posted 07-06-2003 10:31 AM ET (US)            

Since we do not live in a perfect world there are variables.

Did the dealer mount the motor as specified by Whaler?

Did Whaler run their tests with the boat loaded as I do?

Did Whaler run their test with an SS prop or aluminum?

Did the dealer install the corect prop?

In my case I know that I run my Montauk much heavier than the tests Whaler ran, as most do. Performance was OK but with the addition of a 4 blade SS prop and raising the engine one more hole it improved.
Were Whalers rigging specs wrong? No, I just load my boat heavier.

The same applies to the vehicle you drive, it does not come from the factory set up for optimum performance. My F-150 is a good example, off the dealers lot it was great. With the addition of a K&N intake and a Borla exhaust systems it is much better. Ford wasn't wrong I just wanted more.

I think I am starting to ramble a bit but I get tired of unjustified critisim of the best boat builder that there is.

posted 07-06-2003 12:46 PM ET (US)            

In the past, Whaler just sold a boat. The selection of the motor and the propeller and their installation was left to the dealer and ultimately to the buyer. Even if the boat was ordered with pre-rigging for a particular brand (typically only OMC or Mercury), there is no way to guaranty that the engine would be mounted in accordance with the instructions provided by Boston Whaler. Nor is there any guaranty that without extensive testing by the dealer and the customer, the most optimum propeller could be chosen.

According to reports from others, Whaler supplied their dealers with information on how to properly mount the engine, generally specifying a relationship between the hull bottom at the keel centerline and the height of the engines anti-ventilation plate.

As for recommending a propeller, the factory would have to test the boat with dozens of different engines to determine the proper propeller for each one. Engines have different lower unit ratios, and this makes a big impact on the propeller pitch that give best results.

The testing would have to include hundreds of different propellers, too. Should the factory only test OEM propellers? What about all the aftermarket propellers? Was there a real expectation that the factory--whose business then was selling boats not motors and propellers--purchase and have on hand dozens of different motor brands and hundreds of different propellers FOR EACH MODEL OF BOAT IN THEIR PRODUCT LINE?

Of course the Boston Whaler factory did not test their boats with every brand of engine and horsepower, and of course they did not select a propeller for all of these combinations. They left that to the dealer and the customer to work out. They told them where to mount the engine, and after that the dealer and the customer were on their own.

Did the dealer ignore the instructions and mount the motor improperly? Yes. We've had reports of engines mounted too low, engines mounted off center, engines mounted not square to the transom top surface. Sorry, but that is shoddy work by the engine installer and not something Whaler failed to do.

Did the dealer just slap on a propeller that was not optimum for the boat? Yes. Maybe he told the customer that he needed a $500 Stainless propeller instead of the $99 aluminum one that comes with the engine. Customer did not want to spend the money. Whose fault is that? Whaler? Hardly.

Now, we turn to the present. The Boston Whaler company now sells boats and motors as a package. They install the motor right on the boat. One would think that they mount the engine in the position they think will be best for the typical user of the boat. I assume they sell it with a propeller, but on many larger horsepower engines the propeller might be optional. On smaller boats they definitely haved tested and found the best propeller. That comes with the engine. (Unless the dealer takes it off and tries to begin a new profit center.)

What do they get for all this trouble? They get complaints from people who want to buy just the boat.

It seems to me to be hard to hold Boston Whaler responsible for poor installations and bad propeller selection on boats which they did not sell as a package with boat and motor. That covers about 99-percent of all Whalers in use right now.

posted 07-06-2003 01:35 PM ET (US)            

X prop with X motor= fishing alone, top speed

posted 07-06-2003 03:34 PM ET (US)            

As for dealers and what they were told by Whaler, I think they probably liked to keep some of this information close to the vest. If a customer can walk over to a rack and pick up detailed literature about recommended engine and propeller combinations, that make the customer about as smart as the dealer. But if the customer has to ask a salesman about what engine is recommended, then the salesman can pull out something from the inside pocket of his suit coat and act like the has all the answers. Giving all this information to the shopper might lead the shopper to discover that the boat runs better with an engine that this dealer doesn't even sell.

Now it makes more sense if Boston Whaler would publish any test results they may have observed. I don't think they are available at the dealership any more easily in 2003 than they were in 1963. They could put them on their website. (Other makers do this.)

By the way, the engine test results and recommended propeller information I included in my article last year about the 170-MONTAUK came from Boston Whaler. But I have not seen that data elsewhere. I don't know if they have a flyer that includes it, and I can't find it in the catalogue. In fact, when a buyer took delivery with a 170-MONTUAK that had the wrong propeller on it, he said the only way he knew something was wrong was because of that article. Maybe there could be better distribution of test data like that.

posted 07-06-2003 04:31 PM ET (US)            

I suppose that would be a mini-test to see if the advise of BW was followed by the dealers or the dealers just ignored BW standards and ill fitted props and motors.

Jim, in regards to your comments about salesman pulling, "something from the inside pocket of his suit coat...", I couldn't agree more. For a dealership, it is neccessary for the salesman to know a little more than the customer. Otherwise, they have no sales pitch and come across as if they lack credibility when the customer has more knowledge than the dealer.

posted 07-07-2003 10:45 AM ET (US)            

From Boston Whalers reccomended engine mounting instructions dated 5-14-99.
All engines are reccomended mounted one hole up.
Merc 75 12.75 X 21
Merc 90 12.75 X 21
Merc 100 12.75 X 21
Merc 50 4 stk 10 3/8 X 14

The reccomended specs worked OK on my Montauk but as I stated earlier I run fairly heavy and wanted better.
I raised the 50 4 stk 2 holes up and went to a 10 5/8 X 13 4 blade SS prop. Much better performance. I don't feel that there was anything wrong with Whalers reccomended specs they just didn't work for me.

I was chastised for comparing this to my F-150. Both came from the dealer performing as designed, I wanted more and the modifications to both were not free. I have no regrets on the bucks spent on either.

posted 07-07-2003 04:07 PM ET (US)            

It is a science project - you will need to tweak your boat to your application and whaler says so.

posted 07-07-2003 11:21 PM ET (US)            

I understand the value of a correct prop and have used and ruined many a prop in my young life. I have been Whalering since I was 6. I am 28 now and still have the same Whaler. I will NEVER sell her. How many of you guys here, can say they have had the same Whaler for 22 years?

Anyways, the threads that keep appearing and your advise is the same for most all applications except, the exact prop pitch and motor combination.

From my reading, it seems there is an agreement that, if you raise your motor, you will get better performance.

posted 07-08-2003 12:31 AM ET (US)            

It may be a wierd combination but those are the reccomendations on the rigging sheet from Whaler.

Dunkin Whalers

Sorry I got my hackels up.
My F-150 is a 97 short bed step side with the 4.6L V-8. I didn't notice much improvement with the K&N filter system but when I put the Borla cat back system on big time improvement.

Trucks, boats or anything that is powered in most cases can be tweeked to make you happy. Thinking of putting a blower on my Honda mower, so the wife can mow the lawn faster.

posted 07-08-2003 05:36 AM ET (US)            

This little boat with the Merc on it has spent more time waiting to launch than most guys have spent on the water. I have run from Anacortes to Henry, Anacortes to Center, Bellingham to Lummi, Lummi to Orcas, Everett to Point No Point and about every mile on the Columbia from Colville to Umatilla. Come launch time, usually, I have always been the one at the helm waiting immpatiently for the guy before me to get out of the way, My Dad has trusted me with this task since I was 8.

I have an interest in the topic because I am working on buying a '84 15' C/C. My best friends Dad owns it and it is PERFECT. He has had it for 12 years and it has a 70hp Yamaha on it. I have always been able to smoke him with my 13' with a worn out 50hp merc. He has never been able to keep up with me and my Dad when we have gone out on Boeing Salmon derbies and other fishing trips together.

posted 07-08-2003 01:32 PM ET (US)         

For example, the 220 Dauntless had four or five adults on board, a Bimini top, full fuel, and gear. I can't recall the details of the other set of data, but it was performed in a like fashion. The positioning of the individuals on the boats was also varied from test to test, simulating what would be commonly seen on a day of recreational boating.

The probability of optimal performance from a factory-tested set-up is good under these circumstances. Overall, I think that Boston Whaler tests its boats thoroughly, as evidenced by the detail in the reports I reviewed. Almost every variable I'd considered, in addition to many I hadn't, were factored in. Engine height was just one of the many variables. There was also a brief narrative from the individuals performing the tests relaying their overall "seat-of-the-pants" impressions.

In every boat my family has bought, regardless of manufacturer, some tuning was necessary to achieve the performance characteristics we considered important. For the general public, assuming little knowlege of boating, the factory's setting up a boat and motor combination for safety and stability in a wide variety of conditions probably takes priority over higher performance. I'd imagine that this is particularly true with regards to Boston Whaler, "The Unsinkable Legend."

posted 07-09-2003 03:25 AM ET (US)            

I have had the same whaler since I was 13, and I feel the same as you, I will never give that boat up. However, I have failed to add to my Whaler stock - and that is pretty sad. I am still dreaming however.

I wish I was 28, but I am 46 (so I have had the boat for 33 years).

I am glad I can learn from the postings on this forum. Otherwise I would never have tested props, bought an engine monitor and a GPS. That too is pretty sad, especially as an adult. My god, as a kid I spent more time fiddling with my Aurora AFX HO cars, than I have spent fiddling with my boat, cars and motorcycles as an adult - until I started reading this forum.