posted 02-12-2004 12:49 PM ET (US)            

Evinrude E-TEC seems a much more promising outboard for most boat owners. We'll see.

I am sure Mercury will have something to compete with it before long.

posted 02-12-2004 01:53 PM ET (US)            

These may be very technologically advanced, but they are too heavy! 649# for a 200HP 25" shaft? The Yamaha 4s 200 is almost 50# lighter! I was certain that weight and size would be two of the primary design considerations for "next generation" outboards. I guess I was wrong.

posted 02-12-2004 03:23 PM ET (US)            

There have been reports on several web sites of people ordering the new 320 with the 250Hp Verado twins package already. I guess we'll need to wait and see which it is when their boats are delivered.

posted 02-12-2004 03:47 PM ET (US)            

Jim Hebert (jimh) and Larry Goltz (lhg) are in Florida now and are supposed to be going to the show this week. Whaler had given Jim four tickets to the show and I believe they were looking forward to meeting one another in person and talking about these new motors.

I am confident we will get a full report from Jim upon his return.

I too, am surprised by the tremendous weight of these engines. I had thought that keeping the displacement down and compensating for that with supercharging was going to save weight.

posted 02-12-2004 05:49 PM ET (US)            

This thread may set a new record for continuouswave. I am predicting at least 200-300 posts.

C'mon E-tech!

posted 02-12-2004 06:23 PM ET (US)            

The only advantage that I've heard in the videos is that these will out accelerate any 4-stroke or virtually any 2-stroke. Who cares except bass boaters? It's unlikely that I'll every drag race anybody in my 27 Whaler. It pops up on plane quite fine with the 225 Evinrudes I've got now and I don't have the extra 250 lbs hanging on my transom changing the balance of my boat.

This almost seems to me to be a classic case of a failure to listen to the voice of the customer, which I think was one who just wanted to get back their 2-stroke performance and weight with the 4-stroke quietness and economy. They missed the mark. All of the "fly-by-wire" stuff is of no real benefit to the consumer. It only benefits Mercury because it reduces rigging labor cost at the Mercury factory.

posted 02-12-2004 11:13 PM ET (US)            

If those engines have anything new, they are keeping it secret. Everything else they trumpet about has been around from 20 to 80 years.

Applying some of it to the heaviest outboards ever offered in that HP range is something new.

posted 02-13-2004 08:39 AM ET (US)         

As I recall, he also had some harsh words for the cowling on the Suzuki 140. It looks elegant compared to the Mercury Jumbo Shrimp.

What a disappointment! At least now, the hype should end.

posted 02-13-2004 08:49 AM ET (US)            

* Sound Attenuation: This is huge. They tout 14 dB lower sound levels. For anyone familiar with sound, 75dB versus 90dB is like moderate conversation level versus what you normally hear on plane behind you with an outboard. This is also a big benefit to Boston Whaler sales. As you all know, the foam in the hull provides great sound proofing compared to conventional hull construction. Imagine the sales impact of driving a potential customer in a solid, quite Whaler versus a Grady White or Scout. The outboard engine sound previously masked all the noises (squeaks, rattles, water slamming the hull, etc) emanating from the hull- but not anymore. All conventional hulls manufacturers will need to improve their NVH (noise, vibration, harshness) response to compete. I bet all future Boston Whaler customers will be invited to take two boat rides: one in a Verado equipped hull, and one in anyone other boat.

* Vibration: In addition to the explantion above, there is the vibration component of NVH. You all know vibration in a car. Take the difference of your average stiff SUV versus a Lexus sedan on a brick lined road and you get the feel for different approaches in vibration isolation. The Verado has a subframe which contains isolation bushings for engine mounts. Have you ever been in a large diesel cruiser with and without new engine mounts? It is night and day.

* Weight: Yes, they are indeed heavier than expected. The increase can be attributed to the supercharger-which I'm guessing could be 50 lbs or more, and the steering mechanisim. The steering set up appears to be plug and play with an internal electonic assist pump versus the external hydraulic rack. I won't know for sure until people report who have seen it up close. The steering rack weight would be included in the total reported engine weight that is missing from other engine specs.

posted 02-13-2004 09:00 AM ET (US)            

I hope it works out for Mercury's sake.......and Larry's.

posted 02-13-2004 11:57 AM ET (US)            

Under Four Stroke, the subcategories are Verado, BigFoot, Mid-Range (30-115hp), Small (9.9 and 15hp), and Portable (4-6hp)

What is Whaler gonna do about the 220 Dauntless, and the 210 Outrage and Ventura? These are max motor weighted at 610 lbs, and the 25" 225HP Verado is 649 lbs without the 8.5 quarts of oil and a prop. Will the 497+ lb (20" spec) 225HP Opti be the only option?

posted 02-13-2004 03:27 PM ET (US)            

Yes, I am sure Larry will also be very disappointed by the weight of these behemoths.

You're right, the weight of the 250 and 275's don't seem too bad compared to the 200. I think the classic 27 hull with the 10' beam could easily handle a pair of 275's.

posted 02-13-2004 08:32 PM ET (US)            

For me the weight and the added complexity of a super-charger are deal killers.

posted 02-13-2004 11:45 PM ET (US)            

Perry,
Even now without boost, Merc (Last yr) on the small block V6 Optis had a range of 115hp to 175hp. On the old black Max's they ran the 175-250s on the same size block. Getting just over 100 hp/Liter is not that difficult and many auto engines do it. More than likley the lower horsepower versions do indeed restrict intake air, boost, and fuel pressure. Granted an outboard is not an auto engine because it lives it's life at a much higher load and duty cycle. But even so, the power output from 2.6 liters is not so radical that one would be suspect of the reliability. For a forced induction injected motor, 275hp/2.6 litres is almost conservative.

I wonder how long before an IO version hits the streets. That is where Merc will really start paying off their development costs, when they can share common power platform components between IOs and outboards. Here in central TX lakes, IOs outnumber the outboard by about 4 to 1, and 80% of those are Mercs now.

posted 02-14-2004 07:23 PM ET (US)            

I can fondly remember being 12 years old and buying a brand new Mercury 50 HP four cylinder for my 16 foot clam boat. Manual start, long-shaft with the tiller handle. That motor ran great for me for 10 years, started on the first pull every time. I sold it for about 70% of what it cost me new. So I am rooting for the boys at Mercury to hit one out of the park with the Verado. I like the DTS, I like the supercharger, but I agree that the high weight will likely hurt the 200 and 225 variants. It will be interesting to see if Whaler adjusts the horsepower / weight limits on some of the boats like the 220 Dauntless, where it is currently an exclusionary 225 HP / 610 lbs.

posted 02-15-2004 12:28 AM ET (US)            

We saw the engines and went for a test drive with them on a Whaler 320 Outrage with a pair of 250-HP VERADO motors.

posted 02-15-2004 01:59 PM ET (US)            

http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/006715.html

for some first-hand impressions and a test ride report.