Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

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HeyBuddy
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Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby HeyBuddy » Wed Nov 30, 2022 1:22 am

I just bought a MONTAUK 17, and I plan to install a Bimini top. I am 6-feet 2-inches tall, and I want to be able to stand at the center console.

Give me advice on selecting a Bimini top.

Q1: is a sliding track for the frame hinge point necessary?

jimh
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby jimh » Wed Nov 30, 2022 6:17 am

There are three general sources for a Bimini top for a MONTAUK 17:
  • buy from Wm. J. Mills. & Co., the original OEM for classic-era Boston Whaler boat canvas and made to suit the particulars of Dick Fisher; they are still supplying these products; you then install the top by following the directions provided;
  • commission a local artisan to fabricate a Bimini top to your specifications and the artisan will perform the installation on the boat; or
  • buy an off-the-shelf Bimini top said to be suitable for a Boston Whaler MONTAUK 17 from a big supplier of boat canvas, and fit the top to the boat as you see best.
Any of the three options will result in a usable Bimini top.

There are two important elements of the top construction to consider: the frame material and the fabric material. These choices will affect the cost, the strength, and the durability of the top.

FRAME MATERIAL
The frame for a Bimini top can be made from aluminum tubing or from stainless steel tubing. Aluminum tubing frames are lighter, not as strong, and generally less expensive. They often use plastic fittings or cast white-metal fittings for hinges. Stainless steel tubing frames are heavier, stronger, and more expensive. The fittings are all stainless steel and much stronger than plastic or cast fittings. The result is a stainless steel Bimini top frame is a more solid structure than an aluminum frame. There usually is a considerable cost difference going to all stainless steel frame and fittings. When aboard a boat and underway, the crew might grab onto the top frame as a hand hold for support. A frame made from steel will be more able to tolerate this sort of unexpected loading than an aluminum frame.

FABRIC MATERIAL
The fabric for a Bimini top is overwhelmingly best if made with the Glen Raven Mills SUNBRELLA material. The SUNBRELLA has been the gold-standard fabric for boat canvas for many decades because it is very color stable, tolerates exposure to sunlight and weather, when maintained well is very water resistant, and is very long-lasting. There are other materials which generally are less expensive, but their appearance, resistance to fading, weather resistance, and durability may not be as good as SUNBRELLA. Generally alternative fabrics are often promoted as being "as good as" SUNBRELLA but less expensive.

BUYING OFF THE SHELF PRE-MADE TOPS
Regarding buying an off-the-shelf top from a big manufacturer of Bimini tops, the Boston Whaler 16/17-foot hull has been in production since the 1960's, and there are hundreds of thousands of these boats. Accordingly, almost any big supplier of boat tops will have a top that is designed for a MONTAUK 17.

VERTICAL CLEARANCE UNDER TOP
Regarding a 6-foot-2-inches tall helmsman being able to stand under the Bimini top at the center console of a MONTAUK 17, this is a legitimate concern. Generally the frame size for a Bimini top is specified by the width of the frame and the height of the frame above the mounting point. The mounting point can vary. Some frames are mounted to hinges that are fixed to the gunwales, others are mounted to hinges fixed to the inwales, and others are mounted to hinges mounted to the railings of the side rails. Each mounting point will result in a different overall height under the Bimini top for a particular frame height. To know if a particular top will provide the desired height clearance, you have to measure from the mounting point of the frame hinge. The top should be level when deployed, so the angle of the frame rail must be considered when calculating the height under the top.

SLIDING TRACK
Regarding installation of a slide track so the hinge point of the frame can be moved fore and aft along the gunwale, the need for this depends on where you wish the folded top and its frame to be stowed when not erected. In general, whenever the boat is in use, the frame for the top will be erected. When the boat is not in use, the frame for the top should be able to be collapsed in order to reduce the overall height of the boat for trailer travel and storage. If the top is to be collapsed and folded down while the boat is in use, the frame and folded canvas will restrict movement fore and aft in the cockpit. For this reason the folded and collapsed top is often stowed at the very bow or very stern of the boat.

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Phil T
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby Phil T » Wed Nov 30, 2022 7:38 pm

I had the same concern.

When selecting the top you need to see the height when deployed.

I went with a Carver branded top.

L: 72" / H: 54" / W: 61"-66"
https://www.boatcoversdirect.com/products/bimini_tops/BOSTON_WHALER_75/17_MONTAUK_O-B_W-_BOW_RAIL_W-_SIDE_RAILS_2120/23/A5463UB/8/

You can also go with a 60" height (off the mounting postion) and 8' long.
https://www.covercraft.com/us/en/shop-bimini-top-by-dimension/60x96/61-66/

For a classic Montauk 17, the track is great. It allows you to stow the top on the outside of the bow rail (takes up less room) and have 2 deployed positions, RPS seated passengers and bow cooler seated passengers. .
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HeyBuddy
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby HeyBuddy » Thu Dec 01, 2022 2:23 am

Thank you for both of your comments. I've been looking at the CARVER-brand Bimini top, and I like it.

My MONTAUK 17 boat already has the mounts on the inwales from the previous owner.

I like the idea of using a track and having the ability to store the top outboard of the forward rails when not being used. Since Id like to store the top forward of the bow rail, the existing mounts cannot be used, and that is okay.

Phil:

Q2: do you have a photo of a Bimini top install with the hinge slide track?

Q3: what length of track are you using?

Thanks.

Jefecinco
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby Jefecinco » Thu Dec 01, 2022 9:45 am

If you intend to use a storage cover, highly recommended, for your boat having the bimini cover outside the bow rail will cause fit problems. Carver covers, also recommended, can be used while towing your boat if properly tied down. If towing your boat while covered is useful in your situation storing the bimini behind or inside the bow rail would be preferable. There are reasons that is the usual storage location.
Butch

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Phil T
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby Phil T » Thu Dec 01, 2022 10:35 am

Dale -

I sold my Montauk many moons ago.

I sent you an email with a link to my photos.

The sliders were very long--4-feet-long if I recall. See the photos.
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jimh
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby jimh » Thu Dec 01, 2022 11:22 am

On the rare occasion when my boat is in use and the Bimini top is not deployed, the frame is left in the erected position and the top's bows are folded in. Stowing the top in the erected frame position really is the simplest way to get the top out of the way without laying down the whole frame. The only time I fold down the frame is when the boat is going to be towed a long distance on the highway (or the boat is going to sit in the driveway on the trailer in storage). I don't want the added wind resistance of the upright frame with stowed top when towing, nor do I want a zillion bugs smashing into the boot cover on the top.

My boat also has a mooring cover (which is actually a storage cover or towing cover since the boat is never left on a mooring). The mooring cover was intentionally designed and fabricated for the Flying Top to be stowed and the frame to be folded down, rather than having ducts cut into the mooring cover to allow the Flying Top frame rails to pass through. Omitting those ducts in the cover also improves the ability of the cover to keep rain out of the cockpit.

HeyBuddy
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby HeyBuddy » Thu Dec 01, 2022 12:47 pm

Thanks for everyone’s comments. I think I’m going to go with the carver Bimini and cover. I’d also like to use the existing attachment points on the inwals but I’m going to measure everything this weekend and see what works. Cheers

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Alibertucci
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby Alibertucci » Thu Dec 01, 2022 5:31 pm

In Spring 2022 I bought the Carver Bimini in stainless steel and Sunbrella, and I am very pleased with it. I installed the frame hinge on the gunwales. Although I did purchase a track, I have not installed the track.

IMG_1910.jpg
Fig. 1. The Carver Bimini top fully deployed.
IMG_1910.jpg (49.15 KiB) Viewed 3363 times


IMG_1921.jpg
Fig. 2. The and bows folded into the frame.
IMG_1921.jpg (46.72 KiB) Viewed 3363 times


Sliding the frame aft on my Montauk 17 interfered with the engine when the engine was trimmed up for trailering and storage. Sliding the frame forward would have allowed the top to go over the bow railing. but I felt that position would create a problem for the boat cover.

I decided to install the Carver Bimini top without the tracks after dry fitting the cover and trying various down positions. I still have a new 24-inch-long track. I may eventually install the track to allow for more position options when the Bimini top is deployed

The clearance under the Carver Bimini top is plenty high enough for a six-foot-two person.

The antenna for the VHF radio is mounted at the console; the antenna fits under Bimini top when the top is deployed.
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jimh
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby jimh » Sat Dec 03, 2022 7:30 am

In Figures 1 and 2 the aft frame support tubes are set at quite an angle.

What was your thinking on the choice of angle for the aft frame support tubes?

I would have expected those frame tubes to mounted almost vertically.

HeyBuddy
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby HeyBuddy » Thu Feb 02, 2023 7:39 pm

For my 1975 [probably means MONTAUK 17] I will order from Carver the Bimini Top with stainless steel frame. I measured the [width between the center of the two] gunwales [on my 1975 MONTAUK 17] to be 69 to 70-inches. Carver’s width of their standard bimini is 61 to 66-inches.

Q4: will [a CARVER bimini top with 61 to 66-inch width work for gunwales that are 69 to 70-inches apart on center] if the vertical [frame railings are] bent out slightly?

Q5: or, should I order based upon my centerline dimensions of 69 to 70-inches?

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Phil T
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Re: Bimini Top

Postby Phil T » Thu Feb 02, 2023 7:59 pm

I would not order the 66-inches CARVER top.

Here is the wider size.

https://www.boatcoversdirect.com/products/bimini_tops/by_dimensions/length/72/height/60/widths/67-72/23/no-category/A6069UB/8/

Note that there is a 7-feet long as well as an 8-feet long.

Personally I think longer is better.

deck RPS.jpeg
Fig. 99. The slides from my 1987 Montauk 17.
deck RPS.jpeg (57.39 KiB) Viewed 3065 times


Q6: Is this the same location you are planning for?
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HeyBuddy
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Re: Bimini Top for Six-foot-two Helmsman

Postby HeyBuddy » Tue Feb 07, 2023 12:53 am

I ordered the wider CARVER top. Thanks for everyone’s input.