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Author Topic:   While Shopping For My Newest Whaler.

Ritzyrags posted 11-03-2009 10:42 PM ET (US)
I am back from a grueling twenty four hour trip to acquire my newest Whaler.
The trip started at eight am and finished the next day at 1 am.
I did have my certified bank draft in hand and was shopping "on faith"
The ad was very specifically saying;
"You won't find a nicer Whaler and the care it has had. READY TO GO!"
The expectation was..high;
But hold on here..Where was this feeling of uneasiness did come from then?
Upon setting eyes on the hull;
I did feel that this Whaler was noticeably smaller then mine..Fact or illusion?
My Girl here looks somehow much more substantial and deeper.
For such a well and garage kept unit;
I was slowly getting miffed at the work to be done on the gel surfaces and through hull fittings replacements
Have I turned into some hard to please Whaler perfectionist?
The seller knew of my intent and was somehow confident that he could still pull the sale at the preferred agreed price.
The quick survey proved to be sending me in an increasing amount of displeasure.
I have left him with an offer with the duration of one week.
I will be then moving on to my next Whaler Dream.
Has this kind of experience happened to you in the past or I am I one of the unlucky few to have been put through this emotional elevator of highs and lows???

Tohsgib posted 11-04-2009 11:29 AM ET (US)
Happens to everyone that looks at used Whalers. I had one that the guy said was in excellent condition. When I saw it I asked him if he dragged it here without the trailer it was so rough...no lower unit to boot!
elaelap posted 11-04-2009 11:56 AM ET (US)
From a June 20, 2007 thread in GAM:
_____________________________
Here's a couple of pix of a real beauty, described recently by its owner in a newspaper ad as being in "excellent" condition, I kid you not!
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b309/elaelap/beatersmirkless16003.jpg
http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b309/elaelap/beatersmirkless16001.jpg
Tuco
_____________________________
contender posted 11-04-2009 12:31 PM ET (US)
Ritz, Everyone has a different opinion on what is "Mint" I never go on someone's opinion unless I know the person or have seen it for myself. Sorry you wasted your time but you never know. Ask the seller to send you some pictures (tell him what you and were you want them taken) next time and tell him to please have them in focus. The last whaler I purchased was about 275 miles from my home, had the guy send me some pictures and still there were some issues(not bad) but purchase it anyway. Another thing to do is have the person meet you 1/2 way, tell him to bring the clear title and you bring the cash. However, Do not let this incident turn you away from other deals like I said you never know...Keep looking until you find what you want its a buyers market...
elaelap posted 11-04-2009 01:43 PM ET (US)
I agree with contender's comments above, but digital photos are often totally misleading when it comes to boat condition. I spent almost three years searching for my current sailboat, and during that time personally inspected at least forty or fifty boats (probably more), just about all of which I had initially viewed via email photos and/or internet photo ads. Many times I was totally fooled by the pix, sometimes to the extent that I was able to see terminal defects from fifty feet away as I walked toward the boats which had not been apparent in their photos.
What I have appreciated greatly at this website is the generosity of CW members in distant locations to take the time to "survey" a boat for another member, and to take the kind of close-up, detailed pix of problem areas that sellers are unwilling--consciously or unconsciously--to provide. Still, there's nothing like a personal visit to either break one's heart and ruin one's fantasies, or more happily to cause one to start waving hundred dollar bills around.
Good luck with your search, Ritz. In many ways the journey is more fun than the destination ;-)
Tony
Whaler_bob posted 11-04-2009 03:12 PM ET (US)

quote:
...digital photos are often totally misleading when it comes to boat condition.

+1
Due to the fact that you're imaging a 3-D object onto a 2-D surface (photographic paper, LCD screen, etc..) you tend to lose depth perception and a whole lot of details that stereoscopic vision offers.
Photos only show us what the photographer intended to show us too. If there's a bad area he can simply skip over it, shoot it, but from a distance to obscure defects or shoot at an angle that minimizes the problem area.
I'm constantly amazed at the undersized and poor quality photos linked to expensive items on ebay, Craigslist, etc. In most cases, I now assume the photographer knowingly took the shots in the rain, or in low light conditions or shooting into the sun or used his cellphone to take photos intentionally hoping to hide something.
Knowing that this is the case, how do you protect yourself on bid type auctions like ebay where you pay a deposit up front upon winning the auction, and agree to buy the item at the winning bid price assuming "what you see is what you get".... But, upon personal inspection find undisclosed defects?
Tohsgib posted 11-04-2009 03:23 PM ET (US)
Escrow
Ritzyrags posted 11-04-2009 10:31 PM ET (US)
I still do have some respect for the seller;
As he has what he has as background and expertise on the boating front..
I have made my last ditch attempt toward the adoption of this unit.
I did somehow involuntarily flinch when I did see that the through hull drain from the hullside decking locker was all together ..missing
The foam was dry to the touch but still left me quite concerned.
The fact that the live bait drain was also missing did not help much either.
My beef will reside in the fact that the unit was presented as "done" and ready to go.
Under my care I will have estimated that there is a minimum of twenty hours of precise work to make it just "right"
It was the intent from this all together decent guy to sell the unit for the agreed price and this over the phone;
"On Faith"
I think that the few refits from the past and of my currently ongoing one;
With seven to eight hundred hours spent, has been a stiff and intransigent master when it has come to surveying such models.
I still have a firm bid in place for another five days..But I am not holding my breath on it.
Que sera, sera.
PS-On a happier note,
I did burst out laughing when I did see the photos of the "Excellent condition" Whaler.
Mine did not look quite that bad.
elaelap posted 11-04-2009 11:02 PM ET (US)
I wasn't laughing quite as hard as you when I saw that dog, Ritz. I first read an ad in our local rag which described the boat as being in 'excellent' condition; and then this description was reinforced when I discussed the boat for 10 or 15 minutes with the seller via telephone before driving 45 minutes from my home to its location, my little heart just a-pitti-patting, almost sure that I'd be towing her back with me. I've seen some (make that many) boats for sale where the seller has described their conditions in glowing terms, only to be disappointed upon seeing the boat in person; but that one took the cake for me. My digital photos really do the boat too much false justice; if you can believe it, the poor thing was much worse in person than she appears in the pix.
Anyway, I kept my cool with the seller only because I was dying to take photos and post the story at this website. "Yeah," I told him. "She's sure nice but just not exactly what I was looking for. Say, would you mind if I took a couple of photos? You see, I'm a member of this Boston Whaler website and I'm sure other members would be interested in seeing pictures of your boat." A truthful statement...as far as it went ;-)
Tony
Basshole posted 11-05-2009 10:20 AM ET (US)
I've flown across country to be disappointed in the condition of a misrepresented boat. On top of that they didn't even have the trailer it was supposed to come with. Even if I wanted it I wouldn't have been able to take it with me. I was so pissed I almost tore the guy's head off with my bare hands! Instead though I left that dealership and went to another dealer and bought one new for twice the money. It took a lot of self control for someone who has the Brazilian Jiu Jitsu training that I have to not give that guy the ass whoop he deserved. That salesman was very lucky, very lucky.
Ritzyrags posted 11-05-2009 11:37 PM ET (US)
I just didn't know what to respond when I was asked point blank..
Are you some kind of Whaler perfectionist club kind of guy???
This is when I did realize that for some people there is only two rules..
Rule number one: They are ALWAYS right.
Rule number two: When the evidence overwhelmingly suggest that they are out in left field;
Revert to rule Number one.
Next time I will be waiving the dollar bills around instead of worrying about getting my bank draft wet from the down pouring rain.
Still thinking about the boat everyday.
And have the nasty suspicion that it possibly could have been a Chineese Whaler imitation.
I was assured that it is just an illusion;
But I can't get over the feeling that the Whaler prospect was somehow smaller then my own and very same model.

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Author	Topic: While Shopping For My Newest Whaler.
Ritzyrags	posted 11-03-2009 10:42 PM ET (US) I am back from a grueling twenty four hour trip to acquire my newest Whaler. The trip started at eight am and finished the next day at 1 am. I did have my certified bank draft in hand and was shopping "on faith" The ad was very specifically saying; "You won't find a nicer Whaler and the care it has had. READY TO GO!" The expectation was..high; But hold on here..Where was this feeling of uneasiness did come from then? Upon setting eyes on the hull; I did feel that this Whaler was noticeably smaller then mine..Fact or illusion? My Girl here looks somehow much more substantial and deeper. For such a well and garage kept unit; I was slowly getting miffed at the work to be done on the gel surfaces and through hull fittings replacements Have I turned into some hard to please Whaler perfectionist? The seller knew of my intent and was somehow confident that he could still pull the sale at the preferred agreed price. The quick survey proved to be sending me in an increasing amount of displeasure. I have left him with an offer with the duration of one week. I will be then moving on to my next Whaler Dream. Has this kind of experience happened to you in the past or I am I one of the unlucky few to have been put through this emotional elevator of highs and lows???
Tohsgib	posted 11-04-2009 11:29 AM ET (US) Happens to everyone that looks at used Whalers. I had one that the guy said was in excellent condition. When I saw it I asked him if he dragged it here without the trailer it was so rough...no lower unit to boot!
elaelap	posted 11-04-2009 11:56 AM ET (US) From a June 20, 2007 thread in GAM: _____________________________ Here's a couple of pix of a real beauty, described recently by its owner in a newspaper ad as being in "excellent" condition, I kid you not! http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b309/elaelap/beatersmirkless16003.jpg http://i22.photobucket.com/albums/b309/elaelap/beatersmirkless16001.jpg Tuco _____________________________
contender	posted 11-04-2009 12:31 PM ET (US) Ritz, Everyone has a different opinion on what is "Mint" I never go on someone's opinion unless I know the person or have seen it for myself. Sorry you wasted your time but you never know. Ask the seller to send you some pictures (tell him what you and were you want them taken) next time and tell him to please have them in focus. The last whaler I purchased was about 275 miles from my home, had the guy send me some pictures and still there were some issues(not bad) but purchase it anyway. Another thing to do is have the person meet you 1/2 way, tell him to bring the clear title and you bring the cash. However, Do not let this incident turn you away from other deals like I said you never know...Keep looking until you find what you want its a buyers market...
elaelap	posted 11-04-2009 01:43 PM ET (US) I agree with contender's comments above, but digital photos are often totally misleading when it comes to boat condition. I spent almost three years searching for my current sailboat, and during that time personally inspected at least forty or fifty boats (probably more), just about all of which I had initially viewed via email photos and/or internet photo ads. Many times I was totally fooled by the pix, sometimes to the extent that I was able to see terminal defects from fifty feet away as I walked toward the boats which had not been apparent in their photos. What I have appreciated greatly at this website is the generosity of CW members in distant locations to take the time to "survey" a boat for another member, and to take the kind of close-up, detailed pix of problem areas that sellers are unwilling--consciously or unconsciously--to provide. Still, there's nothing like a personal visit to either break one's heart and ruin one's fantasies, or more happily to cause one to start waving hundred dollar bills around. Good luck with your search, Ritz. In many ways the journey is more fun than the destination ;-) Tony
Whaler_bob	posted 11-04-2009 03:12 PM ET (US) quote: ...digital photos are often totally misleading when it comes to boat condition. +1 Due to the fact that you're imaging a 3-D object onto a 2-D surface (photographic paper, LCD screen, etc..) you tend to lose depth perception and a whole lot of details that stereoscopic vision offers. Photos only show us what the photographer intended to show us too. If there's a bad area he can simply skip over it, shoot it, but from a distance to obscure defects or shoot at an angle that minimizes the problem area. I'm constantly amazed at the undersized and poor quality photos linked to expensive items on ebay, Craigslist, etc. In most cases, I now assume the photographer knowingly took the shots in the rain, or in low light conditions or shooting into the sun or used his cellphone to take photos intentionally hoping to hide something. Knowing that this is the case, how do you protect yourself on bid type auctions like ebay where you pay a deposit up front upon winning the auction, and agree to buy the item at the winning bid price assuming "what you see is what you get".... But, upon personal inspection find undisclosed defects?
Tohsgib	posted 11-04-2009 03:23 PM ET (US) Escrow
Ritzyrags	posted 11-04-2009 10:31 PM ET (US) I still do have some respect for the seller; As he has what he has as background and expertise on the boating front.. I have made my last ditch attempt toward the adoption of this unit. I did somehow involuntarily flinch when I did see that the through hull drain from the hullside decking locker was all together ..missing The foam was dry to the touch but still left me quite concerned. The fact that the live bait drain was also missing did not help much either. My beef will reside in the fact that the unit was presented as "done" and ready to go. Under my care I will have estimated that there is a minimum of twenty hours of precise work to make it just "right" It was the intent from this all together decent guy to sell the unit for the agreed price and this over the phone; "On Faith" I think that the few refits from the past and of my currently ongoing one; With seven to eight hundred hours spent, has been a stiff and intransigent master when it has come to surveying such models. I still have a firm bid in place for another five days..But I am not holding my breath on it. Que sera, sera. PS-On a happier note, I did burst out laughing when I did see the photos of the "Excellent condition" Whaler. Mine did not look quite that bad.
elaelap	posted 11-04-2009 11:02 PM ET (US) I wasn't laughing quite as hard as you when I saw that dog, Ritz. I first read an ad in our local rag which described the boat as being in 'excellent' condition; and then this description was reinforced when I discussed the boat for 10 or 15 minutes with the seller via telephone before driving 45 minutes from my home to its location, my little heart just a-pitti-patting, almost sure that I'd be towing her back with me. I've seen some (make that many) boats for sale where the seller has described their conditions in glowing terms, only to be disappointed upon seeing the boat in person; but that one took the cake for me. My digital photos really do the boat too much false justice; if you can believe it, the poor thing was much worse in person than she appears in the pix. Anyway, I kept my cool with the seller only because I was dying to take photos and post the story at this website. "Yeah," I told him. "She's sure nice but just not exactly what I was looking for. Say, would you mind if I took a couple of photos? You see, I'm a member of this Boston Whaler website and I'm sure other members would be interested in seeing pictures of your boat." A truthful statement...as far as it went ;-) Tony
Basshole	posted 11-05-2009 10:20 AM ET (US) I've flown across country to be disappointed in the condition of a misrepresented boat. On top of that they didn't even have the trailer it was supposed to come with. Even if I wanted it I wouldn't have been able to take it with me. I was so pissed I almost tore the guy's head off with my bare hands! Instead though I left that dealership and went to another dealer and bought one new for twice the money. It took a lot of self control for someone who has the Brazilian Jiu Jitsu training that I have to not give that guy the ass whoop he deserved. That salesman was very lucky, very lucky.
Ritzyrags	posted 11-05-2009 11:37 PM ET (US) I just didn't know what to respond when I was asked point blank.. Are you some kind of Whaler perfectionist club kind of guy??? This is when I did realize that for some people there is only two rules.. Rule number one: They are ALWAYS right. Rule number two: When the evidence overwhelmingly suggest that they are out in left field; Revert to rule Number one. Next time I will be waiving the dollar bills around instead of worrying about getting my bank draft wet from the down pouring rain. Still thinking about the boat everyday. And have the nasty suspicion that it possibly could have been a Chineese Whaler imitation. I was assured that it is just an illusion; But I can't get over the feeling that the Whaler prospect was somehow smaller then my own and very same model.