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Author Topic:   Heavy Engine on Outrage 17

Quogue posted 09-15-2007 09:50 PM ET (US)
My cousin just joined me as a Whaler owner. He bought a beautiful [1991] Outrage 17 with no bottom paint, and a [1993] Honda 115-HP with only 19 hours that weighs almost 500-lbs.. The Outrage is rated for a 120-HP. The problem is the OUTRAGE 17 is very low at rest, and with two people in the stern the water is almost at the transom level. My cousin would rather not change the engine as it is mint and makes this Whaler fly over 50-MPH. Does anyone make additional floatation that can be bolted onto the transom at the port and starbord side of the engine? Any ideas would be appreciated.
jimh posted 09-15-2007 11:08 PM ET (US)
You cannot improve the buoyancy of the hull by bolting on floatation. Buoyancy comes from the volume of water being displaced. If you need more buoyancy in the stern, you will have to increase the volume of the hull so that it displaces more water in the stern.
I wouldn't be surprised if that Honda weighs more than 500-lbs. Those early Honda four-stroke motors were extremely large for their rated horsepower. They're monsters. You usually see them in commercial applications and on boats much larger than a 17-foot Boston Whaler.
Casco Bay Outrage posted 09-16-2007 09:04 AM ET (US)
I have a 1991 Outrage 17 with a 2003 Yamaha 115 4 stroke. It weighs about 435 lbs. with fluids and a prop. Still heavy and sits a bit low.
Consider moving any gear stowed in the stern quarter seat compartments and under the bait well forward. Also, move heavy items from inside the console to the front cooler.
Is the battery in the stern? If so, consider moving it to the console.
This is a rare boat and handles exceptionally well for a 17.
Regards
CBO
Tohsgib posted 09-16-2007 08:35 PM ET (US)
Depeneds on what year the Honda is but up until 2007 they were 505lb dry....lotsa cabbage too.
Perry posted 09-16-2007 09:40 PM ET (US)
It sure does depend on the year of that Honda in question. BTW, it couldn't be a 1993 BF115 because The BF115/130 wasn't introduced until 1998.
jimh posted 09-16-2007 09:58 PM ET (US)
Perry--Thanks for catching the five year error in the age of the motor. In retrospect, 1993 does seem very early for a four-stroke outboard to have appeared in that horsepower range. The era of the high-horsepower four-stroke outboard is not that old.
Royboy posted 09-16-2007 10:29 PM ET (US)
If I read the original post correctly, Quogue wants to bolt additional floatation onto the outside of the boat. If so, then it would increase the boyancy of his boat.

This is not a true statement:

quote:
You cannot improve the buoyancy of the hull by bolting on floatation.
Bolting additional volume onto a hull will increase the boyancy of the hull as long as whatever you bolt on there is boyant.
In practical application, however, this is probably not something you would want to do as it would require quite a large chunk to be added to make a meaningful improvement.
Roy
galtsfan posted 09-17-2007 09:15 PM ET (US)
I questioned the weight when I read this thread. I went on Hondas web site and the dry weight for the 25 inch shaft BF 115 (505 lbs) is more than my BF 150 (485 lbs) Hard to believe. Anyone know why it would weight more?
jimh posted 09-17-2007 10:48 PM ET (US)
There's the solution. Contact Royboy and he'll help you bolt on some floatation.
And when you bolt it on, whatever you do, do not use self-tapping screws.
Tohsgib posted 09-18-2007 10:36 AM ET (US)
It is the older 115/130 design, not the newer lighter engine. Should be obsolete soon if not already.
Royboy posted 09-18-2007 09:58 PM ET (US)
Or, you can be like Jimh and make up your own laws of physics and engineering principles and apply them however you like.
By the way, my 1998 135 merc weighs in at 492 lbs, but on an outrage II hull the static trim is fine. Shift whatever weight forward as you can.
Roy
towboater posted 09-19-2007 12:25 AM ET (US)
Start by plugging the scuppers in the splash well.
Get aboard carefull not to let water come over the splash well. Move aft and watch for overflow. Add another passenger, sit at the console, have the passenger move fwd first, then aft watching for water to overflow.
You are trying to figure out if the dry spash well adds floatation and at the same time, figure out if adding weight fwd or the combo of the two helps.
OK, if the dry splash well does help your trim, it may be worth the trouble to install a bilge pump in there and cover the entire splash well with alum plate or plastic sheeting. Fasten it but also be able to remove it if you want your engine tilted up all the way.
In the bow locker, for starters, just fill it with water or maybe even run with the drain plug out so long as you dont use it to stow dry goods. A little deeper draft, a little heavier...you have all the power in the world, you may like the ride.
good luck.
mk
Jefecinco posted 09-19-2007 09:04 AM ET (US)
RABUD SeaScupper could solve the problem of taking on water through the cockpit drains due to too much weight aft. Try www.rabud.com/seascupper.2htm and see if you think it would be useful.
Unlike plugging the drains the SeaScupper allows for drainage while underway. Pretty useful in a bad weather situation, IMO.
Butch
elaelap posted 09-23-2007 06:58 PM ET (US)
Well, here we go again with this topic. The solution is simple, Quoque. Move weight forward as suggested by CBO, and then complete the trim to your satisfaction with a bunch of 40 ounce lead fishing weights--even a lead ingot or two if necessary--in your anchor locker in a plastic bucket. It's really no big deal at all...I don't understand why so many small-motorboat folks shy away from trimming their craft, especially if they operate a boat such as yours with a huge amount of positive floatation. Sailors do it all the time; racers for speed and passage-makers because they have to deal with thousands of pounds of additional goods, spare parts, extra sails, fuel, water & belongings. Trim up that beauty...she looks godawful waving her bow in the air like that, and not only will look and handle better but will jump up onto plane much more swiftly with onboard weight properly distributed.
Tony
Or you could just lash some big styrofoam tubes along the topsides, port & starboard, to "increase buoyancy" ;-)

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Author	Topic: Heavy Engine on Outrage 17
Quogue	posted 09-15-2007 09:50 PM ET (US) My cousin just joined me as a Whaler owner. He bought a beautiful [1991] Outrage 17 with no bottom paint, and a [1993] Honda 115-HP with only 19 hours that weighs almost 500-lbs.. The Outrage is rated for a 120-HP. The problem is the OUTRAGE 17 is very low at rest, and with two people in the stern the water is almost at the transom level. My cousin would rather not change the engine as it is mint and makes this Whaler fly over 50-MPH. Does anyone make additional floatation that can be bolted onto the transom at the port and starbord side of the engine? Any ideas would be appreciated.
jimh	posted 09-15-2007 11:08 PM ET (US) You cannot improve the buoyancy of the hull by bolting on floatation. Buoyancy comes from the volume of water being displaced. If you need more buoyancy in the stern, you will have to increase the volume of the hull so that it displaces more water in the stern. I wouldn't be surprised if that Honda weighs more than 500-lbs. Those early Honda four-stroke motors were extremely large for their rated horsepower. They're monsters. You usually see them in commercial applications and on boats much larger than a 17-foot Boston Whaler.
Casco Bay Outrage	posted 09-16-2007 09:04 AM ET (US) I have a 1991 Outrage 17 with a 2003 Yamaha 115 4 stroke. It weighs about 435 lbs. with fluids and a prop. Still heavy and sits a bit low. Consider moving any gear stowed in the stern quarter seat compartments and under the bait well forward. Also, move heavy items from inside the console to the front cooler. Is the battery in the stern? If so, consider moving it to the console. This is a rare boat and handles exceptionally well for a 17. Regards CBO
Tohsgib	posted 09-16-2007 08:35 PM ET (US) Depeneds on what year the Honda is but up until 2007 they were 505lb dry....lotsa cabbage too.
Perry	posted 09-16-2007 09:40 PM ET (US) It sure does depend on the year of that Honda in question. BTW, it couldn't be a 1993 BF115 because The BF115/130 wasn't introduced until 1998.
jimh	posted 09-16-2007 09:58 PM ET (US) Perry--Thanks for catching the five year error in the age of the motor. In retrospect, 1993 does seem very early for a four-stroke outboard to have appeared in that horsepower range. The era of the high-horsepower four-stroke outboard is not that old.
Royboy	posted 09-16-2007 10:29 PM ET (US) If I read the original post correctly, Quogue wants to bolt additional floatation onto the outside of the boat. If so, then it would increase the boyancy of his boat. This is not a true statement: quote: You cannot improve the buoyancy of the hull by bolting on floatation. Bolting additional volume onto a hull will increase the boyancy of the hull as long as whatever you bolt on there is boyant. In practical application, however, this is probably not something you would want to do as it would require quite a large chunk to be added to make a meaningful improvement. Roy
galtsfan	posted 09-17-2007 09:15 PM ET (US) I questioned the weight when I read this thread. I went on Hondas web site and the dry weight for the 25 inch shaft BF 115 (505 lbs) is more than my BF 150 (485 lbs) Hard to believe. Anyone know why it would weight more?
jimh	posted 09-17-2007 10:48 PM ET (US) There's the solution. Contact Royboy and he'll help you bolt on some floatation. And when you bolt it on, whatever you do, do not use self-tapping screws.
Tohsgib	posted 09-18-2007 10:36 AM ET (US) It is the older 115/130 design, not the newer lighter engine. Should be obsolete soon if not already.
Royboy	posted 09-18-2007 09:58 PM ET (US) Or, you can be like Jimh and make up your own laws of physics and engineering principles and apply them however you like. By the way, my 1998 135 merc weighs in at 492 lbs, but on an outrage II hull the static trim is fine. Shift whatever weight forward as you can. Roy
towboater	posted 09-19-2007 12:25 AM ET (US) Start by plugging the scuppers in the splash well. Get aboard carefull not to let water come over the splash well. Move aft and watch for overflow. Add another passenger, sit at the console, have the passenger move fwd first, then aft watching for water to overflow. You are trying to figure out if the dry spash well adds floatation and at the same time, figure out if adding weight fwd or the combo of the two helps. OK, if the dry splash well does help your trim, it may be worth the trouble to install a bilge pump in there and cover the entire splash well with alum plate or plastic sheeting. Fasten it but also be able to remove it if you want your engine tilted up all the way. In the bow locker, for starters, just fill it with water or maybe even run with the drain plug out so long as you dont use it to stow dry goods. A little deeper draft, a little heavier...you have all the power in the world, you may like the ride. good luck. mk
Jefecinco	posted 09-19-2007 09:04 AM ET (US) RABUD SeaScupper could solve the problem of taking on water through the cockpit drains due to too much weight aft. Try www.rabud.com/seascupper.2htm and see if you think it would be useful. Unlike plugging the drains the SeaScupper allows for drainage while underway. Pretty useful in a bad weather situation, IMO. Butch
elaelap	posted 09-23-2007 06:58 PM ET (US) Well, here we go again with this topic. The solution is simple, Quoque. Move weight forward as suggested by CBO, and then complete the trim to your satisfaction with a bunch of 40 ounce lead fishing weights--even a lead ingot or two if necessary--in your anchor locker in a plastic bucket. It's really no big deal at all...I don't understand why so many small-motorboat folks shy away from trimming their craft, especially if they operate a boat such as yours with a huge amount of positive floatation. Sailors do it all the time; racers for speed and passage-makers because they have to deal with thousands of pounds of additional goods, spare parts, extra sails, fuel, water & belongings. Trim up that beauty...she looks godawful waving her bow in the air like that, and not only will look and handle better but will jump up onto plane much more swiftly with onboard weight properly distributed. Tony Or you could just lash some big styrofoam tubes along the topsides, port & starboard, to "increase buoyancy" ;-)