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Author Topic:   Classic Whaler/Hatteras Forum?

hardensheetmetal posted 11-17-2001 01:57 PM ET (US)
http://www.boating-industry.com/news.asp?mode=4&N_ID=26649
Now their going to turn Hatteras' into big SeaRays! All those old 53 Hats. just went up in value!
dfmcintyre posted 11-17-2001 03:47 PM ET (US)
I found the following quote interesting:
"Hatteras is an "excellent addition" to the Brunswick Boat Group, said Buckley, as there is almost no overlap in the product line between Hatteras and Brunswick's Sea Ray, Bayliner and Maxum pleasure boat brands."
I guess, as CEO, he isn't aware (or didn't count) of Boston Whaler in his holdings.
Tsuriki BW posted 11-17-2001 05:27 PM ET (US)
"Commenting on the announcement Brunswick Chairman and Chief Executive Officer George W. Buckley said, "Hatteras is the premier US manufacturer of luxury sportfishing convertibles and motor yachts in the 50-foot (15.2-metre) to 100-foot (30.5-metre) range."
BW's bigest is what, 34'?
Tsuriki
bigz posted 11-18-2001 06:25 AM ET (US)
Brother guys -- Buckley also said Hatteras will continued to be run by current management --- at least he's smart enough to realize don't screw up a good thing when you bought it for a song. (could be even a better deal than realized because he mumbled something about additional tax right off with this purchase).
Jacob's Genmar I can understand wanting to rid themselves of Hatteras as they did Chris Craft --- neither really fit their product/marketing/manufacturing profile.
Comparison to Sea Ray, Bayliner and Maxum is not a statement which forgot about BW!
It's a simple statement saying these are the only boats we make that might be construed as internal competitors since they are the only ones we own that make boats in the Hatteras size range. These boats are built in general with a totally different purpose and clientele than the Hatteras.
The 34 BW doesn't hold a "candle" to a Hatteras or any of the other true Sportfishing boats even though BW marketing would like you to think it does. Though the price reflects to a degree this illusion.
Z
lhg posted 11-28-2001 10:47 PM ET (US)
Regarding the Brunswick purchase of Hatteras, the President of the Brunswick Boat Group, Dustin McCoy, recently said: "We are not going to make these boats Sea Rays, Bayliners or Maxums. We know very well we don't want to tinker with this one." Looks like they're finally getting smart. Guess Hatteras lucked out - they won't get the Sea Ray Euro Transom that befell Whalers!
Compared to what they have done to Boston Whaler, that is a good management decision. It's only a shame that Brunswick, under the previous management of Peter Larson, didn't have the foresight for the same idea when they took over Boston Whaler. The Company has now been so badly "mingled" with Sea Ray's "Booze and Cruise" image (or tinkered with) that much of it's original distinctive character, design and corporate culture has been lost. Reebock and Meridian, of course, also share some of the responsibility.
But there is evidence of a "light at the end of the tunnel", as I believe Brunswick's newer management, under Buckley, is now partially attempting to recover some of Whaler's original identity, more in keeping with the Hatteras plans. However, the idea of naming the boats with Sea Ray's 3 digit convention was a temporary step in the wrong direction. They should fire the birdbrain that dreamed that one up! A 170 Montauk? A 130 Sport?
GAwhale posted 11-29-2001 12:28 AM ET (US)
I used to own a 1978 SAAB 99GLE (not a good car). I asked the service manager at the dealership what the 99 meant. He said, "Nothing, SAAB just likes the number 9".
With Boeing Aircraft the model means nothing. It is simply the next one developed.
B-757, B-767, B-777
I think the Marketing Guys at Boston Whaler should do away with any numbering system that may give you an indication of the length of the boat. Maybe give the boat some cool number with lots of pizaz and add some sparkles. These would sell like hotcakes. Next, the Marketing Guys should get big fat payraises and stock options for their valiant efforts.
After all quality and reputation will never sell a boat.
daverdla posted 11-29-2001 07:00 AM ET (US)
According to SAAB, their first car was a 92 because the previous vehicles, both airplanes, were 90 and 91. After that they just stayed with 9. They don't mention why the first digit is a 9. Maybe 89 airplanes? My mother had a saab 99, it was great, when it ran. I have a 2001 9-5, big difference, starts every time.
Boston Whaler's three digit numbering scheme seems too gimicky for them.
jimh posted 11-29-2001 08:23 AM ET (US)
I used to work in the Marketing department of an electronic instrument company. They started their model numbering with "100" and when I got there the main product was a "303".
I was working on some new sales literature for them and realized that the only thing that had a model number was the main instrument itself, all the accessories were without any designation. So I sat down and made up all the model numbers for the rest of the product line, showed them to my boss, who made a couple of changes, and WHAM, we had a whole new product line!
We had a German sister-company, and all their products were numbered in this exacting heirarchical scheme. Instruments of a certain type were all "3's" for example, and decimal points were added to make subdivisions. So we'd have an instrument that was a model "3.1.001.004" or such. Not very zippy for sales promotion use.
Ol' Dick Fisher was pretty innovative in using names like Montauk, Currituck, Newport, etc. Nowadays some consultant would probably tell you that they are "too regional".
He'd probably have a point, too. Most young people seem absolutly clueless about geography and couldn't find Montauk on a map on a bet.
hauptjm posted 11-29-2001 10:25 AM ET (US)
jimh, you're right as usual. In fact, when Dick Fisher set-up "Boston Whaler", the brand name couldn't have been more regional in nature. Then by extension of the brand, he captured model names of nearby islands, ports, towns, etc. The point is that he took this concept of tough, weather beaten places and people and instilled the idea that his product could be just as tough and take a beating and still survive and float. He was right, and the public bought into it because he proved it. That was the day when integrity and quality in small sea craft was something that REAL sailors wanted. Glitz and sparkle existed and sold well before Whaler and of course, still does. The point is I don't think the days of wanting great sea-going boats are over. We're probably in an era of change that at some point will either create another 'Dick Fisher' or the revival of a great brand we know as Boston Whaler.
GAwhale posted 11-29-2001 10:35 AM ET (US)
I was being sarcastic in my earlier post.
In reality I don't have much respect for Marketing.
Delta Air Lines had the same paint scheme on the airplanes for approx 27 years. The trademark widget was swept back to portray forward motion. Delta had the best looking fleet in the industry.
I think the marketing guys all got their MBA from the same school and read the same textbook (flavor of the month). In approx 1997 they stated you must never alter your trademark (the swept back widget). They came up with a new paint scheme and started the change. It takes years to change a fleet of almost 600.
Two years into the project, they came out with a third paint scheme. This scheme looks remarkably similar to Continental Air Lines. It only says Delta once on each side of the plane. Makes you wonder about a merger?
Today there are three paint schemes flying. It is not uncommon to see the new white scheme flying with a black nose cowling or to see a mismatched engine cowling.
Mechanically the aircraft is sound, however it looks ridiculous.
dgp posted 11-29-2001 11:10 AM ET (US)
I�m surprised that one of the �politically correct� marketing gurus haven�t pointed out the dark side of the former whaling industry and make efforts to change the name to something more warm and fuzzy. How about Florida Manatee? As chubby looking and weight gains of the new boats, that would work. ;-)
hardensheetmetal posted 11-29-2001 12:54 PM ET (US)
Hauptjm-
Not to get off the topic too far, but (and I know I will be further chastized for this) I believe that the Maritime Skiffs I posted about some time ago have just that spirit you speak of. They are made in New England and this is mentioned throughout their advertising - definately a back to basics, utilitarian style boat, not unlike the original Whalers. These boats are not Whalers nor are they Carolina Skiffs, they are tough, seaworthy boats, kind of a Whaler without the shine. My feeling is that the type of people that origianally bought BWs are the same people that will look at Maritimes, they are over built, functional, and yes a little pricey, again just like the original Whalers. These boats are known as a New England style boat, that works well anywhere the water conditions may not be perfect (OK - let the chastizing begin!)
Thanks for listening,
Dan
zpeed7 posted 12-02-2001 03:32 PM ET (US)
Can't wait for that new 54 Hatt/Ray Fisher Cruiser with the sloped back transom, the integrated swim platform, and the pressed wood/vinyl L seat/fightingchair.
Maine whaler posted 12-02-2001 03:43 PM ET (US)
I wrote to Maritime asking about the possibility of a 22 footer and was told that they have plans of a 23 footer in 2002. Can't wait to see what that looks like.
David Ratusnik posted 12-02-2001 04:59 PM ET (US)
You guys laugh that Sea Ray Brunswick would turn the Hatteras line of biiiiiig boats into Sea Rays with a cute rear end and fast looking bow. On Merritt Island (FLA) Sea Ray has brand new plant (just down the road the the main plant), yes just built, that has not turned out its first boat. The economany was tanking so they completed the plant and shut it down. That plant was suppose to build the really big 70 foot Sea Rays- Now they have a line biiiiiig enough to fit the plant. Oh, I'm just kidding. David

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Author	Topic: Classic Whaler/Hatteras Forum?
hardensheetmetal	posted 11-17-2001 01:57 PM ET (US) http://www.boating-industry.com/news.asp?mode=4&N_ID=26649 Now their going to turn Hatteras' into big SeaRays! All those old 53 Hats. just went up in value!
dfmcintyre	posted 11-17-2001 03:47 PM ET (US) I found the following quote interesting: "Hatteras is an "excellent addition" to the Brunswick Boat Group, said Buckley, as there is almost no overlap in the product line between Hatteras and Brunswick's Sea Ray, Bayliner and Maxum pleasure boat brands." I guess, as CEO, he isn't aware (or didn't count) of Boston Whaler in his holdings.
Tsuriki BW	posted 11-17-2001 05:27 PM ET (US) "Commenting on the announcement Brunswick Chairman and Chief Executive Officer George W. Buckley said, "Hatteras is the premier US manufacturer of luxury sportfishing convertibles and motor yachts in the 50-foot (15.2-metre) to 100-foot (30.5-metre) range." BW's bigest is what, 34'? Tsuriki
bigz	posted 11-18-2001 06:25 AM ET (US) Brother guys -- Buckley also said Hatteras will continued to be run by current management --- at least he's smart enough to realize don't screw up a good thing when you bought it for a song. (could be even a better deal than realized because he mumbled something about additional tax right off with this purchase). Jacob's Genmar I can understand wanting to rid themselves of Hatteras as they did Chris Craft --- neither really fit their product/marketing/manufacturing profile. Comparison to Sea Ray, Bayliner and Maxum is not a statement which forgot about BW! It's a simple statement saying these are the only boats we make that might be construed as internal competitors since they are the only ones we own that make boats in the Hatteras size range. These boats are built in general with a totally different purpose and clientele than the Hatteras. The 34 BW doesn't hold a "candle" to a Hatteras or any of the other true Sportfishing boats even though BW marketing would like you to think it does. Though the price reflects to a degree this illusion. Z
lhg	posted 11-28-2001 10:47 PM ET (US) Regarding the Brunswick purchase of Hatteras, the President of the Brunswick Boat Group, Dustin McCoy, recently said: "We are not going to make these boats Sea Rays, Bayliners or Maxums. We know very well we don't want to tinker with this one." Looks like they're finally getting smart. Guess Hatteras lucked out - they won't get the Sea Ray Euro Transom that befell Whalers! Compared to what they have done to Boston Whaler, that is a good management decision. It's only a shame that Brunswick, under the previous management of Peter Larson, didn't have the foresight for the same idea when they took over Boston Whaler. The Company has now been so badly "mingled" with Sea Ray's "Booze and Cruise" image (or tinkered with) that much of it's original distinctive character, design and corporate culture has been lost. Reebock and Meridian, of course, also share some of the responsibility. But there is evidence of a "light at the end of the tunnel", as I believe Brunswick's newer management, under Buckley, is now partially attempting to recover some of Whaler's original identity, more in keeping with the Hatteras plans. However, the idea of naming the boats with Sea Ray's 3 digit convention was a temporary step in the wrong direction. They should fire the birdbrain that dreamed that one up! A 170 Montauk? A 130 Sport?
GAwhale	posted 11-29-2001 12:28 AM ET (US) I used to own a 1978 SAAB 99GLE (not a good car). I asked the service manager at the dealership what the 99 meant. He said, "Nothing, SAAB just likes the number 9". With Boeing Aircraft the model means nothing. It is simply the next one developed. B-757, B-767, B-777 I think the Marketing Guys at Boston Whaler should do away with any numbering system that may give you an indication of the length of the boat. Maybe give the boat some cool number with lots of pizaz and add some sparkles. These would sell like hotcakes. Next, the Marketing Guys should get big fat payraises and stock options for their valiant efforts. After all quality and reputation will never sell a boat.
daverdla	posted 11-29-2001 07:00 AM ET (US) According to SAAB, their first car was a 92 because the previous vehicles, both airplanes, were 90 and 91. After that they just stayed with 9. They don't mention why the first digit is a 9. Maybe 89 airplanes? My mother had a saab 99, it was great, when it ran. I have a 2001 9-5, big difference, starts every time. Boston Whaler's three digit numbering scheme seems too gimicky for them.
jimh	posted 11-29-2001 08:23 AM ET (US) I used to work in the Marketing department of an electronic instrument company. They started their model numbering with "100" and when I got there the main product was a "303". I was working on some new sales literature for them and realized that the only thing that had a model number was the main instrument itself, all the accessories were without any designation. So I sat down and made up all the model numbers for the rest of the product line, showed them to my boss, who made a couple of changes, and WHAM, we had a whole new product line! We had a German sister-company, and all their products were numbered in this exacting heirarchical scheme. Instruments of a certain type were all "3's" for example, and decimal points were added to make subdivisions. So we'd have an instrument that was a model "3.1.001.004" or such. Not very zippy for sales promotion use. Ol' Dick Fisher was pretty innovative in using names like Montauk, Currituck, Newport, etc. Nowadays some consultant would probably tell you that they are "too regional". He'd probably have a point, too. Most young people seem absolutly clueless about geography and couldn't find Montauk on a map on a bet.
hauptjm	posted 11-29-2001 10:25 AM ET (US) jimh, you're right as usual. In fact, when Dick Fisher set-up "Boston Whaler", the brand name couldn't have been more regional in nature. Then by extension of the brand, he captured model names of nearby islands, ports, towns, etc. The point is that he took this concept of tough, weather beaten places and people and instilled the idea that his product could be just as tough and take a beating and still survive and float. He was right, and the public bought into it because he proved it. That was the day when integrity and quality in small sea craft was something that REAL sailors wanted. Glitz and sparkle existed and sold well before Whaler and of course, still does. The point is I don't think the days of wanting great sea-going boats are over. We're probably in an era of change that at some point will either create another 'Dick Fisher' or the revival of a great brand we know as Boston Whaler.
GAwhale	posted 11-29-2001 10:35 AM ET (US) I was being sarcastic in my earlier post. In reality I don't have much respect for Marketing. Delta Air Lines had the same paint scheme on the airplanes for approx 27 years. The trademark widget was swept back to portray forward motion. Delta had the best looking fleet in the industry. I think the marketing guys all got their MBA from the same school and read the same textbook (flavor of the month). In approx 1997 they stated you must never alter your trademark (the swept back widget). They came up with a new paint scheme and started the change. It takes years to change a fleet of almost 600. Two years into the project, they came out with a third paint scheme. This scheme looks remarkably similar to Continental Air Lines. It only says Delta once on each side of the plane. Makes you wonder about a merger? Today there are three paint schemes flying. It is not uncommon to see the new white scheme flying with a black nose cowling or to see a mismatched engine cowling. Mechanically the aircraft is sound, however it looks ridiculous.
dgp	posted 11-29-2001 11:10 AM ET (US) I�m surprised that one of the �politically correct� marketing gurus haven�t pointed out the dark side of the former whaling industry and make efforts to change the name to something more warm and fuzzy. How about Florida Manatee? As chubby looking and weight gains of the new boats, that would work. ;-)
hardensheetmetal	posted 11-29-2001 12:54 PM ET (US) Hauptjm- Not to get off the topic too far, but (and I know I will be further chastized for this) I believe that the Maritime Skiffs I posted about some time ago have just that spirit you speak of. They are made in New England and this is mentioned throughout their advertising - definately a back to basics, utilitarian style boat, not unlike the original Whalers. These boats are not Whalers nor are they Carolina Skiffs, they are tough, seaworthy boats, kind of a Whaler without the shine. My feeling is that the type of people that origianally bought BWs are the same people that will look at Maritimes, they are over built, functional, and yes a little pricey, again just like the original Whalers. These boats are known as a New England style boat, that works well anywhere the water conditions may not be perfect (OK - let the chastizing begin!) Thanks for listening, Dan
zpeed7	posted 12-02-2001 03:32 PM ET (US) Can't wait for that new 54 Hatt/Ray Fisher Cruiser with the sloped back transom, the integrated swim platform, and the pressed wood/vinyl L seat/fightingchair.
Maine whaler	posted 12-02-2001 03:43 PM ET (US) I wrote to Maritime asking about the possibility of a 22 footer and was told that they have plans of a 23 footer in 2002. Can't wait to see what that looks like.
David Ratusnik	posted 12-02-2001 04:59 PM ET (US) You guys laugh that Sea Ray Brunswick would turn the Hatteras line of biiiiiig boats into Sea Rays with a cute rear end and fast looking bow. On Merritt Island (FLA) Sea Ray has brand new plant (just down the road the the main plant), yes just built, that has not turned out its first boat. The economany was tanking so they completed the plant and shut it down. That plant was suppose to build the really big 70 foot Sea Rays- Now they have a line biiiiiig enough to fit the plant. Oh, I'm just kidding. David