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  trim tabs with whaler drive?

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Author Topic:   trim tabs with whaler drive?
mhoyt01 posted 08-05-2003 07:08 PM ET (US)   Profile for mhoyt01   Send Email to mhoyt01  
Is is possible. The Outrage 22 W/D is struggling a wee bit under the weight of the Honda 130's, and I was wondering if anyone had put trim tabs on a W/D, and if so, details would be much appreciateded....

Matt

alkar posted 08-06-2003 04:41 PM ET (US)     Profile for alkar  Send Email to alkar     
Struggling how? (I have twin Honda 115's on my 22' Outrage w/ whaler drive.)

Do you have any profile photos showing the static trim of your boat?

Alex

Barry posted 08-06-2003 06:06 PM ET (US)     Profile for Barry  Send Email to Barry     
I've only seen pictures of one 22' Outrage WD that had trim tabs. That boat had a single plus a kicker and the tabs were mounted on the flat aft surface of the WD. I don't think that tab mounting location would work with twin engines.
mhoyt01 posted 08-06-2003 06:34 PM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
Barry, that's what I was thinking, that for the reply.

Alkar, pleased to see someone powered the same as me!

OK, since our engines weigh the same I'd like to know exactly how you're got your set.

The problem is the boat starts porpoising pretty badly after about 22 mph.

We bought dole fins, my brother took it out but said it was snotty out and too hard to tell.

I will take pics after work. My big question is what hole do you have them mounted on? Ours are 2nd from the top and I was thinking of moving them to the top hole?(engine would move down relative to the boat...

Also, what do you get for top speed?

We had merc non-counter rotating 125 carb that pushed us 47 mph with 19 pitch aluminum props. We now have the 19 pitch Honda SS props are hoping to get 50 mph once we get dialed in...

thanks so much in advance for your help,

Matt

mhoyt01 posted 08-06-2003 06:38 PM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
BTW Alkar,

I bet you know this, but the only difference between the 115/130, other than price, is the throttle body. Same goes for the 200/225. The 115 simply has a device which restricts the TB from fully opening. the only purpose of the 115 is to meet HP requirements. So you can buy 130 TB's and have 130's if you're interested. I was also told it's vitually impossible to modify the 115 TB's so you would have to buy new ones....

Matt

mhoyt01 posted 08-06-2003 07:15 PM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
Here's the pix, sorry if they're too big....

http://www.nationalpayments.com/matt/Honda1.JPG

alkar posted 08-06-2003 07:33 PM ET (US)     Profile for alkar  Send Email to alkar     
Matt,

My boat has never been inclined to porpoise. My only complaint if the aft-down static trim. It bothers my eye, but it doesn't seem to adversely effect performance.

My motors are mounted on the bottom holes. The holes in the whaler drive were drilled 2" (on center) below the top edge. That appears to be approximately where your holes are, so I suspect you'll have no further problems if you just run the bolts through the bottom holes.

At WOT I get about 40 mph. (One day the GPS bounced between 39 and 40. The next day it bounced between 40 and 41 - both times running on the bay with very small surface ripples/chop.) Both times with an average load and a half tank or more fuel.

I'm going to see what the throttle bodies would cost.

Alex

alkar posted 08-06-2003 07:41 PM ET (US)     Profile for alkar  Send Email to alkar     
Matt, here's the scoop from my reliable Honda guy: It's the same throttle body. The 115 just has a tab which prevents it from opening all the way up. He says, theoretically, the tab can be ground or broken off - but it's a $10,000 EPA fine if you're caught doing it.

Sounds kinda nutty, but he says you can't legally modify outboard motors anymore. I think I'll do a little more digging on that.

Alex

mhoyt01 posted 08-06-2003 08:24 PM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
Alex,

Awesome info. So to double check, bottom wholes, or RAISE the engine with respect to the boat. Out of curiosity, what is bad about aft-down static trim. This just mean your rear is sitting lower in the water right? Are you taking in water or is there some other problem.

What props are you running?

My response to throttle bodies, illegal catylitic converters, ripping mattress tags etc. is always:

"I have NO idea what you're talking about"

Matt

Barry posted 08-06-2003 08:43 PM ET (US)     Profile for Barry  Send Email to Barry     
Matt, you definately need to raise your engines.

Here is a shot of alkar's boat members.aol.com/bburtensha/alkar/profileaft.jpg

Barry posted 08-06-2003 08:55 PM ET (US)     Profile for Barry  Send Email to Barry     
I've got twin 1988 Johnson 150s on mine. They are only 390 lbs. each but I also have the large 129 gallon fuel tank. As a result, with several people in the back my boat will take some water in through the scuppers. I keep my sump plug in and have a large bilge pump in the sump. To keep the pump from cycling I've got rubber balls (with cords attached so I can easily remove them) stuffed in the scuppers.
mhoyt01 posted 08-06-2003 09:00 PM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
Barry,

Ok, looking at his boat, and having looked at many boats overthe years, it looks low in the back, and does look like mine. (It's all coming back to me now, since I've only been in it once with the Honda's). I will raise them.

What do you think, other than appearance, is affected by the low ride in the back?

Matt

http://www.nationalpayments.com/matt/Honda2.JPG
http://www.nationalpayments.com/matt/Honda3.JPG
http://www.nationalpayments.com/matt/Honda6.JPG

Barry posted 08-06-2003 09:41 PM ET (US)     Profile for Barry  Send Email to Barry     
http://members.aol.com/bburtensha/outrage/nc2003_2.jpg

I don't know if the extra weight at the rear would make it more difficult to get the bow down at speed. If so, that would result in a rougher ride in a short chop.

jimh posted 08-06-2003 11:30 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
[Administrative post]
mhoyt01 posted 08-07-2003 02:26 AM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
Barry and Alex,

BTW, both of you have good looking boats, I may say so...

Yes, my boat used to look like Barry's, now it's sit like Alex's. I'm really excited to get those engines raised up and try it out on my lake powell trip next week.

Now, Alex, when I boughtthe Honda's i was told they were 17 pitch props. But I just looked closer(read: spent 15 minutes picking off grime to see the numbers) and they're 17's. This explains why the engines where laso running what seemed audible(no tachs hooked up yet) a little loud on my test run.

I was running 19 pitch aluminum on the merc 125's and it was about right. Do you guys think 19 or 21 pitch, and Honda or non-Honda, and 3 or 4 blade?

Matt

mhoyt01 posted 08-07-2003 02:21 PM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
I'm sorry, they said 19's but it was 15's. I went ahead and ordered to 13.25 x 19 Honda 3 blade stainles for 239 each, no tax, and $17 shipping. good deal I thought.

Anyone interest in two 13.25 x 15 Honda 3-blade stainless. Great condition and all the torque you can handle!

Barry posted 08-07-2003 06:20 PM ET (US)     Profile for Barry  Send Email to Barry     
Matt, what RPM are you seeing at WOT with the existing setup? Raising the engine should reduce drag and increase the RPM. I would raise first and test before I ordered new props.
mhoyt01 posted 08-07-2003 07:11 PM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
I'm looking for 550 Barry,

Since hte WOT operating range is 5000-6000. I went ahead and ordered them because the 15 pitch is just way too steep for our boat, and the lady I ordered them from said I could exchange them I used them for just one trial and returned them, shipping at my exspense of course.

Matt

mhoyt01 posted 08-17-2003 10:07 PM ET (US)     Profile for mhoyt01  Send Email to mhoyt01     
Fellas,

Moving the engines all the way up did the trick. Can't say thank you enough. Aside from having the the low aft static trim, as we know all call it, it handled just like I felt it should. I haven't recieved my 19 pitch props yet, so the rpm's are a little high with the 15 pitch, but UPS ground should take care of that this week...

Matt

O, and ps, the guy and his wife 5 miles offshore with 2 broken 2001 sea doo GTX's thank you too, as I towed them in on what was a really nasty sunday out there on the pacific...

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