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  Issue w/ 90' HP Johnson on 17' Montauk

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Author Topic:   Issue w/ 90' HP Johnson on 17' Montauk
AV8R posted 04-23-2005 08:36 AM ET (US)   Profile for AV8R   Send Email to AV8R  
I have a 1986 Montauk 17 I have owned since 1988. It has the original V4 90-HP Johnson that I have admittedly abused, and despite that, it has continued to work flawlessly and runs 42 MPH. About six years ago I abonadoned this rig on the Gulf Coast of Florida and now "visit" it 2-3 times a year. I abuse it for 7-10 days run the engine dry and promptly abandon it again. Despite this it has continued to fire right up and work great.

Now to the problem. At my most recent visit after 7 days of abuse while cruising about 25-30 Mph in a smooth bay I decided to add a little throttle to cure (or at least indulge) my need for speed. This is when something gave, the motor went up in RPM but the boat stopped. I was unable to get it in gear and the prop spins freely. I assume something "gave" in the lower unit unless it has a sheer pin or bolt on the prop that is meant to break under stress like my bush hog. I know a little about planes and tractors but very little about outboards.

This happened a couple of hours before my return flight so all I could do was beg a tow from a pal and get it on the trailer so I could make my flight.

I am now home, 1000 miles away in Kentucky, and it is a little hard to trouble shoot remotely. Does this sound [like a] major [repair expense]? Should I hire a mechanic to look at it and spend dollars on a 19-year- old engine or think about re-powering?

I have the name of some reputable mechanic from the facility where I keep this vessel, but have yet to call.

I have read some of the threads on here about re-powering with another 90HP 2-stroke but, why spend the cash if I don't need to.

jimh posted 04-23-2005 09:58 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
Let's look at these issues:

"Why spend the cash if I don't need to?"

In general I would take the side that says "no, don't spend the cash," however, the economy of our country depends on strong consumer spending, and many things are purchased which are not necessities. Spending cash on purchases is one way to stimulate economic growth. Also, I like the cash purchase. There is too much consumer debt in our country, but that is a different issue. I think in general, one ought to spend some of their income on things that gives one pleasure, so a new outboard motor may be an enjoyable thing. Opponents on this issue will probably argue that spending on non-essentials should be reduced, and that instead you ought to put the money to use in debt-reduction (assuming you have some debt) or into personal savings. I think these are personal decisions, and it is hard to have a good discussion on this issue without getting too deep into your personal finances.

"Should I hire a mechanic to look at it and spend dollars on a 19-year-old engine or think about repowering?"

Here you raise several issues simultaneously. First, let's look at the issue of should you hire a mechanic. Because the motor is 1,000 miles away, I think you will probably have to hire a mechanic to work on it. I don't see any other option. The proponents of the other side of this issue will have to explain how you can work on the engine when it is 1,000 miles away, and I think we can easily win that debate.

Next let's consider the second issue: should you spend dollars on a 19-year-old engine?

This is a difficult issue. In economic terms, for every mechanical device there does come a point where the utility (in the economic sense of the word) of the device is reduced to the point where continued investment in it will not bring good return. However, the age of an outboard motor is not, by itself, a good factor to judge by. Instead I would judge on the overall condition and state of repair. If the engine was providing good propulsion up to the moment of the failure, it seems to me that this is evidence of its continued utility, and therefore strong consideration should be given to its repair. On the other hand, if the engine were not in good condition, had other problems which needed repair, and in general was not providing good propulsion, these factors would weigh against further investment.

Based on your description of the motor, I would tend to favor further investment in the motor. Particularly since the cost to repair is currently unknown. My position on this issue would be to recommend you determine the true repair costs, then make a decision regarding further investment in this engine.

Finally, lets examine the third part of this issue: should you think about re-powering?

I have to confess, I think about re-powering all the time. It is really quite a harmless activity if you can contain it, but I do believe that it can lead to actual re-powering. The more you think about it, I am afraid, the more comfortable you will become with the idea. This may lead to actual re-powering. Thinking about re-powering is one of those "slippery slope" situations. It is especially dangerous to spend time around people who actually have re-powered. These people will almost universally endorse taking a similar action, and then, before you realize it, you will find yourself getting more and more comfortable with the idea of re-powering. Many factors work in this situation: pier pressure is one of them. When you stand at the pier and see all of those other Boston Whaler boats with new engines, it is almost impossible to avoid pier pressure. The urge to conform is another. You want to fit in with the others. They all have new motors. Well, the result will be very strong motivation to conform, to fit in. Again, all of this just from the simple act of thinking about re-powering. Be careful. It can be dangerous.

My position on this issue would be to recommend isolating yourself from others who have re-powered to prevent being contaminated by their influence. Only think about re-powering during the evening hours, say after dinner and household chores are done. Don't let re-powering take over your head. It can really become an interference to other mental activity.

acassidy posted 04-23-2005 09:49 AM ET (US)     Profile for acassidy  Send Email to acassidy     
[This respondent ignores all the issues and instead give advice on how to repair the problem!] There are two things that it could be. 1st : you could have spun you prop. There is a rubber hub inside your prop, which gives when hitting objects in the water. This where out and needs replacing over time 2nd: Which sounds more like your description. The lower unit! It could be your dog clutch or the gears. The damage could be from water in the lower unit, since you say that you use the motor but do not do very much maintenance. Lower unit inspection and refilling should be done around once a year and since lower unit fluid is only $4 a quart, it is a good investment. Leaking could be from plug o-rings or lower unit seals.

That being said, it sounds like you good use out of the motor for its age. It would get a mechanic to look at it (and the whole motor, compression check and so-on) and give you an estimate for repairs and opinion to see if motor (powerhead) is not near catastrophic failure anyway. Also look at lower units on ebay.

OR you could have ceremonious funeral and repower with new and be done with it.

jimh posted 04-23-2005 10:12 AM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
Please, let's stick to the issues here. No repair advice. That belongs in another area!

(But I also think it sounds like a spun hub or maybe a broken clutch dog.)

fourdfish posted 04-23-2005 10:42 AM ET (US)     Profile for fourdfish  Send Email to fourdfish     
jimh---RE-POWER-- RE-POWER-- RE-POWER, I am loving it!!!
ratherwhalering posted 04-23-2005 11:30 AM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
My name is Rob, and I am a re-poweraholic. I believe it is high time someone broke the ranks and exposed this dangerous and highly subversive group. I am going to break the solemn oath I took when I re-powered my Montauk, and identify the conspiracy.

Immediately upon re-powering, you will be contacted by a representative of the Re-power Club, and forced to accept the governing rules.

Rule 1: There is no Re-power Club.
Rule 2: THERE IS NO RE-POWER CLUB.
Rule 3: You must coheres, cajole, influence, and manipulate all non-members into re-powering by any means necessary.
Rule 4: You must exaggerate the engine condition that caused you to consider a re-power in the first place.
Rule 5: You must downplay the cost, inconvenience and delay involved in a re-power.
Rule 6: You must, at every opportunity, mention the fact that you recently re-powered.
Rule 7: You must profess your love for the new engine.
Rule 8: You must criticize others that have not re-powered by dropping subtle hints. Coughing at two-stroke smoke, speaking louder than necessary when the engine is running, offering to pay obscene amounts for gasoline, Sea-Tow christmas presents, and checking safety gear “in case of breakdown,” are all acceptable methods.

I know I will be taking alot of heat from the re-power rank and file, however I thought it important to shed light on this dark and nefarious group. Should I fall, I hope others will be inspired to step forward, into the light, take up the torch and continue what I have started.

ratherwhalering posted 04-23-2005 11:40 AM ET (US)     Profile for ratherwhalering  Send Email to ratherwhalering     
I almost forgot the most important rule,...wait, who could that be at the door this time of night? I'd better go see.
AV8R posted 04-23-2005 12:47 PM ET (US)     Profile for AV8R  Send Email to AV8R     
Its not helping me that my buddy who let me borrow his 23' Grady just re-powered with a 4-stroke Yamaha 225. The peer pressure is building. (I guess that should be pier pressure since its a boat.

Thanks for all the advice. I guess I should have posted in the repair forum.

Teak Oil posted 04-24-2005 01:43 AM ET (US)     Profile for Teak Oil  Send Email to Teak Oil     
Get a lower unit off eBay for $300 and keep on abusing that V4. Repowering for 2 weeks use out of a year sounds kind of dumb to me.

Put a $30 impeller in while you are in there.

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