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ContinuousWave: Post-Classic Whalers
190 OUTRAGE v. 190 MONTAUK
|Author||Topic: 190 OUTRAGE v. 190 MONTAUK|
posted 12-30-2008 07:44 AM ET (US)
[Moved to the POST-CLASSIC discussion area. The POST-CLASSIC discussion area is a discussion area that focuses on the newer Boston Whaler boats, typically ones first designed and produced after c.1990., and it is the preferred discussion area for conducting discussions such as the differences between current model production boats like the 190 MONTAUK and 190 OUTRAGE.--jimh.]
I'm torn between buying a 2008 190 Outrage or 190 Montauk. Up until now the price difference was significant, but with the current economy the gap seems to be narrowing considerably. Any information one can share about these boats, plusses and minusses would be appreciated.
posted 12-30-2008 09:13 AM ET (US)
How will you use the boat? Fishing, boat rides, tubing-skiing-wakeboarding,etc
What class of water? protected, bay chop, nearshore ocean, offshore
How many people on board 90% of the time?
What boat do you have now and why do you want to change?
answers to these questions will give you better input.
posted 12-30-2008 10:33 AM ET (US)
Thanks for your interest, in response.
No skiing or wakeboarding
Usage is mostly on Lake Erie, some Florida Gulf, 75% pleasure rides, 25% fishing. Do not head out in anything worse than waves 2' or less. Although occassionally coming back in 4' to 5' on Erie. Crew normally consists of family members. Current bost is a 17' Whaler, 90 hp Johnson
|Casco Bay Outrage||
posted 12-30-2008 11:55 AM ET (US)
Here's my opinion:
For the [money] you are going to spend, go with the Outrage 190. The semi-V hull will give you a much better ride.
While the Montauk 190 is a great boat, it is in my opinion a near shore and lake boat. If on the ocean and Great Lakes, you will want to be comfortable when the sea state picks up.
Just one opinion.
posted 12-30-2008 12:57 PM ET (US)
As an owner of a 190 Outrage I would have to say that the 190 Outrage is probably a better choice for your requirements. It will take more abuse than you can.
posted 12-30-2008 01:05 PM ET (US)
Since the price gap is narrowing that means that one boat is either becoming cheaper in price or the other is increasing. I am assuming the Montauk is staying pretty close and the Outrage is getting cheaper. Therefore the Outrage is a better deal. I also believe the Outrage is a better boat for most applications, especially if you find yourself in 5' stuff periodically. For my use I would prefer the Montauk but if the current economy says I can get an Outrage for a few grand more instead of ten grand more--no brainer.
posted 12-30-2008 03:04 PM ET (US)
Yep, when you mention 4- to 5-footers in Lake Erie I'd go for the 190 Outrage too.
But, if you are using your 17 Montauk type hull in these same conditions now and you love the old "Classic" lines like I do, there are some 190 Montauk owners on this site who might jump in and say you'd be fine with the 190 Montauk. You'd then have to decide between the 115 and 135 HP motors, which is why I asked how many people in the boat. And you'd have to live with a little bumpier ride.
It's a good time to be in the position to buy a new boat. Enjoy it!
posted 12-30-2008 06:59 PM ET (US)
The number of people on the boat will rarely exceed five, generating a total weight of 700 lbs.
I think a well equipped 2008 19' Montauk with the 115 can be purchased for under $30,000.
I thought I read the 115 was a little weak for the boat, perhaps it is sufficient. We do prefer the look of the Montauk over the Outrage. However, the Outrage gets better reviews.
posted 12-31-2008 09:21 AM ET (US)
I've had two earlier Whalers a Classic Montauk and a Post Classic 170. I've never been on an Outrage so can't really debate against it. I do use my boat similarly as you plan to use your new boat. However, I do fish more and fish offshore. I liked the Montauk because it seems to have slightly more interior room and storage (a big deal for me). Second, at the time I bought mine the asking price was about $10,000 more for the Outrage. Third, was the economy of the 115 vs the larger engines on the Outrage. And... yes the 115 is no hot rod but, it does a respectable job and is VERY cheap to run. And lastly, I believe that the Montauk would run in less water than the Outrage even though the specs claim they are the same. I do fish some skinny water. I have not been disappointed at all in the Montauk in the least. I know the Outrage is a very nice boat and you can't go wrong with either!
posted 12-31-2008 10:20 AM ET (US)
If you're leaning toward the 190 Montauk, the decision between the 115 and 135 HP motors is not easy. For the considerable premium in price, the 135 Verado option gives you DTS and hydraulic steering and a supercharger to help get up on plane with a heavy load. That DTS is very enjoyable to use.
A few months ago there was a long discussion here among owners and prospective owners of 190 Montauks on the issue of who could live with what motor, etc. Maybe you could search and find that thread. The bottom line to me was that it boiled down to a matter of balancing preference and budget.
I had a classic Montauk with A 90 HP Honda and that thing felt like a hot rod compared to the 190 Montauk with 115 HP AND the 190 Outrage with 150 HP that I tested because of the power to weight ratio in the smaller Classic Montauk, just because the other two were heavier boats with big internal fuel tanks.
I tested the 190 Montauk with a 115 HP motor with two men on board and I thought it planed very quickly but struggled to stay up on a crisp plane under 4000 rpm.
A load of 4-5 people in a 190 Montauk with the 115 is going to be really different from what you are used to if you have a 90 on your Montauk 17.
I can't tell where you live or where you would be buying from your profile. I wonder if you could test drive a 190/115 combo with your family on board this time of year?
posted 12-31-2008 12:40 PM ET (US)
The salesperson said the 135 is a must with the 19" Montauk. He mentioned the additional gages but most importantly said the 135 is needed to zip the 19' right along.
Our 17' has a 90 and it moves pretty well. You are right in that it is a tough decision, the difference in cost appears to be about $4,500 more for the 135.
The best deal is the Outrage, however, we are not that crazy about the design. We have always been Montauk owners.
I think if we can get the 2008 19' Montauk with the 135 for approx $32,000 plus tax we'll make the deal. Although if this economy continues to deteriorate in the spring the dealers will be giving those boats away to generate cash.
Hopefully the economy turns positive in 2009 and we can all get back to making some money.
Thanks for the help.
posted 12-31-2008 02:16 PM ET (US)
The Outrage is designed to handle rough water. If you plan on using your boat occassionally in 4' to 5' waves like you said, you would appreciate the design of the Outrage compared to the Montauk.
posted 12-31-2008 06:17 PM ET (US)
I vote Outrage;
1) rough water design
...going from '17 to Outrage 190 will be dreamy...
Are you towing, or mooring, or private docking? (That can change the picture too.)
posted 01-01-2009 10:28 AM ET (US)
[Moved from MARKETPLACE, where this discussion was off-topic.]
posted 01-01-2009 10:32 AM ET (US)
Neither the 190 OUTRAGE or 190 MONTAUK is going to be able to make much progress into head seas of 5-foot height, so I would not consider that sea state as the defining criterion for making a decision about which boat to get.
posted 01-01-2009 12:26 PM ET (US)
While neither boat may make much progress going into 5 foot seas, the Outrage will leave your boat and body feeling less wear and tear than the Montauk. Believe me, I have been in both boats in 5+ foot seas.
posted 01-01-2009 01:08 PM ET (US)
A nineteen foot boat is minimal for big water, the Outrage 190 is the better choice if big water is your destination. I have been on both boats and the Outrage 190 is a better riding boat in the rough. Unfortunately in order to make full use of the Outrage 190's rough water capability it needs tabs. The Montauck 190 with a 115 horse engine is an underpowered boat. Either the Montauck or the Outrage should be looked at with a 135 as minimum and really for the Outrage 190 you need the 150. With five persons on board and a full load of gear and fuel our 150 Merc powered Nantucket (same boat as the Outrage) easily and quickly planes.
Five foot rolling seas, no problem, five footers stacked up and close, no thanks.
posted 01-01-2009 03:20 PM ET (US)
I will not go out in 4' - 5' seas, just want something that can handle the waves if we get caught in some unanticipated weather. We are calm seas boaters, Erie can be a challenge, we pick our days carefully.
I do think either the 19' Montauk or 19' Outrage can get 15 - 20 miles off shore in the Gulf on a calm day, just need to be aware of the weather.
Most of the time the Gulf seems almost panel flat with the exception of the occassional rogue wave.
posted 01-01-2009 07:17 PM ET (US)
The Gulf is not to be taken lightly. I have been on rigs and watched waves 30 feet high or more pass under the rig. We take our Nantuket 190 twenty miles out or more but only when I have a solid forecast (if such a thing exists) and if the forecast goes downhill, I would rather be in the Outrage 190 between these two.
posted 01-01-2009 08:31 PM ET (US)
I would suggest that you not plan on going out in 5 footers in either boat, but its your dinner party. I have been on both and own the Nantucket/Outrage and these questions have been raised here before if you do a look up you will see that the nantucket.Outrage is the better application in tuff goings. Like some here who have owned the same boat and compared the two by riding on the other, there is a marked improvement in ride with the Nantucket/outrage in tuff goings. Mind you that in 4-5 footers, and waves coming at me from three sides, the boat does wonderfully, but you won't!!I would suggest you try both and seee which one you prefer as thats the only person you have to agree with and please in the end. They are both great boats, but have different atributes and will make you choose between the two.
posted 01-04-2009 06:25 PM ET (US)
I have now had the pleasure in driving both the 190 Montauk w/135hp and 190 Outrage w/150hp with tabs. In open water, in 2-3 foot waves, the ride on the Outrage wins hands down!
The ride is softer in the Outrage, but she does not track as well at slow speeds.
If you do not run fast the Montauk will have more usable deck space on the move for passengers.
Both ride better with the wind coming over the stern.
posted 01-04-2009 07:58 PM ET (US)
If you are talking about the tendency of the Outrage 190 to wander at slow non planning speeds then trim the engine out. If the engine is tucked in as you work your way through a no wake zone the boat will wander, trim it out and the tendency is much reduced.
posted 01-04-2009 10:28 PM ET (US)
Cheers for that tip, will try it out the next time I am on the water.
posted 01-07-2009 08:47 PM ET (US)
I guess I am one of those 190 Montauk owners you were warned about but.... I cannot imagine a bettter boat for my needs and desires. Again, I have not "rode" the Outrage, but my sense of things is that the Montauk provides more pleasure in terms of fishing, cruising, exploring and wollygagging. This is a superskiff--I mean we could be Somali pirates in this mothersucker. I have had two years of fishing and boating adventures in the "Debunker Redux" and she has not failed me yet. This boat has what it takes to meet your needs in more ways than one! Shallow water, getting around, dealing head on with some snot and nastiness, laying out on the sandbars, pulling up to the dock and dines (they usually want us to hide the bunker chunks),carrying people here and there, diving,swimming off the boat, going to a Mets game at the World's Fair Marina, fishing the Waestern Sound and the New York Bight, fishing wherever there are fish ,it's all good in the hood when you're piloting that Montauk around the waters of Manhatten and beyond.
I vote for the Montauk 190.
posted 01-08-2009 11:16 AM ET (US)
"I guess I am one of those 190 Montauk owners you were warned about but.... I cannot imagine a bettter boat for my needs and desires. Again, I have not "rode" the Outrage, but my sense of things is that the Montauk provides more pleasure in terms of fishing, cruising, exploring and wollygagging. "
posted 01-09-2009 10:13 PM ET (US)
I went from an 05 170 Montauk with a 90 hp to the 08 190 Outrage with a 150 Verado in May of this year. When it comes to handling the chop, the big wakes and wind the Outrage prevails. I looked at the 190 Montauk but for my needs and concerns the hull design of the 190 Outrage was the absolute choice. But I agree, it is not a "big water" boat. That's where the 32 Outrage might be a choice.
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