All About the 2002 Johnson 175--Or Maybe Not

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AK153 posted 12-25-2007 06:01 PM ET (US)
I need any information available on the 2002 Johnson 175-HP outboard motors, the good, bad, and ugly. If I understand correctly anything 2002 and newer should be fine. This could be pending a new Whaler purchase so any information in a timely fashion would be greatly appreciated. I have researched the archives and have found some helpful information but more is better.
Thanks in advance,
Mel
jimh posted 12-25-2007 06:38 PM ET (US)
What exactly are you asking about?
AK153 posted 12-25-2007 09:15 PM ET (US)
Jim,
Search the archives and you will see what I'm talking about. 2001/2002 model year seems to be the time frame when these problems were getting resolved. Please understand I'm just asking for advice and I couldn't find any information that gave me a warm fuzzy. There was some information but as you know when members talk outboards it's sometimes hard to get a honest, straight answer. If there aren't any huge problems with these Johnson 2002 models I wouldn't want to pass up a chance to own a larger Whaler. I hope this makes sense and I apologize if it doesn't.
Thanks,
Mel
jimh posted 12-25-2007 09:57 PM ET (US)

quote:

"2001/2002 model year seems to be the time frame when these problems were getting resolved."
Could you be specific about "these problems"?
Generally we "search the archives" to find the answers, not to find the questions. :-)
Peter posted 12-25-2007 10:48 PM ET (US)
2002 was the first model year for Johnson and Evinrude products under the BRP ownership era. Those products and all thereafter bear a Bombardier or BRP trademark in addition to the Evinrude or Johnson trademark. The story has it that BRP threw out any parts in the OMC inventory that it acquired that didn't meet specifications.
Having owned a pair of 2002 Evinrude 225s for the last 4 years (more than 400 hours) with only one problem apparently caused by excess ethanol in the fuel, I think its reasonable to have confidence in the 2002 Johnson 175s. Like any used motor, have them checked out by a qualified Johnson technician prior to purchase.
I wouldn't hesitate at all on those motors provided they checked out OK by the tech.
Tohsgib posted 12-26-2007 12:30 AM ET (US)
I love these questions....the engines are almost 5 years old. If they were junk they would have blown years ago. Any engine that IS 5 years old, no matter the best made or worst, at this point could last 5 minutes or 5000 hours. My point is after 5 years it has proven to be reliable but ANY engine can die tomorrow, no matter what the reputation. But to more directly answer your question....the 2002 should be a BRP and was covered under full BRP warranty and have proven to be reliable.
AK153 posted 12-26-2007 01:01 AM ET (US)
Tohsgib,
Sorry, the motor in question has only 140 hours. It shouldn't make me nervous but buying a Whaler sight unseen makes me very cautious and thorough. Unfortunately, you guys get to take the hit for my crazy questions. Thanks for the information, it was much appreciated.
Peter,
Thank you for the reply as I assume you understood exactly what I was referring to. You have eased my mine but as Nick stated, they could last 5 minutes or 5,000 hours. It's a gamble I'm now willing to take.
Jim,
I should have been more specific about the injector and plug fouling problems. I was in a super hurry and we all know clean used Whalers don't sit around long.
Thanks for all your patience,
Mel
Tohsgib posted 12-26-2007 01:05 AM ET (US)
Oh...the OIS ignition system is pretty reliable but a little expensive to replace/diagnose. Not sure how much it was perfected since my 1991 175. Mine also lasted 15 years if it was original(bought it used).
Peter posted 12-26-2007 07:33 AM ET (US)
Mel -- All motors, whether new or used could last 5 minutes or 5000 hours. The only difference is that if you buy new, you have a warranty to fall back on but the price is, of course, higher.
A common killer of V6 2-strokes is an air leak into the fuel line. If you buy the boat, go through the fuel system and make sure that all of the fuel line connections to the motor are tight.
I have a 2003 150 on my 18 Outrage and am very pleased with it. It is amazingly quiet for a carbureted 2-stroke V6. The 175 is built on the same 60 degree V6 block. The only drawback is that they, like all carbureted 2-strokes, are thirsty critters.
jimh posted 12-26-2007 08:01 AM ET (US)
Mel--I don't understand your reference to the 2002 Johnson 175-HP motor as having a reputation for chronic problems with "injectors" or "spark plug fouling."
To the best of my knowledge, a 2002 Johnson 175 motor has carburetors. It does not have fuel injectors.
The 2002 Johnson 175 probably has the Optical Ignition Sensing System (OIS 2000). The OIS 2000 was an improvement in the generation of ignition timing signals. OIS 2000 uses an optical sensor to create the electrical signals to control ignition timing and spark plug firing. Older Johnson engines (and just about all other outboard motors) use an inductive system of rotating trigger magnets and stationary sensor coils to generate those signals.
I believe the impetus for the change to OIS 2000 for ignition spark timing generation was to improve the accuracy and stability of the ignition timing.

AK153 posted 01-04-2008 03:00 PM ET (US)
Jim,
I found out a little more information from the owner. He says it's(as you said) a carbed motor and is a model "PXEE". I have no idea what that symbolizes and could find zero information. Have any ideas? He had the carbs rejetted by the dealer and states the VRO is still attached. Maybe, I'll be shipping a new Whaler?
Mel
Tom W Clark posted 01-04-2008 03:34 PM ET (US)
Model number suffix "PXEE" indicates the motor is a 1999 model not a 2002 model, though it may not have been sold until 2002.
Peter posted 01-04-2008 05:10 PM ET (US)
Mel -- What does the cowl on the 175 look like. Is it boxy or rounded? A 1999 would have a boxy cowl with a Seahorse design below the JOHNSON name and a 2002 would have a rounded cowl with three identical stripes below the JOHNSON name and a round Bombardier badge on the back.
AK153 posted 01-04-2008 05:46 PM ET (US)
Tom,
You're incredible! Did you receive the email about the boat/motor in question? I'm trying to be patient but I think I could be happy with the 20'. Please let me know what you think as your opinion/ knowledge holds a-lot of weight.
Peter,
The whole problem with this purchase is the LACK of pictures. The owner has tried emailing detailed pictures several times with no success. It is supposed to be resolved tonight and I will post any info. Hopefully, some of this information will help other members in the future with some pictures possibly archived.
I'm going to owe you guys if this Whaler is worth going thru.
Thanks again,
Mel
Tom W Clark posted 01-04-2008 06:07 PM ET (US)
Mel,
I did receive your email copy of the ad. I did not make the connection between that boat and this thread until now. I am sorry for not being more perceptive.
I have only seen one photo of this boat and the motor is not visible.
Do I have this straight that you are in Fairbanks, AK? The boat is in Bremerton, WA. I strongly discourage you from buying this boat or any other without flying down to look at it in person or at the least having somebody knowledgeable look at it for you.
AK153 posted 01-04-2008 07:53 PM ET (US)
Tom,
Don't worry, as soon as I receive pictures I'll be sending you an email with an offer.
Mel
Tohsgib posted 01-05-2008 12:05 PM ET (US)
OMC Model Designation
Imbedded in the model number is the Make, horsepower and year of the engine.
For example:
If your model number is J200TLCOS your engine is a 1985 200hpJohnson engine.
The first Letter corresponds to the first letter of the make of your engine.
The next numbers are the engine hp.
The second to last two letters correspond to the year listed in the chart below.
1980(CS) 1981(CI) 1982(CN) 1983(CT) 1984(CR) 1985(CO)
1986(CD) 1987(CU) 1988(CC) 1989(CE) 1990(ES) 1991(EI)
1992(EN) 1993(ET) 1994(ER) 1995(EO) 1996(ED) 1997(EU)
1998(EC) 1999(EE) 2000(SS) 2001(SI)
If it was a 2002 it would be a SN for the last two digits. I would seriously want some money off that boat being the 1999 was pretty much the "junk" years for OMC. nOt really being this engine is still going strong but I would use that "theory" as a strong bargaining point.
Sal DiMercurio posted 01-05-2008 01:52 PM ET (US)
That [which one?--jimh] particular 60-degree power head has been in production since 1991, and is proven time and time again to be a very good engine. I believe the 1999 models were ONLY with the 150 and 175-HP Evinrude FICHT engines, not the carburetor two-cycle. Didn't Johnson go to all four-cycle engines around 2000? The only problem I can think of with the Johnson would be some of the lower units had gears either too soft or too hard and couldn't handle the torque; they went bad.
Sal
AK153 posted 01-05-2008 04:00 PM ET (US)
Nick,
Thank you for the information. Maybe Jimh can archive that chart as it may be helpful to others as well. If I don't receive photos soon I'm going to pass on the deal.
Sal,
I was told the same thing about the Ficht's only having the mentioned problems and that is why I tried to gather as much info as possible.
Thanks again,
Mel
Sal DiMercurio posted 01-06-2008 08:12 PM ET (US)
Jim, the subject is a 2002 Johnson 175 horse power, that is the engine I'm refering to.
The problem engines for OMC, were the 1999 - 150 hp & 175 hp Evinrude FICHT engines [ those 2 engines are exactly the same, except for the computer ].
Sal
Tohsgib posted 01-07-2008 12:07 PM ET (US)
Actually it was the 1997-2000 Ficht that had big problems in that HP range but many are under the impression that OMC was building shit from about 1997 or so until they closed in 01. 1999 falls under those years. Again being it has been runing since 1999 or so, it was most likely a good one. I would use it as a bargaining tool but would not pass on the deal. I had a 1991 175 on my 19 Revenge and although I sold it 2 years ago, she is still going strong and never rebuilt.
Tohsgib posted 01-07-2008 12:08 PM ET (US)
PS...Sal they made the 2 smoke 150/175 until 2006 even though they had 4 strokes as well.
GSH posted 01-09-2008 03:11 PM ET (US)
Regarding the OMC model year letter code:
1 – 2 – 3 – 4 – 5 – 6 – 7 – 8 – 9 – 0 =
I – N – T – R – O – D – U – C – E – S
Just remember that the number series starts with number one and ends with zero, and the word ”introduces”.
-Seb
AK153 posted 01-09-2008 09:57 PM ET (US)
Seb,
That acronym makes it very easy to remember.
Thanks,
Mel
Classic whalers and possibly Sako rifles? That could be an excellent combination!

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Author	Topic: All About the 2002 Johnson 175--Or Maybe Not
AK153	posted 12-25-2007 06:01 PM ET (US) I need any information available on the 2002 Johnson 175-HP outboard motors, the good, bad, and ugly. If I understand correctly anything 2002 and newer should be fine. This could be pending a new Whaler purchase so any information in a timely fashion would be greatly appreciated. I have researched the archives and have found some helpful information but more is better. Thanks in advance, Mel
jimh	posted 12-25-2007 06:38 PM ET (US) What exactly are you asking about?
AK153	posted 12-25-2007 09:15 PM ET (US) Jim, Search the archives and you will see what I'm talking about. 2001/2002 model year seems to be the time frame when these problems were getting resolved. Please understand I'm just asking for advice and I couldn't find any information that gave me a warm fuzzy. There was some information but as you know when members talk outboards it's sometimes hard to get a honest, straight answer. If there aren't any huge problems with these Johnson 2002 models I wouldn't want to pass up a chance to own a larger Whaler. I hope this makes sense and I apologize if it doesn't. Thanks, Mel
jimh	posted 12-25-2007 09:57 PM ET (US) quote: "2001/2002 model year seems to be the time frame when these problems were getting resolved." Could you be specific about "these problems"? Generally we "search the archives" to find the answers, not to find the questions. :-)
Peter	posted 12-25-2007 10:48 PM ET (US) 2002 was the first model year for Johnson and Evinrude products under the BRP ownership era. Those products and all thereafter bear a Bombardier or BRP trademark in addition to the Evinrude or Johnson trademark. The story has it that BRP threw out any parts in the OMC inventory that it acquired that didn't meet specifications. Having owned a pair of 2002 Evinrude 225s for the last 4 years (more than 400 hours) with only one problem apparently caused by excess ethanol in the fuel, I think its reasonable to have confidence in the 2002 Johnson 175s. Like any used motor, have them checked out by a qualified Johnson technician prior to purchase. I wouldn't hesitate at all on those motors provided they checked out OK by the tech.
Tohsgib	posted 12-26-2007 12:30 AM ET (US) I love these questions....the engines are almost 5 years old. If they were junk they would have blown years ago. Any engine that IS 5 years old, no matter the best made or worst, at this point could last 5 minutes or 5000 hours. My point is after 5 years it has proven to be reliable but ANY engine can die tomorrow, no matter what the reputation. But to more directly answer your question....the 2002 should be a BRP and was covered under full BRP warranty and have proven to be reliable.
AK153	posted 12-26-2007 01:01 AM ET (US) Tohsgib, Sorry, the motor in question has only 140 hours. It shouldn't make me nervous but buying a Whaler sight unseen makes me very cautious and thorough. Unfortunately, you guys get to take the hit for my crazy questions. Thanks for the information, it was much appreciated. Peter, Thank you for the reply as I assume you understood exactly what I was referring to. You have eased my mine but as Nick stated, they could last 5 minutes or 5,000 hours. It's a gamble I'm now willing to take. Jim, I should have been more specific about the injector and plug fouling problems. I was in a super hurry and we all know clean used Whalers don't sit around long. Thanks for all your patience, Mel
Tohsgib	posted 12-26-2007 01:05 AM ET (US) Oh...the OIS ignition system is pretty reliable but a little expensive to replace/diagnose. Not sure how much it was perfected since my 1991 175. Mine also lasted 15 years if it was original(bought it used).
Peter	posted 12-26-2007 07:33 AM ET (US) Mel -- All motors, whether new or used could last 5 minutes or 5000 hours. The only difference is that if you buy new, you have a warranty to fall back on but the price is, of course, higher. A common killer of V6 2-strokes is an air leak into the fuel line. If you buy the boat, go through the fuel system and make sure that all of the fuel line connections to the motor are tight. I have a 2003 150 on my 18 Outrage and am very pleased with it. It is amazingly quiet for a carbureted 2-stroke V6. The 175 is built on the same 60 degree V6 block. The only drawback is that they, like all carbureted 2-strokes, are thirsty critters.
jimh	posted 12-26-2007 08:01 AM ET (US) Mel--I don't understand your reference to the 2002 Johnson 175-HP motor as having a reputation for chronic problems with "injectors" or "spark plug fouling." To the best of my knowledge, a 2002 Johnson 175 motor has carburetors. It does not have fuel injectors. The 2002 Johnson 175 probably has the Optical Ignition Sensing System (OIS 2000). The OIS 2000 was an improvement in the generation of ignition timing signals. OIS 2000 uses an optical sensor to create the electrical signals to control ignition timing and spark plug firing. Older Johnson engines (and just about all other outboard motors) use an inductive system of rotating trigger magnets and stationary sensor coils to generate those signals. I believe the impetus for the change to OIS 2000 for ignition spark timing generation was to improve the accuracy and stability of the ignition timing.
AK153	posted 01-04-2008 03:00 PM ET (US) Jim, I found out a little more information from the owner. He says it's(as you said) a carbed motor and is a model "PXEE". I have no idea what that symbolizes and could find zero information. Have any ideas? He had the carbs rejetted by the dealer and states the VRO is still attached. Maybe, I'll be shipping a new Whaler? Mel
Tom W Clark	posted 01-04-2008 03:34 PM ET (US) Model number suffix "PXEE" indicates the motor is a 1999 model not a 2002 model, though it may not have been sold until 2002.
Peter	posted 01-04-2008 05:10 PM ET (US) Mel -- What does the cowl on the 175 look like. Is it boxy or rounded? A 1999 would have a boxy cowl with a Seahorse design below the JOHNSON name and a 2002 would have a rounded cowl with three identical stripes below the JOHNSON name and a round Bombardier badge on the back.
AK153	posted 01-04-2008 05:46 PM ET (US) Tom, You're incredible! Did you receive the email about the boat/motor in question? I'm trying to be patient but I think I could be happy with the 20'. Please let me know what you think as your opinion/ knowledge holds a-lot of weight. Peter, The whole problem with this purchase is the LACK of pictures. The owner has tried emailing detailed pictures several times with no success. It is supposed to be resolved tonight and I will post any info. Hopefully, some of this information will help other members in the future with some pictures possibly archived. I'm going to owe you guys if this Whaler is worth going thru. Thanks again, Mel
Tom W Clark	posted 01-04-2008 06:07 PM ET (US) Mel, I did receive your email copy of the ad. I did not make the connection between that boat and this thread until now. I am sorry for not being more perceptive. I have only seen one photo of this boat and the motor is not visible. Do I have this straight that you are in Fairbanks, AK? The boat is in Bremerton, WA. I strongly discourage you from buying this boat or any other without flying down to look at it in person or at the least having somebody knowledgeable look at it for you.
AK153	posted 01-04-2008 07:53 PM ET (US) Tom, Don't worry, as soon as I receive pictures I'll be sending you an email with an offer. Mel
Tohsgib	posted 01-05-2008 12:05 PM ET (US) OMC Model Designation Imbedded in the model number is the Make, horsepower and year of the engine. For example: If your model number is J200TLCOS your engine is a 1985 200hpJohnson engine. The first Letter corresponds to the first letter of the make of your engine. The next numbers are the engine hp. The second to last two letters correspond to the year listed in the chart below. 1980(CS) 1981(CI) 1982(CN) 1983(CT) 1984(CR) 1985(CO) 1986(CD) 1987(CU) 1988(CC) 1989(CE) 1990(ES) 1991(EI) 1992(EN) 1993(ET) 1994(ER) 1995(EO) 1996(ED) 1997(EU) 1998(EC) 1999(EE) 2000(SS) 2001(SI) If it was a 2002 it would be a SN for the last two digits. I would seriously want some money off that boat being the 1999 was pretty much the "junk" years for OMC. nOt really being this engine is still going strong but I would use that "theory" as a strong bargaining point.
Sal DiMercurio	posted 01-05-2008 01:52 PM ET (US) That [which one?--jimh] particular 60-degree power head has been in production since 1991, and is proven time and time again to be a very good engine. I believe the 1999 models were ONLY with the 150 and 175-HP Evinrude FICHT engines, not the carburetor two-cycle. Didn't Johnson go to all four-cycle engines around 2000? The only problem I can think of with the Johnson would be some of the lower units had gears either too soft or too hard and couldn't handle the torque; they went bad. Sal
AK153	posted 01-05-2008 04:00 PM ET (US) Nick, Thank you for the information. Maybe Jimh can archive that chart as it may be helpful to others as well. If I don't receive photos soon I'm going to pass on the deal. Sal, I was told the same thing about the Ficht's only having the mentioned problems and that is why I tried to gather as much info as possible. Thanks again, Mel
Sal DiMercurio	posted 01-06-2008 08:12 PM ET (US) Jim, the subject is a 2002 Johnson 175 horse power, that is the engine I'm refering to. The problem engines for OMC, were the 1999 - 150 hp & 175 hp Evinrude FICHT engines [ those 2 engines are exactly the same, except for the computer ]. Sal
Tohsgib	posted 01-07-2008 12:07 PM ET (US) Actually it was the 1997-2000 Ficht that had big problems in that HP range but many are under the impression that OMC was building shit from about 1997 or so until they closed in 01. 1999 falls under those years. Again being it has been runing since 1999 or so, it was most likely a good one. I would use it as a bargaining tool but would not pass on the deal. I had a 1991 175 on my 19 Revenge and although I sold it 2 years ago, she is still going strong and never rebuilt.
Tohsgib	posted 01-07-2008 12:08 PM ET (US) PS...Sal they made the 2 smoke 150/175 until 2006 even though they had 4 strokes as well.
GSH	posted 01-09-2008 03:11 PM ET (US) Regarding the OMC model year letter code: 1 – 2 – 3 – 4 – 5 – 6 – 7 – 8 – 9 – 0 = I – N – T – R – O – D – U – C – E – S Just remember that the number series starts with number one and ends with zero, and the word ”introduces”. -Seb
AK153	posted 01-09-2008 09:57 PM ET (US) Seb, That acronym makes it very easy to remember. Thanks, Mel Classic whalers and possibly Sako rifles? That could be an excellent combination!