Forum: WHALER
  ContinuousWave
  Whaler
  Moderated Discussion Areas
  ContinuousWave: Whaler Performance
  Texan Re-powers MONTAUK 17 with HONDA 90--Says Evinrude's "Junk"

Post New Topic  Post Reply
search | FAQ | profile | register | author help

Author Topic:   Texan Re-powers MONTAUK 17 with HONDA 90--Says Evinrude's "Junk"
hbrigiii posted 07-22-2004 03:41 PM ET (US)   Profile for hbrigiii   Send Email to hbrigiii  
Hi, I just bought a beautiful 1997 Montauk with a Evinrude 90. the boat is in incredable condition but the motor is a piece of junk. I am going to repower with a Honda 90 and I would like to hear from anybody who has expreience with this combination. Specifically, what prop do you run, what is your average fuel mileage and if you have had any problems with thie combination. Many thanks, Henry Brigham
Legobusier posted 07-22-2004 04:02 PM ET (US)     Profile for Legobusier  Send Email to Legobusier     
Henry,

First of all, welcome to the forum. I have this combo and I love it. It's been a often discussed topic and if you do a search, you'll find more than a couple of posts regarding exactly that. Some people think the Honda's too heavy. I disagree.

Good luck and let me know if you have any questions once you read the old posts.

Chris

LHG posted 07-22-2004 06:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for LHG    
Most here think the OMC 90's are fine motors, and like them.

Please define why you think it's a piece of junk. Is it simply badly corroded, beat up and worn out, or is there something else about it you don't like. I can tell you one thing, the Honda 90 won't be as fast, both in top speed or acceleration.

hbrigiii posted 07-22-2004 10:07 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
LHG, this engine has low hours and actually, runs just fine but my past experience with an Evenrude in 1990 on a 17ft Kenner was that it fouled plugs, loades up the carbs, and left me stranded more than a few times. This engine while of low hours, is pretty well rusted on the frame and lower end. Actually, it might just be that I am talking myself into a Honda even if I really dont need one. The Honda dealer has a left over 2002 90hp that he will swap out installed all up for $6000. Since I only paid $11500. for the Whaler with the Evenrude, it looks like I am still in pretty good shape but I must admit that I am having strong doubls about spending the extea $6000. Thats why I am asking for your advise. Many Thanks, Henry
LHG posted 07-23-2004 03:40 PM ET (US)     Profile for LHG    
Deosn't a brand new 2004 Merury or Yamaha 90 4 stroke (basically the same engine) only cost about $6700? Your Honda deal doesn't sound too hot to me. Actually, for a 2002 left-over, it sounds downright bad. If you are determined to get rid of the Evinrude, I'd shop around a bit, and look at all the brands.

Not being real familiar with Evinrudes, I do think that the 1990 engine was the older 90 degree V style, vs your newer 60 degree v model, which I hear is a superior engine. You might clean up the appearance and see how you like it first.

I would think that engine, mid section and lower unit refinished, would be worth about $2500-$3000.

hbrigiii posted 07-23-2004 08:22 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Lhg, these are the prices that I have been quoted. All without any trade-in since the only dealer who will take a trade is the Honda dealer. Yamahs, 90hp 4 stroke ( 2003 ) installed for $7406. 2stroke (2004 ) $6913. Both installed but plus TT&L. Mercury 90hp 4 stroke $8000 plus $1000 installation. Mercury 90hp 2 stroke $6000 plus $1000. installation. Honda 90hp ( 2002) $6000 including installation, out the door... The 2002 engines are the same as the 2004 and have as new warranty. I dont see how I can beat the deal. As a matter of fact, after putting the boat in the watter this afternoon and going through all the smoking, coughing, running on 3 cylinders and then crapping out completely, I finally got it back on the trailer and just dropped it off at the Honda guy and told him to swap it out. At my age 69, I really dont have the patience or time to be screwing around with some pos outboard that I dont trust. I am glad that you are happy with yours but I am not with mine. I will let you know how it works out next week. Henry
hbrigiii posted 07-23-2004 08:24 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Lhg, these are the prices that I have been quoted. All without any trade-in since the only dealer who will take a trade is the Honda dealer. Yamahs, 90hp 4 stroke ( 2003 ) installed for $7406. 2stroke (2004 ) $6913. Both installed but plus TT&L. Mercury 90hp 4 stroke $8000 plus $1000 installation. Mercury 90hp 2 stroke $6000 plus $1000. installation. Honda 90hp ( 2002) $6000 including installation, out the door... The 2002 engines are the same as the 2004 and have as new warranty. I dont see how I can beat the deal. As a matter of fact, after putting the boat in the watter this afternoon and going through all the smoking, coughing, running on 3 cylinders and then crapping out completely, I finally got it back on the trailer and just dropped it off at the Honda guy and told him to swap it out. At my age 69, I really dont have the patience or time to be screwing around with some pos outboard that I dont trust. I am glad that you are happy with yours but I am not with mine. I will let you know how it works out next week. Henry
elaelap posted 07-23-2004 11:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for elaelap  Send Email to elaelap     
Welcome and go for it, Henry. Once you've used a four stroke you'll never go back, promise. And at almost 60 years of age myself, I totally agree with your philosophy...why wait?! $6000 new with warranty is a very good price for that motor, no matter what 'year.'

Tony ('88 Outrage 18/Yamaha 115 4/s)

Watch out you don't pull your boat up the ramp with the motor still on; you wouldn't be the first, 'cause those four strokers are so, so quiet at idle and trolling speeds you won't even hear your motor.

Perry posted 07-24-2004 01:37 AM ET (US)     Profile for Perry  Send Email to Perry     
Henry, I bought a left over 2002 Honda 90 in 2003 and have really enjoyed it over the last yaer and a half. I think a 13.25 X 17 propeller would be a good place to start. Talk to the guy doing the installation and ask him to place the motor one hole up on the transom or make sure the anti-ventilation plate is at least 3/4" above the bottom of the hull.
AQUANUT posted 07-24-2004 07:38 AM ET (US)     Profile for AQUANUT  Send Email to AQUANUT     
man o man..1000 bucks to do an engine swap...ouch.
is that only the labor involved...it has to be more that labor....perhaps new throttle/shift cables...new control box...and the kitchen sink included right?...check my profile..good luck

AQUANUT OUT!

AQUANUT posted 07-24-2004 07:39 AM ET (US)     Profile for AQUANUT  Send Email to AQUANUT     
man o man..1000 bucks to do an engine swap...ouch.
is that only the labor involved...it has to be more that labor....perhaps new throttle/shift cables...new control box...and the kitchen sink included right?...check my profile..good luck

AQUANUT OUT!

hbrigiii posted 07-24-2004 11:31 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Thanks for the welcome guys. Nice forum !!! The price of $6000. inc. trade of my old Evenrude includes Honda shifter set up and cables, fuel filter, new Honda gauges and incidental wireing. Thanks for prop size advice and 2nd hole installation advice. I'll keep you posted, Henry
jimh posted 07-25-2004 08:40 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
From the pricing being quoted I thought Henry was in Canada, so I checked his profile: he's from Texas. Now this has me worried. If people in Texas are buying Honda motors in preference to Mercury or Evinrude/Johnson, the domestic outboard manufacturing business is in trouble!
Rick Dewees posted 07-25-2004 09:50 AM ET (US)     Profile for Rick Dewees  Send Email to Rick Dewees     
Jimh,

In Mr. hbrigiii's profile, also note that he is a retired Honda car dealer. It sounded to me like he may have had his mind made up from the start.

hbrigiii posted 07-25-2004 12:37 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Being a Honda dealer for 25 yrs. does make me lean toward them but I have had Yamahas on boats as well and they were great engines. I got bids from all the local dealers and frankly, was surprised when the Honda dealer offered the best deal. Not being one to look a gift horse in the exhaust pipe, that's the way I went.
DaveNJ posted 07-26-2004 12:31 PM ET (US)     Profile for DaveNJ  Send Email to DaveNJ     
Henry -
Congrats on the new motor. Sounds like you made an educated decision. Good luck with it and have fun.

Please report back on how you like the motor, your experiences, etc.

Dave

Bad Andy posted 07-26-2004 01:15 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bad Andy  Send Email to Bad Andy     
I am in the process of repowering my 1993 Montauk with a Honda 90 as well. My dealer is recommending a 13X19. I see other suggestions for a 13.25 X 17 all over the web.

I would like more opinions on this so I don't end up with two props right off the bat. I know I should have a back up and will, but enough is enough for right now.

The applications will be 70% trolling, 20% cruising and 10% water skiing. Any advice is greatly appreciated.

Andy

Bigshot posted 07-26-2004 02:18 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Not a bad price Henry but that includes your trade right? If so not a good price at all. I am glad I don't live near you because your dealers are priced about as high as Alaskan dealers. Your 1992 Rude is worth $2500 or so, especially with controls, prop, gauges, etc and being it sounds like she only needed a carb cleaning, that dealer is gonna come out smelling better than 2 stroke in the morning. I run a 4 stroke Evinrude and can't blame ya for going that route but having $18k in a 12 year old boat...Why did'nt ya spend $21k on a new one?
SS17 posted 07-26-2004 04:16 PM ET (US)     Profile for SS17    
Bad Andy,

I have a 17 SSL with a 2002 Honda 90. I have a slightly nicked up 17" stainless prop that I turn at 6150 wot @ 39-40 mph gps. My supersport limited weighs a little more than a Montauk, so a 19" prop may be a good set up.

However, I am happy with the performance of the 17" prop, and like the quick accelaration and mid-range. If you plan on using the boat in rough weather at the slowest possible speeds, and/or with heavy loads, I'd prop the boat with a 17" prop.

I can plane at approximately 12 mph, and would suspect that I would not be able to do this with a larger prop.

Also, I am surprised at how high you can mount the motor. I have mine 2 holes up, and from pics of Legobusiers Montauk, at appears his is 3 holes up. Initially mine was mounted all the way down and handled poorly as a result, as well as causing the lower unit of the motor to touch the water while moored.

JohnJ80 posted 07-26-2004 07:29 PM ET (US)     Profile for JohnJ80  Send Email to JohnJ80     
I would talk this over with Chuck Bennett at Whaler. For non current models, they have compiled quite a list of boats and motor combinations that work and don't work.

For example, when repowering my Dauntless 15, they had noted problems with a Honda 70 (370Lb), ok with a Merc 75 (305 lbs) and a couple of others. The weight is not the only thing that is important, so is where the motor carries the weight.

So, I don't know if this is a great deal or not - but I would check with whaler just to add to my personal database.

The next thing to watch for is the proper mounting of this motor. Check through this forum on motor height and porpoising to see what others have found. My bet is that this Honda dealer will mount that motor way to low on the transom and cause yet another problem (the all do this, it seems). Dealers favor mounting low for some reason. On a whaler, the mounting height makes a huge difference - you might not recognize the boat from one setting to another.

Most people seem to report the best performance and ride when the AV plate is 1-1.5" over the bottom of the hull. Make note of where the current motor is mounted, take her out and drive her noting in different speed ranges how well she handles and ride characteristics. If it is sweet, then try to duplicate this setting with the new motor.

If your current motor is mounted all the way down, then it is too low for starters.

J

jimh posted 07-26-2004 08:13 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
[Changed TOPIC; was "Repower with Honda 90." I was going to make it "Former Texas Honda Dealer re-powers MONTAUK 17 with Honda 90--Says Evinrude's "Junk", but that would have been too long.]
Bad Andy posted 07-26-2004 08:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bad Andy  Send Email to Bad Andy     
I was able to speak to Chuck about this combination before the purchase. Boston Whaler verified this combination will work out well.

Great points and interesting information about the mounting height. I will have to see how/where they are mounting it. Thank You!

daverdla posted 07-26-2004 09:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for daverdla  Send Email to daverdla     
My 89 montauk has a 1992 evinrude 100. Runs like a top. Maybe your motor only needed a carb cleaning as bigshot explained. Sounds like, with the trade in, you paid 8500 for a 2002 left over. 2002 left over sounds pretty long in the tooth. Are you sure it isn't a used motor? Perhaps it's not too late to call the dealer and try to renegotiate. I'm sure you'll be happy however with the honda.
BTW - I like the smell of the 2 strokes. Reminds me of Bermuda!
Dave
hbrigiii posted 07-26-2004 11:45 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Hey,jimh, cut me some slack. I didnt say that all Evenrudes were junk. ( I didnt say that any of them were for that matter ) I just have not had a good experience with the ones that I have had and feel that it is best to install an engine that I will trust. I dont relish the thought of getting stranded 5 mi off shore with an engine that crapped out at the wrong moment. If I want to repower my boat with a new engine, what is the problem.There is only one really good Honda O.B. dealer within 50 miles and I dont feel like whipping my ass all over the highway just to try to save a few bucks. The bids I got from other brand dealers were higher than the Honda guy so why not go that route. Anyway, I will have to live with this dealer for a long time so why piss him off by trying to chisel him down to the last nickel.I found in business years ago that if both parties were happy, than its a good deal. Service and warranty go a lot smoother that way also. I dont understand all the guff about what a rotten deal I have. I am happy with the boat and will be also with the new engine. If I am happy then I should expect everybody else to be happy also. Yours, Henry
hbrigiii posted 07-26-2004 11:47 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Hey,jimh, cut me some slack. I didnt say that all Evenrudes were junk. ( I didnt say that any of them were for that matter ) I just have not had a good experience with the ones that I have had and feel that it is best to install an engine that I will trust. I dont relish the thought of getting stranded 5 mi off shore with an engine that crapped out at the wrong moment. If I want to repower my boat with a new engine, what is the problem.There is only one really good Honda O.B. dealer within 50 miles and I dont feel like whipping my ass all over the highway just to try to save a few bucks. The bids I got from other brand dealers were higher than the Honda guy so why not go that route. Anyway, I will have to live with this dealer for a long time so why piss him off by trying to chisel him down to the last nickel.I found in business years ago that if both parties were happy, than its a good deal. Service and warranty go a lot smoother that way also. I dont understand all the guff about what a rotten deal I have. I am happy with the boat and will be also with the new engine. If I am happy then I should expect everybody else to be happy also. Yours, Henry
Tom2697 posted 07-27-2004 01:44 AM ET (US)     Profile for Tom2697  Send Email to Tom2697     
Henry,
I too replaced my "junk" Evinrude with a Japanese motor. I also live in Texas.
What many people fail to realize is that our "junk" motors didn't run well when we replaced them or just were in bad shape from corrosion. In fact, mine was completely seized after being run (and run hard at that) for an estimated 2000+ hours. I replaced it with a Japanese motor since 3 out of my 5 local dealers carry Suzuki with the other two carrying a combination of Yamahas, Hondas, and Johnsons. I may have paid more for my motor than others have around the country but I still got it installed for $500 less than any comparable motor...unless I wanted to tow my boat 100 miles each way to a more competitive market.
Enjoy YOUR motor!
Tom
SS17 posted 07-27-2004 09:15 AM ET (US)     Profile for SS17    
I don't get the problem with buying a Honda. If you buy a 4 stroke Johnson, you are buying a Suzuki, if you buy a 4 stroke Mercury, it is a Yamaha powerhead. How do you buy a mid-sized american made outboard? Come to think of it, Bombardier Recreation isn't even 'merican owned anyway.
Florida15 posted 07-27-2004 09:42 AM ET (US)     Profile for Florida15    
Bigshot echoed my thoughts exactly. Why not just buy a new boat ?
BUT, it's H.B.'s money and if he's happy, that's what matters.
hooter posted 07-27-2004 03:08 PM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Henry, Ah hate to hear about another guy gettin' stuck with a crappy piece o' junk Evinrude. Ah got bid'ness in Houston later this week and as a favor to you can be by your place next Saturday mornin', if you're lookin' to sell that old piece o' junk motor for cash money. Forget that friggin' horse-thief, shark-skinned dealer you talkin' to. Mah tools, mah labor and mah pick'em-up truck and lift, plus $500 to you for the heartache o' havin' to own that embarassin' piece o' junk for even a li'l while, why, that ought to do it, eh? Thaz to include the wirin' harness, cables and controls, none o' which is worth a damn on that shiney new Honda. You keep the guages, as they might woik, or Ah'll take 'em if you want t'be rid of 'em. Compared to that dealer, thaz at least a fair offer. Lemme know, right here:-!
jimh posted 07-27-2004 08:00 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
I guess I have a soft spot in my heart for Evinrude motors, perhaps from knowing that old Ole Evinrude invented the outboard, and seeing his family still cruising around Lake Huron every summer on their nice motor yacht CHANTICLEER. That V-4 90-HP is just about the perfect motor for a Montauk, at least as far as a 2-stroke engines with carburetors.

They're built by some nice fellas up in Wisconsin, some bachelor Norwegian boys off the farm, probably drive to work in Chevy pick up trucks, come in each morning, have a cup of coffee, and get to work making outboards. Each of them wearing their own clothes, and no calisthenics and inspirational message before the whistle blows, either. Too bad that Mr. Soros fellow ran the whole Outboard Marine Company into the toilet. I see now he's taken up global politics and giving advice to President Bush on how to run the country.

This is where I really get confused, because people keep saying it is President Bush who has made all those manufacturing jobs go away, yet folks--in Texas of all places--are buying outboards and cars made overseas instead of ones made in the United States.

Now, Henry, if you do sell that old piece of junk to Hooter, please take his picture and send it to me via email--I have been just waiting for a chance like this!

Legobusier posted 07-27-2004 09:14 PM ET (US)     Profile for Legobusier  Send Email to Legobusier     
quote:
Now, Henry, if you do sell that old piece of junk to Hooter, please take his picture and send it to me via email--I have been just waiting for a chance like this!

Heh...you know....no offense Hooter, but I sometimes have to wonder if I'm the only one who's figured out your true identity - www.earlpitts.com/

:)

Legobusier posted 07-27-2004 09:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for Legobusier  Send Email to Legobusier     
If you guys have never heard this guy, he's pretty funny. Talks like Hooter writes - look up local radio stations for your area.

Chris

hbrigiii posted 07-27-2004 09:32 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Hi, Hooter. I went by the Honda dealer and took a look at my old engine now mounted on a 2x6 along with a long row of dead Evenrude and Johnsons in the dealers back yard. They had pulled the heads and it shows signs of a serious broken ring problem . One piston on each bank. The engine is down here in Rockport. About 190mi South of Houston. I wouldnt waste the gas if I were you. How ever you want to calculate the final out the door price om my new engine of a flat $6000. that included tradeing in the bones of my Evenrude. I ended up with a discount off of retail of about $3500. Plus whatever you want to figure for installation. The dealer ended up with another frozen turkey in his back yard and I am out the door with a new 4 stroke engine. I dont know how some of you guys do busuness but thats my kind of deal. I will keep you posted as to how it runs. Thanks to all you guys who offered tips on mounting and prop size. 13.25X17 was exactly where the dealer was going to start his in the water tests. That includes a SS prop of course. Later, Henry
DaveNJ posted 07-28-2004 07:15 AM ET (US)     Profile for DaveNJ  Send Email to DaveNJ     
Henry -
I am not sure why everyone piled on you for your Honda purchase, but I sure have enjoyed your responses.

Have fun with the new motor!

Dave

jimh posted 07-28-2004 09:24 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
Dave and Henry--I apologize if it seems like there was "piling on" here. I was just astonished at the notion that folks down in Texas were joining the rest of American consumers and giving old American brands like Evinrude the heave-ho in favor of products built in Asia. I guess I have become accustomed to hearing of such things in California and Massachusetts, but not in Texas. It was an awakening. Boy, when Toyota opens that pickup truck plant they're building in Texas, look out Ford and GM.

I am sure Honda makes a fine motor. You just can't find anyone selling them up here in SE Michigan, so we don't see too many of them around these waters.

Using that "junk" label on Evinrude did not set well with me, and apparently with a few other mid-westerners. We still make outboards around these parts. Those boys over in Wisconsin are hard at work making Mercury and Bombardier motors. I guess it would be similar to me saying something bad about Texas beef cattle and how I now only eat stuff flown in from Tokyo. Something like "Got me some new Kobi beef steak to replace that West Texas rat meat," or something like that.

And the way Henry started issuing disclaimers about what he said had me thinking I was watching a spin-doctor working for Teresa Heinz Kerry. It was almost "un-American."

That poor Evinrude has been through the ringer. One minute it was a piece of junk, next it had low hours and runs just fine, then suddenly it's sitting out in the back with broken rings.

I think we gotta send our man Hooter down there to find out what the hell is going on in Texas. I am starting to wonder. I never met no Texan named Henry--they've always been Hank's.

Hooter--Get on this case and let us know.

AQUANUT posted 07-28-2004 09:33 AM ET (US)     Profile for AQUANUT  Send Email to AQUANUT     
STOP IT ...i CAN'T TAKE IT ANYMORE...lmao
Rick Dewees posted 07-28-2004 10:32 AM ET (US)     Profile for Rick Dewees  Send Email to Rick Dewees     
Jimh,

I'm pretty sure that Henry...uh, Hank wasn't speaking for everyone in Texas. Some of us are still here.

Rick

hooter posted 07-28-2004 10:58 AM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Like the Boss, Ah's more'n a bit confused. Based on what Hank toll' us in his openin' posts 1) 'bout that boat bein' "beautiful... in incredible condition" and 2) 'bout how "this engine has low hours and actually, runs just fine", Ah made mah gen'amanly offer to drive down the Texas coast this week with utter confidence. Now Hank tells us his old Evinrude has gone headless with busted rings. B’lievin’ Hank to be a honest feller and smart, too, it WAS all too much f' me.

For a li’l while, it was. But now, Ah smell a rat, a big, fat TEXAS rat, and it ain't Hank or no damn cow. It's that shark-skinned boat dealer! Hank, you's been HAD, man. That couldn't poss'bly o' been your motor up on those horses. YOUR motor was in the back o' the shop gettin' prettied up to slap on the back o' that dealer's PERS'nal fishin’ boat! Ah've drove sev'ral OMC 90 h.p. motors into the beyond, one ol’ Johnson after 20 years o’ reg'lar duty on the back o’ mah old workhorse Whaler 16' hull. That dealer's grandkids'll still be purrin' that ole piece o' junk Evinrude o’ yours around Aransas Pass after they's done screwed you AND me into the ground, bless our souls.

Ser’ously, now, Ah do b’lieve your Honda outboard will make you happy. Ever’ person Ah know that owns one likes it. Even Honda’s 2-stroke outboards are quiet, and the sev’ral Honda 4-strokes Ah’ve encountered don’t even register as runnin’ on mah ol’ rock ‘n roll busted ear drums.

Unlike most fellers that went to the Pacific front, now 60 years ago, Ah don’t hold no grudge again’ today’s Japanese. Those Hondas are built by the grandkids and great grands o’ those sumbitches caused all the trouble back then. They’s hardly any o’ that gen’ration left to dislike, even if you is so inclined. And it's a world market, anymore, anyway. So our mid-western Norwegian-Americans gots to slug it out in the marketplace along with ever'body else.

As to mah cash money offer, Hank, it sounds as though you’s already done the deed. SO no photographs, this time, Ah’m afraid. Bein’ a generous sort, Ah’m actually happy for that sharp dealer’s grandkids and your’s, too, f‘ that matter. Odds are they’ll eventually all inherit fine runnin’ piece-o’-junk outboards.

And those Norwegian bachelor farmers in the outboard plants up north, Ah reckon they’ll do just fine without the support of a few Texans. There’ll always be enough o’ the rest of us t’ keep the plants hummin’ up there, don'tcha think?:-!

TexasWhaler posted 07-28-2004 11:00 AM ET (US)     Profile for TexasWhaler  Send Email to TexasWhaler     
jimh, LHG, help me out here.

I am a Texan and run a 1986 good old salty dog Johnson every weekend. I love the darn thing.

What's with all the 4 stroke hype???
A few years back, when all 2 strokes were carbed or had early versions of fuel injection, I could see how the cleaner running 4 strokes were a good option.

But now, with 2 stroke DFI systems like Evinrude's E-Tech, that actually run cleaner than 4 strokes and with the great torque and acceleration of 2 strokes, what's the big advantage?

The ONLY advantage a 4 stroke has these days over a DFI 2 stroke is that they idle quieter. Howvever they are, according to numerous tests I've read, louder at wide open throttle.

And there's the weight issue also. Those Montauks have the perfect static trim with motors that weigh 300 lbs or less. More than that, and the splash well is always underwater. With motors that weigh 365 or more, be careful when coming off plane too fast, or you get a complimentary wave splashing over the transom.

hooter posted 07-28-2004 11:15 AM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Tex, that reminds me ' one big advantage of those heavy 4-stroke motors on the back of any Classic Whaler. They make a fat wife look good and especially useful up in the bow o' your boat for evenin' out your Montauk's static trim:-!
SS17 posted 07-28-2004 11:32 AM ET (US)     Profile for SS17    
Huh? Two stroke Honda? Never seen one of those. Even the little Hondas are 4 stroke, always have been, afaik.
Bigshot posted 07-28-2004 11:32 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Texas Whaler....This is not a thread debating the merits of 2 strokes or 4 strokes...it is about the BS a dealer slings it's customers and how stories change.

Now "most" dealers give about $500 off for ANY engine they take on trade because of the parts and most engines still run good. They may also "swap for labor" etc so you think you are getting a deal and what else are you gonna do with a bum engine....right? If this dealer was to give ANY more than that he would have done a compression test which would have brought forth the downfalls inside those cyl heads. With 2 pistons being bad out of 4 she would not have run and if she did(being the workhorse she is) it would not have gotten that boat on plane...no WAY. Somewhere....somebody....aint tellin da truth! Now if that "good ol boy" dealer did the old "Hank look at this piston and see how little it moves and then look at this one and see all the play....HOT DAMN you've been had. Play is good, without it you would have scorched cyls and seized rings. Knocking around inside the cyl and deep scores are another thing. Dealers are not stupid and don't "get had" by anyone, you got a decent deal, especialy if engine was bad but you did not start the thread out stating so, you said she was fine which leaves me to believe his kids are driving it around or will be soon as you pick up your boat and pay. New head gaskets, thermos, water pump and slap some paint on it and $2995 here she comes.

Bigshot posted 07-28-2004 11:36 AM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Shoot...all this time I was thinkin 1992....damn that 1997 is a 60 degree Looper which is one BAD ASS engine that has NOTHING in common with the one on your Kenner. Forget the $2995....Hello $3995 being controls, prop, & gauges....damn Hank YOU'VE BEEN HAD SON!
TexasWhaler posted 07-28-2004 11:42 AM ET (US)     Profile for TexasWhaler  Send Email to TexasWhaler     
Hey Bigshot,
I was following up on some posts from LHG and jimh.
LHG said:
"Most here think the OMC 90's are fine motors, and like them.
Please define why you think it's a piece of junk. Is it simply badly corroded, beat up and worn out, or is there something else about it you don't like. I can tell you one thing, the Honda 90 won't be as fast, both in top speed or acceleration."

And of course jimh's post about foreign and domestic motors.

Good job on "policing" though.

Wild Turkey posted 07-28-2004 11:42 AM ET (US)     Profile for Wild Turkey  Send Email to Wild Turkey     
This is not a slam on Henry at all, but how much do you want to bet that this dealer mounted the new Honda motor "all the way down" on the transom?
hooter posted 07-28-2004 11:56 AM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
SS17 is right. Ah'm confusin' Japanese brands. Yamaha's made plenty o' reliable 2-strokes, and their 4-strokes have become the standard on the back of fishin' guides' boats down here. Come to think of it, Ah've only seen Hondas on the back of recreational boats. Wonder why that is?
hbrigiii posted 07-28-2004 12:35 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Hooter, you may be right. Yesterday when I went by the dealer, he was sort of busy and I didnt want to bother him. Seems that I took for granted that the fresh 90hp evenrude half apart hanging with the string of others was mine. Seems that that wasnt and my trade- in is salvageable and will make somebody a usefull motor in the used market. That really doesnt change anything as far as I am concerned. I made the deal monday even though I might have been selling myself with reasons to buy a new Honda and am now searching for reasons to sell the deal to my wife. I think she is convinced but now you guys have got me feeling sorry for myself that I got screwed. Well, stiff upper lip I say, I will just have to go out and enjoy my new toy. ( quietly and with no fuel smell ) Later, Henry
hooter posted 07-28-2004 01:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Here's the ticket t' bring her 'round, Henry. Do what jimh always does with his new boats: soon after purchase and then occasionally thereafter, take your bride for a pleasant evenin' cruise with chilled white wine and table linen aboard. Whist you're tootlin' around the bay, sippin' daintily from the stemware, pernt out to her how quiet your boat is, how little smoke it's makin', how purdy and shiny ever'thing is on it. Better still, f' contrast, axe a bud to be at the marina a half hour ahead of your arrival with spouse, makin' sure this bud has his ol' smoky 2-banger cluckin' and belchin' away sev'ral slips away next to your fine rig where you and wife will have to pass him to get to your boat. It helps if this bud keeps his boat mostly for woikin' crabs or oerster traps and never washes it other than to pour a bucket o' sea water over it all. Fittin' the bill, Ah'd be glad to help in this part of the mission, but you've undoubtedly got someone closer to home in mind. Axe him not to shave for a couple days and be sure to wear a dirty sleeveless undershirt for even better reflection on you and yours.

Hope you enjoy that nice Montauk. We's all had fun at your expense, and you's been a perfect sport. And welcome aboard:-!

Bigshot posted 07-28-2004 01:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
Teexas...not policing just thought you might be better off asking your question on anther thread than this one being it was off topic...sorry did not get the correlation between your reply and others.

Henry...like I said you got a good deal being a current model in FL installed is about $8k. I was just trying to bust on the dealer but I guess it came out the wrong way. Being a 1997 trade....dealer got a better deal but as long as you both are happy...enjoy. Since you did not really even drive this beast to find out if you liked it much I still ask the same question as my first...why not a new rig for a couple grand more?

TexasWhaler posted 07-28-2004 02:47 PM ET (US)     Profile for TexasWhaler  Send Email to TexasWhaler     
Bigshot,
Go ahead and read through all the posts about everything from "domestic outboard manufacturing" to a site called "earlpitts.com", and then tell me you didn't, for some unknown reason, single me out.

I took that kind of personally partner.

Legobusier posted 07-28-2004 03:05 PM ET (US)     Profile for Legobusier  Send Email to Legobusier     
Texas, with all due respect I think you're being a little over-sensitive here. My reading of Bigshot's response was not a flame directed to you because of a slight diversion of topic, but just an effort to keep it somewhat on-topic. I see no reason why you would have taken that personally.

The 2 stroke vs. 4 stroke debate is/has been alive and well in plenty of other threads.

(ps. Sorry for the earlpitts thing) :)

Chris

TexasWhaler posted 07-28-2004 03:16 PM ET (US)     Profile for TexasWhaler  Send Email to TexasWhaler     
I hear ya Chris. Point taken.

Bigshot, sorry I got bent out of shape.

I need a vacation and some alcohol.

gnr posted 07-28-2004 03:44 PM ET (US)     Profile for gnr    
Uhmmm...

Actually this thread was about a request for member's experiences running a Honda 90 on a Montauk, not about BS or changing stories.

The gentleman from Texas never once asked anyones opinion on the deal he got.

It just evolved that way as they usually do.

LHG posted 07-28-2004 04:12 PM ET (US)     Profile for LHG    
The gentleman from Texas just made the mistake of describing an opinion on what appears to be a decent running 1997 Evinrude 90 as a blanket "Piece of Junk", with no explanation. That's what attracted everyone's attention, since many here like their Evinrude engines.
macfam posted 07-28-2004 08:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for macfam  Send Email to macfam     
Jimh,
Now I know that those folks in Texas are disappointing you, but,
[I apologize if it seems like there was "piling on" here. I was just astonished at the notion that folks down in Texas were joining the rest of American consumers and giving old American brands like Evinrude the heave-ho in favor of products built in Asia. I guess I have become accustomed to hearing of such things in California and Massachusetts, but not in Texas.]

lest we forget......all those Boston Whaler classics we all admire, were built right here in Massachusetts.

Rick Dewees posted 07-28-2004 09:15 PM ET (US)     Profile for Rick Dewees  Send Email to Rick Dewees     
macfam,

I repeat...Henry's unnatural foreign/Honda leanings here don't represent the views of the entire state of Texas. Most of us here are still normal, in other words, unlike California and Massachusetts.

ryanwhaler posted 07-28-2004 09:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for ryanwhaler  Send Email to ryanwhaler     
Since we're all being so sensitive, I don't like Massachusetts, my home state being compared to California.

Just because that bigheaded idiot kerry is from MA doesn't mean we're all liberal honda/toyota driving democrats.

ryanwhaler posted 07-28-2004 09:49 PM ET (US)     Profile for ryanwhaler  Send Email to ryanwhaler     
Just for the record,
I'm jokeing in my above post, it didn't come out right.
Rick Dewees posted 07-28-2004 09:49 PM ET (US)     Profile for Rick Dewees  Send Email to Rick Dewees     
See, it just goes to show ya: Not all Texans are like Henry and all Massachusettians (Massachusettites? Massachusetters?)are not, uh...you know, what Ryan said.
DaveNJ posted 07-29-2004 08:09 AM ET (US)     Profile for DaveNJ  Send Email to DaveNJ     
Henry,
I understand what you did with this post. Sometimes words like "junk" slip out. You wanted the Honda and that is fine.

I have an Evinrude 2 stroke and it is a terrific outboard. I have had it 2 years. The first year I had it, I thought it was junk too and almost gave up on it. It was just I did not know much about it or how to start it properly.

This summer I learned much more about it. I had been flooding it at start all last year. It was starting in spite of my foolishness. This year I learned to pump the bulb hard and give it very little of the key priming. It fires right up after a few cranks. It is a rock solid motor at all RPMs and I expect many years of enjoyment out of it with careful yearly maintenance. Plus, I saved a ton by not junking it and buying new. What a mistake that would have been!

I took no offense in your responses. I enjoyed reading them. I hope your old motor finds its way back to the transom of another boat. It still has a ton of life left in it, we all know that. Hopefully, it will be on a 17' Whaler.

Meanwhile, enjoy the Honda! Report back on how you like it. You better not get stranded!

Dave

skred posted 07-29-2004 08:28 AM ET (US)     Profile for skred  Send Email to skred     
Well, I waded through all theses posts and could not find any reference to the fact that 90 Hondas are carbed and the other engines Henry is considering are EFI or DFI. That factor could make a difference both in price and performance. (Apples vs. apples?) I have a '99 Honda 90, and it's an excellent engine. I find myself wondering - however - if a fuel-injected engine would be somehow superior..
gss036 posted 07-29-2004 01:20 PM ET (US)     Profile for gss036  Send Email to gss036     
This had been an amusing post to follow. I just have to add a (chuckle to it).
When Slick Willey was aked why he did his thing with Monica, his answer was simply, BECAUSE I COULD. Henry could, he did!
I think he will really appreciate the Honda. I enjoy my 15 hp and have friend who have the 90 and 225's, I think they are a great engine. Wish I could afford one for myself.
17 bodega posted 07-29-2004 02:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for 17 bodega  Send Email to 17 bodega     
Henry, Glad you are enjoying the Montauk and the motor. You seem to be an intelligent man with quick wit. My father just turned 73 and he won't have a darn thing to do with my boat. I keep begging him to come fishing but it's of no use. My mother who is 69 on the other hand, is begging me for a salmon trip in 6 foot swells! I count the minutes until my next time on the water. I can only hope that when I'm your age, I have the gumption to get out on a boat and fish.

I could never understand the hostility regarding one's State of residence. How about opening your minds for a second or two? We're people of planet earth?

Here in California, most residents are transplants from another part of the globe. Texas, New England, Great Lakes, West Coast, Florida, Amsterdam, New Zealand, Deep South. What's the difference?

As far as buying American, I do so whenever possible, but It's getting more difficult. How many of you have chartplotters made in USA? Chart chips made in USA? VHF? GPS? Hell, even fishing lure's are made overseas. Merc/yamaha, Brunswick, tennis shoes. Just scan your body or look around and most of your life is made in China these days.

If you are a real capitalist, you better buy the best product for the money, regardless of where it's made. And, by the way, my OMC kicker starts up on .... the second or third pull... but it starts!

All in good fun, from hooter to jimh and everyone in between, you folks are a blast and always good entertainment. As long as the engine is bolted on a Whaler hull, we're all friends here, right?

Steve

Steve

17 bodega posted 07-29-2004 02:27 PM ET (US)     Profile for 17 bodega  Send Email to 17 bodega     
My kicker is a Johnson "sea horse", so is that actually an OMC? The fuel line is OMC though.

Steve

hooter posted 07-29-2004 03:43 PM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Ah just looked some o' this up: Since it formed by merger in 1929, Outboard Motor and Manufacturing Company, later shortened to Outboard Motor Corporation ("OMC"), has sold outboard boat motors under both the Johnson and Evinrude brands. Under the OMC name, in later years the parent company has sold parts that would fit either subsidiary brand’s motors.

There, now, that was sort o' on pernt, though prob'ly not enough t' satisfy the gen'aman from Vermont.

As Ah'm feelin' a li'l weepy and sens'tive right now, could we just have a big ol' virtual group hug, then go out to play with our boats?:-!

gnr posted 07-29-2004 04:02 PM ET (US)     Profile for gnr    
Well Hooter....

Technically it ain't even close to being on pernt but I have never been much for sweatin' the technicalities so I'll let it slide.


Oh and....

Consider yourself hugged. ;-)

17 bodega posted 07-29-2004 04:15 PM ET (US)     Profile for 17 bodega  Send Email to 17 bodega     
See,

I knew you were just teddy bears underneath! ;)

whooda thought that this could become the offical hug thread courtesy of Henry's Honda 90?

hooter posted 07-29-2004 04:46 PM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Thank you, Bubs, Ah needed that.

As to makin' pernts and counter-pernts: Mebbe the gen'aman from Vermont is uniquely diff'rent in this pernt, but ever' bean counter Ah ever knowed favored them pointy Pentel pencils with the teeny tiny li'l leads 'bout as wide as a speck. Damn leads always breakin' and smudgin' the paper,s been mah observation. Me, Ah favor the ol' crayola crayon nub on the Big Chief pad, thank you ver' much. The one makes his pernts very precisely. The other makes 'em sort o' broad brush. By the time the one has figured the exactitude o' the specky li'l pernt he was makin' and finally put lead to paper, Ah has covered the whole damn topic with mah crayon and moved on to another page. But then, what's the pernt o' debatin' this pernt?:-!

Bigshot posted 07-29-2004 05:03 PM ET (US)     Profile for Bigshot  Send Email to Bigshot     
PS---I have a 1965 Evinrude brochure that clearly states that OMC was a Canadian co. Not sure when it went Canadian and when it went back to USA. She then went back to Canada again in 2002 but I do know in 1965 she was Canadian.
LHG posted 07-29-2004 07:11 PM ET (US)     Profile for LHG    
Nick - as far as I know, OMC was always headquarted here in Waukegan IL.

The current ownership of the company, now called BRP, INC, having been sold off by Bombardier due it's own needs for cash in the airplane and other assorted businesses, is 35% French Canadian (Bombardier family), 15% Canadian pension fund, and 50% US Pension fund, both of the latter being silent partners. So I guess it's fair to say Evinrude and Johnson are now half US owned again. Now if they'd only get rid of that Sea Doo Doo stuff, the bane of US waterways

WT posted 07-29-2004 07:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for WT  Send Email to WT     
LHG:

Why would you want to get rid of Sea Doo's?

I own a Sea Doo. Nice piece of engineering. How about the new ones with 215 HP on a 10 foot hull that weighs 800 pounds total?

WT

hooter posted 07-29-2004 11:35 PM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
See Doodoos do indeed have their appropriate place on the high and low seas,

with they plugs pulled and used as 800 pound anchors for decent seafarin' craft.

But then that's like hatin' guns instead o' murderers, right? It's the imbecils that own and or ride the damn things need to be put in a shark cage and dropped into 100 foot o' water without scuba gear.

Present comp'ny excluded, of course, there, WT, so as not t' be more'n mildly offensive:-!

jimh posted 07-29-2004 11:48 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
I think the boating in the thread is over and done, so let me go farther astray...

While up in Wisconsin with the Door County gang I was lying there on the bunk of my Boston Whaler reading The Rise of the Creative Class by Richard Florida, which is now a sort of popular mantra for why we don't need any manufacturing jobs. I can tell you one good thing about that book--if you ever have insomnia it will cure it in a hurry. But before it put me to sleep I read about how we are replacing manufacturing jobs with "creative class" jobs. The theory goes we are all gonna buy our refrigerators at WAL-MART who imports them from China for $49, and we'll be making our living doing more creative stuff than putting lug nuts on Lincoln's all day. The problem that I see is that there are a whole lot of folks who are not going to have much success being Hollywood movie producers or screenwriters, but they could make a decent living in a good manufacturing job with a union-wage.

It is a lot easier for most folks to add value to things by bending some sheet metal than it is to turn out the next popular television show.

If you take this "creative class" thing to the limit, we'd end up with half the society as lawyers, all suing each other, and their income taxed so high it would provide a welfare state for the other half that weren't lawyers.

I guess that means that all the Boston Whalers would be owned by lawyers, and the boat would be made in China from plans the two guys who work for Boston Whaler send over in a big digital file.

I hope it does not come to that. Even if BRP or Brunswick makes a motor or a part in some place other than the US or Canada, at least the money spins around and come home to roost in Illinois or Wisconsin. That is better than the money getting vacuumed up all over Texas and shipped to the Yamaguchi Prefecture Bank

I enjoyed this thread, and I think everyone conducted themselves like the true gentlemen and well-educated Boston Whaler boat owners they are. If you think you get this kind of discussion without the Boston Whaler part, all you have to do is go to some other website and read about thirty seconds of the blather that passes for forum content to see the difference.

WT posted 07-30-2004 02:01 AM ET (US)     Profile for WT  Send Email to WT     
Jimh:

I believe that the creative class has its place in this great country. Everyone has the opportunity to be in this class if they have the brains and determination. This class comes up with the ideas that produce regular jobs for Joe Lunchbucket. Don't get me wrong, there is nothing bad about being a worker bee if that's all one wants out of life.

I also believe that we are headed more towards a "have" and "have not" society with the elimination of the middle class. The problem I see is that most people are consumers. These consumers are now spending too much of their income on housing so that they won't be able to buy the other goods or services goods at Walmart or anywhere else. If the consumer doesn't buy products, this country will go into a recession or another depression.

At least we Boston Whaler owners can go out and catch our dinner.


Hooter:

I love my Sea Doo and I also agree that some of these PWC riders should be shot. (I love my Glocks too.)

WT

17 bodega posted 07-30-2004 02:56 AM ET (US)     Profile for 17 bodega  Send Email to 17 bodega     

hooter,you're killng me!
People at my work wonder what I'm laughing out loud about.

Actually this thread made me look at my lures and the Apex are made in Canada, along with several brands of flashers. Most fishing tackle comes from China.

How long do you suppose it will be before all outboards are made overseas?

Sal A posted 07-30-2004 08:26 AM ET (US)     Profile for Sal A  Send Email to Sal A     
A long time argument of free trade, is that in the long run it allocates resources to where there are most efficient, etc. IE Our labor resources will be allocated to designing websites and Asia's resources will make screwdrivers and everything else. We benefit because by incenting large multinationals to accelerate this process, they will trickle down the wealth to all of us.

My argument is that trickle down argument worked in the past, but I am not sure that "multiplying" trickle-down effect works this time around. In the past twenty years we have quickly outsourced manufacturing, and more recently service jobs abroad. The tax cuts for the big companies, I hypothesize, won't have that same boost this time around because the trickling down won't be here at home. Time will tell, as I may be wrong certainly in my hypothesis.

As a boating newbie I posted here a year ago how I was miffed at not being able to buy the boat of my choice with the Honda, Suzuki, or Yamaha that I was predisposed to believe was better. Suffice it to say when/if I repower I may very well go black. I hope I will be patient enough to wait for a Verado in my size range, and I hope that engine wows everybody; it seems to be doing that so far.

Again thanks to Jimh for this forum, and to differing viewpoints that each day change all of us, even if just a little.

hooter posted 07-30-2004 09:02 AM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Bodega17, exibitin' all the qualities here of a card carryin' member o' the Creative Class, if you be puzz'lin peoples at woik at 2:56 a.m., what kind o’ real estate you be managin’? Mebbe a grave yard?

As presidential campaigns always make clear, about half this country will on any given day buy just about any line o’ bullshit. Columbia’s Dr. Florida has made a lucrative career of late by toutin’ an old tool o’ the political party now producin’ their quatra-annual TV extravaganza up in Boston this week. While attemptin’ to APPEAR as though he’s defined some new type o’ dangerous macro-economic peril, he’s simply promotin’ an age old demagoguery, paraphrased as follows, “Looky that guy over there in [fill in the country’s name, any one will do]! Why, if he’s doin’ THAT good, it could ONLY be at our expense. It’s the boob runnin’ this country now who’s at FAULT! Throw the bum OUT, and vote OUR boob in!”, runs the line. The fact that Dr. FL writes about Bill Clinton as a caped crusadin’, world-savin’ internationalist while he also denigrates George ’43 as “aggressively unilateralist” only serves to further mah pernt. The man’s nothin’ but a slick shill for lib’ral politics. And, again, based on past votin’ patterns, about half the votin’ public is likely to plop down $12.95 to read about his new-found peril. So goody for Dr. FL.

Anyone wants to understand why other parts o’ the woild is doin’ markedly better of late, generatin’ lots of what Dr. FL describes as creative jobs, need look no farther than the followin’ table: http://www.econlib.org/library/Enc/MarginalTaxRates.html . Take a look at what top marginal tax rates have done around the world over the last 25 years, and even a wide-eyed lib’ral might catch a clue. Let people keep more o’ they hard earned money, and guess what? They get more creative at dreamin’ up ways to make mo’ money! Talkin’ American housewives through fixin’ their computer difficulties from a telephone in Bombay sure beats doin’ laundry on a rock down at the river. It was an American competitive holiday while communism and socialism had their day. But now global capitalism appears here to stay, and this country’s got to compete. THAZ what’s goin’ on, to this ol’ coonass’s way o’ thinkin’. Ain’t no new King Kong been let out the box by George Bush and the Republican, as Dr. FL and his ilk would have you believe. Now if you would kindly mail your $12.95 to me, Ah'll be much obliged:-!

17 bodega posted 07-30-2004 07:41 PM ET (US)     Profile for 17 bodega  Send Email to 17 bodega     
Lol,

Damn, you nailed me hooter, I guess I'm not as good at disguise these days. ;-) That would put me at work at 12 o'clock west coast, tying my rig fof the salmon. It's all about the fishing for me right now, and it's mighty convienient to live where I work, for now. Home is dialup, so I often surf, tie fishing knots, and burn the midnight oil at my workspace. As far as the creative class, my only claim is that I'm a mediocre bluegrass musician that loves Americana, bluegrass, jazz, and just about any other style of music I can't play!

Politics isn't worth a breath of 2 stroke exaust here... It would be much more fun to tell you the story of how I let my fishing line get tangled in my prop and almost gave me cause to start a brand new thread here!

Me hands were bloodied from the first dink i put in de box whilst tryin me best to lean ova de transom to untangle de mess me made of de prop! A couple of guys got a laugh or two wit me lack o skills on de fishin grounds. Well... after about 35 minutes of pocketknives, leatherman pliers and elbow grease, I done freed all de 25 pound test and kept me flasher and apex lure too.

All in all, a great day on the water fishing in a whaler.

Sal DiMercurio posted 07-30-2004 08:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for Sal DiMercurio  Send Email to Sal DiMercurio     
I stopped reading the posts after about the 10th one.
You traded a 1997 90 hp Evinrude for a 2002 90 hp Honda & coughed up another $6,000.
Listen, I've got one hell of a deal for you.
I have a 79 ...V20 with a 2000 ....200 hp Evinrude I'll sell you for $25,000, I'll even use grease.
Man, you need to do your home work.
First of all, your 97 Evinrude with fresh plugs & clean carbs will eat that honda alive & spit it out & will most likely still be running when the honda quits.
Those carbed 90s are bullet proof & can & will take a hell of alot of abuse & still get you home.
I think in your head your trying to find any excuse to buy a new engine.
The 97 ...90 Evinrude is worth well over $3,000
Sal
Buckda posted 07-30-2004 08:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for Buckda  Send Email to Buckda     
Creative Class or not (I probably fit into this category), I'm looking at the vacuum of jobs that will be created by the "baby boom" generation hitting retirement (but not looking forward to paying for all your healthcare!). Those of us Generation X and Y'ers would be prudent to position ourselves in the next 5-7 years to "rush in" to those leadership positions vacated by our parents when they retire. It's an important point, because the youth of India and China are in the same position, and as the economic doors continue to open in those countries, us American and European kids will have to run hard and strong to get those good-paying top-of-the-heap jobs.

But somebody's going to have to do it, right? You Boomers aren't going to stop buying things just because your retired, and your stock portfolios are coming back...putting you in a better position to retire soon......meaning you'll require services; healthcare and recreation.

...and my generation is going to be busy thinking up creative ways to provide those services to yours. It'll be fun, challenging and worthwhile because there will be lots of money and reputations to be made by being the best or carving a niche. Hopefully it will result in a nice fat paycheck so I can buy all sorts of new toys for my Whaler.

(Couldn't resist since the thread was so far off topic already).

Henry - enjoy the boat...to me, it sounds like you got a good deal (you're happy, they're happy, what's the big deal, right?!) Life's too short to wring your hands over something that won't matter in two months.

Regards,

Dave

hooter posted 07-31-2004 10:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for hooter    
Hank, Ah'd actually hoped you'd take up mah offer or at least counter with somethin' reasonable. Got a bud just pulled a '71 Katama out from under a old man's oak tree in his back yard and paid him $475 for the pleasure o' cleanin' her up and repowerin' her. Pulled a couple bushels o' fine worm poop and mulch out o' the cockpit. Last license paid for her was 1994. She has a old same-vintage Merc Tower o' Pow'r 115 on the back but she's froze up. Ah figured t' put your ol' piece o' junk on the back. How's that new Honda treatin' you?
hbrigiii posted 08-02-2004 10:29 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Well, I have to tell you guys, now that I have had my boat back and in the water for the last three days, its a little bit of heaven. Starts instantly, runs whisper quiet and doesn't befoul the atmosphire. I havent yet had enough hours on the engine to wind it up to max rpm but I dont anticipate any problem. The dealer started with a 13.25x16 and that seems to be just right. I called Boston Whaler asking about their prop figures for the Montauk/Honda 90 combination and they said that they could only give figures for the Montauk with a Mercury. Thanks a lot B.W.!!!! Whatever, the engine swap seems to have worked out. Now that my wife is talking to me again, life is not too bad. Thanks for all the encouragement fellas, this list was a big help. Henry
hbrigiii posted 08-02-2004 10:31 PM ET (US)     Profile for hbrigiii  Send Email to hbrigiii     
Well, I have to tell you guys, now that I have had my boat back and in the water for the last three days, its a little bit of heaven. Starts instantly, runs whisper quiet and doesn't befoul the atmosphire. I havent yet had enough hours on the engine to wind it up to max rpm but I dont anticipate any problem. The dealer started with a 13.25x16 and that seems to be just right. I called Boston Whaler asking about their prop figures for the Montauk/Honda 90 combination and they said that they could only give figures for the Montauk with a Mercury. Thanks a lot B.W.!!!! Whatever, the engine swap seems to have worked out. Now that my wife is talking to me again, life is not too bad. Thanks for all the encouragement fellas, this list was a big help. Henry
CFCAJUN posted 08-03-2004 05:25 PM ET (US)     Profile for CFCAJUN  Send Email to CFCAJUN     
I just bought a 1971 16' with a 1976 85 Evinrude. She runs like new. I think the owners have a lot to do with how long a motor lasts.

I find my preference to be:

1) Honda Four Stroke (if I don't have to pay for it)

2) Yamaha

3) Johnston

4) Evinrude

I hear Merc's are great under 50HP, but I don't know about the rest. I am sure there are very happy Merc owners out there.

17 bodega posted 08-03-2004 07:33 PM ET (US)     Profile for 17 bodega  Send Email to 17 bodega     
Glad to hear you like the motor Henry,

As you can see, the thread was hijacked into the great errors of comedy, but it seemed everyone had fun along the way. Discussion was entertaining, despite our different points of view. What a boring world it would be if we all thought the same.

I feel four stroke motors are worth the extra weight and are much less headache and better for the environment. I haven't owned a merc 4 stroke so I can't comment on their quality compared to Honda. I do know that Honda has a very loyal following based on the performanc and reliability of their motors and vehicles.

Post New Topic  Post Reply
Hop to:


Contact Us | RETURN to ContinuousWave Top Page

Powered by: Ultimate Bulletin Board, Freeware Version 2000
Purchase our Licensed Version- which adds many more features!
© Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998 - 2000.