Running A Mercury 60 Bigfoot In Cold Conditions

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Author Topic:   Running A Mercury 60 Bigfoot In Cold Conditions

wldrns1 posted 11-11-2009 07:08 PM ET (US)
Here in the Northeast, late fall can be some of the best time for fishing for walleye and perch. My old early 1970's Johnson 35 (on a 13 Sport) had no problem in freezing temperatures.
I've been out a few times this fall on my 2008 150 Sport with Mercury 60 Bigfoot. Provided I allow ample warm-up time and make sure all water is drained via full trim in between trips, is there anything I should be doing or be concerned about with regard to running in these temperatures? Some mornings I'm sure to breaking through skim ice at the launch.
sosmerc posted 11-11-2009 07:51 PM ET (US)
One thing that would concern me about running any outboard in freezing or near freezing temps: before attempting to start, let the lower unit sit submerged in the down position for a few minutes to give any ice that may have formed inside the impeller housing or on the impeller blades a chance to melt. Otherwise the blades may just rip off if they are frozen to the side of the impeller housing.
Some people don't winterize, they just go out every so often and start their engine. This could be disastrous if there is ice inside the water pump.
wldrns1 posted 11-12-2009 01:20 AM ET (US)
Excellent point as wind chill can be a factor trailering to the launch. Could be frozen upon arrival. Didn't think of that. Thanks!
I'll remove my gimbal mounted plotter and SONAR for the ride, too. Trailering at 60-MPH with temperatures of 40 degrees equals wind chill of +25. Powering up frozen electronics doesn't seem like a good idea either. sosmerc--you just might have saved the day. Thanks again.
tmann45 posted 11-12-2009 07:27 AM ET (US)
Wind chill does not affect inanimate objects, only humans.
weekendwarrior posted 11-12-2009 07:57 AM ET (US)
Close. Wind chill will affect anything warmer than ambient temp. The wind chill numbers given by the weatherman assume the object being chilled is body temp. Even if you died outside, your body would not ever get cooler than the air temp regardless of the "winchill" temp. So wind will cool a hot motor faster, but it will never get colder than air temp. Same goes for your body. Good luck, too cold for me!
Tohsgib posted 11-12-2009 11:13 AM ET (US)
Went waterskiing in NJ in December once....ONCE!
Buckda posted 11-12-2009 11:35 AM ET (US)
Since outboards are raw water cooled, I'm wondering if there isn't any concern that the thermostats might allow too much cooling to reach the powerhead - meaning lower efficiency and increased carbon build up?
Just a thought.
Based on that, I'd probably run Mercury's carbon guard product in my fuel in the wintertime, on top of the other precautions mentioned.
Also - make sure you check your lower unit oil for water...this time of year, water in the lower unit cold cause problems when frozen....
Dave
69boo307 posted 11-12-2009 12:02 PM ET (US)
Regarding electronics, heat is their enemy, not cold. A circuit board will operate just fine submerged in liquid nitrogen. Electric circuits do not 'freeze'. Now if a change in temperature such as from warm to cold causes water condensation to form inside the electronic device, that is a different issue.
Buckda posted 11-12-2009 12:07 PM ET (US)
Your electronics will have a temperature rating...check your manual. LCD Screens don't work well at below freezing temperatures, but 40 degrees shouldn't be a problem for them.
15 degrees? That's a different topic - so for your early morning runs on brisk 20* +/- chilly mornings keep that in mind.
Tohsgib posted 11-12-2009 12:13 PM ET (US)
Be carefull. I left my fishfinder in the boat one winter by accident. In the spring it was shongo...the LCD screen froze.
Buckda posted 11-12-2009 12:34 PM ET (US)
nick -
I just checked Garmin's site for the 400 series and they're rated down to 5 degrees now. I think the older ones were more sensitive to freezing temperatures.
I know my 196S has trouble below freezing...but the 2006c doesn't (both Garmin units).
wldrns1 posted 11-12-2009 12:52 PM ET (US)
Thanks to the swing-away tongue, I keep the boat garaged. Even then I remove the plotter/sonar during winter months just to play it safe. I'll have to look into carbon guard. Wasn't aware of it. For end of season use, concerns over efficiency are cast to the wind! When roads around here get their first dose of salt, I'm done.
bloller posted 11-12-2009 12:57 PM ET (US)
Mercury does not reccomend using its synthetic four stroke oil at temperatures below 40 degrees.
wldrns1 posted 11-12-2009 01:03 PM ET (US)
That would be cooling water or air temperature?
Checked the spec for my electronics. -20 degrees F.
Buckda posted 11-12-2009 01:13 PM ET (US)
There's that word again...shongo....
tedious posted 11-12-2009 02:25 PM ET (US)
Unless you're running without a thermostat, I would not worry about the water being cold and causing carbon buildup. The thermostat should keep the temp in the operating range. On the other hand, a little Sea Foam or other carbon-removing product is never a bad idea.
Very surprised that Mercury's synthetic oil isn't rated below 40 degrees - as far as I'm concerned, performance in the cold is one of the key benefits of synthetics.
Tim
Tohsgib posted 11-12-2009 02:32 PM ET (US)
I bet it is but just not the weight. A 10-40 might not be good under 40 degrees in an outboard, might have to switch to a 5-30 or something to run colder. Read your owner's manual.
Tohsgib posted 11-12-2009 02:35 PM ET (US)
My Suzuki manual states to use 10-40 and it's good down till -4. It also states "in very cold weather(below -15), use 5-30 for good starting and smooth operation".
wldrns1 posted 11-12-2009 03:51 PM ET (US)
From what I see on the Merc Site, synthetic viscosity is 25w-40. The crude product is 10w-30. I don't see a product Spec Sheet offered online.
Even with the outstanding advise offered here, the Owners Manual should be the 'controlling document'. If nothing else, related in-warranty issues (hopefully none) can't become non-warranty issues due to improper maintenance.
tedious...the thermostat reasoning. I agree. If the Owners Manual does't specify a minimum operating temperature, the engine should be able to handle much more (or less) than I.
bloller posted 11-12-2009 04:54 PM ET (US)
As far as I know, there are only two four stroke oils available from Mercury/Quicksilver. The 10w-30 crude product and the 25w-40 synthetic. My owners manual and a label on the flywheel cover both indicate that the 10w-30 can be used at all temps and that the 25w-40 should be used only at temperatures above 40 degrees. My engine is a 2004 60hp Efi Fourstroke.
Buckda posted 11-12-2009 05:16 PM ET (US)
Sounds like you should consider the lower viscosity standard oil if you plan to operate early and late season in areas where temperatures are expected to be below 40degrees. The 25W-40 oil is designed for warmer operating ranges - where most people do their boating. The 10W-30 should give you service to temperatures well below zero and still allow the oil to flow properly to reduce friction even on the coldest of mornings.
JMARTIN posted 11-12-2009 07:38 PM ET (US)
Way back in 1985 I went to Mobil's lubricant school. One of the instructors told us that the W in let's say 10W-30 stands for winter. I always thought it meant weight. So a 5W-30 would be a better oil for really cold weather than a 10W-30.
If I remember correctly, to make a 10W-40, they start with a 10 weight oil and put additives in that brings it up to a 40 weight when hot. The old V-8 motors lumbered down the freeway at a pretty low rpm and used 10W-40. As the motor oil degraded with heat and wear, the additives went away bringing the oil down to a 10W-30 and then to a 10W-20 and so on.
Today's higher revving engines would burn off the 40W right away so we see 10W-30 and 5W-30 being recommended for today's engines. Synthetics are good for cold weather viscosity but as before a 5W-30 synthetic will handle the really cold better than a 10W-30.
Unless you are really cold, the 10W-30 offers more protection being a 10 weight than the 5 weight. But if it's really cold, you need the lower viscosity of the 5 weight when you are starting up.
Since all engines are different, check with the manufacturer as to what their recommendation would be for the temperatures you are going to be running in.
John
Tohsgib posted 11-13-2009 10:52 AM ET (US)
Viscosity has changed a LOT due to tolerances and the like. My Wife's Civic Hybrid uses 0W-20 Mobil one.

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Author	Topic: Running A Mercury 60 Bigfoot In Cold Conditions
wldrns1	posted 11-11-2009 07:08 PM ET (US) Here in the Northeast, late fall can be some of the best time for fishing for walleye and perch. My old early 1970's Johnson 35 (on a 13 Sport) had no problem in freezing temperatures. I've been out a few times this fall on my 2008 150 Sport with Mercury 60 Bigfoot. Provided I allow ample warm-up time and make sure all water is drained via full trim in between trips, is there anything I should be doing or be concerned about with regard to running in these temperatures? Some mornings I'm sure to breaking through skim ice at the launch.
sosmerc	posted 11-11-2009 07:51 PM ET (US) One thing that would concern me about running any outboard in freezing or near freezing temps: before attempting to start, let the lower unit sit submerged in the down position for a few minutes to give any ice that may have formed inside the impeller housing or on the impeller blades a chance to melt. Otherwise the blades may just rip off if they are frozen to the side of the impeller housing. Some people don't winterize, they just go out every so often and start their engine. This could be disastrous if there is ice inside the water pump.
wldrns1	posted 11-12-2009 01:20 AM ET (US) Excellent point as wind chill can be a factor trailering to the launch. Could be frozen upon arrival. Didn't think of that. Thanks! I'll remove my gimbal mounted plotter and SONAR for the ride, too. Trailering at 60-MPH with temperatures of 40 degrees equals wind chill of +25. Powering up frozen electronics doesn't seem like a good idea either. sosmerc--you just might have saved the day. Thanks again.
tmann45	posted 11-12-2009 07:27 AM ET (US) Wind chill does not affect inanimate objects, only humans.
weekendwarrior	posted 11-12-2009 07:57 AM ET (US) Close. Wind chill will affect anything warmer than ambient temp. The wind chill numbers given by the weatherman assume the object being chilled is body temp. Even if you died outside, your body would not ever get cooler than the air temp regardless of the "winchill" temp. So wind will cool a hot motor faster, but it will never get colder than air temp. Same goes for your body. Good luck, too cold for me!
Tohsgib	posted 11-12-2009 11:13 AM ET (US) Went waterskiing in NJ in December once....ONCE!
Buckda	posted 11-12-2009 11:35 AM ET (US) Since outboards are raw water cooled, I'm wondering if there isn't any concern that the thermostats might allow too much cooling to reach the powerhead - meaning lower efficiency and increased carbon build up? Just a thought. Based on that, I'd probably run Mercury's carbon guard product in my fuel in the wintertime, on top of the other precautions mentioned. Also - make sure you check your lower unit oil for water...this time of year, water in the lower unit cold cause problems when frozen.... Dave
69boo307	posted 11-12-2009 12:02 PM ET (US) Regarding electronics, heat is their enemy, not cold. A circuit board will operate just fine submerged in liquid nitrogen. Electric circuits do not 'freeze'. Now if a change in temperature such as from warm to cold causes water condensation to form inside the electronic device, that is a different issue.
Buckda	posted 11-12-2009 12:07 PM ET (US) Your electronics will have a temperature rating...check your manual. LCD Screens don't work well at below freezing temperatures, but 40 degrees shouldn't be a problem for them. 15 degrees? That's a different topic - so for your early morning runs on brisk 20* +/- chilly mornings keep that in mind.
Tohsgib	posted 11-12-2009 12:13 PM ET (US) Be carefull. I left my fishfinder in the boat one winter by accident. In the spring it was shongo...the LCD screen froze.
Buckda	posted 11-12-2009 12:34 PM ET (US) nick - I just checked Garmin's site for the 400 series and they're rated down to 5 degrees now. I think the older ones were more sensitive to freezing temperatures. I know my 196S has trouble below freezing...but the 2006c doesn't (both Garmin units).
wldrns1	posted 11-12-2009 12:52 PM ET (US) Thanks to the swing-away tongue, I keep the boat garaged. Even then I remove the plotter/sonar during winter months just to play it safe. I'll have to look into carbon guard. Wasn't aware of it. For end of season use, concerns over efficiency are cast to the wind! When roads around here get their first dose of salt, I'm done.
bloller	posted 11-12-2009 12:57 PM ET (US) Mercury does not reccomend using its synthetic four stroke oil at temperatures below 40 degrees.
wldrns1	posted 11-12-2009 01:03 PM ET (US) That would be cooling water or air temperature? Checked the spec for my electronics. -20 degrees F.
Buckda	posted 11-12-2009 01:13 PM ET (US) There's that word again...shongo....
tedious	posted 11-12-2009 02:25 PM ET (US) Unless you're running without a thermostat, I would not worry about the water being cold and causing carbon buildup. The thermostat should keep the temp in the operating range. On the other hand, a little Sea Foam or other carbon-removing product is never a bad idea. Very surprised that Mercury's synthetic oil isn't rated below 40 degrees - as far as I'm concerned, performance in the cold is one of the key benefits of synthetics. Tim
Tohsgib	posted 11-12-2009 02:32 PM ET (US) I bet it is but just not the weight. A 10-40 might not be good under 40 degrees in an outboard, might have to switch to a 5-30 or something to run colder. Read your owner's manual.
Tohsgib	posted 11-12-2009 02:35 PM ET (US) My Suzuki manual states to use 10-40 and it's good down till -4. It also states "in very cold weather(below -15), use 5-30 for good starting and smooth operation".
wldrns1	posted 11-12-2009 03:51 PM ET (US) From what I see on the Merc Site, synthetic viscosity is 25w-40. The crude product is 10w-30. I don't see a product Spec Sheet offered online. Even with the outstanding advise offered here, the Owners Manual should be the 'controlling document'. If nothing else, related in-warranty issues (hopefully none) can't become non-warranty issues due to improper maintenance. tedious...the thermostat reasoning. I agree. If the Owners Manual does't specify a minimum operating temperature, the engine should be able to handle much more (or less) than I.
bloller	posted 11-12-2009 04:54 PM ET (US) As far as I know, there are only two four stroke oils available from Mercury/Quicksilver. The 10w-30 crude product and the 25w-40 synthetic. My owners manual and a label on the flywheel cover both indicate that the 10w-30 can be used at all temps and that the 25w-40 should be used only at temperatures above 40 degrees. My engine is a 2004 60hp Efi Fourstroke.
Buckda	posted 11-12-2009 05:16 PM ET (US) Sounds like you should consider the lower viscosity standard oil if you plan to operate early and late season in areas where temperatures are expected to be below 40degrees. The 25W-40 oil is designed for warmer operating ranges - where most people do their boating. The 10W-30 should give you service to temperatures well below zero and still allow the oil to flow properly to reduce friction even on the coldest of mornings.
JMARTIN	posted 11-12-2009 07:38 PM ET (US) Way back in 1985 I went to Mobil's lubricant school. One of the instructors told us that the W in let's say 10W-30 stands for winter. I always thought it meant weight. So a 5W-30 would be a better oil for really cold weather than a 10W-30. If I remember correctly, to make a 10W-40, they start with a 10 weight oil and put additives in that brings it up to a 40 weight when hot. The old V-8 motors lumbered down the freeway at a pretty low rpm and used 10W-40. As the motor oil degraded with heat and wear, the additives went away bringing the oil down to a 10W-30 and then to a 10W-20 and so on. Today's higher revving engines would burn off the 40W right away so we see 10W-30 and 5W-30 being recommended for today's engines. Synthetics are good for cold weather viscosity but as before a 5W-30 synthetic will handle the really cold better than a 10W-30. Unless you are really cold, the 10W-30 offers more protection being a 10 weight than the 5 weight. But if it's really cold, you need the lower viscosity of the 5 weight when you are starting up. Since all engines are different, check with the manufacturer as to what their recommendation would be for the temperatures you are going to be running in. John
Tohsgib	posted 11-13-2009 10:52 AM ET (US) Viscosity has changed a LOT due to tolerances and the like. My Wife's Civic Hybrid uses 0W-20 Mobil one.