Forum: WHALER
  ContinuousWave
  Whaler
  Moderated Discussion Areas
  ContinuousWave: Whaler Performance
  Preliminary 90hp E-Tec Performance Report

Post New Topic  Post Reply
search | FAQ | profile | register | author help

Author Topic:   Preliminary 90hp E-Tec Performance Report
ratherwhalering posted 03-11-2004 01:05 PM ET (US)   Profile for ratherwhalering   Send Email to ratherwhalering  
Here, as promised, is the performance report for my new E90DSL. The following were pictures were taken during installation (I’m the guy in the first picture) and are posted to give an idea of the engine’s size and styling:

IN CRATE

ON CRANE

ON TRANSOM

ON TRANSOM

AT NIGHT

JACKPLATE

COWLING ON

The Engine is mounted on a 4’ CMC setback plate. The anti-cavitation plate is approximately 3” above the transom. The propeller is Michigan 3.25 x 17 aluminum. The load was 18 gallons of gas, and two 200 lb guts...I mean guys, aboard, and two 70 lb Labs. Max RPM was 5000 with full tilt down, 5500 trimmed out for speed.

2500 RPM=18mph
3000 RPM=22 mph
4000 RPM=31 mph
5000 RPM=39.5 mph
5500 RPM=41mph

I also have some comments regarding this engine. First and foremost, anyone interested should start by reading Jim’s thread regarding the specifics of E-Tec design and function
http://continuouswave.com/ubb/Forum4/HTML/002392.html
Some notes for the self-installer: The engine does not have blind hole mounts, only Evinrude’s “fast-trac” system, which is compatible with standard BIA hole mount patterns. The E90DSL is a 20” saltwater edition of the 90hp. E-Tec. The engine appears very small when mounted, and has a lower profile than most 2 stroke V-4 engines.

Make no mistake, this is a two stroke engine, just no smoke. It starts immediately, and idles very quietly, but it is a little rough in the idle to 1200 RPM range. It does not have the slick, smooth idle of a 70hp 4stroke, but it is quieter than anything I have ever heard. Above 1200 RPM that it is essentially silent because the water slap and wind noise cancel out engine sound.

The acceleration is awesome, but frankly the engine “felt” just a tad more powerful than my old Johnson 90hp V-4. The most noticeable difference was acceleration...the e-tech seems much quicker to respond, with greater thrust. I’ll have more photos in the next few days, and more specific RPM/MPH data. In the mean time, I’ll be out on the water! (it was 80 degrees here yesterday!)

Bigshot posted 03-11-2004 02:39 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
numbers look good EXCEPT for you get 39.5 @ 5k yet only get 41 @ 5500. Either you are blowing out from too much trim or prop is not getting a good bite. The last 500rpms usually give the best speed. I would think your problem might be the alum prop is starting to flex above 40mph and hence, you aint getting anymore speed. My 70 4 stroke fetches over 39 and my 90 Yamaha got about 41.5. I would expect that if you are setup right, even with 2 guts:), you should be closer to 43.
Peter posted 03-11-2004 03:35 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
Neat pictures. It looks great on the Montauk.

Just a guess here but I suspect the perceived roughness at idle to 1200 RPM is normal and might be caused by a pulsed tuned exhaust system and possibly the stratified fuel charge. Did you notice any transitional change in exhaust tune between the high RPMs and the mid throttle settings?

As a reference point, my 3 cylinder loop charged Yamaha 70 having a pulse tuned exhaust system is somewhat rough from idle to about 1500 RPM and I'm told this is normal. Above that its smooth and until it hits about 4500 RPM where it sounds horrible. I try to avoid 4500 RPM. Above 4500 to 6000 RPM it really sings a sweet and different tune.

It would be interesting to know whether the 3 cylinder E-TEC does what other 3 cylinder loop charged.

Plugging your data into the propeller calculator suggest the prop was losing its grip at 5500 RPM and trimmed out. The aluminum propeller might not be ideal for an anti-vent plate 3 inches above the bottom even though it is set back.

Mike Brantley posted 03-11-2004 04:31 PM ET (US)     Profile for Mike Brantley  Send Email to Mike Brantley     
Rob, that's a great looking rig! Beautiful teak on the RPS.

On my E-Tec 50, I observed the exact same roughness at idle below 1,200 as you experienced with your 90. My front thwart seat vibrates a great deal at idle, and my GPS mounted on top of my console shakes so much at idle that I can't reat it. But as soon as I goose the throttle a little, it smoothes right out, just as you've observed. It's not anything I'm going to complain about -- just a characteristic, I guess.

I don't have any direct experience with 4-stroke motors, but comparing mine to my old 2-stroke 50, I sense the same feeling of "power" that you do with your 90 as compared to your previous motor.

Did you get your EMM reprogrammed for XD100 oil yet? I've made no steps in that direction yet, but I'm thinking it would be a good idea.

The white saltwater edition looks good on your boat. I'm in brackish water a lot. Hope my blue motor doesn't rust off!

jimh posted 03-11-2004 10:34 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
The pictures also show the built-in lifting eye strap on the engine chassis. It seems positioned to give good balance when the engine is suspended from the eye strap with a crane hook.

Thanks very much for the report!

jimh posted 03-12-2004 06:25 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
[Shortened Hyperlinks]
Salmon Tub posted 03-12-2004 12:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for Salmon Tub  Send Email to Salmon Tub     
Rob, lucky dog, nice rig. I got to enjoy the weather from my office yesterday. Motor looks very nice, good proportions for the Montauk, and white to boot. Does not have that big headed Brainiac look like some of the 4-strokes I have been seeing. What did you do with the 90? I take it the engine requires no initial programming from the dealer such as the Nissan/Tohatsu TLDI, makeing the TLDI engines tough for a self-install. I will try to make it out Sunday for some sturgeon, got four shakers last saturday, but Sunday has a good outgo early in the morning, and winds are predicted to be light. Good luck, and have fun, salmon are a month away!

B.T.W., Labs, are you a fowler?

ratherwhalering posted 03-12-2004 12:51 PM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
Nick, I couldn't agree more. I'm going to play with the height this weekend and try to find the optimum range. I think it is set a little high right now, and that may account for loss of speed at the top end. I'll be looking for that SS prop soon enough.

Peter: minimum idle, in forward gear, is very smooth. The vibrations seem to happen between 900 and 1200 RPM. The rest of the range is smooth and quiet. I don't know why this is, but Mike reports the same thing. I think you might be right on the stratified fuel charge because this is the range where it begins.


Thanks for the help, and compliments, Mike. It was nice to have your ear during my prolonged wait for this engine, especially knowing what to expect when the engine arrived. I did have my install inspected by a dealer, and he reprogrammed the engine for the XD100 oil. It cost an extra $180.00 but he did a nice job, and found some stuff that needed attention.


Jim: the balance was very good, and the easiest part of the whole day was removing the engine from the box and setting it on the transom. I am really impressed with the attention to detail, for example, the lifting eye was even plastic coated to prevent scratches.

ratherwhalering posted 03-12-2004 12:58 PM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
ST: Thanks, it doesn't require dealer programming, I just wanted someone to look at the install, turn every nut and double check everything. I did have it reprogrammed, however, to take the synthetic oil. I'm sailing this weekend, so I probably won't see you out on the water, but I hope you hammer those sturgeon!
Bigshot posted 03-12-2004 01:08 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Too High? No way....mine is about 3" higher than yours. You need a better prop and go up another bolt hole or 2. If you are always running in rough seas, leave it alone. Mine rarely goes offshore, I have other boats for that so she can be run real high. In trailing seas she blows out a tad.
Bigshot posted 03-12-2004 01:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Ps I think Mercury is the only company that does not have lifting eyes from the factory.
Peter posted 03-12-2004 02:46 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
I was riding the train home today and passed by what I think is a 175 Scout with an all white 90 E-TEC on the back sitting on a trailer. On appearances alone, the E-TEC looked like a perfect match. If these things perform as good as they look, Bombardier is going to own this niche of the market.
ratherwhalering posted 03-15-2004 02:13 PM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
I’m happy to report that I spent the whole weekend, more or less, out on the boat, testing the new rig. For those interested, I have some additional daytime photos that really show how the boat looks with the engine mounted. Note that the splash well drains are out of the water (photo three) even with engine tilted down. There are also some photos of the boat on the trailer, and of the anti-cavitation plate/transom location. Any comments or tips regarding the installation, propeller selection, and engine height are appreciated.

Water: front view

Water: side view

Water: stern view

Trailer: trimmed level

Trailer: tilted up

Trailer: full down trim

I had some difficulty with fuel delivery, and decided to remove the Raycor fuel filter from the console, and will be relocating it to the stern. In addition, I will also be moving the steering link arm to the aft most position. The engine ran great all weekend, although I really cannot bring myself to run it “full speed right out of the box”. Call me chicken, but I just can’t do it. Anyway, I am very pleased with the lack of smoke, and quiet operation. Shifting is smooth. Neutral idle (warm) is around 600/700 rpm. In gear idle is around 900.

Salmon Tub posted 03-15-2004 02:16 PM ET (US)     Profile for Salmon Tub  Send Email to Salmon Tub     
Hey Rob, 1 shaker sturgy, 4 stripers (kept 2), and 1 12" Bar Perch (go figure) up in San Pablo. Flat calm. Opening day on the Bay isn't for a little while, so drop the sails and go stick some fish! Oh, and to keep this pertinent to the thread, please tell us how that motor handles when anchored ;). Don't worry that chocolate milk water won't stain the finish! Good tides through Friday. Have fun.
george nagy posted 03-15-2004 05:22 PM ET (US)     Profile for george nagy  Send Email to george nagy     
Great job, boat looks great!

I think that the prop may have some difflection at higher speeds due to how the paint on the prop flaked off like that.

ratherwhalering posted 03-15-2004 05:53 PM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
Good job Salmon Tub...I'll be getting out there soon enough, but for now, its pleasure cruising and sailing, with maybe a crabbing trip thrown in.

George, I'm considering which stainless steel propeller, but I'm still trying to nail down all the variables. The hub of my current 13.25 x 17" aluminum Michigan propeller is apparently a tad too small, and the Evinrude technicians sugguested a SST (swept) 13 7/8 x 17.

jimh posted 03-15-2004 08:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
[Helped with hyperlinks]
jimh posted 03-15-2004 08:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
Re your comment " I will also be moving the steering link arm to the aft most position".

I interpret this to mean you will move the point of attachment of the drag link to the tiller extension to a point closer to the engine.

I am just curious why you are doing this, as it would seem like this would increase both the amount of force needed and the number of turns from the steering wheel.

John from IL posted 03-15-2004 08:41 PM ET (US)     Profile for John from IL  Send Email to John from IL     
Actually, on that steering arm, the outer most attach point is intended for power (hydraulic) steering attachment, the center attach point is for a tie bar hook up in dual engine installations and the aft most point is for the drag link used in cable steer systems.

I believe you'll find the letters P, T and D stamped into the arm accordingly. If (as in this case) the drag link is installed in either the middle or outer hole (which changes the steering geometry), there will not be full steering travel in one direction.

Hope this helps.

-John

newportguy posted 03-16-2004 11:28 AM ET (US)     Profile for newportguy  Send Email to newportguy     
Ratherwhalering,

With the set back bracket that you have, it appears that it is a power lift model. If I understand correctly this should be the perfect setup....as you can adjust height while under power. This should provide the optimum engine height / speed setup. It will be very interesting to see what happens when you get a chance to put a SST prop on this rig. Great looking rig.

Larry

ratherwhalering posted 03-16-2004 11:45 AM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
John is right on...the steering link is in the wrong position. In addition, I have the NFB steering, so I'm not so worried about the increased ratio. Right now the boat is hard to manuver because I am not getting the optimum engine turn radius, and will gladly sacrafice an increased amount of force and turns for manuverability when docking. The model powerlift I bought manual, and must be done at the dock or on the hard. I'm working with Sal right now to select a stainless steel propeller, and once I find the optimum height, I hope to see 43mph on the top end. I have noticed that aluminum prop is losing more and more paint around the hub, which Nick and George have pointed out is probably due to the aluminum flex.
SS17 posted 03-17-2004 06:47 PM ET (US)     Profile for SS17    
Nice rig. A SS prop is definately what it needs. An 18 raker would make it fly. Maybe find one on Ebay? I've got a couple of used I need to get rid of, but they are V-6 props. The large rake will give a lot of bow lift and hold with the jack plate set high.

Good to see an Etec. I hope they turn out to be rock reliable.

jimh posted 03-17-2004 09:03 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
I had my physics wrong in my comment above. Moving inward the point of attachment of the steering mechanism to the engine tiller has the effect of increasing the force but reducing the distance.

What confuses me is the comment that the outermost point of attachment is for hydraulic or "power" steering devices. This point would seem to me to have the most leverage and thus need the least force. It would also require the most travel in the steering link.

If an hydraulic steering system has the most force available, it seems like that force should be applied through a shorter lever arm. That would be the one closest to the pivot post, and thus closest to the engine.

Am I wrong?

Salmon Tub posted 03-18-2004 11:04 AM ET (US)     Profile for Salmon Tub  Send Email to Salmon Tub     
Jimh, I have not seen hydraulic systems up close, but they may require greater clearance to accomodate their bulk/size?
Vek posted 03-19-2004 03:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for Vek  Send Email to Vek     
In response to Jim's musing about hydraulic steering attaching to the longest lever arm - that idea being strange...

I agree with that gut feeling, but...

Not knowing offhand what pressure ratings are available for economically available hydraulic hoses...the distance a given hydraulic cylinder can actuate something is proportional to fluid volume change in the cylinder, and the force with which it can actuate is proportional to pressure. Consider:

1. Hoses and helm pumps can only handle so much pressure without being pricy (say, 1500 psig for the sake of the discussion)

2. Cylinder diameter limited to whatever it is - larger ram won't allow motor tilt or whatever

3. This leads to using the long lever arm used (less actuation force required = helm pump and line pressure less than 1500 psig), with subsequent long cylinder travel and larger volume of fluid being pumped.

But, this is merely one scenario with the pressure rating of the hardware limiting the design...

Post New Topic  Post Reply
Hop to:


Contact Us | RETURN to ContinuousWave Top Page

Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board, Freeware Version 2000
Purchase our Licensed Version- which adds many more features!
© Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998 - 2000.