I am concerned about the price of parts and labor to repair the yammies versus what it costs to fix a domestic brand. I really like the Hondas but I am not equipped with the right amount of mula to buy a new 4 stroke.
whalerron posted 01-28-2002 11:32 PM ET (US)
SuburbanBoy, where did you get this info on the Johnson/Evinrude parts? I have been trying to confirm this. The Johnson I am considering would be the Saltwater Series 90 in the carburated version. As for the Merc, it would be their 90 3 cylinder, salt water version which would also be carburated.
Thanks,
ron
lhg posted 01-29-2002 12:56 AM ET (US)
That's Bombardier's latest advertizing, trying to distance themselves from the OMC nightmare, after they discovered huge numbers of parts manufactured to bad tolerances, which they discarded, much to their credit. See another post on Bombardier for details.
As a Mercury owner, I can give you several reasons to buy the Merc:
1. Their 90 is one of their best smaller engines, and hugely popular. Tons have been sold. It should hold it's value well. You can get one NOW, a Johnson you may have to wait for.
2. It's probably the the most powerful and fastest of the 90's currently available, except for their 4 stroke 90, which is more like a 95 (Yamaha sells same as an underpowered 100)
3. You can get excellent pricing on one of these, about $4900 if you drive a hard bargain. Try Bass Pro Adventure Worlds.
4. They have an integral oil injection tank, unlike the Johnson which requires a separate mounting location. I think this is important in a 17' Whaler, or 18, 20 & 22 Outrage, notched transom model.
5. It's lighter in weight than the Johnson.
I believe both the Johnson and Merc are more powerful engines than the "lightweight 90" marketed by Yamaha, at only 70 cubes. All three are good, you just have to determine which qualities mean the most to you.
Also, don't rule out the less expensive, slightly detuned Merc 75, same engine as the 90. Determine how much speed you want 42/43 vs 46/48.
Peter posted 01-29-2002 07:35 AM ET (US)
Within the last year or so I recall coming across a report on a test of four outboards that I think were of the 90 hp variety. My recollection is that the 90 Johnson edged out the Merc in top speed. The Yamaha was way behind due to its smaller displacement. I can't remember what brand the fourth outboard was. Perhaps someone else has also seen this report.
jbtaz posted 01-29-2002 08:14 AM ET (US)
My brother has a 1999 Merc 90 on his small Mako. It's a great engine!
whalerron posted 01-29-2002 08:27 AM ET (US)
What do you think about the Merc versus the Johnson oil warning systems? As I understand it, the Merc has a "Low oil" warning whereas the Johnson has a "Low oil" and a "No oil" warning...
TightPenny posted 01-29-2002 10:06 AM ET (US)
The 90 Johnson is a design that has been around for a long time. I have a 2001 Ocean Pro model and love it on my Montauk. Love the Montauk too.
Bigshot posted 01-29-2002 10:27 AM ET (US)
Either one is a good engine. Look for a Yammie 90 too. Although not as torquey, she gets great MPG and weighs the same as your 70 did. I would not trade my RudeSuzi 70 4 stroke for anything even though she is a bit slower.
John from Madison CT posted 01-31-2002 07:12 PM ET (US)
Call me biased but IMHO, the Yammie 90hp is the perfect motor for a Montauk. They run very smooth, are incredibly reliable, weigh only ~250lbs. and give an excellent top speed. (~40mph)
John from Madison
Bigshot posted 02-01-2002 10:49 AM ET (US)
john as far as 2 strokes go...you are correct in my opinion. i would also highly recommend the suzi 70 4 stroke as long as 37mph is OK. Like I posted before, it does not burn gas and sooooo quiet.
JBCornwell posted 02-02-2002 08:38 AM ET (US)
Hi, John.
I agree with Bigshot. Get a test ride in a Johnnyuki DF70 powered boat. There are a LOT of DF70s on Montauks.
You will be amazed, then hooked.
Red sky at night. . .
JB :)
JBCornwell posted 02-02-2002 08:39 AM ET (US)
Hi, John.
I agree with Bigshot. Get a test ride in a Johnnyuki DF70 powered boat. There are a LOT of DF70s on Montauks.
You will be amazed, then hooked.
Red sky at night. . .
JB :)

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Author	Topic: What motor? It's not a black and white decision is it?
whalerron	posted 01-28-2002 08:00 PM ET (US) I have been unpleasantly surprised with the fact that I need to replace my 1975 70hp Johnson. I am thinking about replacing it with a 90. I have always owned Johnsons and they have always performed flawlessly. I would not hesitate to buy a new Johnson 90 if it wasn't for the whole Bombardier fiasco. As I understand it, they are just starting up their production line and I would be a guinea pig if I bought one of their motors now. What are your thoughts on this? My decision is to go with either the Johnson 90 or a Mercury 90. Any thoughts are appreciated. Thanks. - Ron
Dick E	posted 01-28-2002 09:38 PM ET (US) I have a 1998 90 Hp Merc on my Montauk I have not had one problem with it. I use my boat every month of the year. I use Merc brand oil, decarbonize it yearly. And perform regular maintenance. If you are going to chose between a white Johnson or a black Merc it really is a black and white decision. Oh That's Phantom Black
SuburbanBoy	posted 01-28-2002 09:39 PM ET (US) If it is any consolation, at Bombardier/Johnson every part had to re-apply for it's job. Which is ment to imply that BBD reviewed the designs and suppliers, and requalified every part and assembly. Without prices and models it is tough to advise. Consider the cheapest, and skip the hi-tech options. sub
Flipper	posted 01-28-2002 09:50 PM ET (US) I haven't owned a better engine than the 90 Merc I have right now.It's a strong engine, with some bite out of the hole and great top end. The lighter weight of the 3cyl. Merc, compared to the 4cyl. Evinrude Ficht, was why I initially went from Evinrude 'back' to Merc (we were a Merc family). I'm glad I switched when I did; I did not forsee the impending OMC meltdown at the time! That said, a friend of mine put a 90 Evinrude Ficht on his Montauk and it ran great for the small amount of time it had on the water last summer- his uncle knocked the lower unit off on a shoal, in front of their island, before it was even broken in!- This engine was purchased to pull the wakeboarders in the family; a job it will do well some day because of it's great torque. For my application and with the luck I've had thus far, I still prefer my Merc. Why don't you check out some Yammys & Hondas too?
whalerron	posted 01-28-2002 11:29 PM ET (US) Flipper: I have read that the Yammies although rated as 90s don't run like 90s and I am concerned about the price of parts and labor to repair the yammies versus what it costs to fix a domestic brand. I really like the Hondas but I am not equipped with the right amount of mula to buy a new 4 stroke.
whalerron	posted 01-28-2002 11:32 PM ET (US) SuburbanBoy, where did you get this info on the Johnson/Evinrude parts? I have been trying to confirm this. The Johnson I am considering would be the Saltwater Series 90 in the carburated version. As for the Merc, it would be their 90 3 cylinder, salt water version which would also be carburated. Thanks, ron
lhg	posted 01-29-2002 12:56 AM ET (US) That's Bombardier's latest advertizing, trying to distance themselves from the OMC nightmare, after they discovered huge numbers of parts manufactured to bad tolerances, which they discarded, much to their credit. See another post on Bombardier for details. As a Mercury owner, I can give you several reasons to buy the Merc: 1. Their 90 is one of their best smaller engines, and hugely popular. Tons have been sold. It should hold it's value well. You can get one NOW, a Johnson you may have to wait for. 2. It's probably the the most powerful and fastest of the 90's currently available, except for their 4 stroke 90, which is more like a 95 (Yamaha sells same as an underpowered 100) 3. You can get excellent pricing on one of these, about $4900 if you drive a hard bargain. Try Bass Pro Adventure Worlds. 4. They have an integral oil injection tank, unlike the Johnson which requires a separate mounting location. I think this is important in a 17' Whaler, or 18, 20 & 22 Outrage, notched transom model. 5. It's lighter in weight than the Johnson. I believe both the Johnson and Merc are more powerful engines than the "lightweight 90" marketed by Yamaha, at only 70 cubes. All three are good, you just have to determine which qualities mean the most to you. Also, don't rule out the less expensive, slightly detuned Merc 75, same engine as the 90. Determine how much speed you want 42/43 vs 46/48.
Peter	posted 01-29-2002 07:35 AM ET (US) Within the last year or so I recall coming across a report on a test of four outboards that I think were of the 90 hp variety. My recollection is that the 90 Johnson edged out the Merc in top speed. The Yamaha was way behind due to its smaller displacement. I can't remember what brand the fourth outboard was. Perhaps someone else has also seen this report.
jbtaz	posted 01-29-2002 08:14 AM ET (US) My brother has a 1999 Merc 90 on his small Mako. It's a great engine!
whalerron	posted 01-29-2002 08:27 AM ET (US) What do you think about the Merc versus the Johnson oil warning systems? As I understand it, the Merc has a "Low oil" warning whereas the Johnson has a "Low oil" and a "No oil" warning...
TightPenny	posted 01-29-2002 10:06 AM ET (US) The 90 Johnson is a design that has been around for a long time. I have a 2001 Ocean Pro model and love it on my Montauk. Love the Montauk too.
Bigshot	posted 01-29-2002 10:27 AM ET (US) Either one is a good engine. Look for a Yammie 90 too. Although not as torquey, she gets great MPG and weighs the same as your 70 did. I would not trade my RudeSuzi 70 4 stroke for anything even though she is a bit slower.
John from Madison CT	posted 01-31-2002 07:12 PM ET (US) Call me biased but IMHO, the Yammie 90hp is the perfect motor for a Montauk. They run very smooth, are incredibly reliable, weigh only ~250lbs. and give an excellent top speed. (~40mph) John from Madison
Bigshot	posted 02-01-2002 10:49 AM ET (US) john as far as 2 strokes go...you are correct in my opinion. i would also highly recommend the suzi 70 4 stroke as long as 37mph is OK. Like I posted before, it does not burn gas and sooooo quiet.
JBCornwell	posted 02-02-2002 08:38 AM ET (US) Hi, John. I agree with Bigshot. Get a test ride in a Johnnyuki DF70 powered boat. There are a LOT of DF70s on Montauks. You will be amazed, then hooked. Red sky at night. . . JB :)
JBCornwell	posted 02-02-2002 08:39 AM ET (US) Hi, John. I agree with Bigshot. Get a test ride in a Johnnyuki DF70 powered boat. There are a LOT of DF70s on Montauks. You will be amazed, then hooked. Red sky at night. . . JB :)