Forum: WHALER
  ContinuousWave
  Whaler
  Moderated Discussion Areas
  ContinuousWave: Whaler Performance
  Fuel economy of 17' Outrage I vs 18' Outrage I?

Post New Topic  Post Reply
search | FAQ | profile | register | author help

Author Topic:   Fuel economy of 17' Outrage I vs 18' Outrage I?
seaspeak posted 12-11-2003 01:07 PM ET (US)   Profile for seaspeak   Send Email to seaspeak  
Assume a 115hp Ficht or EFI 4-stroke engine on the 17' Outrage I, and a 150hp Ficht or EFI 4-stroke on the 18' classic. Let's say 2 adults (375lbs) plus 150 lbs gear and full tanks of gas.

Further assume that we're going for a little cruise in the San Juans. There will be no trolling. Cruising will be at say 30 knots.

I know that many variables affect fuel economy, but I'm curious to know what 'reasonable' economy numbers would be for these two boats.

Anyone want to hazard some educated guesses?

best,

Brandt

Bigshot posted 12-11-2003 01:21 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
The 115 4 stroke & ficht will burn about 4-5gph at 4000rpm. A conventional 115 carb will burn about 6-7. The 150opti would be up in the 6-7gph range being a V6. A conventional 150 would do 9+. To compare further my 225 carbed burns about 12-13gph at 4000 and the 4 stroke or DFI runs about 8-9.
Peter posted 12-11-2003 01:32 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
Can't answer for the 17 Outrage I, but my old 18 Outrage/150 Johnson cross-flow would cruise at 30 MPH at approximately 3300 RPM. A Ficht 150 burns approximately 7 GPH at 3300 RPM. So assuming an 18 Outrage with a Ficht 150 running at 3300 RPM would go the same speed, it would achieve approximately 4.3 MPG. Compare: I used to get a little over 3 MPG with the old cross-flow 150. The DI engine provides about a 35% improvement. A 4-stroke 150 will be no more fuel efficient than the DI 2-stroke so it should also produce approximately 4+ MPG at that cruise speed.
Sal DiMercurio posted 12-11-2003 08:33 PM ET (US)     Profile for Sal DiMercurio  Send Email to Sal DiMercurio     
Peter, I would think the Ficht 150 would do better then that, as my 200 Ficht [ on a V20 outrage ] gets way better then 5 mpg between 3,000 & 3,500 rpms.
The only drawback about 3,200....3,300 rpms on my engine is, thats when the engine changes from homogines mode to stratos mode & it's a rough spot on the engine, the only one.
Sal
Peter posted 12-12-2003 06:01 AM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
Sal - Many of Evinrude's own performance reports for the 150 indicate a fuel consumption rate of about 7 GPH in the range discussed. However, I went back to look at some additional reports and some indicate a consumption rate of around 6 GPH. If that is true, then you would see 5 MPG. So its fair to say that at a 30 MPH cruise, one should expect a fuel consumption range of about 6 to 7 GPH and mileage in the range of 4 to 5 to the gallon.

Don't the Fichts use stratified charge mode at low engine speeds and homogenious for high engine speeds?

BarryGreen posted 12-12-2003 08:10 AM ET (US)     Profile for BarryGreen  Send Email to BarryGreen     
Sal - Just a question. What year is your Ficht, and has it been upgraded with the latest retrofits? I have a '99 175hp Ficht on a 20 ft Outrage that had that same problem as air velocity ramped up and flow went from stratified (along the cylinder walls) to homogeneous (enough flow velocity to really atomize ai/fuel) before it was upgraded. That hesitation left a funny feeling in my gut every time. However, once my Evinrude dealer upgraded the heads and software I can no longer feel or even sense any change at all as I accelerate up on plane. Absolutely one continuous flow of power, and a much more pleasant experience.
Peter posted 12-12-2003 08:52 AM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
I haven't been able to notice the transition from the one mode to the other on my 2002 225s. They seem to be continuously smooth from idle to WOT.

Sal - is your 200 on the 3.0L block or the 3.3L block? Also, one other thought is that doesn't the V20 have a slightly flatter deadrise? If it does, then it would probably do a bit better on fuel economy.

Sal DiMercurio posted 12-12-2003 11:28 AM ET (US)     Profile for Sal DiMercurio  Send Email to Sal DiMercurio     
My engine is a 200 hp 2000 with the 3.0 block.
Right at 3,200 rpms is where it changes & it's not noticable while accelerating but if i'm running right at that rpm it bounces back & forth between both modes & creates a rough spot.
100 rpms either way & it smooths out.
Yes the V20 is a much flatter bottom & that is most likely the reason for better fuel economy.
Also i'm 50 hp over powered allowing me to swing more pitch in the prop, thus giving more speed at a lower rpm.
I know my application can't be compared with the deeper "V" hulls of the newer Whalers because they require more hp to obtain what mine does because of the slighter V.
Sal
Tom2697 posted 12-12-2003 11:57 AM ET (US)     Profile for Tom2697  Send Email to Tom2697     
Brandt,
On my Outrage 18 (1989), I repowered with a 2003 Suzuki DF140. Most on this site don't believe me but I average over 6 mpg! During my break-in, I ran at idle for 15 minutes, 3000 rpm (just sub-plane) for 105 minutes, 4000 rpm for 60 minutes, and then at various planing speeds for another 30 minutes or so. I travelled over 60 miles (via both fishfinder and GPS) and added EXACTLY 10 gallons of fuel to top-off the tank. When I go trolling offshore, my efficiency improves to around 6.3 - 6.5 mpg depending upon the conditions and how far I run before trolling.

My brother has the 17' Outrage (1994?) but with a 2000 Johnson 90. He says he is getting a little over 4 mpg.

Clark Roberts posted 12-13-2003 09:43 AM ET (US)     Profile for Clark Roberts  Send Email to Clark Roberts     
Seaspeak asked for comparison ("educated guesses") at 30 knots (approx 35mph)!
Peter posted 12-13-2003 01:08 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
I would say that 30 knots (~ 35 MPH) is a very high cruise speed for either of these boats and is unlikely to be the cruising speed of choice unless the conditions are pretty flat. For the 10 seasons I had my 18 Outrage in the typical chop we see here, a comfortable cruise usually fell between 25 and 30 MPH. At speeds of 35+ MPH, the 18 Outrage starts to get into the air born mode. That is why I chose to read the request of " at say 30 Knots" to mean 30 MPH.

Thus, 30 MPH is a good speed to compare motors and estimate cruising fuel economy. It is also a speed which keeps the two cycle motors below the magic 4000 RPM level.

Although Tom's reported data is very typical of real world operations (average of 2.9 GPH, 17 MPH over the 3.5 hours of operation), at a cruise of 30 MPH the Suzuki DF 140 should burn approximately 6 to 7 GPH and should therefore achieve a fuel economy in the 5 MPG range. Thus, its cruising performance should be quite similar to the much larger displacement DI 2-stroke (Mercury, Evinrude, Yamaha) and 4-stroke 150s (Yamaha, Honda) although these larger engines will be working a bit less hard to achieve those results.

linhans posted 12-13-2003 04:34 PM ET (US)     Profile for linhans  Send Email to linhans     
I bought a 17 Outrage II with a 2001 model F115 Yamaha (4 stroke) last september. I ride 13 hours with it up til now with an everage fuel consumption of 3,2 GPH. I used it in its full RPM-range up to 6100 RPM (no trolling). Full tank and one adult (only me) most of the time.
Just to give you an experiance figure.
seaspeak posted 12-13-2003 06:26 PM ET (US)     Profile for seaspeak  Send Email to seaspeak     
I should have said 30 mph, you're absolutely correct. Sorry about that!

I appreciate all the good information you guys have provided. Sounds like with new tech the 18 Outrage should do about 5mpg and the 17 Outrage I should do about 7mpg.

And it sounds like the efficiency with old tech in proper running condition would be 35-40% less.

If I've drawn the wrong conclusions here, pls let me know!

thanks,

Brandt


Bigshot posted 12-15-2003 02:45 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Should be about 5-7mpg on both hulls depending on how fast your cruise is. My Montauk with the 70 gets about 8-10mpg at cruise. I doubt an engine double the size will get much better than 7mpg, most likely about 6(30mph @ 5gph).
raydent99 posted 12-18-2003 10:36 PM ET (US)     Profile for raydent99  Send Email to raydent99     
Tom's brother runs at WOT much of the time, however.

Post New Topic  Post Reply
Hop to:


Contact Us | RETURN to ContinuousWave Top Page

Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board, Freeware Version 2000
Purchase our Licensed Version- which adds many more features!
© Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998 - 2000.