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Author Topic:   Brunswick's New Boats: Boston Whaler Brand

jimh posted 11-18-2013 03:41 PM ET (US)
In a recent presentation to Wall Street, Brunswick told prospective investors about their plans for future outboard-powered boats in their Boston Whaler brand. They made the following statements:

quote:
Product Priorities – Boston Whaler
--Lead U.S. premium fiberglass outboard saltwater marker; benefit from the introduction of five all new models in model year 2013 and four in model year 2014
--Continue to extend product line above 30 feet; beyond 345 Conquest and 370 Outrage, including center console and cabin models
--Extend product line-up in dual console segment following highly successful Vantage series launch
As I read this, we can expect to see more larger hulls from Boston Whaler, including some cabin boats, and more dual-console hulls in the VANTAGE series.
OMCrobert posted 11-18-2013 03:47 PM ET (US)
I know most traditionalist balk at the idea of the dual console but looking at the line up of Grady White and other premium boat lines, it certain is in demand.
I would love to see a 42ft Conquest with quad 300s for my dreams.
Mambo Minnow posted 11-19-2013 10:02 AM ET (US)
I could easily see them extending the Vantage series up to 33-36 feet to directly compete with Grady.
PeteB88 posted 11-19-2013 12:53 PM ET (US)
Wow - must be people have big bucks. What about entry level - perhaps they think the lower end of the line up covers young professionals, business owners etc before or with families. Brand loyalty strategy should start early.
OMCrobert posted 11-19-2013 01:20 PM ET (US)
I agree small boats are being overlooked.
How did we all get started on our Whaler addition? We started off on 13s and 17s. In my opinion, the best business move would be to have the old style 13 and 17 Whalers reintroduced as "Classics" and have them price point.
Whaler is the powerhouse that it is today because of those two hulls. I think the future depends upon it.
sosmerc posted 11-20-2013 02:04 PM ET (US)
I completely agree. The small boats are really what put Whaler on the map and still represent the cream of the crop in small boats. (17ft. and down). I would love to see Whaler put more emphasis on this category...keep them simple and solid and offer a ton of quality options so that individuals have the opportunity to "personalize" their purchase or not.
Mambo Minnow posted 11-20-2013 05:55 PM ET (US)
They completely redesigned the Super Sport series and offer from 11-17 feet with custom order features two years ago.
Of course, these are not changes that curry favor with the classic owners, but they did revamp these models for a younger market.
You can say you do not like them - but you can not say they neglected the smaller models.
OMCrobert posted 11-20-2013 10:03 PM ET (US)
I say they have overlooked the past in the small boat division. They need quantity. I think they need to grow the boating segment of younger boaters.
I am talking about the 10 to 16 year old market. Get young people out from behind the computer and boating as they will continue with boating in the future.
Whaler needs the classic 13ft whaler with a 30hp for $5999. Even if they break even on the boat, it is an investment in the future. People who grew up on a whaler are loyal and will follow it up to large boats.
martyn1075 posted 11-21-2013 01:33 AM ET (US)
I find the current whaler brand to be frustrating. They offer new models far to frequently to be dropped and then leave the buyer without options when they are actually ready. It's hard to find an identity. Let's take the smaller Walkaround series. If you want one you need to find a 205 or 235. Both have been dropped in recent years. If you don't like those models there is really limited options unless you go classic. All the in betweens are history short lived models to the graveyard. Once again leaving the dirty work to the reputation of the golden years. That or boston whaler forces the buyer to go to Grady White or similar brand. Their identity is focused they keep their models alive and well tweaking them ever so slightly. Boston Whaler seems to be trying too hard to find their neiche again. It kind of saddens me to wittness this after being a loyal supporter. Love the boat still through all this but man clean up the management and design crew.
PeteB88 posted 11-21-2013 03:03 AM ET (US)
When we toured the plant April, 2012 (through the back door!) that plant was jammin and were working three shifts as I recall. We were surprised to see the number of big boats being outfitted and/or just out of the mold. Seemed to me many if not most of those 30+ foot hulls were government boats ready to patrol or whatever they do with them. I'll have to go back and look at the pictures I took but that was remarkable to me.
There were also many, many smaller boats being set up - outstanding tour.
wezie posted 11-21-2013 09:31 AM ET (US)
Much more money in big boats.
They are more exciting.
Marketing, management, and promotional folks like to use them more.
Magazine folk like to test them more.
There is not much middle class left to buy smaller boats.
It is all a natural progression!
Peter posted 11-21-2013 11:46 AM ET (US)
The middle class buys used boats. There are plenty of good quality, not so old used boats to buy at 1/4 to 1/3 the price of new.
There is nothing in the Brunswick Whaler line up of the last 15 years or so that appeals to me. Long ago they lost their Downeast character. That's why as a long time Whaler owner I went to a different brand when I wanted something newer.
Binkster posted 11-21-2013 12:30 PM ET (US)
In this country most of the middle class can't afford to buy new boats, so boat builders go where the money is, plain and simple. Whalers were never cheap boats anyway. It's probably harder nowadays to sell an expensive 15 footer than an expensive 31 footer.
rich
PeteB88 posted 11-21-2013 12:33 PM ET (US)
What middle class?
martyn1075 posted 11-21-2013 02:57 PM ET (US)
Peter... exactly my point Boston Whaler almost forces you out to look at another company to buy what you really "need" when you are ready. Most companies would be out of business doing that. You are an example of this and I know you are not the only one. Cost is another factor. I'm not sure there are many that feel right to pay 60K plus taxes for a 19 foot recreational boat. I know a few people I work with that money is not a problem and still visually in discussion its too much to pay.
Boston Whalers attitude is well drop the model then. I don't see their competitors doing that so much therefore they have a drastically better identity to their product because year after year despite hard times and expensive manufacturing they are still alive and allows the buyer to order one. Boston Whaler is not even in the game with some areas of the market.
Martyn
Dave Sutton posted 11-21-2013 03:49 PM ET (US)
<Yawn>
The Boston Whaler company went out of business years ago, the name is now owned by Corporate America and will be thrown at whatever makes money. There is no "Boston Whaler" company with a soul in boating. It's all just empty suits selling SKU's.

Dave
.

jcdawg83 posted 11-21-2013 04:03 PM ET (US)
Dave, you are absolutely correct. Chris Craft went the same way. There are relatively new small boat companies that are gobbling up the market Whaler used to be top dog in. Scout is making huge gains in this area building high quality center console and small cuddys in the 17-25' range. Grady White is not new, but they are gobbling up market share in the 19-30' fishing boat market. Contender is another brand that has come on strong in the past 10-15 years building high quality center console fishing boats. Contender is moving up in the size race, but still has a lot of hulls on the water in the 20-30' range.
Sadly, Boston Whaler is only a sticker on the side of a corporate product now.
egres posted 11-21-2013 05:32 PM ET (US)
<Yawn>
"The Boston Whaler company went out of business years ago, the name is now owned by Corporate America and will be thrown at whatever makes money. There is no "Boston Whaler" company with a soul in boating. It's all just empty suits selling SKU's."
I truly was afraid to let myself fully believe the thought..
My Whaler mentality about Classics is fighting hard to not let me lose interest in the name.
But living in these times today with the multiple threats from the middle East,the rising fuel costs and lately the antics of our Toronto Mayor Rob Ford,I have no choice in finding the expression presented by Dave a strong possibility.
Could it be really all that there is left?
I know..Sounds like the title of another topic.
There is now no wonder left as to why some of the Southern folks have made an accomplishment in "splashing" the Boston Whaler Classic hulls for resale in profits.

martyn1075 posted 11-21-2013 06:10 PM ET (US)
They simply don't have a legitimate direction as a whole. I don't blame the boat its the people behind making the decisions and as mentioned its out of control suit and ties. It goes way back to Reebok days. Such drastic moves so quickly. They keep doing that still today. Model doesn't sell? they drop it. Maybe they should look themselves in the eyes and learn to discover why thats the case.
If Grady is holding true with their lineup for decades whey can't Boston Whaler?
Outrages with pointy bows that resemble sharp bird beaks. No No the look is wide open rounded thats a Whaler. I have to say at least the 210 Montauk has it still. Thank goodness!! If you have seen this boat in person or have been out in it you have to admit it still has character its classy and it means business. It is a nice unit! Its white it should be luxurious tan. To me that boat has the correct design to make the company up to date without losing its glorious history. It may not sell either but its not the boat again its about units sold and why is that probably because purchasers couldn't wait any longer and purchased another boat.
Martyn
Mambo Minnow posted 11-22-2013 05:44 PM ET (US)
Whaler has actually aggressively brought back Desert Tan. I have seen several of the new Vantages in this hull color at Russo Marine. I anticipate they will offer it in yet more additional models.
Mambo Minnow posted 11-22-2013 05:47 PM ET (US)
Yes, confirmed. Go to Whaler website and you will see one of the new Dauntless models cruising in company with three others, one of which is a Desert Tan hull.
martyn1075 posted 11-22-2013 08:14 PM ET (US)
Thats not a dessert tan that resembles more of a grey colour.
Mambo Minnow posted 11-23-2013 10:43 AM ET (US)
http://www.bostonwhaler.com/Page.aspx/pageId/33910/Build-Your-Boat.aspx
I have seen it in person and it is definitely brown base, not grey
martyn1075 posted 11-23-2013 11:27 AM ET (US)
I see what you mean now yes that is a brown. I don't think I would ever consider that the classic dessert tan "gelcoat". Not trying to promote Grady White but if you go to their website you will see the true definition of dessert tan. Whaler of course owned this made it a big ticket sale. When they dropped it Grady moved in and took over changed their white hulls to tan gelcoat.
Binkster posted 11-23-2013 01:23 PM ET (US)
I don't think you can copyright a color. BTW Desert Tan gelcoat is easy to tint from white base.
rich
jimh posted 11-23-2013 01:47 PM ET (US)
A copyright is a protection granted to an author. In the USA the copyright law says it applies to works of authorship as follows:

quote:
Works of authorship include the following categories:
(1) literary works;
(2) musical works, including any accompanying words;
(3) dramatic works, including any accompanying music;
(4) pantomimes and choreographic works;
(5) pictorial, graphic, and sculptural works;
(6) motion pictures and other audiovisual works;
(7) sound recordings; and
(8) architectural works.

Source: http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html
An architectural work sounds like a category that you might fit into with a Boston Whaler, but an architectural work is specifically defined as

quote:
An “architectural work” is the design of a building as embodied in any tangible medium of expression, including a building, architectural plans, or drawings. The work includes the overall form as well as the arrangement and composition of spaces and elements in the design, but does not include individual standard features.
Since a Boston Whaler is not a building, I think you are out under the architectural work category. I do not believe that you can copyright anything related to a Boston Whaler boat itself. A Boston Whaler boat is not a work of authorship.
Boat hull design is protected by its own specific law: the Vessl Hull Design Protection Act. Hull designs must be registered to be protected. I believe the hull must show the registration number. A good corollary topic: are any newer Boston Whaler hull designs registered for protection under the applicable hull design protection law?
Don SSDD posted 11-23-2013 02:54 PM ET (US)
Jim, I thought you could copyright a name, like "Desert Tan" but you couldn't copyright a colour. Anyone can make something that colour, but they can't call it "Desert tan" if the name has a copyright attached to it.
Don
swist posted 11-24-2013 08:28 AM ET (US)
With apologies from the owner of a non-classic Whaler:
Is there something I don't get about desert tan? It's just a color. Or is it simply part of the "look" of classic Whalers.
Peter posted 11-24-2013 08:44 AM ET (US)
Copyrights are being confused with trademarks here.
In certain circumstances, color used on an object can be considered a trademark and if it is a trademark then the trademark owner can prevent others from using that color on identical and related objects. An example of this is Owens-Corning has a trademark in the color pink used on fiberglass insulation. If you go into an attic and see pink fiberglass insulation, its Owens-Corning insulation and no one else.
Brunswick tried to register black as a trademark for its Mercury outboard motors many years ago. It's registration application was successfully opposed by British Seagull on the basis that the color black was functional. Black hides dirt and makes things appear smaller so it is functional when used on outboard motors. If the color is functional, it can't be a trademark and the public should be free to also use the color for the functional purposes. Compare to Ownens-Corning -- the color pink on fiberglass is not functional.
Desert Tan for gelcoat on a boat does not strike me as functional so it could have been a trademark. But the Desert Tan color is just one of many things that make a classic Whaler what it is. The use of Desert Tan on a post classic Whaler just as the use of the Whaler decal on the side doesn't turn a post classic into a classic. The New England "Downeast" character has long since disappeared from the Whaler product line such that I think they should drop "Boston" from the brand name. Maybe "Miami Whaler" would be better suited for the current line up.
martyn1075 posted 11-24-2013 11:06 AM ET (US)
There are still a few models that have that classic look with of course a modern twist. For instance the 210 Montauk and a lesser degree the 190 outrage. Both models with the "classic desert tan" I think would really make a difference. I think we would be amazed by how much more "classic" it would really be. If they would be more consistent with that style vs what appears to be a totally different brand on the majority of their products. I also think we would see Whaler have an identity again. Hints of classic with modern design capabilities that's all they needed to do over the years.
The color tone is not what makes a boat handle better obviously but it certainly has a distinct look. It has a luxurious appeal to it. The painted hull option wrongly described as desert tan makes the boat look more "Miami". Call it a brown or blue etc. The Bayliners started doing this a few years back and we all know they are part of the Brunswick company.
jimh posted 11-25-2013 01:09 AM ET (US)
Peter--The information you contributed about color was very interesting. I never realized that there was something unique about pink attic insulation.
Marsh posted 12-01-2013 08:32 PM ET (US)
When I was shopping for a post-classic Montauk back about 2001 or so, I remember browsing thru a brochure comparing genuine "Whaler" stanchions with those of an "inferior" design found in the competition. By the time I actually purcased my Whaler, the high quality design had become a thing of the past. The stanchions on my Montauk were exactly like those labelled as "inferior" just one model year earlier.
Things do change, no doubt.

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Author	Topic: Brunswick's New Boats: Boston Whaler Brand
jimh	posted 11-18-2013 03:41 PM ET (US) In a recent presentation to Wall Street, Brunswick told prospective investors about their plans for future outboard-powered boats in their Boston Whaler brand. They made the following statements: quote: Product Priorities – Boston Whaler --Lead U.S. premium fiberglass outboard saltwater marker; benefit from the introduction of five all new models in model year 2013 and four in model year 2014 --Continue to extend product line above 30 feet; beyond 345 Conquest and 370 Outrage, including center console and cabin models --Extend product line-up in dual console segment following highly successful Vantage series launch As I read this, we can expect to see more larger hulls from Boston Whaler, including some cabin boats, and more dual-console hulls in the VANTAGE series.
OMCrobert	posted 11-18-2013 03:47 PM ET (US) I know most traditionalist balk at the idea of the dual console but looking at the line up of Grady White and other premium boat lines, it certain is in demand. I would love to see a 42ft Conquest with quad 300s for my dreams.
Mambo Minnow	posted 11-19-2013 10:02 AM ET (US) I could easily see them extending the Vantage series up to 33-36 feet to directly compete with Grady.
PeteB88	posted 11-19-2013 12:53 PM ET (US) Wow - must be people have big bucks. What about entry level - perhaps they think the lower end of the line up covers young professionals, business owners etc before or with families. Brand loyalty strategy should start early.
OMCrobert	posted 11-19-2013 01:20 PM ET (US) I agree small boats are being overlooked. How did we all get started on our Whaler addition? We started off on 13s and 17s. In my opinion, the best business move would be to have the old style 13 and 17 Whalers reintroduced as "Classics" and have them price point. Whaler is the powerhouse that it is today because of those two hulls. I think the future depends upon it.
sosmerc	posted 11-20-2013 02:04 PM ET (US) I completely agree. The small boats are really what put Whaler on the map and still represent the cream of the crop in small boats. (17ft. and down). I would love to see Whaler put more emphasis on this category...keep them simple and solid and offer a ton of quality options so that individuals have the opportunity to "personalize" their purchase or not.
Mambo Minnow	posted 11-20-2013 05:55 PM ET (US) They completely redesigned the Super Sport series and offer from 11-17 feet with custom order features two years ago. Of course, these are not changes that curry favor with the classic owners, but they did revamp these models for a younger market. You can say you do not like them - but you can not say they neglected the smaller models.
OMCrobert	posted 11-20-2013 10:03 PM ET (US) I say they have overlooked the past in the small boat division. They need quantity. I think they need to grow the boating segment of younger boaters. I am talking about the 10 to 16 year old market. Get young people out from behind the computer and boating as they will continue with boating in the future. Whaler needs the classic 13ft whaler with a 30hp for $5999. Even if they break even on the boat, it is an investment in the future. People who grew up on a whaler are loyal and will follow it up to large boats.
martyn1075	posted 11-21-2013 01:33 AM ET (US) I find the current whaler brand to be frustrating. They offer new models far to frequently to be dropped and then leave the buyer without options when they are actually ready. It's hard to find an identity. Let's take the smaller Walkaround series. If you want one you need to find a 205 or 235. Both have been dropped in recent years. If you don't like those models there is really limited options unless you go classic. All the in betweens are history short lived models to the graveyard. Once again leaving the dirty work to the reputation of the golden years. That or boston whaler forces the buyer to go to Grady White or similar brand. Their identity is focused they keep their models alive and well tweaking them ever so slightly. Boston Whaler seems to be trying too hard to find their neiche again. It kind of saddens me to wittness this after being a loyal supporter. Love the boat still through all this but man clean up the management and design crew.
PeteB88	posted 11-21-2013 03:03 AM ET (US) When we toured the plant April, 2012 (through the back door!) that plant was jammin and were working three shifts as I recall. We were surprised to see the number of big boats being outfitted and/or just out of the mold. Seemed to me many if not most of those 30+ foot hulls were government boats ready to patrol or whatever they do with them. I'll have to go back and look at the pictures I took but that was remarkable to me. There were also many, many smaller boats being set up - outstanding tour.
wezie	posted 11-21-2013 09:31 AM ET (US) Much more money in big boats. They are more exciting. Marketing, management, and promotional folks like to use them more. Magazine folk like to test them more. There is not much middle class left to buy smaller boats. It is all a natural progression!
Peter	posted 11-21-2013 11:46 AM ET (US) The middle class buys used boats. There are plenty of good quality, not so old used boats to buy at 1/4 to 1/3 the price of new. There is nothing in the Brunswick Whaler line up of the last 15 years or so that appeals to me. Long ago they lost their Downeast character. That's why as a long time Whaler owner I went to a different brand when I wanted something newer.
Binkster	posted 11-21-2013 12:30 PM ET (US) In this country most of the middle class can't afford to buy new boats, so boat builders go where the money is, plain and simple. Whalers were never cheap boats anyway. It's probably harder nowadays to sell an expensive 15 footer than an expensive 31 footer. rich
PeteB88	posted 11-21-2013 12:33 PM ET (US) What middle class?
martyn1075	posted 11-21-2013 02:57 PM ET (US) Peter... exactly my point Boston Whaler almost forces you out to look at another company to buy what you really "need" when you are ready. Most companies would be out of business doing that. You are an example of this and I know you are not the only one. Cost is another factor. I'm not sure there are many that feel right to pay 60K plus taxes for a 19 foot recreational boat. I know a few people I work with that money is not a problem and still visually in discussion its too much to pay. Boston Whalers attitude is well drop the model then. I don't see their competitors doing that so much therefore they have a drastically better identity to their product because year after year despite hard times and expensive manufacturing they are still alive and allows the buyer to order one. Boston Whaler is not even in the game with some areas of the market. Martyn
Dave Sutton	posted 11-21-2013 03:49 PM ET (US) <Yawn> The Boston Whaler company went out of business years ago, the name is now owned by Corporate America and will be thrown at whatever makes money. There is no "Boston Whaler" company with a soul in boating. It's all just empty suits selling SKU's. Dave .
jcdawg83	posted 11-21-2013 04:03 PM ET (US) Dave, you are absolutely correct. Chris Craft went the same way. There are relatively new small boat companies that are gobbling up the market Whaler used to be top dog in. Scout is making huge gains in this area building high quality center console and small cuddys in the 17-25' range. Grady White is not new, but they are gobbling up market share in the 19-30' fishing boat market. Contender is another brand that has come on strong in the past 10-15 years building high quality center console fishing boats. Contender is moving up in the size race, but still has a lot of hulls on the water in the 20-30' range. Sadly, Boston Whaler is only a sticker on the side of a corporate product now.
egres	posted 11-21-2013 05:32 PM ET (US) <Yawn> "The Boston Whaler company went out of business years ago, the name is now owned by Corporate America and will be thrown at whatever makes money. There is no "Boston Whaler" company with a soul in boating. It's all just empty suits selling SKU's." I truly was afraid to let myself fully believe the thought.. My Whaler mentality about Classics is fighting hard to not let me lose interest in the name. But living in these times today with the multiple threats from the middle East,the rising fuel costs and lately the antics of our Toronto Mayor Rob Ford,I have no choice in finding the expression presented by Dave a strong possibility. Could it be really all that there is left? I know..Sounds like the title of another topic. There is now no wonder left as to why some of the Southern folks have made an accomplishment in "splashing" the Boston Whaler Classic hulls for resale in profits.
martyn1075	posted 11-21-2013 06:10 PM ET (US) They simply don't have a legitimate direction as a whole. I don't blame the boat its the people behind making the decisions and as mentioned its out of control suit and ties. It goes way back to Reebok days. Such drastic moves so quickly. They keep doing that still today. Model doesn't sell? they drop it. Maybe they should look themselves in the eyes and learn to discover why thats the case. If Grady is holding true with their lineup for decades whey can't Boston Whaler? Outrages with pointy bows that resemble sharp bird beaks. No No the look is wide open rounded thats a Whaler. I have to say at least the 210 Montauk has it still. Thank goodness!! If you have seen this boat in person or have been out in it you have to admit it still has character its classy and it means business. It is a nice unit! Its white it should be luxurious tan. To me that boat has the correct design to make the company up to date without losing its glorious history. It may not sell either but its not the boat again its about units sold and why is that probably because purchasers couldn't wait any longer and purchased another boat. Martyn
Mambo Minnow	posted 11-22-2013 05:44 PM ET (US) Whaler has actually aggressively brought back Desert Tan. I have seen several of the new Vantages in this hull color at Russo Marine. I anticipate they will offer it in yet more additional models.
Mambo Minnow	posted 11-22-2013 05:47 PM ET (US) Yes, confirmed. Go to Whaler website and you will see one of the new Dauntless models cruising in company with three others, one of which is a Desert Tan hull.
martyn1075	posted 11-22-2013 08:14 PM ET (US) Thats not a dessert tan that resembles more of a grey colour.
Mambo Minnow	posted 11-23-2013 10:43 AM ET (US) http://www.bostonwhaler.com/Page.aspx/pageId/33910/Build-Your-Boat.aspx I have seen it in person and it is definitely brown base, not grey
martyn1075	posted 11-23-2013 11:27 AM ET (US) I see what you mean now yes that is a brown. I don't think I would ever consider that the classic dessert tan "gelcoat". Not trying to promote Grady White but if you go to their website you will see the true definition of dessert tan. Whaler of course owned this made it a big ticket sale. When they dropped it Grady moved in and took over changed their white hulls to tan gelcoat.
Binkster	posted 11-23-2013 01:23 PM ET (US) I don't think you can copyright a color. BTW Desert Tan gelcoat is easy to tint from white base. rich
jimh	posted 11-23-2013 01:47 PM ET (US) A copyright is a protection granted to an author. In the USA the copyright law says it applies to works of authorship as follows: quote: Works of authorship include the following categories: (1) literary works; (2) musical works, including any accompanying words; (3) dramatic works, including any accompanying music; (4) pantomimes and choreographic works; (5) pictorial, graphic, and sculptural works; (6) motion pictures and other audiovisual works; (7) sound recordings; and (8) architectural works. Source: http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap1.html An architectural work sounds like a category that you might fit into with a Boston Whaler, but an architectural work is specifically defined as quote: An “architectural work” is the design of a building as embodied in any tangible medium of expression, including a building, architectural plans, or drawings. The work includes the overall form as well as the arrangement and composition of spaces and elements in the design, but does not include individual standard features. Since a Boston Whaler is not a building, I think you are out under the architectural work category. I do not believe that you can copyright anything related to a Boston Whaler boat itself. A Boston Whaler boat is not a work of authorship. Boat hull design is protected by its own specific law: the Vessl Hull Design Protection Act. Hull designs must be registered to be protected. I believe the hull must show the registration number. A good corollary topic: are any newer Boston Whaler hull designs registered for protection under the applicable hull design protection law?
Don SSDD	posted 11-23-2013 02:54 PM ET (US) Jim, I thought you could copyright a name, like "Desert Tan" but you couldn't copyright a colour. Anyone can make something that colour, but they can't call it "Desert tan" if the name has a copyright attached to it. Don
swist	posted 11-24-2013 08:28 AM ET (US) With apologies from the owner of a non-classic Whaler: Is there something I don't get about desert tan? It's just a color. Or is it simply part of the "look" of classic Whalers.
Peter	posted 11-24-2013 08:44 AM ET (US) Copyrights are being confused with trademarks here. In certain circumstances, color used on an object can be considered a trademark and if it is a trademark then the trademark owner can prevent others from using that color on identical and related objects. An example of this is Owens-Corning has a trademark in the color pink used on fiberglass insulation. If you go into an attic and see pink fiberglass insulation, its Owens-Corning insulation and no one else. Brunswick tried to register black as a trademark for its Mercury outboard motors many years ago. It's registration application was successfully opposed by British Seagull on the basis that the color black was functional. Black hides dirt and makes things appear smaller so it is functional when used on outboard motors. If the color is functional, it can't be a trademark and the public should be free to also use the color for the functional purposes. Compare to Ownens-Corning -- the color pink on fiberglass is not functional. Desert Tan for gelcoat on a boat does not strike me as functional so it could have been a trademark. But the Desert Tan color is just one of many things that make a classic Whaler what it is. The use of Desert Tan on a post classic Whaler just as the use of the Whaler decal on the side doesn't turn a post classic into a classic. The New England "Downeast" character has long since disappeared from the Whaler product line such that I think they should drop "Boston" from the brand name. Maybe "Miami Whaler" would be better suited for the current line up.
martyn1075	posted 11-24-2013 11:06 AM ET (US) There are still a few models that have that classic look with of course a modern twist. For instance the 210 Montauk and a lesser degree the 190 outrage. Both models with the "classic desert tan" I think would really make a difference. I think we would be amazed by how much more "classic" it would really be. If they would be more consistent with that style vs what appears to be a totally different brand on the majority of their products. I also think we would see Whaler have an identity again. Hints of classic with modern design capabilities that's all they needed to do over the years. The color tone is not what makes a boat handle better obviously but it certainly has a distinct look. It has a luxurious appeal to it. The painted hull option wrongly described as desert tan makes the boat look more "Miami". Call it a brown or blue etc. The Bayliners started doing this a few years back and we all know they are part of the Brunswick company.
jimh	posted 11-25-2013 01:09 AM ET (US) Peter--The information you contributed about color was very interesting. I never realized that there was something unique about pink attic insulation.
Marsh	posted 12-01-2013 08:32 PM ET (US) When I was shopping for a post-classic Montauk back about 2001 or so, I remember browsing thru a brochure comparing genuine "Whaler" stanchions with those of an "inferior" design found in the competition. By the time I actually purcased my Whaler, the high quality design had become a thing of the past. The stanchions on my Montauk were exactly like those labelled as "inferior" just one model year earlier. Things do change, no doubt.