1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Optimizing the performance of Boston Whaler boats
Dave_a
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:55 am

1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Dave_a » Tue Sep 13, 2022 2:07 pm

Recently I purchased a 1964 Nauset that spent 25 years in a barn. I have weighed the boat: it's dry. I believe it weighs about 800-lbs. It has a Homelite 55. I cannot locate any parts source for impellers, points, and other ignition parts. So a re-power is in my future.

I have read almost every re-power post in CW. I distilled my questions to three:

Q1: is keeping engine weight below 300-lbs a critical factor for re-powering an older hull like a 1964 NAUSET 16?

Engine choices abound at engine weights of 359-lbs.

Q2: will 60-HP be enough power to haul three old guys fishing, or ski a couple kids with maybe four on board?

Q3: is a Yamaha F70 and its 10-HP more worth a cost increase of $2,000 more than a Mercury 60 or Suzuki 60?

My idea re-power is to find a late model sweet-water 90-HP two-stroke-power-cycle engine that weighs about 275-lbs. The 2020 to 2022 COVID years have eaten up the used engine supply. I can't find a used engine from 2010 on that isn't priced at 80% of new retail.
So it looks like new.

jimh
Posts: 11869
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:25 pm
Location: Michigan, Lower Peninsula
Contact:

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby jimh » Tue Sep 13, 2022 2:42 pm

Re your boat’s present engine and wear parts:

A fellow on the West Coast was rebuilding and selling HOMELITE AKA BEARCAT 55-HP engines, but that was 21-years ago. In internet years that is about two centuries in the past. See

https://continuouswave.com/whaler/refer ... arcat.html

All the hyperlinks are now redirected to domain squatters. Maybe the telephone number still is good.

Ed Ewing
Economy 4Cycle Marine
(530)241-7990

jimh
Posts: 11869
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:25 pm
Location: Michigan, Lower Peninsula
Contact:

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby jimh » Tue Sep 13, 2022 2:57 pm

Dave_a wrote:Q1: is keeping engine weight below 300-lbs a critical factor for re-powering an older hull like a 1964 NAUSET 16?
A realistic answer is: it depends.

The answer depends on who you ask. Some people think there is harm in too much engine weight and some people think too much engine weight is harmless. I am in the first group.

The answer depends on the particular boat. Your boat is 58-years old. It is not getting stronger with age, but it could be just about as strong as it was when new if the hull were in perfect condition. But that would be the exceptional case, not the norm.

You can simulate more engine weight with some sand bags draped over the transom or atop the engine cowling.

A reasonable criterion to judge by is the position of cockpit or engine splash well drains relative to the static waterline. The drains are supposed to be able to drain water from the boat, not to allow water to flood into the boat.

User avatar
Phil T
Posts: 2624
Joined: Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:08 pm
Location: Was Maine. Temporarily Kentucky

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Phil T » Tue Sep 13, 2022 3:00 pm

Answers -

A 1: - No

A 2: - No

A 3:- Yes

The Yamaha F70 has a stellar reputation, class leading power-to-weight ratio and is the leading choice for repowering classic 16' and 17' hulls.

Reported prices are ~ $9-10K for the engine, $1000 for rigging, $500 for a stainless prop and $1000 for removal and installation.

Shop dealers hard with detailed written quotes. Prices vary.

Try to find a dealer with experience with repowering Boston Whalers. The engine should be mounted so the top bolts are in the 3rd hole down from the top AND the lower bolts clear the bottom of the splashwell. Blind lag screws should not be used.
1992 Outrage 17
2019 E-TEC 90
2018 LoadRite 18280096VT
Member since 2003

jimh
Posts: 11869
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:25 pm
Location: Michigan, Lower Peninsula
Contact:

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby jimh » Tue Sep 13, 2022 3:04 pm

Q2: will 60-HP be enough power to haul three old guys fishing, or ski a couple kids with maybe four on board?
You have the wrong boat for those uses. For three guys fishing get an OUTRAGE 22. For towing two water skiers with four aboard get a water sports boat like an older 220 DAUNTLESS with 200-HP and with very low stern freeboard so swimmers can easily get into the boat from the water.

To do all that in a 16-footer is just dreaming.

jimh
Posts: 11869
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:25 pm
Location: Michigan, Lower Peninsula
Contact:

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby jimh » Tue Sep 13, 2022 3:12 pm

Dave_a wrote:Q3: is a Yamaha F70 and its 10-HP more worth a cost increase of $2,000 more than a Mercury 60 or Suzuki 60?
If the F70 is a four-cylinder and the others are three-cylinders, that could account for what otherwise seems like a rather remarkable price premium for 10-HP.

User avatar
Phil T
Posts: 2624
Joined: Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:08 pm
Location: Was Maine. Temporarily Kentucky

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Phil T » Tue Sep 13, 2022 6:10 pm

The Yamaha F70 is a 1.0 liter, 4-cylinder that has a WOT rpm of 6300 and dry weight of 253 lbs.

The Mercury 60 Fourstroke is a 995cc, 4-cylinder, that has a WOT rpm of 6000 and dry weight of 247 lbs.

The Suzuki DF60A is a 941cc, 3-cylinder, that has a WOT rpm of 6300 and dry weight of 229 lbs.
1992 Outrage 17
2019 E-TEC 90
2018 LoadRite 18280096VT
Member since 2003

Dave_a
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:55 am

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Dave_a » Tue Sep 13, 2022 6:21 pm

Phil, you said an extra 100-lbs on the transom doesn't really matter. What do you base that on?

If [engine] weight doesn't matter I can go to 90 to 100-HP at 353 to 359-lbs.

But then you said the Yamaha 70 is worth $10,800 rigged and with a propeller: dId I miss understand your reply?

Dave_a
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:55 am

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Dave_a » Tue Sep 13, 2022 6:38 pm

[Some unidentified outboard engine makers] use four-cylinder blocks for their 60 to 115-HP engines.

Suzuki goes to four cylinder engines [from three cylinder engines] at their 115-HP model. It weighs 401-lbs

Outboard engine manufacturers used different engines to span the mid-range power.

The Yamaha F70 has small-block 40 to 60-HP weight and " big block" power. It really appears to be the Unicorn

Every other 70-HP weighs hundreds of pounds more.

ASIDE: JIMH-I got what I got. A LONG time ago I skied two teens behind a 14'-foot Lonestar with a 40-HP engine.

User avatar
Phil T
Posts: 2624
Joined: Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:08 pm
Location: Was Maine. Temporarily Kentucky

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Phil T » Tue Sep 13, 2022 6:51 pm

Yes, you can go with a 90hp or even a Honda 100hp.

To offset the weight gain, the battery should be moved to the console.

You can test the new engine weight by adding bags of sand, water, cinder blocks, etc., to understand the new transom weight.

The reported prices were what owners have paid in the last few months for an F70 install.

A Mercury or Yamaha 90 hp runs ~$15,000. Suzuki DF90 slightly less, Honda BF 90 slightly more.
1992 Outrage 17
2019 E-TEC 90
2018 LoadRite 18280096VT
Member since 2003

Dave_a
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:55 am

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Dave_a » Wed Sep 14, 2022 7:49 am

I left the Homelite in the seller's barn temporarily. My tow vehicle wasn't rated for towing, so I wanted to minimize trailer weight. My truck was 1100 miles away.

Interesting that the HOMELITE engine developed in the late 1950's weighs the same as the much heralded Yamaha 70. Overhead cam and no cam belt to worry about changing. I can see Yamaha engineers taking up the challenge to produce a new engine meeting the design criteria.

PHIL T: SUZUKI DF 90 weighs 352-lbs rigged and costs about $11,500.

Q4 : would you buy a used E-TEC?



ASIDE: PHIL T: That's a lot of sand bags.

User avatar
Phil T
Posts: 2624
Joined: Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:08 pm
Location: Was Maine. Temporarily Kentucky

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Phil T » Wed Sep 14, 2022 10:12 am

Dave—I would buy a used late model ETEC-90 for that hull. The E-TEC 75 is a bit heavy.
1992 Outrage 17
2019 E-TEC 90
2018 LoadRite 18280096VT
Member since 2003

Dave_a
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:55 am

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Dave_a » Wed Sep 14, 2022 2:40 pm

Re sources for Homelite or Bearcat parts:

I spoke to the new owner of what used to be "Economy Four Cycle Marine". They do very little with Homelite these days; general marine repair is their focus. He tells me Ed Ewing has been gone a long time.

There are no oil filters, impellers, and ignition parts being manufactured any longer. He has a few OE parts left from the Ewing days.

I tried Crosley Hot Shot (auto) which used the same engine earlier in the 1950's. Nothing there either.

Time to donate the HOMELITE 55 engine to the Clayton Wood Boat Museum. They don't have one on display.

fno
Posts: 183
Joined: Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:01 pm

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby fno » Wed Sep 14, 2022 6:49 pm

Why not put a 90-HP or 115-HP [in-line six cylinder] tower-of-power on that NAUSET 16?

Search classicmercuryoutboards

Weight will not be a problem. The boat speed will scare you and your oldster buddies. And the engine will pull two or three teenagers out of the water at once. The only pain you will feel is at the pump when you have to supply that gas guzzler with fuel. But what the heck, you can't take the monety with you. So, look cool, sound cool, and run around in that boat like a bat out of hell.

jimh
Posts: 11869
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:25 pm
Location: Michigan, Lower Peninsula
Contact:

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby jimh » Thu Sep 15, 2022 9:48 am

The three-cylinder E-TEC 75-HP and 90-HP are the same engine and same weight. The 90 model makes about 85 to 88-HP; the 75 model makes 75-HP. The three-cylinder legacy E-TEC has a very good track record. When it was in production those engines were very popular as a re-power choice for the 16/17 hulls. When the weight of four-stroke-power-cycle engines came down, they became an alternative choice for re-powering.

All E-TEC engines record data about their operating history. If looking at a used E-TEC engine an up-to-date engine history report would be essential for a buyer to see before buying.

More on E-TEC engine history report at

E-TEC Engine History Report
https://continuouswave.com/whaler/refer ... eport.html

jimh
Posts: 11869
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:25 pm
Location: Michigan, Lower Peninsula
Contact:

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby jimh » Thu Sep 15, 2022 2:26 pm

Dave_a wrote:ASIDE: JIMH-I got what I got. A LONG time ago I skied two teens behind a 14'-foot Lonestar with a 40-HP engine.
DAVE—don’t kid yourself. A NAUSET 16 with four people aboard is not going to very useful for pulling two water skiers.

The classic 16/17 foot hulls are great boats, but they just cannot do everything.

Also, younger kids are not able to water ski due to general lack of strength. I see plenty of kids clinging to some stupid water toy while getting towed around by their parents, crossing their own wake for more thrills. It is not a particularly athletic display of skill. Apparently the more they scream the more fun is being had.

The only people I see water skiing these days are usually older teens or young adults who appear quite fit and athletic. And they are being towed by classic Ski Nautique inboard boats.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ski_Nautique

Dave_a
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2022 8:55 am

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby Dave_a » Fri Sep 16, 2022 9:17 am

At least they're not on their PHONES! Maybe that's why they're screaming?


On the engine front, I've deduced 60-HP is marginal when [a NAUSET 16 is heavily] loaded.

With the exception of Yamaha F70, all other brands of 70 to 100-HP are 343-lbs to 359-lbs.

One can buy a 90-HP for approx. the same price as a Yamaha F70.

I remain unclear if the 350-lbs engines are too heavy for a NAUSET.

I am still gathering pricing information.

MarkCz
Posts: 141
Joined: Sat Jan 27, 2018 3:44 pm

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby MarkCz » Fri Sep 16, 2022 7:46 pm

When I was age 15 we used to ski behind a 16-foot-boat with an 18-HP stroke-power-cycle-engine with two people in the boat and one on skis. We each weighed 150-lbs.

jimh
Posts: 11869
Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:25 pm
Location: Michigan, Lower Peninsula
Contact:

Re: 1964 NAUSET 16 Engine Weight

Postby jimh » Sat Sep 17, 2022 9:10 am

Dave_a wrote:At least they're not on their PHONES! Maybe that's why they're screaming?
Good point. It will take about 50 years, but some day those kids will be reminiscing about Dad and how much fun they had trying to waterski behind that old Boston Whaler boat.