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Author Topic:   Nantucket-Livewell FAILURE!
Whalerider posted 05-28-2005 02:18 PM ET (US)   Profile for Whalerider   Send Email to Whalerider  
20 miles offshore today and decided to catch some live bait and try that for the kingfish we were looking for. Well...turned on the livewell pump, then reached into the livewell to insert the drain plug and the entire drain assembly broke off the livewell and fell through the bottom of the livewell into the bilge. Now ... I am left with a 1.5 in drain hose that exits below the water line, no shut-off of any kind, wondering if I am going to have to test out the unsinkability of my Whaler. As it turns out….the hose is high enough that water doesn’t backflow into the boat. We decided that better safe than sorry and called it a day.

Don’t get me wrong, I love my whaler, but the livewell insert is made of some sort of plastic that is PAPER THIN! I can’t believe that it can actually hold as much water as it does and not break apart from the weight of the water alone. (Maybe it did?) I am VERY disappointed in the quality of this particular part.

I will go to the dealer Tuesday and see about a repair. The bad part is....to replace or repair the live well means taking out the console, removing the fuel tank cover, etc to gain access. Oh my!

I have a question for you guys out there. My dealer's mechanics are very capable but, VERY messy when it comes to repairs. I am not sure that they can (or want too) lay down a bead of caulking without it looking like a 2nd grader did it. I am also concerned that removing the console and fuel tank cover will cause it to be damaged or damage my boat in the removal process. Do you think I should insist that BW factory repair it or let my sloppy dealer try to handle it? It will be a warranty item.

Sadly,
Mark


Sadly,
Mark

tuna1 posted 05-28-2005 05:09 PM ET (US)     Profile for tuna1  Send Email to tuna1     
Most likely a junior laborer at the dealer will be assigned to your repair,unless you speakup about your concerns about the level of effort a quality repair should entail.Speak up,expressing your concerns with your dealer and see how/what the dealer's reply is.Try to get a writen repair order that lists your concerns about the repair and condition the boat should be in when the repair is done.It should not be a problem for the dealer,he sold you a topline boat,you paid for it,and he should be able to do a quality repair.If he wants a future sale,he should treat you very well.

Yes - you should have concerns about the need for a repair so soon,but if done properly it should only be a positive result and reinforce your confidence in the brand and your dealer.... Good Luck,you should have no problems.
tuna1 posted 05-28-2005 05:09 PM ET (US)     Profile for tuna1  Send Email to tuna1     
Most likely a junior laborer at the dealer will be assigned to your repair,unless you speakup about your concerns about the level of effort a quality repair should entail.Speak up,expressing your concerns with your dealer and see how/what the dealer's reply is.Try to get a writen repair order that lists your concerns about the repair and condition the boat should be in when the repair is done.It should not be a problem for the dealer,he sold you a topline boat,you paid for it,and he should be able to do a quality repair.If he wants a future sale,he should treat you very well.

Yes - you should have concerns about the need for a repair so soon,but if done properly it should only be a positive result and reinforce your confidence in the brand and your dealer.... Good Luck,you should have no problems.
tuna1 posted 05-28-2005 05:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for tuna1  Send Email to tuna1     
Sorry a double post occured
bigjohn1 posted 05-29-2005 08:46 AM ET (US)     Profile for bigjohn1  Send Email to bigjohn1     
Mark, I understand your concerns completely but I have a little different "spin" on capability, competence, and the dealer doing things neatly and properly. I don't consider a mechanic (or mechanic's helper) who does sloppy repair work to be very competent at what he does. If he doesn't possess the pride in workmanship to lay a straight bead of caulk, its quite likely there is plenty more he can't do right. This is not the kind of guy I want doing critical internal engine work were fairly exacting tolerances must be observed.

I am not so sure you will have the option of insisting the factory conduct this repair as your dealer is their authorized "agent" for doing this type of work. I definitely sympathize with you and think tuna1 has a good idea in getting everything documented on the repair order.

Liteamorn posted 05-29-2005 09:07 AM ET (US)     Profile for Liteamorn  Send Email to Liteamorn     
Express your concerns with a pleasant demeaner. Take a photo at the dealer location of the work to be done, when you pick the boat up take another photo. If it is not repaired in like new condition tell them you are going to send the photo to Boston Whaler to see there opinion and do it. If you rant and rave I am sure your complaint will be handled the same way, from the dealer all the way up to Boston Whaler.
Whalerider posted 05-30-2005 01:53 AM ET (US)     Profile for Whalerider  Send Email to Whalerider     
I will talk to the owner and service dept mgr, they are both very accessible, nice to talk with and will try hard to take care of my problem. I know that if they do the work, it will be a first class job mechanically and my boat will be ready exactly when promised, always has been. We should all be so lucky, don’t ya think. But....how do they get it across to the crew that "this customer wants a neat job and the hanger rash kept too a minimum"? I can just see the crew nodding in compliance and 5 minutes later it’s back to the same ole same ole. I am sure that quality control is a big problem at most boat dealers. That’s why I am considered insisting that the factory handle it where they seem to be able to assemble a boat without the "2nd grade special effects".
Ahhh .... the decisions... the drama... LOL

Will post the outcome as soon as I get it repaired. Thanks for the input.

Mark

Kencvit posted 05-30-2005 03:41 AM ET (US)     Profile for Kencvit  Send Email to Kencvit     
Whalerider,
On Saturday I went to a dealer to inspect a new 2004 Nantucket
As I hadn`t seen one before we spent a long time looking it over. As I was poking my head in the live well, I tried the plug in the drain and noticed the silicone seal on the tail piece was broken . the tailpiece appears to be sealed from under the well( maybe for better drainage), but the flange should be over the well ( like on a regular sink). I showed this to the salesman and he appeared unaware of this problem. A mechanic was walking by and we approached him on this. He said they had had a problem with another one last year and had changed the drain. He said BW had changed the drain in `05 to correct this problem. He said the fix was warranty.
By coincidence, I had asked Sal and Yiddel about this earlier to night in an email as they have been helping me with some questions I had.
Does BW have recalls as automobiles do? This seal I saw was on a new boat that had never seen water. Are all 2004`s going to need this correction? I know the hull warranty is 10 years, but what is it on everything else, I should have asked the salesman, I am close to buying this boat. Until a few weeks ago I was shopping for a older 18-20 but have since leaned toward a new Nantucket partly to be new and trouble free??
Now you also have me concerned with your concerns over the repair of this. The mechanic said it was a straight forward repair. As a carpenter , I couldn`t stand to see silicone smeared over the seams on a brand new boat.
Yiddil posted 05-30-2005 03:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for Yiddil  Send Email to Yiddil     
Saw your email...........I have no problems with mine when I was using it...recently I shut it down as I dont use it much at all...now its storage area....but while I was using it, I never had a problem....Henry
Sal A posted 05-30-2005 05:04 PM ET (US)     Profile for Sal A  Send Email to Sal A     
When I visited my Boston Whaler dealer in Lanoka Harbor, NJ, they had 3 or 4 Nantuckets in the shop that week for that exact livewell problem. It IS an extensive repair, and was poorly and cheaply designed from the getgo. I believe the problem is fixed in the 2005 year. Judging by the way my dealer was handling these issues (ie professionally and in a standup manner) you likely will be greeted with apologies and freebies when you contact you dealer; they should fix it right up for you.
Yiddil posted 05-30-2005 11:12 PM ET (US)     Profile for Yiddil  Send Email to Yiddil     
Sal! did you have a problem with this too???
Sal A posted 05-31-2005 07:31 AM ET (US)     Profile for Sal A  Send Email to Sal A     
I didn't order the livewell option... For me it usually is a simpler is better philosophy; less things to break. I probably don't use my boat as much for fishing as others do.
bsmotril posted 05-31-2005 09:04 AM ET (US)     Profile for bsmotril  Send Email to bsmotril     
Boat dealers don't recall boats unless the problem is a safety issue. This certainly has the potential of becoming such an issue and would certainly sink a lesser boat than a Whaler. The US Coast Gaurd Website has a page and form for reporting such problems. I think this livewell problem warrants such a formal report as there are likley other boaters out there who may not be as lucky as you were when their drain connection comes loose. BillS
gatorman posted 05-31-2005 01:24 PM ET (US)     Profile for gatorman  Send Email to gatorman     
As Sal A has indicated, this problem appears to be wide spread. The same problem you describe recently happened to my brother-in-law while fishing off-shore near Miami. Brand new 190 Nantucket, couldn't believe it! Whaler should definitely address this as a quality/safety issue with a recall.
Whalerider posted 05-31-2005 07:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for Whalerider  Send Email to Whalerider     
Sal A and Gatorman, if you know what was done too repair the problem would post it so I can compare it with what my repair shop may do.

I talked with the shop today and they havent heard if this problem before. I told them that I am not the first and that I am sure that Whaler is aware of the problem. The dealer is calling the factory today too find out what the course of action will be.

Thanks, Mark

Whalerider posted 05-31-2005 08:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for Whalerider  Send Email to Whalerider     
Here is a link to some pics of the livewell after the failure. Notice that where the drain and flange attach, that the livewell itself failed and allowed the entire assembly to fall through into the bilge. Also note how VERY thin the plastic is that the well is made from. Like I said earlier...this is not Whaler quality.

http://www.thehulltruth.com/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=63869&posts=1

Mark


Whalerider posted 06-01-2005 12:14 PM ET (US)     Profile for Whalerider  Send Email to Whalerider     
Received this email from BW today:

Thank you for contacting us regarding the incident with your 190 Nantucket livewell drain breaking through the bottom of the livewell container. We have taken measures to correct this issue by redesigning the container to be stronger at the point where the drain is installed.

George Bach at Sea Island Marine contacted me yesterday regarding your boat. I discussed the repair with him. We can provide an expedient repair to the container by using a stainless steel drain fitting with about 4-5"
flange and 1.5" elbow and hose barb. These are available through many plumbing supply stores. This drain is sealed with 3M 5200 or equivalent and performs quite well.

The permanent fix is to replace the container. To replace the container the T-Top, console, leaning post (or pedestal seats) and the fuel tank cover (deck) must be de-rigged and removed from the boat. The deck is turned up-side-down and the container removed and replaced. The process is inverted and all parts re-installed. This required about 20 hours labor and 3-5 days at the dealership to complete.

George is supposed to contact you and schedule your warranty service.
Please let George know if you want the temporary fix or the complete repair at this time. We can arrange to do the complete repair at a later date if that is your desire.

Sal A posted 06-01-2005 08:19 PM ET (US)     Profile for Sal A  Send Email to Sal A     
Seems to be a stand-up response by BW. I am glad they are furnishing you with options.
Perry posted 06-01-2005 08:37 PM ET (US)     Profile for Perry  Send Email to Perry     
Mark, do you have a t-top on your Nantucket? I read the reply from Boston Whaler and he said that the t-top etc. must be removed before the repair is done.
Yiddil posted 06-01-2005 09:26 PM ET (US)     Profile for Yiddil  Send Email to Yiddil     
Oh MY!! $*)As Ive said, I have not had mine break because I havn't used it, But from what I see here, it needs to be replaced even if it is not broken??? Is that correct?????????
Sal A posted 06-01-2005 09:31 PM ET (US)     Profile for Sal A  Send Email to Sal A     
Yiddill,

I am pretty sure it is a prolem with all 2003 and 2004 Nantucket livewells, and not just one or two bad production runs, but give a call to your dealer, as he will know more than us. Be well amigo.

Whalerider posted 06-01-2005 10:13 PM ET (US)     Profile for Whalerider  Send Email to Whalerider     
Perry,

Funny they mentioned that (the t-top), maybe my service manager mentioned to BW that I was thinking about one. Less than 2 weeks ago I had a t-top builder quote me a price. I was going too have one built and installed ASAP, the bimini top is a PITA to fish around. But now with all this mess, I plan to have the t-top and livewell done at the same time. I thought about ordering a BW t-top for the Outrage 21, it fits perfectly on the Nantucket, until I saw the $4500 price tag! I can have a custom top built of equal or higher quality for ALOT less. By the way...there is wood (Whalerboard) glassed in the proper location at the factory even though Whaler doesn’t offer a t-top option for the Nantucket.

My livewell plan is .... get the temporary fix done next week and have the permanent fix done in a few months (the cobia and kings are here NOW and tarpon follow that).

After talking to everyone, the sad news is, 2003 and 2004 livewells will more than likely fail sooner or later. My though is that if your well is not broken yet, the larger flange that Whaler suggests may provide enough support that it MAY never fail. Might save you a major headache?

Mark

Yiddil posted 06-01-2005 11:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for Yiddil  Send Email to Yiddil     
Hey! Thanks so much for bringing it to my atention everyone...Ill let my dealer know...so far no issue with mine...not using it and Im assuming you have to shove the plug in her to make that thing go pluewy!...:( Im really glad I shut the valve down on her amonth ago...

Wondering why you couldnt do the same and keep the water out that way...not mechanicly inclines me thinks.......
The Yiddil

Whalerider posted 06-02-2005 12:26 AM ET (US)     Profile for Whalerider  Send Email to Whalerider     
Yiddil,

lol...mechanically inclined? hummm... better look closer at your boat and maybe even read the manual. The DRAIN doesn’t have a valve...only the pump does. Closing the valve on the pump won’t have any effect on the drain line. Now..if your saying put a plug in the drain to stop the water...you have a point there. But, if you will read the 1st post...I said, water doesn’t back flow into the drain line under normal conditions. Have two fat girls stand in the back and it does.


For the mechanically challenged here is a link to the plumbing diagram.

http://www.whalerparts.com/Diagrams/2004/190%20Nantucket/PB190NT24%20Model%20(1).pdf

As for me being mechanically inclined?...built my own airplane once (took FOREVER) and I am a contractor, build houses everyday, simple boats like the Nantucket are a no brainer. Hell, I even have a whole warehouse full of big shinny manly tools, so I must be mechanically inclined. LOL

On second thought, you may be right though...my construction crews remind me of my lack of any type of mechanical skill almost constantly.


Mark

Perry posted 06-02-2005 01:47 AM ET (US)     Profile for Perry  Send Email to Perry     
Mark, I take delivery of my 2005 Nantucket later this month and have also decided to go with a custom t-top. The sun gets hot here in Hawaii and a bimini would really get in the way while fishing. I was quoted $2300 including canvas, rocket launchers and mounting tabs for outriggers and antanne.

I also noticed in the diagram that there is whalerboard pads under the deck to mount a t-top. Funny thing that they provide these but not an option for a factory t-top.

My boat does not have the fishing package but I noticed that a similarly equipped boat has the well with drain under the leaning post. I guess if you don't order the livewell, you just use the well for dry storage.

art9234 posted 06-02-2005 08:43 AM ET (US)     Profile for art9234  Send Email to art9234     
Keep t-top light. ie: canvas not fiberglass. O lost beam stability by raising center of gravity on what is a shallow boat. Other than that user mistak, my Nantucket is awesome.

TRAFFICLAWYER posted 06-03-2005 05:01 PM ET (US)     Profile for TRAFFICLAWYER    
If sea island & George is taking care of it, you have one of Whalers best dealers, I have bought 4 whalers from them.
Either kenny or one of the other techs would do the repair, don't fret!!!!!.
Whalerider posted 06-03-2005 07:38 PM ET (US)     Profile for Whalerider  Send Email to Whalerider     
TRAFFICLAWYER...well said!

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