Moderated Discussion Areas
ContinuousWave: Post-Classic Whalers
Outrage 210 vs. 190
|Author||Topic: Outrage 210 vs. 190|
posted 04-20-2007 09:04 PM ET (US)
How would you compare a 210 Outrage with a 200 Verado vs. 190 Outrage with a 135 Optimax. Lateral stability, comfort, cost of ownership, ride, safety, etc. Would a 210 be much more seaworthy? If so how….
posted 04-20-2007 11:13 PM ET (US)
Just to give some perspective:
19' Outrage - LOA 18'10"
21" Outrage - LOA 20'6"
The 19' is a good riding boat but I believe the 21' is much better ride comparatively, wider beam, heavier and a little deeper V.
I have one on order w/ 200 Verado but it won't be until late May before really testing her. I am moving from the Dauntless 180 w 135 Optimax which served me well and by the way is only 4" smaller than the Outrage 19' (a little different hull configuration).
posted 04-21-2007 12:19 AM ET (US)
Jordi, I agree with the previous post...Only reason i didnt get the 21 was not having a tow for her...price in 2004 was like 44,000 and that was a steel...Now I doint know what they run...but if the 19 is 44-48...GEEEZE the 21 must be astronomical...
But the 21 is heavier, cost you more to run gas wise, maybe better heavier ride, but for the money I can't see not going with the 109(money wise) a better buy..........at least back then(2004)I think the 21 will give you more out on open ocean though......fantastic boat, yet oh so heavey to tow..
then again, now I have a 8cyl and could tow hher..go figure
posted 04-21-2007 03:13 AM ET (US)
Your question contains the answer, the larger boat will ride better and offer better stability. That said, the 190 is no slouch on rough water and is a capable and versitle boat and is easy(er) to tow. Obviously the smaller boat will cost less, use less fuel and perhaps less to store if you store offsite. If the 21 has a head then that makes it more female friendly.
At the cost of these boats I own my one and only Whaler, if I upgrade eventually to a larger boat --if----then I fear it will not be a Whaler. There are plenty of quality boats out there for much less money--but--there is the panache of the Whaler decal on the side that makes Bayliner (Lowes, Triumph etc) people drool and foam at the mouth which alone makes the extra costs worth it just for the entertainment value.
posted 04-21-2007 07:31 AM ET (US)
Thanks for the replies, although I am looking for real world experiences (actually having owned or used the 210). I know the numbers well; the subjective evaluation of an owner that has moved up from the 190 to the 210 is what I am after. I am guessing there might not be too many folks that have made the move from the 190 to the 210 with the 200 Verado since it has only been in production for one year. The price difference between the 190 and 210 is roughly $20,000, a considerable amount of money for an "upgrade". The 210’s quiet, smokeless ride (100%), fishboxes, more room, bigger livewell are all appealing for the fisherman/woman. I would loose the 5 MPG cruising speed to 3.5 MPG (roughly) of the Verado. I let the “people drool and foam at the mouth" situation be handled by the ER Doc's at the hospital. My entertainment value is catching fish and family time on the water. For $ 65,000 what other 21 CC Verado (200) powered boat would you seriously consider and why? (Again...real world experience helps). Caveat, I have always owned Boston Whaler boats for the safety, reliability, fit/finish, re-sale value and long term wear. I am willing to consider other makes if they meet the following criteria. (I have yet to find one) Basically “you pay to play” and “you get what you pay for”….no free lunches. But, if you do find a free lunch please share so we can all consume.
posted 04-21-2007 08:32 AM ET (US)
I would think that the almost 50% increase in hp would have a dramatic impact on speed. Whaler literature shows the WOT speed of the 21 approaching 50 mph while the 19 is around 42 mph. That will change both the thrill level and the gas consumption. I don’t own either boat, but the following web page has some performance data www.whaler.com/rec/pdfs/performance/10.pdf
posted 04-21-2007 11:14 AM ET (US)
Since I did look at many other boats in the 21' range, first you need to know that it is all subjective, I kept gravitating back to Boston Whaler for all comparisons. For me, moving from the Dauntless 180, will be very positive except the Dauntless has SO much storage space that I will be giving up.
I use the boat for off shore ocean fishing and when the family comes along we use it in the bay or Colorado river for water sports and cruising. I will miss the fuel consumption of the optimax.
I also doubt that you will find too many people moving from a 19' Outrage to the 21'.
I didn't go any bigger as I want to be able to trail the boat comfortable and easily and in my opinion the Outrage 210 is the limit for Boston Whaler.
posted 04-21-2007 09:06 PM ET (US)
Jordi, Im affraid you will not find many real world upgrades from a 19 toa 21...and heres why IMHO
Not many people will if any, upgrade from the 19 to the 21 for 20,000-30,000 more per boat when your talking a foot here or there and more money to run...tow, and store.........I would say to you That moving froma 19 Nantucket to a maybe Parker 23-25-26 cabin you might find here becuase of the large sweep in standards of the vessel...
So me thinks it unrealistic to find that upgrade although it may exist somewhere, not very often real world...........ME
posted 04-21-2007 11:24 PM ET (US)
Your not goiung to find anybody who has gone from a 190 to a 210. That is what I said before. It does not make sense to get less than two more feet for another 20 plus thousand. I said I would go to another brand of boat and I would move on up to a 23 or 24. I don't think the two additional fett worth the huge expense and I doubt manu others will either.
Oh, BTW, my Nantucket with 150 Opti runs about 46 plus MPH wide open and trimmed out with two on board and half fuel and average equipment, some times a bit more--I don't care what the this or that web site says and that is verified by triple GPS in two way runs.
posted 04-22-2007 06:28 AM ET (US)
Let us know how you like the 210 once you take her out and enjoy her. Having taken the 210 for a brief run the difference in ride, comfort, quietness is considerable to the 190. Both excellent boats, if you can afford the 210 the boat is very impressive.
posted 04-22-2007 11:56 PM ET (US)
Jordi, I too am interested in either the 190 or 210 and am leaning towards the 210. I do not want to buy and sell repeatedly since we take a hit when doing so and for this reason I will most likely move directly to the 210 outrage.
My only concern is launch and retrieval and towing by myself.
Hopefully not a problem.
BTW What do you expect the 210 on a trailer to weigh in at?
How do the rest of you guys feel about towing these wide boats
posted 04-23-2007 12:13 AM ET (US)
The reason I settled on the 190 is because it is as big a boat as I can pull easily long distances using normal automobiles like my Tacoma TRD 4X4. When I no longer have to tow huge distances every time I use the boat I will go to a larger boat, like perhaps a Galicer Bay 2200 cat. Lovely boat but way to much to pull with my Taco great distances. If I only had to tow a few miles normally then I could pick up a beater Chevy or something like that to guzzle gas and drip oil on my drive and tow the Glaicer Bay to the ramp.
posted 04-23-2007 08:32 AM ET (US)
My towing requirements are minimal (2 miles to ramp), I too hate to tow large boats and my V8 4 Runner has a towing capacity of 5,000. 210 towing requirements (boat 2700, engine 650, trailer 800(aluminum), gas, etc 700 (roughly) puts you at 4850. This is a heavy load for long trips; I can handle the short trips. I fish solo (80%) of the time and launch and retrieval has become a simple ritual once you get your system down. The launch and retrieval will be similar on the two boats. Take your time, prepare and practice will make you feel confident after a few “trial” runs. If you are addicted to fishing you will find the fish boxes, larger livewell a plus on the 210. Make sure you take both boats out if you can before purchasing and preferably in some rough weather to get a feel for the differences. I like quiet, comfortable fishing machines and the Verado powered 190/210 will meet your needs. Boston Whaler is currently having a spring sale with cash back rebates, information on the BW site.
posted 04-23-2007 08:51 AM ET (US)
I have a 2002 210 Ventura that is a beast. It weighs in at 5200 lbs fully loaded and it sits on a Load Rite Bunk tandum axle trailor that weighs 1200 lbs. So that brings me in at 6400lbs.
My tow vehicle is a 2002 Toyota Tundra 4x4 V8. I've had no issues launching or recovering the Whaler with the Toyota, it snatches it right out of the water no matter how steep the ramps are. I use the standard mirrors that came with the truck and they provide me more than adequate visiblity. My Whaler has a 8' 4" beam.
I launch and recover the boat by myself some of the time ... it's really a piece of cake. I have a guide that I manufactured myself and installed on the winch post of the trailer. This helps me guide the Whaler onto the trailer as I drive it on. I realize some of you live in states that don't permit that. It is really easy to float the boat on the trailer then winch it the rest of the way if necessary.
posted 04-23-2007 11:56 AM ET (US)
Thanks Jordi and Tom,
A little info on my current rig;
2003 Ford 250 extended cab diesel 4x4 lwb pickup
Elkhorn 8.5' truck camper
150 Sport 60hp two stroke drive on trailer, loaded with a
Motorguide PTS 82# thrust 24v trolling motor, LCX26CHD
and LCX25C, Mills bimini top, 20 gallon bait tank, VHF
and Jimh's favorite antenna setup. Also two group 29
deep cycle batteries and onboard charger, fishing gear
and small downriggers, safety gear, 48 qt ice chest, ect
LOTS OF STUFF FOR A 15' BOAT.
Because of the distances to water I tend to go for 4 to 7 day trips about once a month on average. My round trip distances are between 350 and 600 miles and I live in the mountains in New Mexico so I have to travel up and down the
I have a 2005 Ford 550 4x4 diesel chassiscab that I am
posted 04-23-2007 05:54 PM ET (US)
Pulling the Dauntless 180 w/135 Optimax using a tandem axle galvanized trailer was really nothing. The beam on that boat is 8' and the Outrage 210 is 8'4. The Dauntless is a heavy boat also, less about 800#
There is more weight but I don't expect any issues using a tandem axle trailer. Launching and retrieving, solo, shouldn't be any different as well.
posted 04-23-2007 07:18 PM ET (US)
bkloss, thanks for the input
posted 04-23-2007 09:52 PM ET (US)
jordi, I have a boat to recomend for you,it,s a bluewater 2150.it has a fantastic layout and fish's awesome.I took mine out to the stream out of savannah many times brfore i upgraded to the 2550. the 24 degree deep v provides the finest riding little boat I've been.great storage,fish box capacity,and built in cooler..no verado,you would have to go e-tec or yamaha 2oo hpdi.it is worth your time to look and ride one...adam.
posted 04-24-2007 12:59 AM ET (US)
Steve, I can load and unload my 210 by myself.I have a Performance bunk trailer that is a dream to launch with. I tow it with a Ford F-250 with a 7.3 TD. I did use a rental 1500 Chevy (1/2 ton) one time to tow 200 miles on I-75 in FL and I would not do it again. A 3/4 ton truck is the least I would use for anything more than a 2 mile trip to the ramp.
posted 04-24-2007 10:00 AM ET (US)
Thanks for the reply fno
I assume that Performance is a trailer brand? I will look into these. A well set up trailer makes a big difference, and is a smart place for me to put some of the money.
posted 04-24-2007 11:50 AM ET (US)
1. A V8 4Runner has a 7000 Pound Tow rating.
2. It will tow a 210 Outrage fine. It may be a little squirrelly on the highway due to wheelbase. It has plenty of power though.
3. Performance trailers has gone out of business. They recently had a liquidation auction.
4. My next trailer will be a Owens and Sons.
5. I think that boat would be best with either a Opti or a 4Cyl Verado 200.
If someone on here buys a 210 Outrage for $65,000 please give me a call. I've got some swamp land you might be interested in. It's a buyers market for boat too.
BTW I tow a 19'8" x 8'4" beam 1996 Outrage, 4500lbs B/M/T with either a 1999 Toyota Land Cruiser, or a 2003 Grand Cherokee V8, or a 1987 Dodge Ram V8 and they all tow fine.
posted 04-24-2007 12:20 PM ET (US)
The 4 cylinder 200 Verado won't be available until late summer and I don't know when whaler would be offering it on their boats. It is less weight than the straight 6 but I wonder about the workload on the 4cyl vs 6cyl to turn out the the same hp... It will be interesting to see where they price this one in comparison to the 6 cyl.
posted 04-24-2007 04:12 PM ET (US)
I have a 240 outrage and it is towed everywhere. It was towed with a 1500 5.3L chevy. The truck towed it fine. The hi-way had the occassional white knuckle. But it was fine everywhere else.
I now tow my 240 with a chevy 2500, a lot smoother. That said the 210 that tips the scales at less then 4k lbs, should be no concern with a 1/2 t truck.
posted 04-30-2007 09:07 AM ET (US)
A 210 Outrage loaded with fuel, a 225 four stroke Merc and trailer tips the scales at just over 5000 lbs. Not just an opinion, I checked it out on a truck scale.
posted 04-30-2007 03:00 PM ET (US)
Thanks for the confirmation, with 7300 towing capacity there should be no problem. I am wondering what the fuel efficiency of the Verado 200 (4 cyl)vs. Verado 200 (I6)will be? An inline six is a very smooth running engine with lot's of reserve compared to the 4 cylinder. It seems the new 200 4 cylinder would also be an excellent choice for the 190 Outrage.
posted 04-30-2007 04:38 PM ET (US)
Jordi, You don't need a 200 Verado on the 190 trust me! I have the 150 which is the max it's rated for and the boat moves.
posted 05-07-2007 01:40 PM ET (US)
My personal opinion.
Bigger beam and longer boat will always give you a better ride.(However the draft is deeper to)
If you can justify the price then...go for the larger boat.
The Verado is definitely the motor to have if your staying with a Merc.
Purchase our Licensed Version- which adds many more features!
© Infopop Corporation (formerly Madrona Park, Inc.), 1998 - 2000.