New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

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stephenpgadomski
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New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby stephenpgadomski » Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:02 am

Please share any information on the newly designed 220 DAUNTLESS boat.

The new 220 DAUNTLESS boats are hard to find; they are just now being produced.

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jimh
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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby jimh » Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:13 am

With a suggested MSRP "starting price" of $83,575, and an introduction of just this month, April 2021, I doubt there are very many owners of the new 220 DAUNTLESS, and I doubt they have much time underway with the boat to provide a comprehensive review of it.

Is there something more specific you would want to know from an owner of a new 2021 220 DAUNTLESS?

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Phil T
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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby Phil T » Tue Apr 20, 2021 10:16 am

The entire production run for this year has been pre-sold. You will need to find a dealer who has a production order for a 220 Dauntless available for sale.
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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby jimh » Tue Apr 20, 2021 2:44 pm

The Boston Whaler website is already providing extensive information about the 2021 220 DAUNTLESS boat. There is detailed performance information of the 2021 220 DAUNTLESS\, as Boston Whaler always provides for its boats.

According to the Boston Whaler test data, the boat as tested weighed 4,149-lbs. The engine was 250-HP. The top speed observed was 51.3-MPH.

After reading that, I immediately thought: "What is the Crouch Speed Prediction Method hull factor coefficient?"

I took data
    HP = 250
    LBS = 4149
    MPH = 51.3
to the Crouch's Calculator and found the hull factor coefficient as 209.

A second set of test data (with different propeller)
    HP = 250
    LBS = 4,369
    MPH = 50.3
calculated a hull factor coefficient at 210.

A hull factor coefficient of 209 to 210 indicates a very efficient and fast planing hull. A traditional Boston Whaler moderate v-hull boat like a c.1985 OUTRAGE 22 would typically have a hull factor coefficient of about 190.

Next, I thought: "What was the propeller SLIP was in those tests?"

For the REVOLUTION4 17-pitch propeller the data was input to my Propeller Calculator
    RPM = 6000
    RATIO = 1.75
    PITCH = 17
    MPH = 51.4
and the SLIP calculated to be 7.1

For the ENERTIA 17-pitch the data was
    RPM = 6000
    RATIO = 1.75
    PITCH = 17
    MPH = 50.3
and SLIP calculated to be 8.9.

Propeller SLIP below 10 at top speed is a good outcome, indicating a good propeller selection.

Other interesting data in the performance report was the optimum cruising speed fuel economy in MPG.

For the 4,149-lbs boat with the REVOLUTION4, the peak fuel economy was 3.67-MPG at 22.2-MPH and tapering to 3.54 MPG at 28-MPH. I think those figures are very good for boat that weighs over 4,000-lbs.

For the heavier 4,365-lbs boat with the ENERTIA propeller, the peak fuel economy was 3.63-MPH at 22.3-MPH and down to 3.43-MPG at 28.9-MPH, again, very good numbers.

Any fuel economy over 3-MPG seems good for a 22-foot boat, and 3.5-MPG around 28-MPH seems very good. (Of course, for the buyer who has over $85,000 for a 22-foot day boat, to save a few dollars on fuel cost with great fuel economy probably is not a top consideration.)

So there are some interesting performance aspects of the new 2021 220 DAUNTLESS boat to consider.

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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby jimh » Wed Apr 21, 2021 7:44 am

Looking at some of the options for the 2021 220 DAUNTLESS, I was surprised to find the upcharge for the 250-HP engine and for change in cowling paint color.

The base engine is a 200-HP Mercury V6 with black cowling. Changing the cowling paint to white costs $2,090. That seems incredibly high for a change in paint color. Comparing to automotive paint color options, you can get the whole car painted in a premium color for around $300 to $400. And generally white paint is not a premium color option.

Moving up to a 225-HP Mercury V6 engine with black cowling pumps the cost to $3,883. Those additional 25-HP are very expensive, about $155 per horsepower. I suspect that the two V6 engines are probably mechanically nearly identical, and the horsepower change just comes from a firmware change in the engine control unit, which has a zero cost for manufacturing. Changing the cowling to white increases the cost to $5,972; again the white paint adds $2,089.

Taking the engine option to the limit, the 250-HP V8 engine, adds $5,276 for the black cowling model or $7,366 for the white cowling. For the added 50-HP (compared to the 200-HP base engine) you are paying only $105 per horsepower, and you get a V8 engine instead of a V6 for your money. Those added 50-HP are cheaper than the added 25-HP on the V6 model on a cost-per-horsepower basis. The white paint for the cowling still costs $2,090 more.

To get the 2021 220 DAUNTLESS to the 250-HP and white cowling level puts the MSRP at $90,941.

And the white cowling engine seems like the best aesthetics for this boat, based on how Boston Whaler shows the boat in its promotional images. Every image in the photo gallery has an engine with a white cowling.

With a several more options like a hard top, a deluxe leaning post, and some gel coat color choice, the MSRP rose to $113,438. All I can say at this point is, "Wow."

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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby jimh » Wed Apr 21, 2021 9:23 am

There is a recorded presentation of a walk-through on a 2021 220 DAUNTLESS boat on youTube at

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gh8_ISYvSyo&t=1s

The presenter, Marilyn DeMartini, makes a humorous gaff: she describes the reversible pilot seat as having "cantillated storage" as she demonstrates by opening the hatch covering the storage. I am not sure what she meant, but cantillate means "to recite with musical tones." Perhaps the intention was to say "cantilever storage," but cantilever means "a projecting beam or member supported at only one end." The hatch does have a gas strut that holds it open. I don't know if it plays any music.

She is also not too familiar with electrical terms. Pointing to a panel of rocker switches, she says "And you've got a really nice and easy-to-use flip switch [pause] devices, here."

I do agree with one assessment of the 2021 220 DAUNTLESS in the presentation: "Great day-boat."

However, I disagree with the assessment that the 220 DAUNTLESS is "perfect entry level." The boat she was showing would have an MSRP of about $110,000, and that cannot possibly be "perfect entry level" for a 22-foot outboard day boat.

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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby jimh » Wed Apr 21, 2021 10:11 am

With options for 200 and 225-HP, I was curious how the top speed of the 2021 220 DAUNTLESS would drop off with those smaller engines. Again, using the Crouch Speed Predicting Method and my Crouch's Calculator, and using the hull factor coefficient of 209 previously calculated, I predicted speed with 200 and 225-HP based on the speed from the 250-HP test. Since the 200 and 225-HP engines are V6 and weigh 475-lbs and the 250 (tested engine) is a V8 that weighs 527-lbs, I reduced the boat weight by 49-lbs to 4100 from 4,149-lbs.

The top speed from actual data recorded with the 250-HP was 51.3-MPH.

The Crouch Calculator data entries and calculated speeds were then

    HP = 200
    LBS = 4100
    COEFF = 209
    MPH = 46.2 predicted

    HP = 225
    LBS = 4100
    COEFF = 209
    MPH = 49.0 predicted

Now we compare change in speed with change in costs:

Going to the 250-HP from the base 200-HP increases top speed by 5.1-MPH, at a cost of $5,276 or $1,034 for each mile-per-hour-faster.

Going to the 225-HP from the base 200-HP increases top speed by 2.8-MPH at a cost of $3,883, or $1,387 for each mile-per-hour-faster.

Unless an outboard engine is used for racing or perhaps in some sort of fishing tournament held to a certain time allowed, the amount of time an typical outboard engine operates at full-throttle is usually less than two-percent or thre-percent of the total operating time. Spending $5,276 to increase maximum boat speed by 5.1-MPH to 51.2-MPH from 46.2-MPH to permit the greater speed at full-throttle is an expensive addition to the boat purchase cost.

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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby Benb007 » Sat May 15, 2021 2:01 pm

I have been looking everywhere for information on this [2021 220 Dauntless] boat.

BACKSTORY ABOUT MY PURCHASE
I just ordered [a 220 Dauntless] from a dealer in Morehead, North Carolina. I’ve been told the boat will be a 2022 [220 DAUNTLESS] arriving in September. It’s the first of three in the dealer's allocation [of 220 DAUNTLESS models]. I was also told that the dealer never received any 2021 [220 DAUNTLESS] models, but that’s because they pulled back on buying inventory instead of pushing ahead when they had the chance due to COVID.

It’s almost as if no one actually owns [a 220 DAUNTLESS]. All dealers tell me [the 220 DAUNTLESS has] been selling like crazy, and they can’t get their hands on them. This makes sense if they really have just started production

I’ve walked the 250 [DAUNTLESS] many times and it’s a great layout--really great. The freeboard is raised and gunwales are substantial enough that it feels more like my old 170 Outrage than it does a bay boat or any Dauntless that I’ve previously been on.

I’m speculating that [the 2021 and newer 220 DAUNTLESS] may be one of the most do-it-all boats on the market.

I think 18-degree deadrise and an extra five feet for me [170 OUTRAGE] should be a nice compromise between the Outrage deeper V-hull and a typical bay boat.

I plan to mainly use [the 2022 220 DAUNTLESS] near-shore, or for in-shore fishing, or for recreation, or for long trips on [an intracoastal water way].

How far off-shore I would go in this [2022 220 DAUNTLESS] is up for debate. I would only consider going greater than five miles offshore if I had a was paired with a buddy boat and the conditions were fantastic. I typically go out with five to seven people on my boat, my wife and mostly kids and teenagers.

I debated between the 250 Dauntless 250 and the Scout 235 XSF but my marina killed those options.

All in all the 250 DAUNTLESS is a much better value than the 220 DAUNTLESS, but I want to stack [the boat I bought indoors during the] off-season and the 220 DAUNTLESS with the hardtop was as much as my marina could take.

I’m sure neither [the 220 DAUNTLESS or the 250 DAUNTLESS] are really considered a great value. The difference in cost, as quoted by my dealer was about $25,000.

With the 220 DAUNTLESS the the bait well in the stern and the lounge seating in the bow are lost.

I am [torn] between the bait well and the deluxe leaning post.

Overall the 220 DAUNTLESS has a lot of big boat options that I really like. The lounge in front of the console is a great feature and the cabin simply blew my mind. Overall, it’s an extremely well-thought-out boat.

I’ve had my 170 Outrage for 23 years [Moderator's comment; please see below regarding the model naming] so I’ll have a lot to learn and master with a more modern boat.

I’m skeptical of al the electronics involved with the engine [that will be on the 2022 220 DAUNTLESS] but that’s probably just me being used to the simplicity of [a two-stroke-power-cycle engine].

[For the 2022 220 DAUNTLESS boat on order I chose the option for the Mercury] V8 250-HP [FOURSTROKE engine]. I hope that [the Mercury V8 250-HP FOURSTROKE engine] will be the more simple [than the base Mercury 200-HP V6 FOURSTROKE engine or the other optional engine the Mercury 225-HP V6 FOURSTROKE engine].

To hear some input from someone who has taken a 220 DAUNTLESS offshore or at least crossed an inlet on a busy day would be interesting.

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Phil T
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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby Phil T » Sat May 15, 2021 2:39 pm

Jeff [Rohlfing] has a lot of time on the 2021 220 Dauntless and the new [250] Dauntless, having seen them at the dealer introduction in December. Here is a "one-take" walk-through presentation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LkOAWxB4DTY

He also attended an owner's event with both the 220 and [250] back in March.
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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby jimh » Sun May 16, 2021 9:16 am

ASIDE: Jeff's recorded presentation is far better than the one provided by Marilyn from Boat Trader.

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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby jimh » Sun May 16, 2021 11:30 am

Benb007 wrote:...feels more like my old 170 Outrage...I’ve had my 170 Outrage for 23 years...

If you bought a 170 OUTRAGE new 23 years ago, then you would have a c. 1998 170 OUTRAGE.

The problem is in 1998 there was no 170 OUTRAGE. There was a 17' Outrage or perhaps an OUTRAGE 17.

Boston Whaler did not use three-digit model designators in c.1998. Boston Whaler first used three-digit model designator in their 2002 Catalogue. Any models prior to 2002 were just designated with two-digits.

Benb007 wrote:I hope that [the Mercury V8 250-HP FOURSTROKE engine] will be the more simple [than the base Mercury 200-HP V6 FOURSTROKE engine or the other optional engine the Mercury 225-HP V6 FOURSTROKE engine].

I don't think there is any particularly "simpler" technology in the V8 FOURSTROKE compared to the V6 FOURSTROKE. I suspect the two engines are very similar in terms of their technology, and the essential difference is that the 250-HP engine is a V8 and the 200 and 225-HP engines are V6. On that basis the V6 is probably "simpler" in that it has two fewer cylinders, so two fewer of everything associated with a cyinder.

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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby Benb007 » Mon May 17, 2021 2:25 pm

Thanks for setting me straight on this. I've been wondering for a few years now what this would actually be. I'm purely coming from the car world when I compare the V8 to a V6 so I don't claim to know much. I just assumed that a 225 V6 would be more complicated to get to a similar level of performance as that of a pure V8.

Kind of like a naturally aspirated engine vs a twin turbo.

Would that not hold true for outboards?

Pardon my ignorance on this but would love to know how it works with outboards.

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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby hauptjm » Tue May 18, 2021 10:12 am

The presenter, Marilyn DeMartini, makes a humorous gaff: she describes the reversible pilot seat as having "cantillated storage" as she demonstrates by opening the hatch covering the storage.


You got me on this one. Maybe she meant canted? Not that, that is an accurate description of what she was describing, but....

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Re: New 2021 220 Dauntless Information Sought

Postby Jefecinco » Tue May 18, 2021 10:13 am

There are some variables to consider. If a V6 engine is essentially identical to a V8 engine of the same family and the displacement per cylinder, fuel flow, camshaft timing and Engine Control Units are the same the engine output of the V6 should be close to 75% of the output of the V8.

If the V6 and V8 have dissimilar displacements per cylinder, internal parts and engine tuning. the V6 can be at least as powerful as the V8. Boat performance can be affected by weight and a boat with a V6 engine gains a little performance advantage over the same boat powered by V8. All else being equal.

Mercury Marine outboard engines with virtually the same parts and displacement can have significant power differences. For example A Gen 2 Verado four cylinder engine of 135 HP was upgraded to 150 HP and later to 200 HP. By changing out the engine's electronic control modules.
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