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Author Topic:   18 Outrage with Suzuki 140 fourstroke

Bayoumontauk posted 08-23-2005 10:52 PM ET (US)
I've been pricing outboards to repower my 18 outrage after the restoration is complete. The most bang for the buck locally is the Suzuki 4s 140. The people with the Hondas and Yamahas want alot of money for the 150 4s. With the price of fuel these days a 2 stroke (although econmically attractive) is out of the question. Are there any ContinuousWave members out there with the 18 Outrage and the Suzuki 140 out there? If so, How do you like the performance. What kind of top end can I expect? What is your fuel consumption and cruising speeds? Thanks.
LHG posted 08-24-2005 03:27 PM ET (US)
You might also want to look at the Mercury 135 Optimax. Better performance and fuel economy than the 140 Suzuki. Or is a 4-stroke all you will consider? I think the 140 Suzuki is a discontinued engine, being replaced by their new 150.
Joe Kriz posted 08-24-2005 04:18 PM ET (US)
Bayou,
I just went through all the manufacturers websites and got some new data.
I am not sure the Suzuki DF140 is going to be discontinued or not as they do still list it.
Here is a 'Quick Reference Guide' to the new engine choices...
http://users.sisqtel.net/jkriz/drawings/Outrage18-QRG.html
Bayoumontauk posted 08-24-2005 11:28 PM ET (US)
According to the local Suzuki dealer they will still make the 140 because it is the best seller on the mid size bay boats. Is the 135 optimax built on the same block as the 135 2 stroke? A neighbor has the 225 optimax and likes it alot. Thanks Bill
Bayoumontauk posted 08-24-2005 11:30 PM ET (US)
Joe thanks for the quick reference guide...very helpful.
bsmotril posted 08-25-2005 11:42 AM ET (US)
LHG,
Where did you get your Suzuki 140 fuel economy data? About a year and a half ago, I considered replacing a pair of 135 Optis with 140 Suzukis when repower time rolled around. I did a lot of research and reading of test data in magazines and on the web. Everything I read showed the Suzis with better cruise economy than my Opti 135s. Curious as to where you got your information? BillS
andygere posted 08-25-2005 01:17 PM ET (US)
Do a search on this forum for more info. A long time member, Dan Firth, repowered his immaculate Outrage 18 with a Suzuki 140 before he moved up to a 25. I recall that he posted some performance information.
elaelap posted 08-25-2005 02:11 PM ET (US)
Andy, Andy, Andy...and you of all people. Firth didn't "move UP" from an 18 to a 25, he simply made a decision that a larger boat would suit his needs more than a smaller. We all know that it is a physical impossibility to move UP from a classic Outrage 18...it would be like a mountain climber moving UP from the summit of Everest.
Tony
Phil Tyson posted 08-26-2005 11:33 AM ET (US)
Tony - You are just TOO funny LOL!
jimh posted 08-26-2005 09:23 PM ET (US)
It would be quite unusual for a company to make a 140-HP and a 150-HP engine, however that does not exclude the possibility that Suzuki will do that. On the other hand, I get the feeling that the new 150-HP model is not quite in the pipeline and dealers have plenty of 140-HP models to sell.
The 140-HP model has been criticized as being a stroked out version of the 115-HP, and, unlike most of the Suzuki engines which have very generous displacement to horsepower ratios--a trademark of that brand, in fact--the 140-HP model has the least displacement for horsepower of any of their engines, or darn close.
To get equivalent performance to a two-stroke, most four-stroke engines have had to go to some form of exotic enhancement, usually variable camshaft phasing, multiple valves, tuned air pathways in intake and exhaust, or, in the case of the Mercury VERADO, forced air induction (supercharging). I don't think the Suzuki 140 has any of these techniques up its sleeve. You might find the performance not quite the same as a 140-HP two-stroke. Rather than employ all of these mechanical complexities in their engines, the Suzuki philosophy seems to be just to go with generous displacement. The 140-HP engine seems to violate that dogma.
Bayoumontauk posted 08-26-2005 10:12 PM ET (US)
Jim thanks for the insite. When explained as well as you did, it seems simialiar to what alot of othre people are saying about this motor. Reliable but not quite 140HP. Still have alot of restoration to do on this boat. So am probably 3-4 month away from a mooter decison.
jimh posted 08-27-2005 09:19 AM ET (US)
Some Suzuki motors, their horsepower, displacement, and ratio of displacement to horsepower:
200-HP, 3600 CC = 18 CC/HP
90-HP, 1950 CC = 21 CC/HP
60-HP, 1298 CC = 21.6 CC/HP
Compared to
140-HP, 2044 CC = 14.6 CC/HP
andygere posted 08-27-2005 12:41 PM ET (US)
The boat I mentioned was originally powered with an Evinrude 120, so I'm guessing that Dan didn't give any performance when he repowered with the 140 Suzuki. Since rated horsepower is only made at wide open throttle, I would expect very similar performance on an Outrage 18 with either a 140 or 150 4-stroke at most operating speeds. Tony reports fine performance with his 115 4-stroke on an Outrage 18. If Bayoumontauk can get a 140 Suzuki at a good price, I'd say it's certainly worthy of some consideration.
By the way Tony, I've seen Dan's Outrage 25, and as fine as his 18 was, he's moved up.
placerville posted 08-31-2005 01:48 PM ET (US)
I have the 140hp Suzuki on my 19' Revenge. I have nothing to compare to but for me it is a great engine but definitely not overpowered. I get around 38 mph at WOT. Cruise mileage around 3.5 mpg. I see that it can be bought at Bayracer marine for $6900. Which is a pretty good price.
LHG posted 08-31-2005 03:31 PM ET (US)
That Suzuki 140 cruise mileage is not all that great. On my Classic 21 Outrage, same hull but a little longer and heavier, with an old 1988 Mercury 2.0 liter 150HP, I get 3.2 MPG at cruise. A 135 Optimax or Verado would increase that to over 5.0 mpg.
Tom2697 posted 09-10-2005 01:55 PM ET (US)
I am getting over 6 mpg from my 18 Outrage with 140 Suzuki DF140. Do a search on this site and you should find my performance data...
Perry posted 09-10-2005 03:19 PM ET (US)
Why don't you ust tell us how fast the DF140 pushes your Outrage 18?
David Jenkins posted 09-10-2005 03:45 PM ET (US)
At 4000 RPM (24 mph), my Suzuki 140 gets exactly six miles per gallon pushing a 1974 Outrage 19.

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Author	Topic: 18 Outrage with Suzuki 140 fourstroke
Bayoumontauk	posted 08-23-2005 10:52 PM ET (US) I've been pricing outboards to repower my 18 outrage after the restoration is complete. The most bang for the buck locally is the Suzuki 4s 140. The people with the Hondas and Yamahas want alot of money for the 150 4s. With the price of fuel these days a 2 stroke (although econmically attractive) is out of the question. Are there any ContinuousWave members out there with the 18 Outrage and the Suzuki 140 out there? If so, How do you like the performance. What kind of top end can I expect? What is your fuel consumption and cruising speeds? Thanks.
LHG	posted 08-24-2005 03:27 PM ET (US) You might also want to look at the Mercury 135 Optimax. Better performance and fuel economy than the 140 Suzuki. Or is a 4-stroke all you will consider? I think the 140 Suzuki is a discontinued engine, being replaced by their new 150.
Joe Kriz	posted 08-24-2005 04:18 PM ET (US) Bayou, I just went through all the manufacturers websites and got some new data. I am not sure the Suzuki DF140 is going to be discontinued or not as they do still list it. Here is a 'Quick Reference Guide' to the new engine choices... http://users.sisqtel.net/jkriz/drawings/Outrage18-QRG.html
Bayoumontauk	posted 08-24-2005 11:28 PM ET (US) According to the local Suzuki dealer they will still make the 140 because it is the best seller on the mid size bay boats. Is the 135 optimax built on the same block as the 135 2 stroke? A neighbor has the 225 optimax and likes it alot. Thanks Bill
Bayoumontauk	posted 08-24-2005 11:30 PM ET (US) Joe thanks for the quick reference guide...very helpful.
bsmotril	posted 08-25-2005 11:42 AM ET (US) LHG, Where did you get your Suzuki 140 fuel economy data? About a year and a half ago, I considered replacing a pair of 135 Optis with 140 Suzukis when repower time rolled around. I did a lot of research and reading of test data in magazines and on the web. Everything I read showed the Suzis with better cruise economy than my Opti 135s. Curious as to where you got your information? BillS
andygere	posted 08-25-2005 01:17 PM ET (US) Do a search on this forum for more info. A long time member, Dan Firth, repowered his immaculate Outrage 18 with a Suzuki 140 before he moved up to a 25. I recall that he posted some performance information.
elaelap	posted 08-25-2005 02:11 PM ET (US) Andy, Andy, Andy...and you of all people. Firth didn't "move UP" from an 18 to a 25, he simply made a decision that a larger boat would suit his needs more than a smaller. We all know that it is a physical impossibility to move UP from a classic Outrage 18...it would be like a mountain climber moving UP from the summit of Everest. Tony
Phil Tyson	posted 08-26-2005 11:33 AM ET (US) Tony - You are just TOO funny LOL!
jimh	posted 08-26-2005 09:23 PM ET (US) It would be quite unusual for a company to make a 140-HP and a 150-HP engine, however that does not exclude the possibility that Suzuki will do that. On the other hand, I get the feeling that the new 150-HP model is not quite in the pipeline and dealers have plenty of 140-HP models to sell. The 140-HP model has been criticized as being a stroked out version of the 115-HP, and, unlike most of the Suzuki engines which have very generous displacement to horsepower ratios--a trademark of that brand, in fact--the 140-HP model has the least displacement for horsepower of any of their engines, or darn close. To get equivalent performance to a two-stroke, most four-stroke engines have had to go to some form of exotic enhancement, usually variable camshaft phasing, multiple valves, tuned air pathways in intake and exhaust, or, in the case of the Mercury VERADO, forced air induction (supercharging). I don't think the Suzuki 140 has any of these techniques up its sleeve. You might find the performance not quite the same as a 140-HP two-stroke. Rather than employ all of these mechanical complexities in their engines, the Suzuki philosophy seems to be just to go with generous displacement. The 140-HP engine seems to violate that dogma.
Bayoumontauk	posted 08-26-2005 10:12 PM ET (US) Jim thanks for the insite. When explained as well as you did, it seems simialiar to what alot of othre people are saying about this motor. Reliable but not quite 140HP. Still have alot of restoration to do on this boat. So am probably 3-4 month away from a mooter decison.
jimh	posted 08-27-2005 09:19 AM ET (US) Some Suzuki motors, their horsepower, displacement, and ratio of displacement to horsepower: 200-HP, 3600 CC = 18 CC/HP 90-HP, 1950 CC = 21 CC/HP 60-HP, 1298 CC = 21.6 CC/HP Compared to 140-HP, 2044 CC = 14.6 CC/HP
andygere	posted 08-27-2005 12:41 PM ET (US) The boat I mentioned was originally powered with an Evinrude 120, so I'm guessing that Dan didn't give any performance when he repowered with the 140 Suzuki. Since rated horsepower is only made at wide open throttle, I would expect very similar performance on an Outrage 18 with either a 140 or 150 4-stroke at most operating speeds. Tony reports fine performance with his 115 4-stroke on an Outrage 18. If Bayoumontauk can get a 140 Suzuki at a good price, I'd say it's certainly worthy of some consideration. By the way Tony, I've seen Dan's Outrage 25, and as fine as his 18 was, he's moved up.
placerville	posted 08-31-2005 01:48 PM ET (US) I have the 140hp Suzuki on my 19' Revenge. I have nothing to compare to but for me it is a great engine but definitely not overpowered. I get around 38 mph at WOT. Cruise mileage around 3.5 mpg. I see that it can be bought at Bayracer marine for $6900. Which is a pretty good price.
LHG	posted 08-31-2005 03:31 PM ET (US) That Suzuki 140 cruise mileage is not all that great. On my Classic 21 Outrage, same hull but a little longer and heavier, with an old 1988 Mercury 2.0 liter 150HP, I get 3.2 MPG at cruise. A 135 Optimax or Verado would increase that to over 5.0 mpg.
Tom2697	posted 09-10-2005 01:55 PM ET (US) I am getting over 6 mpg from my 18 Outrage with 140 Suzuki DF140. Do a search on this site and you should find my performance data...
Perry	posted 09-10-2005 03:19 PM ET (US) Why don't you ust tell us how fast the DF140 pushes your Outrage 18?
David Jenkins	posted 09-10-2005 03:45 PM ET (US) At 4000 RPM (24 mph), my Suzuki 140 gets exactly six miles per gallon pushing a 1974 Outrage 19.