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  Brand Preference 90-HP Two-stroke Outboard

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Author Topic:   Brand Preference 90-HP Two-stroke Outboard
DeepSouthWhaler posted 06-22-2004 01:19 PM ET (US)   Profile for DeepSouthWhaler  
I am thinking about repowering my 1986 Montauk. The options have been narrowed down to a 90-HP Mercury 2-stroke or a 90-HP Yamaha 2-stroke. The price difference is minimal. I am also expecting the performance between the two engines to be about the same. My primary concern is the reliability and longevity. I am just looking for any feedback regarding this topic. I would like to stick with an American made product but still want the best.

Also any SS prop recommendations for these engines?

Hoosier posted 06-22-2004 01:34 PM ET (US)     Profile for Hoosier  Send Email to Hoosier     
I'd look at the new Evinrude 90 HP E-TEC.
DeepSouthWhaler posted 06-22-2004 01:56 PM ET (US)     Profile for DeepSouthWhaler    
What is the estimated cost of the E-TEC?
Peter posted 06-22-2004 02:21 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
In the cheap 2-stroke 90 HP category: Yamaha 90 displaces 70 cubic inches, Mercury 90 displaces 85 cubic inches and the Johnson 90 displaces 105 cubic inches. All of these motors are good and substantially the same price so why not get the one that gives you the most displacement for the money? Basically, the Johnson 90 is a detuned 115.

The E-Tec 90 goes for about $1,500 more than the 2-stroke carburetor 90's.

mark11 posted 06-22-2004 02:25 PM ET (US)     Profile for mark11  Send Email to mark11     
Just checked Ed's. 90HP Merc and Yamaha are listed at $4,999
The e-tec is listed at $6499. Which one will work with your existing controls? I'd lean that way. Mark
Bigshot posted 06-22-2004 02:25 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Performance is not the same. Yamaha is about 80hp and does about 41mph. The Merc will do a tad faster and the Johnson(cheapest) will run upwards of 45mph but burn the most fuel. Personally I have run all 3 and chose a 70hp Suzuki/Johnson 4 stroke which runs about 39mph but only burns 2.5gph at cruise(about 1/2 of the Merc.
LHG posted 06-22-2004 02:41 PM ET (US)     Profile for LHG    
Look at alternator output also. Yamaha is 10 amps, Mercury is 18 amps. Don't know about the Johnson.

Upside for Merc and Yamaha is integral oil injection tank, making a clean installation. Johnson needs a remote tank, a space problem with a Montauk.

Mercury engineer has told me the 90 puts out more like 98 HP, which is why it is faster than Mercury's true 90 4-stroke and Optimax models.

Peter posted 06-22-2004 06:27 PM ET (US)     Profile for Peter  Send Email to Peter     
The maximum alternator output of the Johnson is 20 amps. Although I don't think I wouldn't put it there, the smaller remote oil tank is not really a space problem as it can be put in the console for a cleaner transom area. I've seen this done by Whaler dealers and it works.

If you water ski with the Montauk, the additional torque from the extra displacement on the Johnson would make it the best choice by far. I've been on a Montauk with one of these and the acceleration was amazing.

15whalerSSL posted 06-22-2004 10:38 PM ET (US)     Profile for 15whalerSSL  Send Email to 15whalerSSL     
I was asking the same question about my 15 with a 90-HP. I picked the Yamaha. It is a very light weight engine. The only problem is it lacks performance just a bit, but on a MONTAUK 17 it would do just fine. I do not regret my choice. Go listen to a mercury run, listen to a Yamaha run, and then you will make up your mind. Also I own a 225 mercury, I am very happy, but the Yamaha fit better for that size. T
Dick posted 06-22-2004 10:48 PM ET (US)     Profile for Dick  Send Email to Dick     
All of the motors suggested are a good option. The main thing to consider is which one can you get the best service on if you need it.

Dick

Tom W Clark posted 06-22-2004 11:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for Tom W Clark  Send Email to Tom W Clark     
DeepSouthWhaler,

Of the two choices you are considering, I would recommend the Mercury because it is a larger and more powerful motor regardless of what the labels say.

But I would go on to say that you do better to buy the Johnson 90 as it is no more money and larger and more powerful still. It will run circles around the competition. It is also a motor that has been around for a very long time and is well established as one of the most reliable motors of all time. About as close to a zero maintenance motor as you will get unless you buy the new Evinrude E-Tec 90.

Fuel economy in a Montauk? Who cares?

DeepSouthWhaler posted 06-23-2004 09:53 AM ET (US)     Profile for DeepSouthWhaler    
Thanks Tom. I will consider a Johnson. Where do you recommend putting the remote oil tank. Also, is the oil injection system reliable on these new motors?
jimh posted 06-23-2004 10:55 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
What auditory cues are used to determine a superior engine? Perhaps 15whalerSSL, who suggested a listening test, could elaborate.
hooter posted 06-23-2004 11:24 AM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Ah've always liked the sound of the 2-cycle Johnson 90, havin' owned five of them over the years, bought both new and used. Mah current one is on a Montauk hull bought in 1995, both vintage 1985, and both are still doin' weekly, if not daily service around the camp. The only way to kill that motor is via neglect.

As to "where to?", face it, those li'l indentations to either side o' the Montauk splash well are damn near useless as deck space to begin with. Ah've owned three Johnson-powered Montauks over the years and have always kept a VRO tank to starboard and a battery or two to port back there.

Do what you want, but problem-free ownership and more horsepower or displacement per dollar of purchase price makes sense to some people, them that buy Johnson 90s. If you're not in the boat for fishin' or enjoyment but are rather in it principally to save the planet or some other reason, then go with a four-cycle or some other brand:-!

LHG posted 06-23-2004 12:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for LHG    
And Johnsons are made in the Outboard Capital of the World, the great State of Wisconsin, so if you buy one, even though they are 50% Canadian owned, you're making, rather than exporting, some US jobs!
DeepSouthWhaler posted 06-23-2004 12:43 PM ET (US)     Profile for DeepSouthWhaler    
Just when everyone had me leaning toward the Johnson, my local dealer (the one I called for the Mercury) called me a said he had a great deal on Honda 90 ($6400). Any thoughts on this engine? (this topic may have to be changed again to cover all outboards 2 and 4 stroke)
DeepSouthWhaler posted 06-23-2004 01:04 PM ET (US)     Profile for DeepSouthWhaler    
Never mind on the Honda. I just checked the weight on Honda's website. In my opinion in would be a little too heavy for the boat. I run a dual battery set up in stern and do not want to make modifications. Plus, the additional $1,200 in cost to go to the Honda 4 stroke could be saved.

These are the costs that I received from various dealers down here in New Orleans. All costs include engine, new controls, cables, tach. and speed., ignition switch and harness, and ss prop. All labor is also included. Prices do not include sales tax.

2005 Mercury 90 HP 2s: $6300
2004 Mercury 90 HP 2s: $6100
2004 Yamaha 90 HP 2s: $6500
2004 Johnson 90 HP 2s: $6700
2004 Honda 90 HP 4s: $7600
2004 Suzuki 70 HP 4s: $6650
2004 Evinrude 90HP ETEC 2s: $8200

Bigshot posted 06-23-2004 01:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
I would go with the Merc for price reasons. I can't see how the Yamaha is $1500 for controls, gauge & labor. $1100 on the Merc is still a tad high but not bad. The Johnson SHOULD be cheaper than both. Check here for prices and go from there, decent benchmark:

http://www.edsmarinesuperstore.com/

LHG posted 06-23-2004 01:27 PM ET (US)     Profile for LHG    
I'd recommend you get detailed information on which SS prop they plan to give you. Not all are created, nor priced, equal, by a long shot. If Merc, it should be a Laser II 20" pitch.
hooter posted 06-23-2004 03:24 PM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Blue Dot Marine in N'awlins used to sell more OMC motors than any other dealer in the south and has sold me Johnson motors for about 20 years. They've never failed to make the best deal Ah could find. Have you called them?
hooter posted 06-23-2004 03:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
You also need to start with just the base motor for comparison shopin'. You don't know what parts other than the motor these different sources are quoting you prices for. A "standard" control set can cost you anywhere from $200 to $500, and the rest of the parts you mention can vary just as much. Do some homework and know what you're comparing.
Bigshot posted 06-24-2004 02:04 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Did not read the SS prop...that could explain the price being they can run $400.
jimh posted 06-24-2004 08:06 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
These 90-HP motors are getting expensive, which is the term I use for prices of $8,200 (for the E-TEC™ model). It was not that long ago, about 18-months, that you could walk into Bass Pro Shops and get a Mercury 90-HP two-stroke for $4,400. As Archie Bunker used to sing in the introduction to the television show, All In The Family, "...those were the days."
Bigshot posted 06-25-2004 12:03 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
You still can Jim but the 2005's are like $4750.
rbruce posted 06-26-2004 02:06 PM ET (US)     Profile for rbruce  Send Email to rbruce     
Why have you decided not to overhaul the older motor? What make of motor do you have now?
DeepSouthWhaler posted 06-27-2004 03:07 PM ET (US)     Profile for DeepSouthWhaler    
rbruce:

My current motor is a 1993 90hp Mercury. What would a common rebuilt include? Would you happen to know the estimate cost to rebuilt this engine?

Bigshot posted 06-28-2004 02:04 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Good rebuild about $2500.
lerker posted 06-29-2004 08:03 PM ET (US)     Profile for lerker  Send Email to lerker     
"Good rebuild about $2500."

seems like a no-brainer to me... unless you want to go 4 stroke for emissions (etc.) reasons, just do the rebuild and save your money for your next boat. ;)

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