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Author Topic:   Self Bailing
IMEKAKO posted 10-15-2007 03:51 AM ET (US)   Profile for IMEKAKO  
I read in another post here that the 17' Montauk is not self bailing and looking at the BW website only the bigger boats are. Does that mean that if water gets into the boat it has to be pumped and that it will not just flow out automatically. If so then it appears to me that the smaller non self bailing boats are like all others which rely on a bilge pump to keep them from sinking. Am I right on this?
HuronBob posted 10-15-2007 06:37 AM ET (US)     Profile for HuronBob    
Link to a search of this site for "self bailing" many, many discusssions about this...

my 130 sport is self bailing.... meaning if the plugs are left out while at the dock, rain will flow out of the boat.. if the transom plug is pulled while underway, water will flow out of the boat... no bilge pump.

Feejer posted 10-15-2007 01:10 PM ET (US)     Profile for Feejer  Send Email to Feejer     
If you pull the plug on a 170 a small amount of water will come into the back of the boat, maybe 1/2 inch. This is WITHOUT you in the boat and the boat not moving. I tried this over the summer, if I pull the plug and stood in the rear a got about and inch or so of water in. As soon as I started the motor and began moving forward the water ran out. I can't see the boat sinking with the plug pulled, I'm sure someone else will come along and explain it better.
highanddry posted 10-15-2007 06:43 PM ET (US)     Profile for highanddry  Send Email to highanddry     
Boston Whaler Outrage/Nantucket 190 is fully self bailing.
btb posted 10-15-2007 07:29 PM ET (US)     Profile for btb  Send Email to btb     
The venerable SL16 is self bailing.
jimh posted 10-15-2007 08:28 PM ET (US)     Profile for jimh  Send Email to jimh     
The list will be much shorter and easier to compile if we just list the models of Boston Whaler boat which are not self bailing.
highanddry posted 10-15-2007 09:45 PM ET (US)     Profile for highanddry  Send Email to highanddry     
Well, then why don't you list those models, I only can speak assuredly of the one I have.
Royboy posted 10-15-2007 10:24 PM ET (US)     Profile for Royboy  Send Email to Royboy     
This has been discussed on this site (and others) numerous times. Often, a boat owner (or marketing department)will confuse self bailing with some other feature. If one must pull a plug and put the motor in gear to drain water from the boat, this can hardly be described as self-bailing. To do so negates the meaning of the term because all boats will drain in this fashion. Self bailing describes a boat whose deck is above the waterline, with open drains that empty overboard. No action is required of the operator or any powered system to dewater the boat, it simply runs overboard. The small Whalers (17 and below) are not technically self-bailing, except the 17 Outrage, which is.

Roy

btb posted 10-16-2007 11:47 AM ET (US)     Profile for btb  Send Email to btb     
My 16SL is self bailing per this latest definition.
sosmerc posted 10-16-2007 03:51 PM ET (US)     Profile for sosmerc  Send Email to sosmerc     
So is my 18ft. Ventura self bailing??
It does have scuppers, BUT...it also has a very large bildge area that requires a bildge pump...and it gets water down there from the many openings such as drink holders, ski pylon, twin hatches/rear seats, cable/harness opening for engine stuff to pass through etc.
If I were out in big water and took a wave over the bow my guess is alot of water would quickly find its way into this bildge area.
Don't get me wrong, I love the scuppers for the fact that I can hose out the floor and clean the boat while it is in the water, but I do not consider this boat to be truly a self-bailing hull like the old 18 outrage.
Jerry Townsend posted 10-16-2007 06:37 PM ET (US)     Profile for Jerry Townsend  Send Email to Jerry Townsend     
sosmerc - I am surprised that your 18 Ventura does not have a bilge drain - my '96 17 Outrage has a drain - and a bilge pump - and a drain from the fuel tank area into the bilge. The bilge drain is, I thought, a "standard" on BW boats. Years ago, I had a 13 Super Sport which, of course, didn't have a bilge, but it did have floor drain which worked the same way.

Agreed, the scuppers are not a positive check-valve. But with a lot of water on the floor - they would really help - though, I, gladly, have not had that experience yet. ----- Jerry/Idaho

sosmerc posted 10-16-2007 08:23 PM ET (US)     Profile for sosmerc  Send Email to sosmerc     
Just to clarify...my 18 Ventura does have a bildge plug or "drain" ... but the boat has to be out of the water to access it. The bildge pump is used to pump out this area...and it can't really get it all out due to the design.
The scuppers are a great feature...but the boat is still potentially in trouble if you take on a "big" wave and swamp the bildge area (batteries, fuse boxes, trim tab motor, fuel tank sender, floscan sender...all in this bildge area).
highanddry posted 10-16-2007 09:22 PM ET (US)     Profile for highanddry  Send Email to highanddry     
The Outrage 190 has a fuel cell tunnel. The 60 gallon fuel cell consumes most of that room and it is covered by a section of deck that could be removed if it was absolutely required (to replace the tank) There is a small bilge area at the end of the fuel tank tunnel that contains a drain plug and a bilge pump. If one were to leave that plug out the boat will continue to float high and dry. The fuse and CB panels are in the console as are the batteries.
sosmerc posted 10-16-2007 10:04 PM ET (US)     Profile for sosmerc  Send Email to sosmerc     
That sounds like a superior design...and from a standpoint of balance, I like the idea of having the batteries forward.
Nails posted 10-18-2007 07:19 AM ET (US)     Profile for Nails  Send Email to Nails     
From the "article" section on the Boston Whaler website concerning the 150 Sport: " The trademark unsinkability is a result of the self-bailing cockpit and foam-filled construction."
Jack C posted 10-18-2007 11:20 PM ET (US)     Profile for Jack C  Send Email to Jack C     
While not yet a whaler owner I love this site. Short explanation on self bailing and bilges. Most modern small boats are self bailing - meaning water from rain events will drain overboard from the deck without the need of a pump. Once a boat starts to get a bigger (over 13 feet or so) the boat will also have a bilge (space between the bottom of the boat and the deck) that can collect water from a variety of sources - waves, rain that funnels through openings, rod holders, cup holders, anchor lockers, fish boxes... (and on and on) that end up in the bilge. This requires a bilge pump or even more than one for safely reasons (although many boats only have one bilge pump.)

Shelf bailing - The cockpit of the boat drains MOST of the rain water through above the water line scuppers (drains) - but can also have a bilge area that requires a pump.


Most larger boats have a bilge. There are a few boat designs that aren't self bailing that still use old style cockpit covers and bilge pumps (the only one I can think of offhand is Arima.)

My present boat is a 22 Hydrasport Ocean Skiff - it is self bailing and has a large bilge and one bilge pump. The bilge stays fairly dry but can take water through rod holders and when I wash the boat down and water enters through deck opeings that can take water from gas line and control cable openings. (covered from rain but the wash water gets to the bilge)

Some modern boats have NO Bilges but they are not common - the Maritime Skiffs under 20 feet and under have no bilge and are self bailing, blacklab marine (aluminum boats that are somewhat unique) do not normally have a bilge but I just learned that to sell them in Europe they need to have bilges and they are adding them on some models (some unique regulation).

Hope this helps...

bigjohn1 posted 10-20-2007 01:33 AM ET (US)     Profile for bigjohn1  Send Email to bigjohn1     
How important is a true self-bailing boat? I ask this as one who has taken plenty of waves over the bow of a 170 Montauk offshore yet I have never felt threatened by relying on a bilge pump. True, the bilge pump probably does not void all water as quickly as two scuppers would but am I at some sort of disadvantage? If the pump stops working for whatever reason, I can pull the bilge plug and still void water when moving forward. If I lose power and am dead in the water (no engine and no bilge pump), I feel like I am in just as much trouble as if I had scuppers and no power. What am I missing?
highanddry posted 10-20-2007 02:39 AM ET (US)     Profile for highanddry  Send Email to highanddry     
It is important for obvious reasons.
Feejer posted 10-20-2007 02:54 PM ET (US)     Profile for Feejer  Send Email to Feejer     
bigjohn
About 3 years ago my brother and I were about 2 miles off the NC coast. Weather forcast was for sea's to 1-3 ft which they were. Were slowly trolling when out of no where a large wave crash over the bow on my 20 foot Sea Hunt, scared the crap out of us and dumped a few hundred gallons of water on the deck. The water was a good 8-10 inches deep. I continued at trolling speed to keep the bow up, but not too far up. The boat had 2 scuppers which drained the water in 2-3 minutes. The bilge pump was also running. I can't imagine that same freak wave dumping that amount of water in my 05 Montauk. The only thing I dislike about my whaler is the lack of a self bailing deck. Before I bought the Montauk I liked long and hard to find a Dauntless 160 because it has a self bailing deck. Needless to say I could not find one in my price range.
boatdryver posted 10-28-2007 06:07 PM ET (US)     Profile for boatdryver  Send Email to boatdryver     
while the new and old Montauks are not truly self bailing, the fact that one can pull the plug and leave the boat unattended is of great value to the thousands of such boats that are left uncovered on moorings or at docks without electricity seasonally in areas where rains occur year round.

JimL

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