ICON Pro Gauge: TRIM Values

[spike2tx]

My recently purchased boat has a 2012 E-TEC 175-HP engine, installed with the MWS harness and with ICON Pro gauges.

I want the engine TRIM to properly show on the ICON Pro [RPM] gauge, and then I will add an ICON Accessory two-inch TRIM gauge.

I checked the wiring and the trim sender wire ( white/tan) is connected to accessory wire 8. [Perhaps means at lead P1-8 on the ICON Pro RPM gauge wiring harness.] I checked the setup on the gauge and configured input 8 for trim with EVINRUDE setting. Tried calibrating the up-down as well.

After calibration, the TRIM reading [on the ICON Pro RPM gauge] shows a 100-percent (or eight segments on the thermometer bar graph] but when the engine is trimmed down just a bit the display goes to 0-percent.

I even tried calibrating full down and just halfway up to see if that affected what I see on the display.

I tried disconnecting the trim sender wire and metering the resistance on that wire wire while trimming but I'm not getting the readings listed in the other posts. I read getting like 400-Ohm in the full down position and O when the trim hits the point from trim to tilt.

I also read somewhere that maybe I should use pin 7 input instead of pin 8.

Any help would be appreciated, thanks.

[jimh]

You have come to the right place to solve this problem.

I believe the real problem is in your rigging due to the use of the MWS wiring harness. If the engine is to be used with NMEA-2000 gauges like the ICON Pro series, the proper wiring harness would be the "I-Command" wiring harness.

I recommend you let the E-TEC engine measure the TRIM position, and convert that into a parameter in the NMEA-2000 protocol, sent as part of the engine data by the EMM in the engine.

In order to do this, you have to make a minor change to the wiring with the MWS harness. I will explain.

The MWS harness expected that an analogue TRIM gauge would be used, and in this manner, there would be current supplied to the TRIM SENDER on the engine from the analogue gauge. Without an analog TRIM gauge installed, the TRIM SENDER on the engine will not have any current supplied to it.

In the recommended "I-Command" wiring harness, Evinrude solves this problem by inserting a 47-Ohm, 5-Watt resistor into the harness, which effectively duplicates what an analogue TRIM gauge would have done.

When rigged this way, the engine trim can be calibrated using the procedure in the ICON Pro RPM gauge.

I have written about making this adaptation in an article at

Why 47-Ohms and Why 5-Watts
https://continuouswave.com/forum/viewto ... =10&t=5446

Also read all the other hyperlinked articles in the above article, particularly

Advanced E-TEC Rigging Notes: TRIM
https://continuouswave.com/whaler/refer ... .html#TRIM

Now that said, your method of connecting the ICON Pro RPM gauge directly to the trim sender will work. This is discussed in the Rigging Notes in the section under the sub-heading

ICON Pro Series Gauges without ICON Controls

The method you are trying to use is described in the section under the sub-heading

Analogue Input Data Source for Trim

There you will find a link to another article that explains how to accomplish what you are attempting, which is to let the ICON Pro RPM gauge connect directly to the trim sender.

TRIM Gauge with E-TEC 90
https://continuouswave.com/forum/viewto ... =10&t=2997

(Note: on the 90-HP E-TEC engines, the smaller EMM is not capable of converting the trim voltage to a NMEA-2000 parameter.)

I think the reason your set-up is not working is you failed to properly re-configure the ICON Pro RPM gauge to switch to using its own P1-7 wired input. This very important step is described in the above linked article about the E-TEC 90. And make sure only ONE input is set as the TRIM input—if two inputs are configured to be TRIM inputs there will likely be a problem.

Also, be certain you actually made the change. A LONG press of the MODE button is needed. If you make a short press of the MODE button that is interpreted as an exit command. For more help see

Evinrude ICON Pro RPM Gauge User Interface
https://continuouswave.com/whaler/refer ... _Menu.html

The drawback to wiring the trim sender directly to the ICON Pro RPM gauge is that if you configure the trim wiring this way, the only gauge that can show the TRIM value will be the ICON Pro RPM gauge and an accessory gauge connected to it via the ICON gauge bus (based on a report by someone who did this and said it worked with the accessory gauge, too).

For me, the best approach is to add the 47-Ohm 5-Watt resistor as described above, and let the engine send the TRIM data via the NMEA-2000 protocol. In this way you can also read the trim data on any NMEA-2000 display that can show engine data.

I am certain if your carefully read all the articles for content and comprehension that I have mentioned above, you will have a clear understanding of the several options for the trim wiring. But again, were I rigging this, I would make the modification to the wiring harness with the 47-Ohm 5-Watt resistor. On the other hand if you already have gone to the trouble of wiring the trim sender to the ICON Pro RPM gauge input, you can just perform the re-configuration procedure I describe in the article just mentioned above. Also, you can leave it wired to P1-8, but be sure to set all the other inputs to not be the TRIM input, and to designate P1-8 as the TRIM input.

But be aware that you won't be able to show the TRIM value on other NMEA-2000 gauges if you do it that way. On my own boat with an E-TEC, I have a multi-function display and have configured three pages of that display to show all sorts of engine data, including trim. I find this is a very handy method to see a lot of engine data on one screen.

[jimh]

As for how you were able to measure 400-Ohms as the resistance of the TRIM sender, you probably made this measurement while other circuits were connected. To measure the resistance of the TRIM sender, you must disconnect all other circuits from the sender. The expected range of resistance is much different than your measurement.

See my article at

TANK SENDER and TRIM SENDER RESISTANCE
https://continuouswave.com/forum/viewto ... f=9&t=3043

There you will find that the proper range of resistance for an Evinrude trim sender will be 10-Ohms (at full UP) to 88-Ohms (at full DOWN).

[spike2tx]

[The resistive fuel tank level] sender’s white-tan wire [located] at the dashboard harness is connected to P1-8 [at the ICON Pro RPM gauge] with no resistor. P1-8 is configured for trim, and all other analog inputs are set to NC. Data for trim [sender] is set to Evinrude.

I metered the trim sender from ground to white-tan with nothing else connected.

Are you saying I should install the [47-Ohm 5-Watt] resistor and change [the configuration on the ICON Pro RPM gauge to source the TRIM data] to NMEA-2000?

[jimh]

[The resistive fuel tank level] sender’s white-tan wire [located] at the dashboard harness is connected to P1-8 [at the ICON Pro RPM gauge] with no resistor. P1-8 is configured for trim, and all other analog inputs are set to NC. Data for trim [sender] is set to Evinrude.

Assuming all is as you say, there should not be a problem with the ICON Pro RPM gauge indicating TRIM level, once the circuit has been calibrated using the calibration procedure in the ICON Pro RPM gauge. Since you seem to have done everything correctly, there are only two reasonable explanations for why it is not working:

1. you omitted some step that is required, or
2. the trim sender is not working properly.

I metered the trim sender from ground to white-tan with nothing else connected.

That technique should give you a reading between 10-Ohms and 88-Ohms. You report a reading of 400-Ohms. This indicated that of the two possible causes of the problem mentioned above, the most likely cause of the problem is the second option: there is a problem with the trim sender. Its resistance is out of the normal expected range.

Are you saying I should install the [47-Ohm 5-Watt] resistor and change [the configuration on the ICON Pro RPM gauge to source the TRIM data] to NMEA-2000?

As I explained earlier, you can choose how you want to implement the TRIM function, but my recommendation is to employ the method in which the TRIM SENDER is connected to the EMM, and the EMM measures the resistance of TRIM SENDER, then converts that into a value for TRIM POSITION from 0 to 100 based on a calibration procedure. To use the EMM calibration procedure you must have the EMM connected via a serial-data-interface cable to a terminal that is running EV-DIAGNOSTIC v.5 software. If you do not have the ability to use EV-DIAGNOSTICS v.5 software, then stick with the method you are trying now.

To be clear, my latest recommendation is that you more carefully and thoroughly inspect the trim sender on the engine bracket, as perhaps there is something quite wrong with it.

HOW TO MEASURE THE RESISTANCE OF THE TRIM SENDER

If you are connecting to the WHITE with TAN stripe conductor at the helm, that circuit is also connected to the EMM. So you are not measuring the actual resistance of the TRIM SENDER with nothing else connected. In order to measure the resistance of the trim sender itself, you need to remove the engine cowling, locate the three-pole connector in the engine wiring harness that has the following wire colors:

1. WHITE with TAN stripe
2. BLACK with TAN stripe
3. Green

This is the connector that connects to the actual TRIM sender. Disconnect the engine from the trim sender, and measure the resistance of the trim sender between the WHITE with TAN stripe wire and the BLACK with TAN stripe wire. This will give you access to the trim sender resistance without anything else connected. Report the resistance reading. You can also now move the engine position using the power trim and observe the change in resistance. The sender resistance should conform to the range specified above, 10 to 88-Ohms. Report your findings and then more advice can be given.

To better visualize the actual circuit of the TRIM SENDER, read this article:

E-TEC Trim Sender Circuit Details
https://continuouswave.com/forum/viewto ... =10&t=3349

There you will find this wiring diagram sketch I made to make the circuit easier to visualize:


Fig. 1. A sketch showing the path and details of the trim sender circuit from the sender, to the the engine, via several connections, and to the helm via the MWS harness.

Note that in engines prior to c.2012 the TRIM SENDER was subject to damage if there was a poor battery negative connection. Read about his in another article on that topic:

Improved TRIM SENDER for E-TEC c.2012
https://continuouswave.com/forum/viewto ... 072#p19072

Also, you may find this account of my own experience in trying to the the P1-7 input to work as the TRIM input when I was experimenting with this circuit on my bench. Read

Simulating an Evinrude TRIM Sensor
or How not to go crazy trying to perform the CAL SENDER procedure
https://continuouswave.com/forum/viewto ... =10&t=3226

You might find the narrative to be interesting. And, just for fun, you might try using P1-7 as the input, as that seems to be the preferred use based on the suggesting in the owner's manual for the ICON Pro RPM gauge, as I recall.

[jimh]

NEW IDEA

After reviewing what I have written already, it occurs to me that the essential problem here is because of the way you have accessed the TRIM SENDER: you are also connected to the EMM. This is inherent in the engine wiring harness on your engine. Note that I mean the engine wiring harness and not the MWS rigging harness.

In the article in which I commented about the 90-HP engine using the method of connecting the trim sender to the ICON Pro RPM gauge, there is a BIG difference from your 175-HP engine. In the 90-HP engine the trim sender does NOT connect at all to the EMM. So when the WHITE with TAN stripe conductor arrives at the helm, it has not passed through the EMM current measuring circuit, it just goes direct from sender to the wire at the helm. This is radically different than on the 175-HP engine. This may be the cause of all the problems you are experiencing.

If this is true, and I have a strong feeling this is the real problem, then I see only two solutions:

1. hack into the engine harness wiring and alter it so the WHITE with TAN wire no longer is connected to the EMM--and I DO not endorse this approach, or
2. change your whole plan of attack and install the 47-Ohm 5-Watt resistor into the MWS wiring at the helm, and obtain the needed EV-DIAGNOSTIC v.5 software so you can then calibrate the TRIM sensor.

If you already have EV-DIAGNOSTICS v.5, then you certainly should change plans and use the NMEA-2000 data source method. This is much preferred compared to hacking up the engine wiring harness.

If you DO NOT already have access to EV-DIagnostics software v.5, you probably should get set up with that. For a summary of what is needed to run EV-Diagnostics software see this article:

EV-Diagnostic Software
https://continuouswave.com/forum/viewto ... 706#p26694

[spike2tx]

I'll have to look [at something unspecified] when I get the boat back from the shop. The white-tan wire being used is in the bundle with the ["molex' connectors] that directly plug into the [ICON Pro RPM gauge wiring harness]. [The wire harness includes] a three-wire bundle with a [VIOLET] and [BLACK] wire which powers the [ICON Pro RPM] gauge.

I assumed by looking at the wiring schematic for [the ICON Pro RPM gauge] that [this boat has the [MWS] harness not the I-Command harness.

I bought a new trim sender to have handy in case the sender is the culprit.

I'll let you know what I find.

Also to note, the engine was installed in place of the original engine and the trim circuit was already connected as I described. I assumed it worked at some point—but who knows.

[jimh]

The wiring problem is in the engine’s wiring harness under the cowling. The problem is not in the MWS harness on how you have interfaced the ICON Pro RPM Gauge analog input to the WHITE with TAN stripe wire provided in the MWS wiring harness.

The ICON Pro RPM gauge has its own special multi-pole connecter, which breaks out all the circuits into individual circuits, such power, NMEA-2000, analog inputs. If there are “molex” connectors on those breakout wire someone must have added them, as most of the circuits are just on loose wires except the DeviceNet Micro connector on the NMEA-2000 cable. If Evinrude put any connector on the end of the ICON Pro RPM gauge harness they would have used a Deutsch connector, perhaps for the power circuit and maybe for the external aural alert sounder circuit. The analog input circuits would have been loose wires with clear labels to identify them by P1-n pin number and perhaps preferred function assignment.

Unless someone made a major alteration to the E-TEC 175-HP engine’s internal wiring, the problem that I am alerting you to will definitely be occurring, and it is because, I have stated several times, that in the current wiring arrangement you have the trim sender is being connected to the EMM via the routing of the circuit in the engine's own wiring harness.

Also to note, the engine was installed in place of the original engine and the trim circuit was already connected as I described so I assumed it worked at some point—but who knows.

The TRIM circuit would have worked with a non-E-TEC Evirude engine with a NWS wiring harness interface, which would be any engine made after c.1995. or with any 90-HP or lower E-TEC engine. That is because both of those groups of Evinrude either:

1. do NOT have NMEA-2000, or
2. if the have NMEA-2000 they do NOT have the ability to send trim data in their engine data parameters, and the trim circuit is not routed through the EMM.

[jimh]

About two weeks have elapsed since this discussion began. Has there been any resolution of the problem?

[spike2tx]

ok, finally today I installed a new trim sender to rule that out. I still have not trim showing on the gauge. Everything looks factory in the engine wiring so I can assume the sender is going to the EMM. I will look for the software to do the calibration. I'm lost on why I need to add a 47 ohm resister to the trim sender white/tan in the dash if I am setting the Trim source back to NEMA?

[jimh]

You should feel free to not follow the advice already offered to remedy the problem. I have exhausted all my ideas and attempts to explain them.

[spike2tx]

I’m trying to follow them but I don’t understand wiring in the [resistor] when I’m using the [NMEA-2000] source not the analog source.

[jimh]

I’m trying to follow them but I don’t understand wiring in the resister when I’m using the Nema [sic] source not the analog source.

I have already pointed you to the answer to your question. It does no use to give you pointers to the answer to your question if you do not follow the pointer to the answer and read the article for comprehension.

The answer to your question was given in my first reply to you in this thread. Please re-read my first reply and follow the hyperlinked text that says “Why 47-Ohms and Why 5-Watts.” You can keep telling me you do not understand why the resistor is needed, but you really ought to try reading the answer already given.

Also, there nothing involved in this discussion that is related to “Nema.” The protocol involved in the NMEA-2000 protocol.

There is no mystery about needing the 47-Ohm resistor when you use the WRONG wiring harness. The resistor is needed to create a source for current to flow in the circuit. If you had rigged the engine with the "I-Command Wiring Harness" the 47-Ohm and 5-Watt resistor would already be in place as part of the proper wiring harness.

[spike2tx]

Update

I installed the 47-Ohm resistor. I replaced the trim sender.

After performing the calibration procedure with EV-Diagnostic software, and when using the EV-Diagnostics software I was able to watch the value of TRIM change from 0 to 100 as the engine trim changed.

Also, on the ICON Pro RPM gauge I set the TRIM DATA SOUCE to "NMEA" and on all other analog inputs I removed Trim.

BUT still on the ICON Pro RPM gauge the display value of TRIM remains at 0, no matter the engine position.

[jimh]

I installed the 47-Ohm resistor.

I am glad you finally overcame your RESISTANCE to installing the RESISTOR.

At this point, with the addition of the 47-Ohm resistor, the systems should be working.

If I encountered this problem, my next step would be:

--do a total reset on the ICON Pro RPM gauge, and begin the configuration procedure over again.

Also, if the E-TEC engine is now sending engine TRIM data, you should be able to see that data on any other multi-function display that supports showing NMEA-2000 engine data. Seeing another device show the TRIM data would confirm that the engine is actually sending it to the NMEA-2000 network.

[spike2tx]

I have a new Garmin unit connected to the [boat’s NMEA-2000] network. I'll try that [display] and check for engine [TRIM] data.

[jimh]

A corollary question:

Q1: are you getting NMEA-2000 engine data on the ICON Pro RPM gauge, like engine speed and engine temperature?

ASIDE: I think at this point (and from your lengthy narratives) you must have already connected EV-Diagnostics to the E-TEC engine EMM and performed a calibration procedure for the TRIM sensor. Until this calibration process is done, the EMM will not send any data about engine TRIM. If you think you already did this procedure, it would not hurt to perform it again.

[spike2tx]

I have TRIM data on the ICON Pro RPM gauge!

I calibrated [the engine EMM for the TRIM function] with the [EV-Diagnostics] software.

Then ran the engine to check data like water pressure and engine temperature from the engine getting to the gauge; the gauge showed those data.

Then I did the Master Reset [on the ICON Pro RPM gauge] as you suggested.

Then I went through the Initialization procedure, and TRIM [data] popped up and worked without any other settings being changed.

Thanks for all the help.

[jimh]

Your outcome was good. Thanks for following up with the eventual outcome that fixed the initial problem.