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Author Topic:   Announcing: Whaler Voting Booth

jimh posted 12-03-2000 04:32 PM ET (US)
A new feature on the website, the Whaler Voting Booth. I think everyone will find this interesting. See:
http://continuouswave.com/whaler/poll/index.php
--jimh
dscew posted 12-03-2000 05:51 PM ET (US)
What a great idea Jim!. I cast my vote for my 17. Thanks for a great job...Dennis
stagalv posted 12-03-2000 09:48 PM ET (US)
Jim, if my size Whaler does not win like I want it to, can I force you to have a recount?? Rex
lhg posted 12-03-2000 10:26 PM ET (US)
I've just hired Warren Christopher to make sure my boat has a fair vote count, and to totally disrupt the operation of this website.
jimh posted 12-03-2000 10:29 PM ET (US)
If you are voting from Dade County, Florida, be sure to click FIRMLY on your mouse when making your choice to insure that your vote is properly registered.
I don't want to set an example for the youth of America in which all votes aren't counted!
--jimh
kingfish posted 12-03-2000 10:45 PM ET (US)
Hey, it doesn't matter who wins, just as long as every vote is counted! (as long as they are for me...)
kingfish
lhg posted 12-03-2000 10:49 PM ET (US)
What assurance do we have that votes from PC machines will be counted the same as votes from Mac machines? After all, ContinuousssWave is a heavily Mac domain. I think we will have to insist that a representative of each boat size is enlisted to re-count the vote, as we all know computers alone can't be trusted and are highly unreliable. What is our deadline for final vote certification by the Secretary of ContinuousWave?
hauptjm posted 12-04-2000 09:31 AM ET (US)
How many times can I vote?????
hauptjm posted 12-04-2000 11:02 AM ET (US)
Wow! Look at the latest results, and I'm shocked at the number of 16/17s. I guess I always thought the smaller craft would inherently be the larger volume of boat purchased/owned. Does anyone know what the factory stats are broken down by size as far as sales go??
Mark Gallagher posted 12-04-2000 11:45 AM ET (US)
Jim,
Another innovation of this forum...I like it.
May I suggest that another poll be: where do you live? I'd like to see geographically where most of these Whalers reside.
Great job on the site.
Mark
rwest posted 12-04-2000 06:13 PM ET (US)
This is my second Classic Whaler. Since I couldn't vote on the Web back in 72' due to the minor teck-no-kal-ity that there wern't no internet back then, I figure I need to get to vote once for each year that I had it minus the years I was stupid and didn't have one due to being really dumb and selling it. Based on that figure I don't get to vote again for 18 more years, darn....Maybe the Butterfly ballot would be better.
Whaletosh posted 12-06-2000 08:52 AM ET (US)
Actually the roots of the internet go back to 1969. It wasn't available to the general public until Al Gore "invented" it.
Sean Bashaw
jimh posted 12-07-2000 08:55 AM ET (US)
Hmm... Has anyone been unable to vote in the second poll because the poll software thinks you have already voted?
I think I may have some more work to do here...
Let me know by replying to this thread if you could not vote in the second poll.
--jimh
Ed Stone posted 12-07-2000 09:52 PM ET (US)
Hey Jimh,
What would a 1996 - 2000 classic whaler be?
rhemrah posted 12-07-2000 10:31 PM ET (US)
HELLLLLLLP, CHADS ARE FALLING OUT OF MY COMPUTER.

RICK
jimh posted 12-07-2000 11:56 PM ET (US)
Ed Stone asks:
"Hey Jimh,
What would a 1996 - 2000 classic whaler be? "
Any of the following:
17 Montauk (still being made)
27 Offshore (last made 1998)
13 Classic Aniversary Edition (last 1998)
17 Standard (still available)
any many others available in that time.
--jimh
hauptjm posted 12-08-2000 11:20 AM ET (US)
As of 1015 CST it looks like a pattern is emerging from the exit polls. An '80s Montauk might be the most popular boat among the Whaler population in this site. Not surprising considering the 30 years they have been making this craft. Let's look for another 30 from Bayliner. It's their only chance to build some credibility among real boats.
george nagy posted 12-15-2000 09:22 AM ET (US)
Yes, I was able to vote on the second poll but it is telling me I have already voted on the third. I haven't voted on the third yet. What is going on here? And by the way I live in Palm Beach County Florida and hope that this isn't another "rigged voting system". You may want to look at each "chad". Some might have gotten "pregnant" while others may have "fallen off" the job! Anyway since I have had evinrudes on both of my whalers I would vote for Evinrude. They have taken quite a beating from me especially the 70 on my old 15'.
hauptjm posted 12-15-2000 11:03 AM ET (US)
It's early, but the trend refines itself. An 80's Classic Montauk with OMC power. I knew the participants in this site were purist. jimh, your poll is a hit!
triblet posted 12-15-2000 11:46 AM ET (US)
More interestingly: almost no Hondas. That
surprised me.
Chuck Tribolet
mattr posted 12-15-2000 12:55 PM ET (US)
Chuck -
I am a big Honda outboard fan, but they are awfully heavy for a montauk. I am hopefull that the 4stroke technology will produce a light and super-efficient outboard soon!
mattr
lhg posted 12-15-2000 01:47 PM ET (US)
As is happening, expect OMC to win the Outboard engine poll. From it's beginning up until the Company was first sold in 1990, BW had a very strong relationship with OMC. I would guess that 90% of their Dealers were OMC Dealers. Almost all of the Commercial Products boats also went out with OMC's on them. As a Mercury buyer, it was almost impossible to find a Whaler Dealer who sold Mercs. There were a few, but not many. I always had to buy the boat, then go elsewhere for the Mercury engine. (this is how I also learned that "unbundling" the Dealer's package" saves a lot of money on the total cost of a new boat rig)
Then Yahama entered the market around 1985, with twice the Dealer profit of an OMC, and Whalers started appearing with Yamaha rather than OMC. The extra price charged for the Yamaha went to Dealer profit, and was not because of increased engine manufacturing cost. This would be typical marketing strategy when bringing a new brand to market.
Don't know if that situation still persists today with Yamaha.
I also would think that once any Whaler is initially powered with a given brand of engine, even a re-power tends to keep the same brand, because of trade-in opportunities, engine controls, etc. So since most of the Whalers represented here are "Classics", the period of the strong OMC relationship, we would still see OMC the winner here.
Gep posted 12-15-2000 03:48 PM ET (US)
Jimh,
I tried to vote in the third poll, but it said I already voted. I would go with a Evinrude also.
jimh posted 12-15-2000 08:03 PM ET (US)
I understand people are having trouble voting in the follow-on polls. This may be the fault of the mechanism that prevents duplicate voting. I made some adjustments to permit a little more leeway in voting, but, please, keep it fair and only vote once.

--jimh
lhg posted 12-16-2000 04:05 PM ET (US)
I have set the Netscape browser on my Compaq PC to reject cookies (highest security setting), and have not had a problem. Could acceptance of cookies be the problem?
whalernut posted 12-16-2000 10:43 PM ET (US)
Larry, I agree OMC should win the Voting Poll, but are you and others as shocked as I am that Mercury is right there in it only 2 down as I write this. With Whalers useing OMC for alot of years, that is why I am so suprised, maybee people are repowering with the Mercs? Any comments? Regards-Jack Graner.
lhg posted 12-17-2000 03:57 PM ET (US)
Jack: Don't forget to include Evinrude in the OMC category, and Mariner in with Mercury. From a previous poll, I noticed 22 votes for BW's 1996-2000 years. These would be mostly Mercury powered. Also, somewhere around 8 years ago, Merc overtook OMC as the largest seller of outboards. And beginning in 1996, OMC developed a lot of problems, hurting salses badly. They're still trying to recover. So all of these factors could be why Merc is showing stronger than one might expect, especially in the re-power market.
What surprises me is that Yamaha is not in 2nd place. Since 1985, I'll bet more Whalers left dealerships with Yamahas than OMCs.
whalernut posted 12-17-2000 04:21 PM ET (US)
Larry, good points. I forgot to package OMC(Evinrude-Johnson) and Mercury Marine(Mercury-Mariner). Hey Larry some Force outboards also could be under Mercury Marine? Also I know a dealership on Lake Erie that for years now sold both Johnson and Yamahas on their Whalers. I asked their opinion on which they thought was a better all around engine and they(Salesmen and Mechanics) almost too a man said Yamaha. But was this because of the Yamaha markup? Who knows. I do know I haven`t heard much bad things about Yamahas for years, just a few minor things, mostly initial cost and parts price and availability if needed.I also know that the same dealership is not very happy with the newer Whalers, especially design and the practice of haveing to go with Mercs. only. They are a very old diehard Whaler dealership. I don`t know what they will do? The name of the dealership is Portage Entry Marine. They know their stuff and aren`t Cutesie, gel-haired Sea Ray, Marine Max style salesmen. Regards-Jack Graner.
lhg posted 12-17-2000 11:57 PM ET (US)
Jack - Several of us here know the Portage Entry people very well. They're one of the finest old-line Boston Whaler Dealers. Two of the boats in the Rendezvous section came from them (Memory & Backlash), and all three of us attended the first eight of their annual Rendezvous. Actually, it's where we first met. My 25 Outrage was only a year old when I attended the first one in 1990, but every year I took a*LOT*of grief about the black outboards I was running! How times change. These OMC and Yamaha Dealers don't give up easily!

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Author	Topic: Announcing: Whaler Voting Booth
jimh	posted 12-03-2000 04:32 PM ET (US) A new feature on the website, the Whaler Voting Booth. I think everyone will find this interesting. See: http://continuouswave.com/whaler/poll/index.php --jimh
dscew	posted 12-03-2000 05:51 PM ET (US) What a great idea Jim!. I cast my vote for my 17. Thanks for a great job...Dennis
stagalv	posted 12-03-2000 09:48 PM ET (US) Jim, if my size Whaler does not win like I want it to, can I force you to have a recount?? Rex
lhg	posted 12-03-2000 10:26 PM ET (US) I've just hired Warren Christopher to make sure my boat has a fair vote count, and to totally disrupt the operation of this website.
jimh	posted 12-03-2000 10:29 PM ET (US) If you are voting from Dade County, Florida, be sure to click FIRMLY on your mouse when making your choice to insure that your vote is properly registered. I don't want to set an example for the youth of America in which all votes aren't counted! --jimh
kingfish	posted 12-03-2000 10:45 PM ET (US) Hey, it doesn't matter who wins, just as long as every vote is counted! (as long as they are for me...) kingfish
lhg	posted 12-03-2000 10:49 PM ET (US) What assurance do we have that votes from PC machines will be counted the same as votes from Mac machines? After all, ContinuousssWave is a heavily Mac domain. I think we will have to insist that a representative of each boat size is enlisted to re-count the vote, as we all know computers alone can't be trusted and are highly unreliable. What is our deadline for final vote certification by the Secretary of ContinuousWave?
hauptjm	posted 12-04-2000 09:31 AM ET (US) How many times can I vote?????
hauptjm	posted 12-04-2000 11:02 AM ET (US) Wow! Look at the latest results, and I'm shocked at the number of 16/17s. I guess I always thought the smaller craft would inherently be the larger volume of boat purchased/owned. Does anyone know what the factory stats are broken down by size as far as sales go??
Mark Gallagher	posted 12-04-2000 11:45 AM ET (US) Jim, Another innovation of this forum...I like it. May I suggest that another poll be: where do you live? I'd like to see geographically where most of these Whalers reside. Great job on the site. Mark
rwest	posted 12-04-2000 06:13 PM ET (US) This is my second Classic Whaler. Since I couldn't vote on the Web back in 72' due to the minor teck-no-kal-ity that there wern't no internet back then, I figure I need to get to vote once for each year that I had it minus the years I was stupid and didn't have one due to being really dumb and selling it. Based on that figure I don't get to vote again for 18 more years, darn....Maybe the Butterfly ballot would be better.
Whaletosh	posted 12-06-2000 08:52 AM ET (US) Actually the roots of the internet go back to 1969. It wasn't available to the general public until Al Gore "invented" it. Sean Bashaw
jimh	posted 12-07-2000 08:55 AM ET (US) Hmm... Has anyone been unable to vote in the second poll because the poll software thinks you have already voted? I think I may have some more work to do here... Let me know by replying to this thread if you could not vote in the second poll. --jimh
Ed Stone	posted 12-07-2000 09:52 PM ET (US) Hey Jimh, What would a 1996 - 2000 classic whaler be?
rhemrah	posted 12-07-2000 10:31 PM ET (US) HELLLLLLLP, CHADS ARE FALLING OUT OF MY COMPUTER. RICK
jimh	posted 12-07-2000 11:56 PM ET (US) Ed Stone asks: "Hey Jimh, What would a 1996 - 2000 classic whaler be? " Any of the following: 17 Montauk (still being made) 27 Offshore (last made 1998) 13 Classic Aniversary Edition (last 1998) 17 Standard (still available) any many others available in that time. --jimh
hauptjm	posted 12-08-2000 11:20 AM ET (US) As of 1015 CST it looks like a pattern is emerging from the exit polls. An '80s Montauk might be the most popular boat among the Whaler population in this site. Not surprising considering the 30 years they have been making this craft. Let's look for another 30 from Bayliner. It's their only chance to build some credibility among real boats.
george nagy	posted 12-15-2000 09:22 AM ET (US) Yes, I was able to vote on the second poll but it is telling me I have already voted on the third. I haven't voted on the third yet. What is going on here? And by the way I live in Palm Beach County Florida and hope that this isn't another "rigged voting system". You may want to look at each "chad". Some might have gotten "pregnant" while others may have "fallen off" the job! Anyway since I have had evinrudes on both of my whalers I would vote for Evinrude. They have taken quite a beating from me especially the 70 on my old 15'.
hauptjm	posted 12-15-2000 11:03 AM ET (US) It's early, but the trend refines itself. An 80's Classic Montauk with OMC power. I knew the participants in this site were purist. jimh, your poll is a hit!
triblet	posted 12-15-2000 11:46 AM ET (US) More interestingly: almost no Hondas. That surprised me. Chuck Tribolet
mattr	posted 12-15-2000 12:55 PM ET (US) Chuck - I am a big Honda outboard fan, but they are awfully heavy for a montauk. I am hopefull that the 4stroke technology will produce a light and super-efficient outboard soon! mattr
lhg	posted 12-15-2000 01:47 PM ET (US) As is happening, expect OMC to win the Outboard engine poll. From it's beginning up until the Company was first sold in 1990, BW had a very strong relationship with OMC. I would guess that 90% of their Dealers were OMC Dealers. Almost all of the Commercial Products boats also went out with OMC's on them. As a Mercury buyer, it was almost impossible to find a Whaler Dealer who sold Mercs. There were a few, but not many. I always had to buy the boat, then go elsewhere for the Mercury engine. (this is how I also learned that "unbundling" the Dealer's package" saves a lot of money on the total cost of a new boat rig) Then Yahama entered the market around 1985, with twice the Dealer profit of an OMC, and Whalers started appearing with Yamaha rather than OMC. The extra price charged for the Yamaha went to Dealer profit, and was not because of increased engine manufacturing cost. This would be typical marketing strategy when bringing a new brand to market. Don't know if that situation still persists today with Yamaha. I also would think that once any Whaler is initially powered with a given brand of engine, even a re-power tends to keep the same brand, because of trade-in opportunities, engine controls, etc. So since most of the Whalers represented here are "Classics", the period of the strong OMC relationship, we would still see OMC the winner here.
Gep	posted 12-15-2000 03:48 PM ET (US) Jimh, I tried to vote in the third poll, but it said I already voted. I would go with a Evinrude also.
jimh	posted 12-15-2000 08:03 PM ET (US) I understand people are having trouble voting in the follow-on polls. This may be the fault of the mechanism that prevents duplicate voting. I made some adjustments to permit a little more leeway in voting, but, please, keep it fair and only vote once. --jimh
lhg	posted 12-16-2000 04:05 PM ET (US) I have set the Netscape browser on my Compaq PC to reject cookies (highest security setting), and have not had a problem. Could acceptance of cookies be the problem?
whalernut	posted 12-16-2000 10:43 PM ET (US) Larry, I agree OMC should win the Voting Poll, but are you and others as shocked as I am that Mercury is right there in it only 2 down as I write this. With Whalers useing OMC for alot of years, that is why I am so suprised, maybee people are repowering with the Mercs? Any comments? Regards-Jack Graner.
lhg	posted 12-17-2000 03:57 PM ET (US) Jack: Don't forget to include Evinrude in the OMC category, and Mariner in with Mercury. From a previous poll, I noticed 22 votes for BW's 1996-2000 years. These would be mostly Mercury powered. Also, somewhere around 8 years ago, Merc overtook OMC as the largest seller of outboards. And beginning in 1996, OMC developed a lot of problems, hurting salses badly. They're still trying to recover. So all of these factors could be why Merc is showing stronger than one might expect, especially in the re-power market. What surprises me is that Yamaha is not in 2nd place. Since 1985, I'll bet more Whalers left dealerships with Yamahas than OMCs.
whalernut	posted 12-17-2000 04:21 PM ET (US) Larry, good points. I forgot to package OMC(Evinrude-Johnson) and Mercury Marine(Mercury-Mariner). Hey Larry some Force outboards also could be under Mercury Marine? Also I know a dealership on Lake Erie that for years now sold both Johnson and Yamahas on their Whalers. I asked their opinion on which they thought was a better all around engine and they(Salesmen and Mechanics) almost too a man said Yamaha. But was this because of the Yamaha markup? Who knows. I do know I haven`t heard much bad things about Yamahas for years, just a few minor things, mostly initial cost and parts price and availability if needed.I also know that the same dealership is not very happy with the newer Whalers, especially design and the practice of haveing to go with Mercs. only. They are a very old diehard Whaler dealership. I don`t know what they will do? The name of the dealership is Portage Entry Marine. They know their stuff and aren`t Cutesie, gel-haired Sea Ray, Marine Max style salesmen. Regards-Jack Graner.
lhg	posted 12-17-2000 11:57 PM ET (US) Jack - Several of us here know the Portage Entry people very well. They're one of the finest old-line Boston Whaler Dealers. Two of the boats in the Rendezvous section came from them (Memory & Backlash), and all three of us attended the first eight of their annual Rendezvous. Actually, it's where we first met. My 25 Outrage was only a year old when I attended the first one in 1990, but every year I took aLOTof grief about the black outboards I was running! How times change. These OMC and Yamaha Dealers don't give up easily!