2019 230 OUTRAGE v. 2025 190 MONTAUK: Operating Tips

[sausalitoswiss]

For readers with experience with a 2019 230 OUTRAGE and a 2025 190 MONTAUK and their use in condition on choppy bays or windy coastlines, and particularly in San Francisco Bay:

Q1: how do a 2019 230 OUTRAGE and a 2025 190 MONTAUK compare in ride quality in San Francisco Bay chop?

Q2: will the extra size of the 230 OUTRAGE make a big difference in rough water?

Q3: will the hardtop of a 230 OUTRAGE produce more comfort for guests and keep them dry and cozy, as compare to the open layout on a 190 MONTAUK?

Q4: on the 230 OUTRAGE, is there any must-have add-on gear, such as an enclosure?

Q5: on the 190 MONTAUK, is there any must-have add-on gear, such as an enclosure?

Q6: is the 190 MONTAUK safe for use in San Francisco Bay current?

Q7: is the 230 OUTRAGE safe for use in San Francisco Bay current?

Q8: with six to eight people aboard, will a 190 MONTAUK [with 150-HP engine] be under-powered?

Q9: considering re-sale value, will the extra cost to purchase the 230 OUTRAGE be worth the added expense compared to the less expensive 190 MONTAUK?

BACKSTORY
I'm in the market for a Boston Whaler to use in the San Francisco Bay Area, primarily for commuting from Sausalito to San Francisco (a trip of about eight miles), and also for sunset cruises with as many as eight friends, plus occasional angling, and possibly--after gaining more confidence--for coastal day trips (such as going 20 to 50-miles to Tomales Bay or Half Moon Bay) in good weather.

I have gotten many opinions on what to get for San Francisco Bay and am a bit turned around, and my options here are a bit strange. I'm debating between:

• a used 2019 230 Outrage with a Mercury 250-HP V8 engine that has around 860 hours, a hardtop, in-console head, listed around $160,000 with trailer; or,
• a new 2025 190 Montauk with a Mercury 150-HP engine at $85,000 base price.

My budget is about $100,000, but I can stretch slightly for the right [boat].

I’m prioritizing protection from

• wind, spray, and cold, because San Francisco Bay gets 15 to 30-knot winds and two- to four-feet chop;
• ease of maintenance; and,
• resale value.

OTHER ADVICE
In addition to my nine questions, please give me tips for operating in San Francisco Bay.

[jimh]

Q3: will the hardtop of a 230 OUTRAGE produce more comfort for guests and keep them dry and cozy, as compare to the open layout on a 190 MONTAUK?

A hard top will protect a limited area of the cockpit from rain, but do nothing about spray. It will not affect the wind chill or ambient temperature at all.

The hard top will make the boat more difficult to store due to the much higher fixed height. The hard top will make the boat more difficult to trailer due to added wind resistance from the fixed hard top, which will be particularly influential at highway speeds as the drag from wind resistance increases exponentially with wind speed. The hard top will tend to raise the boat's center of gravity causing the stability of the boat to decrease.

Generally a hard top is useful for avid anglers as it provides a location for many rod holders. It also allows anglers fighting a large fish to be able to move around the entire perimeter of the boat without any blockage, which is apparently a prized feature in those situations.

[jimh]

Q8: with six to eight people aboard, will a 190 MONTAUK [with 150-HP engine] be under-powered?

All boat performance is always subject to the power-to-weight ratio. On smaller boats, the added weight of eight adults represents a considerable increase in the total boat weight. Without a corresponding increase in the engine power, the performance will always be reduced. There certainly will be a significant difference in performance on a 190 MONTUAK (or any small boat) with eight guests aboard (for a total on nine adults) compare to one adult aboard.

Also, you won't be able to have more than seven guests on a 190 MONTAUK because the rated capacity is for eight persons in total.

The 190 MONTAUK weight with engine and fuel is said to be 2,770-lbs. Let's use 180-lbs as the weight of one adult (which is 5-lbs less than the USCG uses), so with one person aboard the boat total weight will be 2,950-lbs. With 150-HP the Boston Whaler performance table indicates a boat speed of 47-MPH. With the power, weight, and speed taken from those data, we can estimate the hull coefficient for the Crouch Speed Prediction formula using my Crouch's Calculator as 208. Now we can estimate speed with eight 180-lbs adults aboard, again using 180-lbs per adult for an additional weight of 1,260-lbs, bringing boat weight up to 4,210-lbs. Again using the calculator, we use the new weight, the now known hull coefficient, and the same 150-HP to predict a new boat speed: 39-MPH.

In actual use the maximum boat speed will very likely be lower because the predicted speed assumes the engine will still produce 150-HP. Unless the propeller is changed to a lower pitch, the existing engine will not be able to accelerate under the new load to the same 5,900-RPM it did with the single person aboard, and this is particularly true with four-stroke-power-cycle engines, where we generally always see that the highest power output is occurring right at the maximum allowed engine speed. Without changing to a lower pitch propeller, the engine will NEVER be able to get back to its 150-HP power level because it will never be able to accelerate to 5,900-RPM.

If we estimate the engine power output falls to perhaps 125-HP due to limited engine speed, then the boat speed with the new higher load conditions wll decrease to about 35 to 36-MPH. However, the speed prediction always relies on having an efficiently operating propeller, and because the boat speed is now quite a bit slower, the original propeller won't be working as efficiently, which will probably cause the top boat speed to be further reduced, perhaps as low as say 32-MPH.

The real hurdle to be overcome with such a heavier load will be if the engine can produce enough power at lower engine speeds to enable the boat to even get onto plane. To reach plane the boat must accelerate uphill and get over its own bow wave. In many cases the available engine power at much reduced engine speeds can fail to sufficient to push the boat over its bow wave, and the boat never gets on plane. The only way to know for certain will be a sea trial.

If you really need to operate the 190 MONTAUK with eight adults aboard, you will probably need to change the propeller to one with a lower-pitch.

[Jefecinco]

We owned a 190 Montauk and it's a marvelous boat. It does well in a moderate chop and should be a great performer with a 150HP engine. Our 190 was powered by a 135 HP engine and we were very happy with the performance. Regardless of the 190s many qualities I believe a 230 Outrage, assuming it is powered by the right engine, will be superior in every respect for your stated use. The extra room, longer hull with more deadrise should more than offset six additional years of use. The Outrage, assuming it is in excellent condition, should also be a far better value.

[NorthShoreWhaler]

[Endorses the 2019 230] Outrage for this use scenario.

[Having] six people on a 190 MONTAUK is very crowded.